User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 3:03:51 PM EDT
[#1]
HD 870. Each buckshot round you shoot has (9) 9mm balls. Much more effective than a .22.
Plus you can buy these for under $300. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 3:12:35 PM EDT
[#2]
Four main problems with a shotgun...
-can't carry as many rounds -lots of potential for "Innocent bystanders" being near by -unless I take the time to unfold the stock, the shotgun may break my wrist. -can't buy or possess a straight pistol grip here in GA because you have to be 21 to have an aow I am either thinking pre-ban mini/1022, or Bullpup-ing my Marlin 60 |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 3:19:19 PM EDT
[#3]
Chuck,
What is wrong with considering less than lethal force, such as a TASER or pepper spray? I would think your goal would to break contact/disable the aggressor and live to fight another day. Martial arts helps, too. Put some other tools in the toolbox, besides firearms. Jim |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 3:20:33 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted: Four main problems with a shotgun... -can't carry as many rounds How many shots do you think you're gonna need? -lots of potential for "Innocent bystanders" being near by Simple rule is that if you can't safely take the shot you don't take the shot. Remember you're accountable for your actions. -unless I take the time to unfold the stock, the shotgun may break my wrist. Never broke mine. -can't buy or possess a straight pistol grip here in GA because you have to be 21 to have an aow An AOW is a different animal from a folding stocked riot gun. I am either thinking pre-ban mini/1022, or Bullpup-ing my Marlin 60 If your mind is made up why ask for opionions? [img]http://w1.511.telia.com/~u51102888/anims/cartoon6/dad_anm.gif[/img]......I vote for the 870 |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 3:24:55 PM EDT
[#5]
Quoted: Chuck, What is wrong with considering less than lethal force, such as a TASER or pepper spray? I would think your goal would to break contact/disable the aggressor and live to fight another day. Martial arts helps, too. Put some other tools in the toolbox, besides firearms. Jim |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 3:42:53 PM EDT
[#6]
Go with the 870, the pistol grip does not make the 870 an aow. You can use slug so you don't have to worry about scatter pattern, or you can use rounds like the bean bag. The normal distance for a gunfight is less than 15 feet so you don't need snipper type shot placements. Don't worry about ammo 1 or 2 shots and the bad guys will scatter. The shotgun will not break your wrist, I've used this setup and have never had a problem. I would useing some type of less than lethal loads strongly. Semper Fi and God Bless
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 4:30:01 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted: Go with the 870, the pistol grip does not make the 870 an aow. You can use slug so you don't have to worry about scatter pattern, or you can use rounds like the bean bag. The normal distance for a gunfight is less than 15 feet so you don't need snipper type shot placements. Don't worry about ammo 1 or 2 shots and the bad guys will scatter. The shotgun will not break your wrist, I've used this setup and have never had a problem. I would useing some type of less than lethal loads strongly. Semper Fi and God Bless What he said. Go with the 870!! They are built like a tank and will last forever!!! [shotgun] |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 4:45:50 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted: -Ruger Mini-14(yes I have been told, crap) -Chuck first, i favor the shotgun approach. second, the mini 14 is only crap when the person tries to make it a sniper rifle. that was never the purpose and hence was never built to be dead on accurate. i had no problems putting the bullets where i wanted them to go. but i also know i never would win a shooting competition with one. given that less than 5% of the times a firearm is used in self-defense results in the actual discharge of the firearm, it wouldn't be that big of a deal. and simply aiming it at him (perp) and putting one near him would probably be enough to dissuade him from his original intentions. either send him running and/or give you enough time to take more action (run or take better aim). off the mini soap box now. [:)] |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 4:50:21 PM EDT
[#9]
-can't buy or possess a straight pistol grip here in GA because you have to be 21 to have an aow They ain't no AOW. Per info from a FFL off another site- The ATF [i]DID[/i] get into a tizzy about them a while back, and said that they (stockless Pistol gripped shotties) were classified as pistols, thus could only be sold to those over 21- but they since recanted. They will be AOW's soon enough though. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 4:50:43 PM EDT
[#10]
I'd go with a shotgun, specifically, the 870. I'd load the first two shots with a less than lethal beanbag round. If it takes more than 2 beanbags to bring someone down (meaning beanbags aint gonna cut it), load some buck in the last couple spots to back up the LTL rounds.
But always fire the shotgun as if it were loaded with real shells. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 5:01:53 PM EDT
[#11]
No flame, but if I was in the "wrong part of town" I would worry about the theft of a firearm I had to leave in a vehicle. But if I had to carry a firearm, I would go for the shotgun, with a shortened but legal barrell, and a shortened stock. I have a youth gun for the kids that is about the legnth of the average .22 rifle that is very handy. fullclip
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 5:24:15 PM EDT
[#12]
When I was in New York City in the 1970’s, the NYPD used double barrel shotguns. Their position at the time was that they never needed more than two rounds.
I don’t think they still use them, and I’m definitely not suggesting you get a double barrel shotgun. Its just that you need to forget all the blazing gunfights you see in the movies – with rare exception, that’s not the real world. An 870 is an awesome weapon even by today’s standards. If you’re worried about recoil, use lighter loads. If you’re worried about bystanders (assuming they’re not too close), use a smaller pellet such as #4 buck. Also, racking the action and/or making potential assailants look down the cavernous barrel of that thing can encourage these folks to leave you alone without having to fire a shot – always a good thing! I don’t know if I’m disagreeing with ARlady or not, but keep in mind that any discharge of a firearm, even as a warning shot, is probably going to be viewed by the courts as justified only if deadly force was justified at the time. This becomes real important if someone is injured by that “warning shot”. Typically, you can’t fire a round just to help someone along. (Admittedly, the views of different states and courts on this may vary.) |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 5:25:55 PM EDT
[#13]
Sounds like the man lives close to Hotlanta? Like fullclip, I would only leave a "throwaway" in my vehicle in that situation. I know its the wrong term to use but you guys know what I mean. One option that hasn't been brought to light would be a Dbl Barrel 12ga. I have seen short versions called "Coach Guns" new that were cheap. A pawn shop... maybe even cheaper. Small,lightweight and no safety I believe. Plenty of options (ammo type) for defensive situations. The first thing that comes to mind when looking at one from the wrong end would be: "My grandma... what big eyes you have!!!"[shock] A putride smell that would emit from BG and the pitter patter of BG feet would let you know that you have made the right choice. Good enough for the stage coaches for a reason I suppose......... |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 5:43:48 PM EDT
[#14]
Go with a M-17. I absolutley love mine, ultra reliable acurate. Plus you get 30 ronds, versus, what 8 or 9 with a shot gun. Plus I would take a semi over a pump anyday. It's short and it's manuverable, perfect for in a car.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/14/2001 5:49:35 PM EDT
[#15]
Plus if I was a perp, I would be more likely to back down facing down a 870 pump pistol grip than some tricked out .22.
[shotgun] On the pumps versus auto SG's, I am almost as fast on the pump, and it is more dependable. BTW, the double barrel shotgun can be just as intimidating. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 5:05:28 AM EDT
[#16]
I think I am leaning towards the m-17. About how much am I looking to spend?
-Chuck I did not mention that my air conditioner is broke and i leave my window down when it's hot. I also work in a gun range so I can leave the gun in the range till I go to the car. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 5:07:10 AM EDT
[#17]
I think I am leaning towards the m-17. About how much am I looking to spend?
-Chuck I did not mention that my air conditioner is broke and i leave my window down when it's hot. I also work in a gun range so I can leave the gun in the range till I go to the car. So what's the cheapest route for an 870?, i am in college, cheap is good[uzi] -Chuck |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 6:15:34 AM EDT
[#18]
New 870 Express can be found for around $230. If I remember correctly they made a "combo" with two barrels, long and short.
Or you could go to a pawnshop and find an old 870 there for $150-$175 and have your local smith trim the barrel down and re-bead it. Or you could look for a police trade-in, which pop up every now and then. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 6:20:38 AM EDT
[#19]
Dude buy your self an old SKS.
Damn thing will never brake,it's per-ban so you can put any stock on it. Nice and cheap,good junk gun just to keep in the car. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 6:32:43 AM EDT
[#20]
winchester's model 94 trapper in 44 mag...6 pounds, 34" long, 16" barrel and it holds up to 9 rounds.
if you like in a pc area, the last thing you want is to have to explain why you have a "militarized" or "assault" style weapon in your vehicle. the beauty of a level action is that most everyone has a nice warm fuzzy feel about them. lever actions are a part of americana and if you are stopped or have to use it--you can just refer to it as your "deer rifle". http://www.winchester-guns.com/prodinfo/catalog/md94/m94_trapper.htm if you like marlin better they have a very comperable model... http://www.marlinfirearms.com/firearms/1894_centerfireRifles/1894P.htm good luck, sloth |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 6:36:22 AM EDT
[#21]
How about a Kel-Tec sub2000.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 6:45:38 AM EDT
[#22]
i'm not following the logic on the m17. what's your thinking on this. is it mainly teh 30 round capability? do already own an ar15? why spend 600.00 on such a similar rifle that doesn't even have fully interchangable parts? i like the 870, myself. or perhaps somethign simlar. the m17 just does not seem practical in any sense. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 6:53:06 AM EDT
[#23]
Armalite, I was reading this thread and wondering why nobody had suggested the Kel-Tec. If you can't find one of the new 2000's they will be out soon, or you can get one of the older models. they fold up small enough to bit in a backpack or a briefcase, are pretty light and take highcap pistol mags. Get either the Glock or the Beretta 92 version (Keltec 2000).
I have a buttload of G17 mags for a gun I got rid of, so I might go this route, or might also go for the Beretta 92 model since I have a dozen or so mags for this gun as well. Too bad they didn't make one for the Browning HP, you can get military highcaps for less than $20! |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 8:07:26 AM EDT
[#24]
antoher thing to keep in mind some of the newer "cruiser" model shotguns from mossberg and remington have a dao trigger group like a hammerless revolver would, meaning it's never cocked so they're supposed to be completely safe to have chambered and ready in a vehicle.
wonder how dao trigger would work on quail? Henry Bowman could do it. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 11:23:48 AM EDT
[#25]
If that's your situation your first choice is to carry a pistol anyway. Buy one from an individual. Second choice, get the 870. I saw a new one the other day. It was an express with a factory extended mag. This is a new item I guess and it was 275 new. Don't get the folding stock or pistol grip if you want to hit your target. You need a solid stock. Remember if you get in a shooting scrap your gun will become "evidence" a wind up in some property room rusting for two years. Don't spend too much. Get a used Smith model 10 or any fixed sight K frame or a used 870.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 6:07:32 PM EDT
[#26]
Well my thinking on the M17s is that is is small enough to manevaer around ina vehicle and has lots of power as opposed to a pistol. I don't already have an AR-15 so it would be ok. I would definately have to put a folding stock on a 870 to make it manvearable. The lever-action is not a bad Idea, might go that route.
-Chuck where can I get some info on the KEL-TEC, does it Jam, and COst$$? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 6:09:46 PM EDT
[#27]
Well my thinking on the M17s is that is is small enough to manevaer around ina vehicle and has lots of power as opposed to a pistol. I don't already have an AR-15 so it would be ok. I would definately have to put a folding stock on a 870 to make it manvearable. The lever-action is not a bad Idea, might go that route.
-Chuck where can I get some info on the KEL-TEC, does it Jam, and COst$$? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 6:57:39 PM EDT
[#28]
I like a paratrooper SKS with folding stock. Use the factory 10 round mag so you can dump the rounds in the mag if you need to. It makes a great car gun,short ,slim,and fast.I still got a bunch of steel core bullets.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 7:10:49 PM EDT
[#29]
Why not get a shotgun and loaded it with non lethal rounds? I have seen bean bags hit a guy who was 6'9 350lbs and it knocked him on his ass.
There are also a lot of other less lethal rounds out there they have some that are like buckshot and if you hit anyone that your not aiming at all they will have is a bad bruise. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 8:06:07 PM EDT
[#30]
The Kel-Tec should cost about $275 and it takes different makes of magazines (don't know which ones but can probably get high caps). It is available in 9mm or .40 cal. It seems like it will be a pretty cool little rifle and perfect for the car.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/15/2001 8:12:08 PM EDT
[#31]
I like sloth's idea on the lever-gun. I have an older, full-sized mod 94 in .44mag. It holds nine rounds and can handle most problems that would arise. A lever-gun is about as PC as you can get while actually having a gun. They are compact, light, and fast handling. The .44 mag out of a rifle is some pretty decent firepower.
I would not go with a less-than-lethal option. If I was in a situation where I needed a firearm, I damn sure don't want the first two rounds in the tube to be beanbags. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
