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Posted: 11/20/2001 2:09:29 PM EDT
i mean the bootcamp, were di's that bad? was hartman the norm or the exception, did it capture the realism of bootcamp well? i don't care about the rest of the movie or other stuff i just want to know if di's were that: loud mean thanks OffRoad
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 2:11:30 PM EDT
It was identical, except instead of one guy yelling at you, there'd be 3-5 of them.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 2:17:36 PM EDT
Real? From Kubrick? [rolleyes] But actually, the film was a adaptation of Gustav Hasford's book [i]The Short Timers[/i]. It is hard to find, but a brutal read. Amazon says it's out of print [url]http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0553279459/qid=1006297566/sr=1-2/ref=sr_1_10_2/107-8053408-4362937[/url]. Required reading in a Ga Tech lit elective class, very hard to get, "The Vietnam War in Literature" taught by Bud Foote.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 2:21:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2001 2:15:27 PM EDT by Jarhead_22]
Originally Posted By OffRoad: i just want to know if di's were that: loud
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Yes, my SDI and DIs were very loud. Everything was at max volume if you screwed up. Also, you have to remember that they're addressing a group of ~85 guys in a large room, and they have to make themselves heard without any hollywood amplification. On more than one occasion, I was screamed at from a distance no greater than the radius of the Drill Instructor's campaign cover, and sometimes closer. One DI dipped Copenhagen, and I got spattered with dip several times from him hollering in my face from very close up.
mean
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They break you down to strip off all the civilian baggage guys show up with at Parris Island, and try to build you up again in their image. They [b]ARE[/B] God for 13 weeks of your life. I was knocked around a little, made to do diamond pushups until I had a knot on my head from collapsing onto the concrete floor over and over, made to skip meals because we were behind schedule, made to do side-straddle hops (jumping jacks) for ~45 minutes because I smiled, made to pour an entire 7 oz bottle of Listerine in my mouth and then made to laugh so it all came out my nose (ouch) and on and on and on. Anyone who screwed up was hazed unmercifully so that they would not do it again, and so that anyone watching would be motivated not to make the same mistake. It worked for me.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 2:33:51 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 2:59:33 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Major-Murphy: It was identical, except instead of one guy yelling at you, there'd be 3-5 of them.
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Exactly. And Gunny Hartman was funny. You won't find your DI's so funny (most of the time). And they are loud. VERY loud.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 3:31:49 PM EDT
Major-Murphy is on the money. There are so many direct similarities between the movie and my experiences at MCRD San Diego in '84 it is not even funny. Hardly any physical contact between DI's and recruits though. One of my DI's would get your attention on the parade deck by walking up behind you and wispering corrective instructions into your ear...with your ear firmly clenched between his teeth. A few "sanctioned" blanket parties were held. One recruit, Pvt Reed (AKA Casper, as named by the DI's because the boy was damn near an albino when compared to the rest of the tanned recruits), sported a bruse over his left eye and cheek that closely resembled the tread on the heel of a combat boot. Reed was a sickbay commando with a smart mouth and Drill Instructor Sgt Harris hated his guts. Everytime Reed would screw up, another recruit or group of recruits, would get bent in his place. One evening after chow, my Platoon was on the parade deck with Harris putting us through some close order drill. The Senior DI and the other Junior DI's were gone for the evening and Harris had the overnight duty. Reed, as usual, was sitting on the bleachers with his rifle, while the rest of the platoon marched up and down the parade deck for about 2 hours. Well, Harris caught Reed eyeballing the area, and had enough. Since Reed could not be thrashed because of his "medical" status, other means of motivation and discipline had to be brought to bear. Harris marched platoon 1085 in front of the bleachers for a practice pass in review. He halted the platoon 6 and centered on Reed. He then commanded: Right, Face. The platoon responded, and was now facing Pvt Reed. Harris then began a verbal assualt on Reed. Harris: Well there Casper, I see your undisciplined body is unable to sit at the position of attention. Reed: Sir, No Sir! This Recruit was.. Harris: Bullshit Reed! I saw you eye fucking the area you no good piece of shit! How in the fuck can you even begin to think you are a member of this platoon when you share none of the hardships of the other recruits. You have been on light duty for the past six weeks and there is not a damn thing broken on your body! You are just a non-hacking piece of shit! Your sorry ass should be recycled! Harris turns to the platoon. Harris: Well how about it there '85. Is Casper a member of this platoon? 1085: Sir, No Sir! Harris: You know what there '85? I sure am tired. I mean just bone tired. Shit, I bet you ladies could throw a wild ass party in the squadbay tonight, and I would sleep right through it. Shit, you could make your buddy Reed the Guest of Honor! He would probably get a big kick out of it! Hint Hint! 1085: [b]SIR, YES SIR!![/b] Harris: Left, Face! Forward, March! Semper Fi
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 3:46:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2001 3:39:38 PM EDT by A-36Pilot]
I remember when we got "picked up" out of recieving. The company commander stood up in fornt of us a gave this nice touchy-feely speech about how the DIs couldn't touch us, or use profanity towards us, or belittle us. After he turned us over to the DI's, they started screaming about how everything the Captain said was bullshit and they could do anything they wanted to do to us. I never really got in too much trouble in Boot. I made the mistake of calling the Senior Drill Instructor senior DI once, and got bent for about a half an hour. A little one on one attention is NOT what you want. Then right before final drill, we were out on the parade deck practicing close order and the DI gave a command right as a 727 took off. Half of the platoon went one way and the other half the other way. We went "island hopping" for an hour and a half. And then we had to unblouse our trousers. Nothing worse than being in third phase and looking like a first phase recruit.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 3:51:16 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 4:00:19 PM EDT
That was filmed at San Diego but they said it was Parris Island because everyone knows that that's where the real Marines come from.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 4:09:32 PM EDT
PI is so tough, it turns women into men!!! (4th Battalion Wookie Monsters) [smoke]
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 4:09:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By kpel308: "prac private"
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Been There, got the 2nd Bn, Golf Co t-shirt. What is it with prior college types,... where you the secretary private too? I was that too. Actually, it had some benefits. As far as being the prac private, my instructions were; "when you sh#t green, I want all these rocks to sh#t green!" They all passed.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 4:10:17 PM EDT
In 1987, my old man took me to see FMJ two days before I was heading to the MEPS. He wanted me to see what boot camp was like, before I signed my life away. When Ssgt. Mashburn showed up and my old man told him about the moveie and how much it resembled basic when he went through, in 1964, the recruiter laughed and said it's not like that anymore. My old man turned to me and said " you might as well go in the Air Force, sounds like a bunch of pussies are running the show now!" He couldn't believe they couldn't hit recruits anymore!
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 4:15:36 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 4:19:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2001 4:12:09 PM EDT by Dave_G]
GardenWeasel, Actually, Full Metal jacket was filmed almost entirely in England, the only non-English scenes being a very few 2nd Unit air to ground shots from a helicopter in the Philipines. Kubric hated to leave England. The PI part of the movie was a hoot.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 4:19:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2001 4:16:19 PM EDT by gardenWeasel]
Gee Whiz thanks for pointing that out! I knew it wasn't Parris Island. There I looked it up: Parris Island scenes were shot at a real military training camp in Bassingbourne. The barracks set was built at Enfield.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 6:47:04 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Major-Murphy: It was identical, except instead of one guy yelling at you, there'd be 3-5 of them.
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No way it was a 100 times worse,,and better at the same time. Sure there were more DI's, but the movie does not do boot camp (at that time period) justice, not even close. How in the name of Chesty Puller can you even state that? Today I was talking to a freind of mine who is a phycologist, I told him of this one little thing, just a moment in the life of a recruit at PI,,we were woken in the middle of the night,,pt'ed till we piked in the rose garden,,sand fleas and fire ants. After we worked up a lovely sweat in the summer heat and covered with sand and all sorts of creatures. we were told to stand at attention for god knows how much time,,could have been an eternity,,then and this says it all about what the mane of the game is, We were given the order to kil. God I love the Corps, and God this was ingrained so deep and all of the time, because the name of the game is to Kill. And no movie can convey the importance or the reason why Marine Corp "Boot Camp" was or possibly is the way it was or is. The smells, the sweat, the time,,as I went through it there was only one option, to be the best. I also questioned my friend and others in the field,, what is it? Do the Marines attract a certain pychologial profile? If so or not what influence does the training have on an individual. And all you guys out there who chose not to become Marines, you have to admit, there is not a bunch of individuals out there that live the word "Brotherhood" better than We Marines. Semper Fi I'll die right now for the Corps, please God!
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 7:01:49 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 7:05:23 PM EDT
wow what a rant,,it was more much more,,the little lessons like standing at attention, while you ass is being chewed apon was nothing to laying in ambush. As far as the training being compared to the Air Force,,I gotta say your old man was in a cave, the recruits today get alot of training that we did not get. Oh, a last tid bit as we snapped into attention on the day of my graduation,,a mosquito landed in my keccken ear and proceeded to suck my blood, in theat moment I could not help but smile(inwardly) a most befitting end of my most beautiful experience of my life.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 7:06:59 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Paul: I'm not a Marine but they are part of my organization - the Department of the Navy. (I'm in the part of the department that passed their ASVAB exams) There were times in boot camp that I wished that I could have just taken a beating. I was squad leader so when any of the fools in my squad screwed up I joined them in their punishment. The 2000 to 2400 marching parties were the first parties I'd ever been to without women and booze. I went more than a dozen times so the head games wore off and they turned into just another workout without the gym. We screwed up on the grinder so our chief put us in our nice thick Navy peacoats, with rain gear over them and put us all in the showers. All 80 of us crammed in there and had to stay there until it started raining. After two or three hours standing at attention and sweating in the hot and humid heat of a San Diego August evening it did start raining. Our sweat was condensing on the ceiling and raining down on us... Then there was the time we got put at push-up position and the instructor when home for the night leaving us there for a few hours until we broke ...
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Please, get a gonad
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 7:21:07 PM EDT
you still don't impress me,,capon,,work on it. And start running to work off your gut. And once more Please!
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 7:24:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2001 7:18:12 PM EDT by Jarhead_22]
We got a similar treatment to what Paul describes: We'd all have to put on field jackets, ponchos and gas masks, then cram all 85 of us in the head with the hatches and portholes closed. Then all the hot water faucets were turned on, and we were directed to begin side-straddle hops. Another fun one was when one guy really screwed up, he'd have to stand in the whiskey locker (big gear closet) and we'd all march by with full 1 quart canteens and throw them at him. A quart of water weighs around 2 pounds, FYI. We never had any blanket parties, but if you had a beef with a guy, you would wake him up in the middle of the night and take care of business by the rear hatch. As long as all the blood was swabbed up by morning, no one was the wiser. We also had to "Meet Mr. Maytag." In the head against the wall behind you when you stood in front of the urinals were our washer and dryer. If you screwed up bad, the third hat would take you in the head and make you do pushups with your boots up on the washer. Your hands would normally be in a puddle of piss provided by 85 guys trying to make a head call in 10 seconds.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 7:30:20 PM EDT
Ermey AKA Hartman used about every line in the D.I. script. He was every D.I. rolled into one. The boot camp stuff was right on the money and yes, instead of one you had for the first few days 5-6 then 3-4 for the rest of your training.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 7:40:56 PM EDT
I always knew that my training was good. It was confirmed the first time I shot someone, in the heat of the moment and very close, the one round I fired dropped the bad guy. That is basically what it boils down to,,the training. Maybe also the mind. Training, training and training, physical and mental,,till it is as easy as breathing,reflex. Kill Kill Kill! and Kill some more. Eat flesh and relish the taste, live for the taste. Yern for more, morn the the fact that unless this current sit. becomes a world war that you will not be able to participate in the game. Totally fustrating when you ass is in better shape than the average male less than half your age. Is this another issue? I don't know but it is true in my reality. Nothing better than sticking/slicing a bad guy or squeezing off a round into bad guy.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 7:47:40 PM EDT
God Damn IronMike's got some serious issues. Don't get caught in the latrine sucking on your M-14 by the fire sentry. [shock]
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 8:00:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Paul: I'm not a Marine but they are part of my organization - the Department of the Navy. (I'm in the part of the department that passed their ASVAB exams)
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[img]http://home.earthlink.net/~thegardenweasel/byebye.jpg[/img] [^]
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 8:02:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Sukebe: Ermey AKA Hartman used about every line in the D.I. script. He was every D.I. rolled into one. The boot camp stuff was right on the money and yes, instead of one you had for the first few days 5-6 then 3-4 for the rest of your training.
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No movie can come close to describing Boot Camp in the Marines , let alone in a war. I don't know,the movie made it look easy. And fucckkin jelly donuts? Wake the fuk up! Not one jelly donut on the island. There was so much more. And I excelled in Boot Camp, was asked to go to canoe university and my first promotion. To me it could have been real bad, wors by a long shot, I still would have made it or died trying.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 8:03:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2001 7:57:19 PM EDT by IronMike]
Originally Posted By Troll: God Damn IronMike's got some serious issues. Don't get caught in the latrine sucking on your M-14 by the fire sentry. [shock]
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Never will happen, and I'll never go "off" cause I'm disicplined. No where close to loosing it. pogue.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 8:04:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Death_By_AR15: Exactly. And Gunny Hartman was funny. You won't find your DI's so funny (most of the time). And they are loud. VERY loud.
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Actually, I found my DI's to be very funny. But at the time they didn't seem funny because of the situation you found yourself in and even if you did feel the urge to laugh, you didn't (for obvious reasons). Looking back and sharing stories with old Marine buddies... it always seems we laugh more about our DI's than anything else we experienced. Their mannerisms, tone of voice, facial expressions, and actions were (at least to me... and looking back) quite funny. They over exaggerated EVERYTHING and they just screwed with you for no apparent reason.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 8:05:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By gardenWeasel: That was filmed at San Diego but they said it was Parris Island because everyone knows that that's where the real Marines come from.
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No, that's were sand flees come from. Real Marines come from MCRD San Diego. [:)] You East Coast Marines always screw that up...
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 8:15:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2001 8:11:57 PM EDT by ColonelKlink]
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 8:25:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By wgunn: No, that's were sand flees come from. Real Marines come from MCRD San Diego. [:)] You East Coast Marines always screw that up...
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We did sessions of push/run/mountain climbers/roll right/roll left etc., in a stinkin' swamp (Third Battalion seemed to have no shortage of these hidden from view within its stomping ground) whenever recruits were caught swatting during drill.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 8:53:37 PM EDT
I was in boot in Sept of 65, The DI's were all black,all had CIB's,and all had Purple Hearts, and were meaner than junkyard dogs. My First Sergeants' name was LoveJoy, talk about oxymoron. He was about 6'7" and made PeeWee Herman look like Sonny Liston. Every morning at 4.30am morning at roll call, he'd sic his team of spitting cobra's on us. Dickheads, this Dickheads that...His favorite expression was,"Dickheads, I want those mess kits shinier than a diamond on a goats ass". He had the peculiar habit of popping his zits while he cussed the living shit out of us. One morning during roll call he found out that a Private Levine had decided that he had enough wasn't going to fall out. Levine! Levine! Where the Fuck is that 'Dickhead' Levine ? After a few tense moments someone volunteered that the Private wanted to sleep in...Lovejoy detonated the zit he was working on, and then marched into the orderly room and out the door with a 1911A1 .45 auto,and we all winced as he racked a round in the chamber and made for barracks #4. Private 'Dickhead' Levine came flying out the door clad only in his skivies and Lovejoy's .45 pointed at the base of his thick skull. The MP's escorted Levine to the stockade where he was never heard from again...The rest of us were glad when the orders for Vietnam came in. I still turn my head when when I hear the words 'dickhead' Sarge was one class act
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 9:16:20 PM EDT
I did drill duty in P.I. '83 and '84. Was the hardest job I ever had in the corps. Second btn. We worked longer than the recruits and had to keep up with them. When you are 28 yrs old and trying to keep up with a 19 yr old athlete it can be challenging. Couple of things to keep in mind. The DI is only there trying to figure out how much stress you can handle, and if it is up to corps standards. He doesn't hate you just hates your lack of faith in yourself. The hardest thing I had to do , believe it or not, Is ripping sum kids head off for nothing with out laughing. Ever been really chewed up and have the DI walk away with his smokey over his face?? he is trying to hide his laugh!! pat
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 9:18:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2001 9:30:24 PM EDT by sharky30]
I read an interview of R. Lee Ermey. He said he actually had to rewrite the dialog to make it more vulgar in order to add realism
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 9:19:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By IronMike:
Originally Posted By Troll: God Damn IronMike's got some serious issues. Don't get caught in the latrine sucking on your M-14 by the fire sentry. [shock]
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Never will happen, and I'll never go "off" cause I'm disicplined. No where close to loosing it. pogue.
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I thought all that was normal stuff for a Marine. I am lucky enough to have two father figures in my life.. One, a (step dad)Marine Vietnam vet that I knew loved to kill. He to this day would still love to "kill gooks". I thought that was normal. I also have an (biological father) Army Vietnam vet father figure, that is probably the most ruthless person I know. Both are loyal, disiplined, family men. I find them easy to admire.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 10:11:02 PM EDT
Er... Paul... I aced the ASVABS.... (and what a great job I had working in one of those places I can't tell you about) But, I was destined to be a Marine from birth... 10 November 1955 one of only 2 great November 10's I can think of... Ted... Semper FI
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 10:17:33 PM EDT
no blanket parties but we did have a couple of "recruit meetings" at the rear hatch. i was never struck by a DI but i dont doubt it happened back in the 60's. the hardest part of getting Bent by a DI was not laughing. at some point towards the end you are in such good shape that getting quarterdecked for something isnt that fearsome. once i was watching a greenbelt tear up some kid across from me "on line" and i couldnt take it anymore. "SIR, RECRUIT B***** REQUESTS PERMISSION TO LAUGH, SIR" he spun around with a look of suprise on his face "go ahead sweet-tits, its gonna cost you" im telling you. being able to cut loose for 10 seconds was worth the 45 minutes i spent in the pit with my rifle. best laugh of my life.
Link Posted: 11/21/2001 9:33:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2001 9:28:30 AM EDT by USNA91]
Originally Posted By gardenWeasel:
Originally Posted By Paul: I'm not a Marine but they are part of my organization - the Department of the Navy. (I'm in the part of the department that passed their ASVAB exams)
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[img]http://home.earthlink.net/~thegardenweasel/byebye.jpg[/img] [^]
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Isn't that just like a Marine...... Tries to finger-fuck a warship because everyone refers to it as "she". Sorry. Couldn't resist. [:D] Edited to add the following: In all sincerity; If I had to do it all over again, I'd definitely join the Marine Corps. No doubts whatsoever.... Semper Fi to the best! [beer]
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