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Posted: 10/7/2001 6:57:31 PM EDT
In the PRK we are not allowed to take an "assault weapon" to a friend's house to show it off. Open carry will get you "suicide by cop" in any city. And that's even if it is unloaded. If some psycho terrorists start waging war in our cities, do you think Big Brother will let us start packing on our morning commutes, or do you think that our society is already so far gone that civilian terror casualties will be acceptable? How long is it going to be before the sheeple realize that when the socialists in Sacramento disarm them that the only people with guns mean us harm? I would have no compunction about slinging the AR-15 over my shoulder before grabbing my briefcase. Do it now and I would be in jail for a long time, but when push comes, I don't intend to be one of the ducks in a shooting gallery.
Link Posted: 10/7/2001 6:59:57 PM EDT
Those of us that live in parts of the country that are [b]STILL FREE[/b] don't have to worry about this. I go to work with my Beretta, legally inside my center console. No CCW required for that here.
Link Posted: 10/7/2001 7:03:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/7/2001 6:58:18 PM EDT by beanbagger]
if you haven't already done so, make sure you install the trapdoor buttstock on your ar so you can carry some extra tin foil.
Link Posted: 10/7/2001 7:05:47 PM EDT
We are a "Bananna Republic" we are not a part of the United States. Down here even "Flag Burning" will likely put you in the hospital with "Multiples".
Link Posted: 10/7/2001 7:10:38 PM EDT
what I worry about...is the anti's that run out "converted" after the SHTF, those idiots buying up guns and not knowing how to use them scares me if it comes down to random acts of terrorism....a la "Invasion U.S.A".
Link Posted: 10/7/2001 7:19:48 PM EDT
The 2002 state elections might be a great time to get people on our side. Which party lets you buy weapons? The NRA sunk Gore in 2000, now we can get his cohorts, like Condit.
Link Posted: 10/7/2001 9:10:45 PM EDT
Who the Hell do you think the US government is going to rely upon to defend the US should we ever be invaded. You and I. Benjamin
Link Posted: 10/7/2001 9:22:17 PM EDT
Piss on bid brother. I carry every day on my morning commute. I rely on no one but myself for protection! [uzi]
Link Posted: 10/7/2001 9:26:17 PM EDT
I do not foresee the US government returning any 2nd Amendment rights willfully - regardless of the crisis. A lot of people want to bring our nation under full-blown socialism right now- and returning gun rights would be counterproductive to the Chuck Schumers and Swinesteins of this world. Here in Germany every firearm purchase is treated the same as purchasing a destrucive device, Class III, or Class II weapon in the States. Fortunately, I have my toys at home in the States in a state that still respects the 2nd Amendment. The only way we can get our 2nd Amendment rights back is if all gun owners are extremely vocal and active - and if America itself wakes up to reality. Even after the attacks on New York City, I still see most Americans as being sunk into apathy - concerned with the almighty dollar rather then freedom or defending America.
Link Posted: 10/7/2001 11:31:00 PM EDT
Should the situation in the states ever approach that in Israel I will be carrying at all times. CCW or not. But then I live in a county where the local deputy stops by and encourages me and my kid to keep practicing when they get reports of gun fire (us) [:)]
Link Posted: 10/7/2001 11:47:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By beanbagger: if you haven't already done so, make sure you install the trapdoor buttstock on your ar so you can carry some extra tin foil.
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If you haven't already done so, pick up a newspaper or turn on a TV. Something happened in a state near you, recently. If you had made the "foil" wisecrack a month ago, you would have looked pretty foolish on the 11th. Come to think of it.........
Link Posted: 10/7/2001 11:59:15 PM EDT
Unfortunately, the aftermath of Sept. 11 escalated R.G.s Popularity in NY. One of the biggest gun grabbers.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 12:21:51 AM EDT
Now I don't want to do any profiling... But think of this. I am told by the local newspaper that there are 39,000 Afganistans in the US legally. Of that 39,000 - 4,000 live in the city of Hayward CA. I do not know if these stats are right. I live in Hayward. The Afgan Americans I know of are hard working blue collar men. None of them support the taliban or bin laden. They tell me the same thing I hear from other Americans, what a bunch of stupid idiots (the terrorists). An Afgan-American delivers ice cream to both my handicapped sons daily. And some stupid assholes pulled him out of the icecream truck and beat him up. Just great, Beat up the @#$%#$* icecream man. The dude is not being supported by some rich maniac if he is working in a damn icecream truck. I'm glad he is ok and came back to work after a few weeks. Change of discussion-I be drinkin. May God watch over the innocent children, woman, and men and especially our military forces. Our retaliation has just begun! And yes I carry. Not all the time. I would rather sacrafice a misdemeanor than my life. It is a pistol. I would rather have a rifle ready but... mabey in a locked case... at least I would have a pistol to get to the rifle... Hmmm... I gotta go to sleep........
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 12:28:32 AM EDT
The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, sir, let it come. It is in vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, Peace, Peace–but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! The next gale that sweeps from the north will bring to our ears the clash of resounding arms! Our brethren are already in the field! Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 12:40:20 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/8/2001 12:39:34 AM EDT by misterhemi]
In a sense our cities have already become battle zones, as they are targets. Without a doubt, they will be attacked! Now, by what means - who knows? If it is by Nuclear, Biological or Chemical weapons then there may not be a visible enemy to engage upon our streets. It would seem, having killed as many as they did, they would only move on to more distructive, much larger attacks. While possible and maybe somewhat likely, it would not be practical for terrorist to engage us - in person - upon the streets. If it does resort to this, then [B]without[/B] hesitation I shall arm myself as well. And so be it! [Edited because lately I have been screwing up so badly - can't spell, leave out words, poor conjugation, etc, etc.... Bad, bad, baaaadd!]
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 1:14:00 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Wheelgunner: An Afgan-American delivers ice cream to both my handicapped sons daily. And some stupid assholes pulled him out of the icecream truck and beat him up. Just great, Beat up the @#$%#$* icecream man. The dude is not being supported by some rich maniac if he is working in a damn icecream truck. I'm glad he is ok and came back to work after a few weeks.
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Yet some still view bigotry (even here), as a good thing. Very disturbing. Thank you for sharing that! The news and media, is in "war mode". So most of us will never know the real stories.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 1:20:31 AM EDT
The truth is that it's doubtful that we'll see terrorist action on the scale to warrant carrying an AR in to work, but it's nice to have the option! The key is to do so discretely. I work in manhattan, and the day after the 11th, I brought my guitar case in. I quietly set it up and put in in a corner by my desk, locked, loaded, safety on, with a sportsjacket thrown over it. If I need it, it's there. I think that this attack will wake people up to the fact that we can't continually rely on the government to protect us, we need to help ourselves (a foreign concept to a lot of americans unfortunately). As far as our cities turning into battlezones, personally, I don't see it happening. Then again, if you asked me on September 10th if I thought that 2 planes would smash into the WTC and another into the pentagon, I would've said that's improbable too. It's better to be prepared and not need a weapon than need a weapon and not have it due to complacency, or worse yet, legislation. Oh, one more thing. No more badmouthing Mayor Rudy! Say what you want, the guy's a hell of a leader in a crisis. SAMHAIN44
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 2:14:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/8/2001 5:55:29 AM EDT by platform389]
Originally Posted By Stealth:
Originally Posted By Wheelgunner: An Afgan-American delivers ice cream to both my handicapped sons daily. And some stupid assholes pulled him out of the icecream truck and beat him up. Just great, Beat up the @#$%#$* icecream man. The dude is not being supported by some rich maniac if he is working in a damn icecream truck. I'm glad he is ok and came back to work after a few weeks.
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Yet some still view bigotry (even here), as a good thing. Very disturbing.
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These are only the first sprinkles in the coming storm. When the car bombs start going off, or the bioweapon kills a few more thousand, your ice cream guy will wish he was somewhere else very, very badly. As I said in another thread, the general population still wants to maintain that warm fuzzy multicultural, "I'm alright, you're alright" attitude. To use your example, what will happen when the ice cream truck blows up near a school or other large group of children. Don't think it will happen? Ask the folks in Israel about their experiences. This has only just begun, it will get nasty, and some of it will be fought right here. Tinfoil hat or not, the "party" is only just getting started.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 2:43:42 AM EDT
One word...... MOVE After the WTC was bombed in, 1993?, Do you think that I would have stepped foot back in that building? I was raised in NY, and after having visited most of the other states (except HI, SD and NM) in the last ten years, I've found the place to live. Don't all you come running this way, but know that there is still room in this great state. Not comfortable where you are at? Then get the hell out and move somewhere better.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 2:55:48 AM EDT
Originally posted by Samhain44: The truth is that it's doubtful that we'll see terrorist action on the scale to warrant carrying an AR in to work, but it's nice to have the option! The key is to do so discretely. I work in manhattan, and the day after the 11th, I brought my guitar case in. I quietly set it up and put in in a corner by my desk, locked, loaded, safety on, with a sportsjacket thrown over it. If I need it, it's there. I think that this attack will wake people up to the fact that we can't continually rely on the government to protect us, we need to help ourselves (a foreign concept to a lot of americans unfortunately). As far as our cities turning into battlezones, personally, I don't see it happening. Then again, if you asked me on September 10th if I thought that 2 planes would smash into the WTC and another into the pentagon, I would've said that's improbable too. It's better to be prepared and not need a weapon than need a weapon and not have it due to complacency, or worse yet, legislation. Oh, one more thing. No more badmouthing Mayor Rudy! Say what you want, the guy's a hell of a leader in a crisis.
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True, hopefully people will wake up a bit.
Originally posted by RobertInMaine: One word...... MOVE After the WTC was bombed in, 1993?, Do you think that I would have stepped foot back in that building? I was raised in NY, and after having visited most of the other states (except HI, SD and NM) in the last ten years, I've found the place to live. Don't all you come running this way, but know that there is still room in this great state. Not comfortable where you are at? Then get the hell out and move somewhere better.
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Well I may not be entirely happy with the state of affairs in California but battles are not won by running away and nothing is lost until you've given up! Look at the casualties inflicted upon the V.C. in Viet Nam, they were many! Did they give up? No. Things may get worse but they eventually have to get better. Throughout history things have swung back and forth.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 4:14:54 AM EDT
Look at the casualties inflicted upon the V.C. in Viet Nam, they were many! Did they give up? No.
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Actually, yes they did. The VC were all killed during their Tet offensive of '68. After that it was strictly NVA. They were bombed into submission and gave up at the Paris peace talks. They left South VietNam, we got our prisoners back and we pulled our combat troops out. After that, the NVA came back in & we ignored the country. The TV footae you keep seeing is the embassy guards & CIA evacuating their friends & co-workers. It was NOT the US military being defeated or driven out of South VietNam.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 4:21:51 AM EDT
Some people love their country. Some people just love themselves. Some people wish that we could carry our ARs with us all the time as per the 2nd and RKBA. Other people wish that our country would become so dangerous that this was needed -"it would be cool". Some people just can't wait to head for the hills, to shoot at any of their neighbors who get in the way. They think that's "freedom". They think being a "patriot" means supporting the freedom to run and hide when their country needs them. If things get so hairy that any of these SHTF scenarios come to be, our country will be lost. To wish for these things, because it fulfills some Rambo/SHTF fantasy that you've been dreaming/wishing/preparing for is wrong. If you wish for this, then you're wishing for America's doom. Fuck you.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 4:58:56 AM EDT
Post from Norm_G -
They were bombed into submission and gave up at the Paris peace talks.
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You are sooo correct! It's amazing how few folks know the amount of fear that American bombing put into the North Vietnamese! We've been told that the bombing was practically useless against a people not that far removed from the Stone Age. In truth, if we had started that kind of bombing in 1965, that we were doing in 1970, the war would have ended a helluva lot earlier, and with a much different outcome. Imagine the Vietnam War Memorial in Washington D.C., with about 5,600 names on it rather then 56,000! Eric The(OurLeadersAreSeldomWorthyOfTheMenTheyLead­)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 5:25:02 AM EDT
whatever..prk, if they day comes when you need to carry an ar to work along with a briefcase, something is horribly wrong with where you work, or live, or with civilazation in general. ...or maybe your threat perception. if it does come to pass, worrying about how legal it is will likely be far down on your list of priorites. ps. i wonder how many people in this thread were wacking it as they fondled their ar's last night.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 9:19:22 AM EDT
Hey, Isn't there a town somewhere that the Gun Owners of America put together as a "community of firearm enthuasists" that encourages you to sling your AR over your shoulder with your briefcase? Maybe some people should consider moving... Another point to make, that no one else has brought up is this - what good would an AR have done if you were working on the 110th floor of the WTC? What are you going to do? Shoot the fucking plane? Shoot your way out of the building? Help with "crowd control" on the scene? Gimme a break. If I pulled up to a burning WTC and I was NYPD, and I saw some dude waving an AR around, I'd ask him once to place it on the ground and back away from it. If he didn't, I'd remedy the problem with hot lead. You want the RTC? Hey, I'm all for it, but I also agree wholeheartedly with Major Murphy when he said that there's some twisted people out there looking for a disaster to justify them living out gun toting fantasies a la red dawn, invasion usa, and alot of other stupid 80's movies we've seen mentioned with great frequency on this site since 9/11.... One more thing - Moving away is not the answer. As much as I love the great state of Maine, particularly Baxter state park, Moosehead lake and Bar Harbor, don't delude yourself into thinking that no harm will befall you in your little corner of the USA. Tell me, when that big wind called the gulf stream blows radiactive fallout up to your front door and you and your family start growing an extra set of heads, will you still be safe? I think not. How about when the terrorists carting chem or bio weapons get into a car wreck in Bangor on their way to NYC and their munitions detonate prematurely, will you be safe then? I'll feel a great deal safer when Afghanistan, Iraq and a few other countries are glass craters you can see from space. nuff said. SAMHAIN44
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 9:32:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/8/2001 9:41:30 AM EDT by Rangemaster]
[b]
In the PRK we are not allowed to take an "assault weapon" to a friend's house to show it off. Open carry will get you "suicide by cop" in any city. And that's even if it is unloaded.
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[/b] Madkiwi, where do you live? I'm in the 2nd biggest city's suburbs, and I take my stuff anywhere I want to. Open carry is legal in a vehicle if a rifle is unloaded, that's why gun racks are legal! I always travel packed, that's what those little plastic (pistol) boxes are for! The police couldn't care less, as long as you're law-abiding. Now if you mean because you didn't register your ar's, now that's a different issue. I totally understand. Quote by Norm G:[b]
Actually, yes they did. The VC were all killed during their Tet offensive of '68. After that it was strictly NVA. They were bombed into submission and gave up at the Paris peace talks. They left South VietNam, we got our prisoners back and we pulled our combat troops out.
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[/b] The VC were killed by the NVA once they were ready to move their regulars South. The VC were the hardcore patriots who believed they really were fighting for Uncle Ho's independent Vietnam. Actually, the NVA were simply using the image of good Uncle Ho to the VC to soften up the South, collect intelligence on the US and test us out. When the time was right, the NVA killed off the VC, moved South, and fought any remaining resistance while the US (broke their promises to the South) moved out of the country. The bombing raids were largely ineffective as stated since the infrastructure supporting the war effort was Russian, not Vietnamese, and we weren't bombing them. After the war the NVA rewarded their friends with land and businesses in the South. Listening to the accents heard downtown in Ho Chi Minh city today proves it.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 9:38:50 AM EDT
Samhain and Major Murphey I agree totally. There are very few stituations where several untrained armed people could make a matter better. I agree that a weapon could be used for defending yourself or others but if anyone thinks that they are going to "save the day" by running around and shooting terrorist in the street they are sadly mistaken. It more likely that they would be shot by the police, other armed citizens, or the terrorist themselves. If I was in either of those buildings I would have traded all my weapons for several 100 ft of static line and a carabiner or a parachute.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 10:17:37 AM EDT
In the event of a terrorist attack in most large cities, it would not be the terrorists running around the streets shooting thier ak's that would be a problem.It would be the gang bangers, street thugs, and other general scum that would take advantage of the situation that would be a threat to the average joe, imho. During the L.A. riots, I was working in Compton and the leo's had no problem with the fact that all persons on our crew were visibly armed. We had no problems with looters or rioters. No macho bravado b.s. just what needed to be done to protect ourselves so we could do what we had to do. I guess we could have stayed home, but, just like now, if you give in to fear, you lose.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 1:02:33 PM EDT
Ok ok ok, everyone is welcome to move here except Samhain and Major Murphey. I've never been called a coward before, and my awards and decorations speak otherwise.... but it's easy to judge from a mere comment on the web. On the one hand, if our country needs it, we will stand up and fight. I've got all the faith in the world in our Military and G.W. On the other hand.... if you like having both legs, you don't picnic in a mine-field. I doubt that we've seen the last of these mid-east jokers. We need to pay more attention to our friends and neighbors. Nothing wrong with that. I rarely ever knew any of my neighbors in NY, but I know all of my neighbors here in Maine. Let's all remember who the enemy is. God Bless
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 1:37:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By JIMBEAM: Samhain and Major Murphey I agree totally. There are very few stituations where several untrained armed people could make a matter better.
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But you imply that none of us have taken any tactical training courses. How many here have been to Thunder Ranch or similar? How many are ex-military?
I agree that a weapon could be used for defending yourself or others but if anyone thinks that they are going to "save the day" by running around and shooting terrorist in the street they are sadly mistaken.
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I agree with you, up to the point that I believe saving my own life or the lives of those around me IS saving the day. Better to have a gun and need it than need a gun and not have it. But I have no fantasies of being Rambo. God Bless Texas
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 2:02:52 PM EDT
Rangemaster- I'd have to look again, but I think I remember something about "no open rifle carry" within 1000 feet of a school unless it's in your trunk and/or locked case, even if it is unloaded. I guess if you live in a less urban area the rifle rack would work, but even in most suburbs you'd have very few roads to drive on that would be outside the 1000 foot radius of every school. (I think I saw that law in "How to Own a Gun and not go to Jail in California", but I don't have it handy)
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 2:17:21 PM EDT
Just a few quick things: 1) I'm not saying that anyone who chooses to live in a rural part of the country is a coward, I just don't think the answer to this problem is for the entirety of the NYC population to move to Maine. I mean, would YOU want Rev. Al Sharpton as your new neighbor? Also, don't think that because you happen to live just south of timbuktu that you're gonna be safe. 2) Though I may not have agreed before 9/11, and it's certianly no absolute now, I doubt that "gang thugs" will take advantage of a city hit by terrorism. In NYC, it's so quiet at night (I work 11PM-7AM) you can hear a rat fart from 3 blocks away. Criminals, if nothing else, know when it's time not to play with "the man" and believe me, the man is out in force, pissed off, and packing a SAW M249 mounted on a Natnl. Guard Hummer. 3) People should use an AR to protect themselves and their families. As far as traveling protection goes, look into a handgun permit. An AR is alot of firepower that you most likely won't need to use, and it's also wrong for the application. You want a longarm? Try a shotgun, it'd be a better call (and easier on the laws in most places) than your AR. Leave the AR at home with a wife and kids that know how to use it until Dad gets home. That's your best call. SAMHAIN44
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 3:56:34 PM EDT
Damn, I had almost forgotten about Al Sharpton! Whatever happened to Tawana Brawley(sp?) anyway? I've still got relations in NY and I pray for them. Sheesh, I pray for us all.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 4:02:43 PM EDT
... I just flew in from [b]Seattle[/b] after spending about a week there. I took my Para-Ordnance. Checked her at [b]Phoenix[/b] and back home no problem. The flight attendant in [b]SeaTac[/b] says [i]"that's a good idea these days to travel with a firearm"[/i] ... I reminded her that it has always been a good idea.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 4:16:16 PM EDT
Sucks to be you dude. In Texas we are still free. Get out of that lame ass republik.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 4:55:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/8/2001 4:50:04 PM EDT by GodBlessTexas]
Originally Posted By ar50troll: Sucks to be you dude. In Texas we are still free. Get out of that lame ass republik.
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Amen! Best advice I've heard so far. Some places are a lost cause. Just turn tail and run before you turn to salt with the socialists. [:)] God Bless Texas
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 5:05:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RobertInMaine: Damn, I had almost forgotten about Al Sharpton! Whatever happened to Tawana Brawley(sp?) anyway? I've still got relations in NY and I pray for them. Sheesh, I pray for us all.
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She admitted smearing herself with feces (shit) to make it appear she was attacked. Lying POS. Sharpton too.
Link Posted: 10/8/2001 5:52:41 PM EDT
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