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Posted: 8/23/2001 7:51:58 AM EDT
I hope so, because I already bought it. [:|]
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 7:54:48 AM EDT
Nothing wrong with that!
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 7:56:09 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/23/2001 7:56:44 AM EDT by Ian]
Originally Posted By Orion: I hope so, because I already bought it. [:|]
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That's what I use!
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 7:56:58 AM EDT
Do you live in an apartment? Do you live with other people? Are the interior walls of your home drywall? Think about what happens if you MISS with one or more pellets. A 00 buck pellet is, what, .35 caliber? How many walls will that penetrate? I kinda lean towards 1-1/8 oz #2 shot myself.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 7:59:53 AM EDT
Originally Posted By KBaker: Do you live in an apartment? Do you live with other people? Are the interior walls of your home drywall? Think about what happens if you MISS with one or more pellets. A 00 buck pellet is, what, .35 caliber? .
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I remember reading somewhere its .30 - as in a .308 or 30-06. NOT the best choice for home defense, IMO. I STILL think the BEST home defense firearm is a handgun.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 8:09:21 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 8:12:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/23/2001 8:19:04 AM EDT by KBaker]
Ok, 00 buck is 0.33", 000 buck is 0.36", 0 buck is 0.32". #2 shot is 0.15". See [url]http://www.thesportingchef.com/hunt/shotsizes.htm[/url] for more information.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 8:13:53 AM EDT
I prefer #6...or even #8 bird shot to 00 Buck. I don't like the going thru walls thing either. I use 2 3/4 or 3" #6. Lots of pellets...coming out of Cly. bore is a deadly combo. My .02
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 8:17:09 AM EDT
Originally Posted By raf: In the confines of the normal home, the benefits of shotgun patterning are greatly diminished. Pattern your smoothbore at the longest distance found in your house. Most likely 20-25 feet. Result: still-concentrated cluster of shot; not really a pattern yet due to insufficient distance for the shot to spread. Given the choice, I'd take the handgun, fed with ammo CAREFULLY selected to suit the environment in which the pistol might be used.
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Shotguns have the advantage of being [i]very[/i] effective stoppers, but the disadvantage of being unwieldy in close-quarters. A single hit by a shotgun will be much more effective than a single hit by a handgun. However, I agree that a handgun is a better defensive weapon in a house given your caveat of ammo choice.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 8:30:04 AM EDT
Bird shot, unless you have a really large house, then the short range of bird shot is just as bad as buck shot. a bellyfull of birdshot and the realization that this is not a sheep house.... gets most of those cowards to to a premature defication. But it is just a spackle and a paint and nobody knows what happened.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 8:30:13 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 8:36:20 AM EDT
I keep a handgun next to my bed for the instant when "I hear the glass break", and a shotgun in the corner, loaded with Federal Premium OO. Yeah, it will penetrate walls, but I use it for a couple of reasons. I have a Vang-Comp barrel, so it patterns very cleanly, not to mention an optical sight to keep my entire pattern on target, as opposed to a bead, where you are effectivley "throwing" your pattern. I don't really have to worry about strays. If I miss with the entire load, well, it will penetrate the walls , but so will a handgun, so that argument dosn't work. Also, I can run through my house at a full sprint with my shotgun, and havn't had a problem "handling" it, so if you aren't very coordinated, it probably isn't for you. 12ga is the best for home defense IMO, so far ahead of it's competitors, there really isn't a debate.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 8:39:20 AM EDT
Now for serious social work, #4 buck, or OOO also work. my old mentor used to swear by a double barrel, I saw him lay down fire faster and longer than one could with a pump or auto
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 8:41:41 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 8:50:43 AM EDT
I shot a 3-Gun match last week where one stage required 00 Buck and the best 3 hits were scored. I patterned at 25 yds on an IPSC target. Mod choke had 4 hits in the A zone, Imp Mod had 5 hits, and Full had 6 hits. All groups had 2 flyers. The full choke pettern was about 1" high and 4" wide. Knowing this I would use the most open choke possible for home defense.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 8:54:21 AM EDT
My uncle keeps a his home defense shot gun loaded with deer slugs, and birdshot alternating. [rail]
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 9:26:19 AM EDT
It can be good depending on your layout. 00 will punch some drywall so if you have a split floor plan and kids down the hall it's no good. If you live by yourself and are not in an apartment, it's OK. Birdshot is the way to go inside. At 7 yards it only opens up to about softball size so it's a hell of a weapon but you do have to aim. Winchester makes a frangible 223 load that could be good in your 15. Other people may make one too. I use 00 but all my bedrooms are on one end of the house and I have a right handed shot down the hall. I could not fire if someone was in the dorway of my bedroom because of a child's bedroom. I would have to let them take a few more steps or hope they run when they see me so I can catch them in the hallway.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 9:37:17 AM EDT
I load the magazine like so, 1st shot: bird shot 2nd shot: Buck 3rd shot: Buck 4th shot: Slug 5th shot: Slug 6th shot: Buck 7th shot: Buck 8th shot: Buck I figure if I'm firing more than 5 shots, it's time to spread out again, 'cause something's fucked.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 9:37:28 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Orion: I hope so, because I already bought it. [:|]
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OO buck is fine for home defense. Keep in mind these pellets are rather big (0.33") and have a lot of penetration capability, about the same as some pistol rounds.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 9:39:24 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Major-Murphy: I load the magazine like so, 1st shot: bird shot 2nd shot: Buck 3rd shot: Buck 4th shot: Slug 5th shot: Slug 6th shot: Buck 7th shot: Buck 8th shot: Buck I figure if I'm firing more than 5 shots, it's time to spread out again, 'cause something's fucked.
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I like rounds 4 and 5... WHOOO HOOOO! If you you need more than 8 you just met GODZILLA.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 10:18:01 AM EDT
I DO, in fact, live in an apartment. So, I basically spent $70 for 200 rounds I can't really even use! [:(] So, what would I use it for then? I guess I'll have to pick up some more appropriate loads for an apartment. Place your suggestions below for an apartment dweller: Or should I just use the 124 gr. 9mm Golden Sabers?
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 10:29:00 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Orion: I DO, in fact, live in an apartment. So, I basically spent $70 for 200 rounds I can't really even use! [:(] So, what would I use it for then? I guess I'll have to pick up some more appropriate loads for an apartment. Place your suggestions below for an apartment dweller: Or should I just use the 124 gr. 9mm Golden Sabers?
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In an apartment your longest shot shouldn't be over 21 FEET (7 yards). I'd use a good high-base dove & quail load, like 1-1/8 oz. of #7. At 7 yards the "pattern" will be about 6" in diameter out of a short barrel with a cylinder bore. I guarantee that will ruin a bad-guy's day, and it won't overpenetrate the walls, or at least whatever gets through the other side won't have much "oomph" left. Go to the range and abuse your shoulder. 00 Buck is FUN!
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 10:56:25 AM EDT
Most people already answered the question but I'll add my two cents because I thought, read and studied this one out for some time. I called a couple of police depts. and even did some crude home testing. Go with the birdshot 6,7,8. 8 if you're really worried about penetrating drywall. It will still destroy a panel but loses most of it's velocity going into it/ some getting through it, and is no longer lethal. 6 penetrates deeper and has more chance to inflict damage after going through drywall. I use 7 or 8, Shoot a panel at 10 feet, you won't be worried about home intruders anymore- trust me.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 11:19:27 AM EDT
Anyone want to buy some 00 buck shot?! [8)]
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 11:24:16 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/23/2001 11:25:03 AM EDT by ECS]
If your appartment building has block firewalls then penetration will not be a problem... 9mm pistol penetration will be just as bad, if not worse than 00 buck
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 11:29:15 AM EDT
Collateral damage is an acceptable price to pay.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 11:40:36 AM EDT
I use the 00, 1 1/8 ounce slug combo too. When I did some research on this subject a while back, the overall opinion was to use #4 Buck shot or less for indoor/home defense purposes. It has very lethal close range properties with little wall penetration.
Link Posted: 8/23/2001 2:23:06 PM EDT
Originally Posted By VonFatman: I prefer #6...or even #8 bird shot to 00 Buck. I don't like the going thru walls thing either. I use 2 3/4 or 3" #6. Lots of pellets...coming out of Cly. bore is a deadly combo. My .02
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My thoughts exactly. And at Home defense ranges, would be VERY effective.
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 5:03:02 PM EDT
I considered this when I lived in an apartment, also. I decided that I hated my neighbors and that a stray round taking them out (despite the lawsuits) would not be so bad--like killing two birds with one stone. Mind you, if someone was breaking in, it was probably my damn neighbor to begin with!
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