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Posted: 12/6/2001 12:36:07 PM EDT
Literally right before the Indana shooting bumped it off of the air, the big story on Fox News Channel was that someone probed the perimeter at the Marines FOB Rhino. The Fox memeber of the reporting pool got on his sat phone and reported that the base went on full alert and they were hearded into a bunker. While they were being moved he saw and heard a large amount of outgoing mortar illumination and heard small arms fire coming from the side of the perimiter furthest away from their position. The Taliban are supposedly negotiating to give up Kandahar, the stumbling block being that Omar doesnt want to wind up in a American jail. Given that, do you think they might have it in them to try a round of Sapper-type suicide attacks on the Marines, in the hopes that they would get lucky and cause a bunch of casualties- which in their minds would make the US go away?? Or did somebody just get jumpy? You would think that with all the NVD's they have now that would alleviate some of the jumpiness units in their first combat situation have at night.
Link Posted: 12/6/2001 12:43:36 PM EDT
MSNBC reported at 4:30 EST that there had been a second round of outgoing mortar and small arms fire, and that the Marines informed them that part of the perimiter had been fired upon.
Link Posted: 12/6/2001 1:00:32 PM EDT
You would think there would be listening-posts with night vision outside the parameter. Wonder how the Talib's got so close ?
Link Posted: 12/6/2001 3:41:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 5subslr5: You would think there would be listening-posts with night vision outside the parameter. Wonder how the Talib's got so close ?
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Sound carries very far at night in the desert, it probably was the listening posts getting in a firefight. They kept shoving the reporters into holes and (rightly) wont let them near the fence.
Link Posted: 12/6/2001 3:51:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/6/2001 3:44:53 PM EDT by DaMan]
My guess would be they were shooting at "ghosts"! As for the cause..... my guess would be GSR operator "seeing" something followed by illuminating rounds being fired. I don't think there were any enemy out there or small arms fire on the base. But that's just MY opinion, and sure there are "experts" with other opinions! [:P] DaMan
Link Posted: 12/6/2001 4:19:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 5subslr5: You would think there would be listening-posts with night vision outside the parameter. Wonder how the Talib's got so close ?
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The main objective of an LP/OP (listening post/obervation post) is just that. THEY DO NOT ENGAGE unless they are taking fire or are about to. If they saw Taliban troops approaching, they would contact their command element and they would either set up an ambush, send a fighting patrol or the Marines would just face them at their defensive positions. So it is doubtful any of the fire was from the LP/OP.
Link Posted: 12/6/2001 4:19:06 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DaMan: My guess would be they were shooting at "ghosts"! As for the cause..... my guess would be GSR operator "seeing" something followed by illuminating rounds being fired. I don't think there were any enemy out there or small arms fire on the base. But that's just MY opinion, and sure there are "experts" with other opinions! [:P] DaMan
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The Marines did say some of their people took fire- unless of course it was other Marines..
Link Posted: 12/6/2001 4:45:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/6/2001 5:25:14 PM EDT by DaMan]
Originally Posted By ArmdLbrl: The Marines did say some of their people took fire- unless of course it was other Marines..
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I don't think the Marines were shooting at each other. However, I do think the "incoming" were actually outgoing shots at ghosts which started a "shootin' frenzy"! I regret hearing that a few were injured when a chopper "hit hard"! But glad to hear of no fatalities! I'm hoping this will be a good lesson in fire discipline! DaMan
Link Posted: 12/7/2001 2:33:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/7/2001 2:29:46 PM EDT by ArmdLbrl]
Marines are spreading out, in the air and on the ground, and are engaging Taliban trying to escape Kandahar after the faked surrender attempt. [url]http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/20011207/ts/afghan_us_military.html[/url] They are still weighing options about moving the Marines from their present location and/or reinforcing them with Army units. This brings up the possibility that the shooting yesterday was from fleeing Taliban vheicles wandering into night ambush positions. The weather is so clear right now and the terrain, from what you can tell from the released pictures, is so flat that the journalists within the perimeter could have been seeing and hearing something that was taking place 10+km away from their hole.
Link Posted: 12/7/2001 3:08:57 PM EDT
Gentle people, in my short little post I only wondered how the L/P,s equipped with night vision allowed the Talib's to get in close - if they truly did get in close. Anyone know if the Marines are equipped with IFR scopes ??? Those lil darlings cost about $15,000 on the civilian market but still there should be some there somewhere. Nice warm bodies against a cooler desert floor should make for some good images.
Link Posted: 12/7/2001 6:13:20 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 5subslr5: Anyone know if the Marines are equipped with IFR scopes ??? Those lil darlings cost about $15,000 on the civilian market but still there should be some there somewhere. Nice warm bodies against a cooler desert floor should make for some good images.
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I'll bite.... WHAT ARE "IFR scopes"? DaMan
Link Posted: 12/7/2001 6:55:43 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/7/2001 6:59:30 PM EDT
DaMan, I've seen exactly one perched on a .50 cal bolt gun. To the best of my limited knowledge it operates like FLIR. Little suckers are heat sensitive - or maybe more correctly pick out images warmer than the surrounding background - tank engine running at night, lurking human, etc.
Link Posted: 12/7/2001 7:36:28 PM EDT
What you see mounted on 50 cals and Mk19 are AN/TVS-5 they are Gen II image intesifiers (star light scopes), not thermal imagers.
Link Posted: 12/7/2001 7:42:11 PM EDT
Stlrn there is a thermal imager weapon sight in service. We used them in saudi in 1996 after kohbar was blown up. I am not sure if it is .50bmg compatable though. john
Link Posted: 12/7/2001 7:59:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/7/2001 8:07:35 PM EDT by STLRN]
The military has some AN/PAS-13, thermal imagers small arms sights, but since I have the same SMF (gear that I signed for) as the Marines on the MEU, I can say that what we mount on our 50 cals are AN/TVS-5s
Link Posted: 12/7/2001 8:00:00 PM EDT
TOW lauchers have an IR site, the Gunny used to use them to bust guys smoking in the bush when "dey wuz told dey damn well not be". Mounted on Hummers and Bradleys. Jarheads shooting at ghosts that ignites a firing frenzy, sheet thats just havin' a little fun and bustin up the monotiny. Hell, they don't pay us to bring the ammo home. But the most important thing, DON'T MAKE ASSUMPTIONS UNLESS YOU WER THERE. [heavy] [uzi] [50] Lite em up boys!!!!!!
Link Posted: 12/7/2001 8:59:49 PM EDT
metacomment -- cute li'l board code bug. Lionhntr nailed 00:00:00, and the timestamp didn't show up on the forum-topics-listing page, just the date. Not a big deal, but Goatboy might want to patch it if he's got nothing better to do.
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