Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Posted: 12/15/2001 3:20:23 AM EDT
I locked it up yesterday morning on the way to work. I'm not sure what caused it yet, as I haven't had a chance to tear into it. I was accelerating to get on the highway, and then "[b]BAM![/b]". Then silence. The harmonic balancer was actually sheared off from the sudden stop. This ought to be fun. Carless
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 3:22:29 AM EDT
No warning signs?? IE: Major smoking, oil leaks, REALLY loud knocking?
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 3:24:41 AM EDT
What sort of engine? [>]:)]
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 3:41:02 AM EDT
Nope, nothing that would make me thing anything was wrong. That is why it really took me by surprise. It's been running great lately. It's a 5.0 litre Mustang.
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 3:48:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/15/2001 3:41:26 AM EDT by Ruckus]
Ahhhh, Mustang, Hence your name! Sounds like it definitely snapped the crank. But why? maybe a broken rod?? Any warranty left? Let us know. Edited to say, NO, it doesn't have any warranty left, cuz if it's a 5.0 it's gotta be at least 8 years old!
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 3:50:08 AM EDT
does the fuel pump still work?
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 4:45:02 AM EDT
Man that sux! Right before the holidays too. Sounds like a thrown rod. Was the block windowed? If it isn't an HO, you can probably drop in a remanufactured long block. Do a search of remanufactured engines. Here's one link I found in a quick search http://remanufactured-engines.com/33%20Ford%208%20Cylinder.htm
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 4:51:38 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 5:12:09 AM EDT
the 5.0s had chains, but that is still a possibility.
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 5:20:21 AM EDT
Originally Posted By kpel308: What was the status of your timing belt? My ex-wife had a similar situation when hers wore out. Turned her nice Toyota engine into a paperweight.
View Quote
Which engine/model? Most toyota are belt, motor won't mess up if belt breaks. If the Toyota is a truck (22R) or '98 and newer with chain, engine will be history if chain breaks.
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 5:28:06 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 5:33:18 AM EDT
If it stopped violently enough to make the damper come off, the whole bottom end is scrap. Block, rods, crank is for sure gone. Time to look for an engine or short block at the least.
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 6:13:20 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 7:16:48 AM EDT
Originally Posted By kpel308: '85 Corolla that she had before she met me. Her brother told me about it.
View Quote
I threw the belt on my '81 Toyota Tercel, but the valve/piston clearance was designed not to be damaged. I was doing 80 when mine went, and I all it needed was a new belt.
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 7:29:31 AM EDT
You have trashed the bottom end, or maybe, just may be, blown a head gasket and hydro-locked the engine. If it locked up violently enough to twist the balancer, I would look more for a broken rod, or collapsed piston than anything else. The 5.0 uses a chain, and the engine will not be damaged or lock up if the chain breaks. You will need at least a short block. Failing the cash, and if you aren't planning to keep it long, maybe a junkyard engine.
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 7:47:09 AM EDT
Wow, that sucks. How many miles did it have on it? At least it was a 5.0L, lots or parts to choose from. You have lots of options. Jeg's now sells Ford Motorsports short and long blocks. If you had that much force on the bottom end something has to be messed up bug time. Anyway, you have tons of options depending on what you want to do with it. Go with just a short block from Jeg's for $1299.99 (im sure you can shop that around) and build it back up with stock stuff or go out with edelbrock heads and all. Good luck. check out [url]http://oemfordparts.com/index.asp[/url] for Ford Motorsports parts. and [url]http://www.jegs.com[/url] with part # 397-m-6009-b50 I prefer Summit Racing for my parts, and FYI if you take the part number from about any major parts manufacturer and put it in the summit online search they will have the part. They have tons more stuff online than in their catalog.
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 2:44:56 PM EDT
I also like Summit - and I live 45 min from Jegs! Bought a lot of race parts from them over the years. Beware "autoparts store" rebuilds! Most of them suck; far poorer choice than good junkyard engine. I can go on for a long time about what I have found in them and none of it is good. Jasper is a little better but not much. There are more ways to screw up an overhaul than grains of powder in a 5 LB can! FOMOCO rebuild is likely to be a little above independent in quality as they want to protect the Ford name and generally have a better warranty. You DO PAY for that, of course. The independents disassemble a truck load of engines, including one like yours, and throw parts in trays. Everything is cleaned and those parts to be reused are once again placed in trays. The cheapest pistons, bearings, gaskets, lifters cam and other parts are then fit to a questionable tolerance. Appropriate number of each part is pulled from the trays and the whole mess is thrown together. Matched and selected parts aren't anymore. Different production runs of slightly different size weight or other characteristic get mixed. Little time is spent on inspection or measurement - FAR LESS than when OEM builds the thing. Result is a crap shoot. Life of most rebuilds is way less than a new engine for this reason. They can vibrate more (nearly a certainty), give less than desired performance, economy or wear quicky. Ask yourself this: If the parts and machine shop work for a good rebuild is well over $1000 these days and the job requires 15 - 30 hours at, say $30 hr, how can the cheapy rebuilders offer you that item for $900? Yep, they cut corners SOMEWHERE. What corner do you suggest to cut? Cheap low quality parts? Uncaring mechanics? ?? Any car that is not a specialty item is, in most cases, not worth the expense of a QUALITY engine rebuild or replacement. You never get your money back otherwise. If you have the tools, skill and time you can sometimes almost break even on the job. Almost. Be very certain what direction you wish to go.
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 5:06:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/15/2001 5:02:31 PM EDT by Ruckus]
Originally Posted By paspecops: The 5.0 uses a chain, and the engine will not be damaged or lock up if the chain breaks.
View Quote
Ummmm, Sorry to rain on your parade paspecops, but it WILL most definitely damage the engine. Think about it, if the timing chain breaks what happens? The cam stops turning which means your valves just stay where they are. (be it open or closed) That being said, just because the chain breaks doesn't mean the crankshaft (and pistons) stop moving. So, just about .00000002 of a second after the timing chain breaks, one, or a number of the still moving pistons will come in contact with the valves that are 'stuck' open in the corresponding cylinder. As soon as that is over you've had the equivalent of a hand grenade going off in your engine. So all those metal fragments just may lock up your engine. Although I really doubt this is what happened in Ponyboy's case, it can happen. Albeit rare BTW, paspecops. This is in no way a flame towards yourself. Edited for Punk-shoe-eh-shun. I allsew don't spel god ether.
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 5:13:07 PM EDT
Well, my best guess is that it probably threw a rod. I had just left my house to head to work and was speeding up on the entrance ramp to the highway. I was probably turning somewhere between 4-4.5K RPM's, I would guess. Sounded normal and was running good. Normal oil pressure and it had just warmed up so no overheating. Just a loud noise and it jerked to the left, which I guess could have possibly been the HB hitting the left front tire maybe? Then silence as I coasted down the highway. I had it towed to my parents, where most of my good tools are and I have a place where I can work on it. I haven't seen it since yesterday and I just glanced at it while I was waiting on a ride to work to show up right after it happened. This isn't the first catostrophic failure I've had with the car though. About 5 years ago I put a Motorsport cam in that had a lobe that was off by a couple of thousandths and snapped a lifter and seized up the oil pump. A month later I had a factory head crack due to a defect in the casting, which was ok cause I already had some TrickFlows on order. Since then though its only been small stuff like the water pump and manifold gaskets. I was planning on a rebuild pretty soon, just not quite like this. Maybe I'll get to taking it down this week, though I'll probably hold off on it for a while. When I figure out what happened I'll let yall know. Anybody got a cheap GT40 upper and lower they don't need?
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 5:17:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/15/2001 5:11:13 PM EDT by toaster]
For a replacement, Mr. Leadfoot.[url]www.keithblack.com[/url][:D]
Link Posted: 12/15/2001 5:32:29 PM EDT
Oh, and just a little side info. I have helped build and work on a [b]LOT[/b] of Mustangs. Blown 302's to NOS sucking 351W's. I've watched people blow parts of their cranks out of the bottom of their oil pans (along with other unidentifiable engine parts) and I've seen them sit in the parking lot and rev engines they just finished building until they seize because they were pissed cause they couldn't get them to run right. But I have never seen a broken timing chain. I've seen a couple that had been obviously streched, but not one that broke. So I seriously doubt that was the problem. I'll let you know though....
Link Posted: 12/16/2001 12:53:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/16/2001 1:12:30 AM EDT by Kgibson]
Originally Posted By Ruckus: Ummmm, Sorry to rain on your parade paspecops, but it WILL most definitely damage the engine. Think about it, if the timing chain breaks what happens? The cam stops turning which means your valves just stay where they are. (be it open or closed) That being said, just because the chain breaks doesn't mean the crankshaft (and pistons) stop moving. So, just about .00000002 of a second after the timing chain breaks, one, or a number of the still moving pistons will come in contact with the valves that are 'stuck' open in the corresponding cylinder. As soon as that is over you've had the equivalent of a hand grenade going off in your engine. So all those metal fragments just may lock up your engine.
View Quote
Ummm.. Sorry to rain on your parade Ruckus. 302s are not interference motors. Meaning the timing chain can break and there will not be a piston to valve problem. And honestly, I can't think of any small block/big block american motors. IE: 302, 351, 400, 460, 454, 327, 350, etc etc. That are in fact interference motors. [Edited to add Factual Data links] [url]http://www.members.home.net/daveandlois/motors.htm[/url] [url]http://www.committment.com/benoit1.html[/url] The last link this ASE Master tech even says the 302 motor is not an interference motor. He had a 302 motor that did have an interference problem but that was because the motor had milled heads on it. -Kc -Kc
Link Posted: 12/16/2001 2:50:55 AM EDT
Certain versions of Chevrolet engines are, in fact, "interference motors"! The emasculated low compression low lift V8 engines DO have a lot of space and tend to not bend valves when timing chain/gear/belt fails. Timing chains VERY rarely break. The trashy polymer coating on the cam gear fails. It is used to control sound and vastly shortens life. You should check cam timing with one of those plastic gears! Some REALLY ODD variations!
Link Posted: 12/16/2001 3:53:05 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/16/2001 4:14:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/16/2001 4:09:18 PM EDT by Gopher]
Bummer man. I guess there's always Jeff Hill motors.[xx(]
Link Posted: 12/16/2001 4:28:30 PM EDT
I've locked 2 engines up but both had some sort of warning. One engines was a "new" engine from Autozone to replace the original engine. With only 1,000 miles on the "new" engine, and already having it in the shop once already becuase it wasn't assembled properly to begin with, it threw a rod and Autozone would not cover it. After the engine was installed they told me that since I didn't use a shop they specifically deal with that it violated the warranty. The shop they deal with is the favorite of all the corrupt car dealers, the kind that put 50 weight oil in a car so it won't leak oil until it's sold. They were the shop that "fixed" the bent rocker arms by putting the nuts, which had fallen off, back on. So whatever you do, don't go to Autozone for a replacement engine. Did you use any products such at Slick 50 on the engine? Curious to see if you did and had a major failure. I've had no engines lock up after the first 2, I've been using Slick 50 since then.
Link Posted: 12/16/2001 4:55:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By toaster: For a replacement, Mr. Leadfoot.[url]www.keithblack.com[/url][:D]
View Quote
Yep, a company and engine I am familiar with... The MOPAR Hemi - best when blown!
Link Posted: 12/16/2001 7:08:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SWIRE: So whatever you do, don't go to Autozone for a replacement engine. Did you use any products such at Slick 50 on the engine? Curious to see if you did and had a major failure. I've had no engines lock up after the first 2, I've been using Slick 50 since then.
View Quote
I don't think you will need to worry about me going to AutoZone for an engine, I cannot stand that place. Not only are most of the people that work there stupid, their computers are stupid too. I went there once to get a set of plug wires for a '94 5.0 litre Mustang and they told me they didn't sell them. Unbelievingly I asked him to go through all of his little screens and check again. Same response, they didn't carry [b]ANY[/b] type of plug wires for my car. When I asked him to check on wires for a '93 Mustang, four different types that were in stock magically appeared! It's the same damn engine! Plus, I get tired of somebody trying to sell me a gap checker every time I go in there no matter what I am buying. "Is the air freshener it for you today?......How about a spark plug gap checker?" Like I don't know what the hell I am there for. All I can say is thank God for O'Reileys. No, I have never used Slick50, but about every other oil change or so I'd spring for Mobil 1. The last time a couple of weeks ago wasn't the time though. If this God forsaken rain ever stops I might tear into it this week before I have to go back to work.
Link Posted: 12/16/2001 7:33:46 PM EDT
Ahhh the joys of Ford ownership........
Link Posted: 12/16/2001 8:02:58 PM EDT
One thing I haven't seen posted yet is the chance that you just lost the HB due to the Woodruff key shearing off the crankshaft. This happens when it gets loose. Had it happen once with the same symptoms. If you can still turn the engine over, that may be all it is.
Link Posted: 12/16/2001 8:09:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Ponyboy: It's been running great lately. It's a 5.0 litre Mustang.
View Quote
In sports car racing, we always say the engine runs best just before they blow up. (not just Mustangs, but any of them)
Link Posted: 12/16/2001 11:10:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By toaster: For a replacement, Mr. Leadfoot.[url]www.keithblack.com[/url][:D]
View Quote
I actually knew Keith Black. He was a great man. Knew everything about how to make horsepower. A vibrant and energetic man he was tragically struck down by a stroke. Not a fitting end to a man that was so alive. Still makes me sad to this day. Good to see his company still going strong though.
Top Top