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Posted: 4/7/2006 1:28:18 PM EDT
I've never seen 4 guys who who are as vicious as these 4. I can't nail down even one of them who might lose....
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 1:38:52 PM EDT
I sure am hoping Forest embarasses Tito in a Coutoure kind of way-spanking and all, but I don't know if he can do it.

I watched the Spike live last night and I thought those four fights sucked big time. What the hell was wrong with Bonnar? The TV show looks decent enough for the season and I sure can't wait to see Tito and Ken get scrappy.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 1:42:06 PM EDT
Saw it last night...lets make this the offical thread.

Shamrock seems to old, and they were right about that bodybuilder guy.


Link Posted: 4/7/2006 1:45:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ZitiForBreakfast:
Saw it last night...lets make this the offical thread.

Shamrock seems to old, and they were right about that bodybuilder guy.





Ken's coaching abilities are...mundane. Tito seems to have spunk. I still think he's an ass and one of the greatest sports scenes ever was when Randy was litterally spanking his ass.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 1:48:42 PM EDT
That fight between Jardine and Bonnar was kind of a joke. Keith controlled the pace and handed Stephan his own chin with that high kick in the 3rd and it still went unanimous?


3rd season looks exciting already. I'm betting we don't see much of Shamrock doing Bible study with the boys ala Rich Franklin.

Is it just me or does Tito look about 230? I'm sure he'll cut in time for his match, but damn that's a lot of weight.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 1:49:50 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 1:52:28 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 1:53:39 PM EDT
Shamrock is a has-been, not to mention an ass. I would NOT want to be on his team.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 1:59:50 PM EDT
Bonnor is packing on some good size.

Link Posted: 4/7/2006 2:00:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/7/2006 2:02:15 PM EDT by AR15fan]
Shamrock is a has been.

Ortiz's local reputation is nothing like his UFC reputation. I could respect him as a fighter, if he were to clean up his act. I have arrested tweekers in the past who told me the last time they used was at Titos pad in HB. Kimo has a meth problem too which leads me to belive the UFC doesnt have drug testing.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 2:02:33 PM EDT
I'd like to see ortiz vs. franklin
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 5:15:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AR15fan:
which leads me to belive the UFC doesnt have drug testing.

I doubt they do. I would guess a lot of the fighters are on roids.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 6:42:36 PM EDT
when is the Gracie fight?
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 6:46:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By -Absolut-:

Originally Posted By AR15fan:
which leads me to belive the UFC doesnt have drug testing.

I doubt they do. I would guess a lot of the fighters are on roids.



I don't know. Given that roids make your joints so much weaker, it would be pretty stupid to take them in a sport which involves deliberately attacking someone's joints (BJJ).

Link Posted: 4/7/2006 6:50:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By -Absolut-:

Originally Posted By AR15fan:
which leads me to belive the UFC doesnt have drug testing.

I doubt they do. I would guess a lot of the fighters are on roids.



I believe they only test for the title fights, but I could be wrong.

Tito is huge in person, and probably does go around 230.

Looking forward to Arlovski vs. Sylvia 2 also.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 6:52:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By glock223:
when is the Gracie fight?



May 27, still a bit of a wait.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 6:54:16 PM EDT
This will sound stupid, but one of my mom's friends (Barbara) knows a guy who fights in UFC. She (Barbara) says this guy can't hardly get out of bed after a fight and takes him all week just to recover.

I'll have to pry for the guy's name.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 6:54:21 PM EDT
Gracie might be able to pull it off if he keep it on the ground...

That Hughes is a farking animal, though...
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 6:57:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Gracie might be able to pull it off if he keep it on the ground...

That Hughes is a farking animal, though...



Not to take anything away from Matt, but I think the rules favor him a lot, with the shorter rounds and the standups. Royce always works best slowly grinding guys down, don't know if he can do it in (3) 5 minute rounds, and have to worry about getting stood up when he's setting up submissions.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 7:03:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By -Absolut-:

Originally Posted By AR15fan:
which leads me to belive the UFC doesnt have drug testing.

I doubt they do. I would guess a lot of the fighters are on roids.


NSAC does the drug testing. Sylvia has tested pos too.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 7:05:46 PM EDT
ya i was gonna say lots of those fighters look like they eat roids like candy.....especaily ol shamrick. as for royce and matt, matt is gonna fuck that clown all up. andre is gonna kick sylvias ass to
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 7:07:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AZ-K9:

Originally Posted By -Absolut-:

Originally Posted By AR15fan:
which leads me to belive the UFC doesnt have drug testing.

I doubt they do. I would guess a lot of the fighters are on roids.


NSAC does the drug testing. Sylvia has tested pos too.



twice if I remember right.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 7:22:07 PM EDT
I'm just not impressed with Sylvia AT ALL

Now, given, he's 6'8 and all, but just not impressed other than his height
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 7:23:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By glock223:
I'm just not impressed with Sylvia AT ALL

Now, given, he's 6'8 and all, but just not impressed other than his height



I agree, and I'm even less impressed with his attitude.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 7:30:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lester_Burnham:

Originally Posted By glock223:
I'm just not impressed with Sylvia AT ALL

Now, given, he's 6'8 and all, but just not impressed other than his height



I agree, and I'm even less impressed with his attitude.



If I was even close to his size, I'd get in the ring with him, no doubt
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 7:35:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/7/2006 7:38:49 PM EDT by Lester_Burnham]

Originally Posted By glock223:

Originally Posted By Lester_Burnham:

Originally Posted By glock223:
I'm just not impressed with Sylvia AT ALL

Now, given, he's 6'8 and all, but just not impressed other than his height



I agree, and I'm even less impressed with his attitude.



If I was even close to his size, I'd get in the ring with him, no doubt



I remember like 2 years ago, there was so much hype behind him, and I would see him fight and think "why?" I thought I was the only person that didn't see it.

I wish that his fight with Jerome LeBanner would have been signed.

ETA: He looked horrible vs. Assuerio Silva, then that interview afterwards where he was talking about shitting his pants during the fight, what a class act.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 8:27:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lester_Burnham:

Originally Posted By glock223:
I'm just not impressed with Sylvia AT ALL

Now, given, he's 6'8 and all, but just not impressed other than his height



I agree, and I'm even less impressed with his attitude.

+2
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 8:31:41 PM EDT
When is it on? Or did I already miss it . . .
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:18:57 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Steve-in-VA:
When is it on? Or did I already miss it . . .



Thursday nights, Spike TV- the Show.

They have an upcoming fight, 59 I think today or tomorrow.



Link Posted: 4/8/2006 8:50:07 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 4:04:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/8/2006 4:16:01 PM EDT by Variablebinary]
UFC used to be something worth watching. It was more about the fighting styles, and showing the world what works and doesnt work. Even traditional martial arts schools took part.

Now it's just a meathead factory that looks like the yard of any prison in America. No respect, no character and all the flair of WWE. I'll pass, and watch old UFC tapes when men fought four times, no weight classes

Keith Hackney vs Emmanuel Yarbrough

Gracie vs Kimo

Those are legendary. Nothing like that happens now. Just jock douche bags

Tito would need to fight in 4 UFC matches do equal what gracie did in just one

Royce Gracie versus Akebono. None of these current UFC guys have the balls to get into fights like that
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:23:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Variablebinary:
...t



I gotta disagree, the old stuff was good, the best of the new breed (hughes, orlovsky maaaybe franklin) could take on a few of the older champs at a time.

I don't think anyone is gonna beat either Hughes or Orlovshy until they're in has-been mode, like Shamrock slipping and getting TKO'd.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 7:48:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/8/2006 7:50:32 PM EDT by Lester_Burnham]

Originally Posted By Variablebinary:
UFC used to be something worth watching. It was more about the fighting styles, and showing the world what works and doesnt work. Even traditional martial arts schools took part.

Now it's just a meathead factory that looks like the yard of any prison in America. No respect, no character and all the flair of WWE. I'll pass, and watch old UFC tapes when men fought four times, no weight classes

Keith Hackney vs Emmanuel Yarbrough

Gracie vs Kimo

Those are legendary. Nothing like that happens now. Just jock douche bags

Tito would need to fight in 4 UFC matches do equal what gracie did in just one

Royce Gracie versus Akebono. None of these current UFC guys have the balls to get into fights like that



You make some good points. I did enjoy the old UFC's and the style vs. style matchups, and nowdays most of the fighters have similar styles compared to back then, which can lead to some less exciting fights.

The lack of respect some of the fighters show I also have a problem with, and I see where you're coming from, watching the commercials for the next UFC did seem like some of the WWE/TNA commercials. Maybe some of it is hype to sell fights, maybe some of the guys are just that way. There's one guy that I know that back in the day, was a real humble, respectful guy, now that he's in the spotlight more, I can't believe some of the shit that comes out of his mouth when the camera's on him. And it's disappointing.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 11:34:30 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lester_Burnham:

Originally Posted By Variablebinary:
UFC used to be something worth watching. It was more about the fighting styles, and showing the world what works and doesnt work. Even traditional martial arts schools took part.

Now it's just a meathead factory that looks like the yard of any prison in America. No respect, no character and all the flair of WWE. I'll pass, and watch old UFC tapes when men fought four times, no weight classes

Keith Hackney vs Emmanuel Yarbrough

Gracie vs Kimo

Those are legendary. Nothing like that happens now. Just jock douche bags

Tito would need to fight in 4 UFC matches do equal what gracie did in just one

Royce Gracie versus Akebono. None of these current UFC guys have the balls to get into fights like that



You make some good points. I did enjoy the old UFC's and the style vs. style matchups, and nowdays most of the fighters have similar styles compared to back then, which can lead to some less exciting fights.

The lack of respect some of the fighters show I also have a problem with, and I see where you're coming from, watching the commercials for the next UFC did seem like some of the WWE/TNA commercials. Maybe some of it is hype to sell fights, maybe some of the guys are just that way. There's one guy that I know that back in the day, was a real humble, respectful guy, now that he's in the spotlight more, I can't believe some of the shit that comes out of his mouth when the camera's on him. And it's disappointing.



I have my black belt kyokushinkai Karate, which features extensive full contact Kumite, and it is always respectful. It is never personal and we for sure dont insult each other after. Also, I think people forget that the core of martial arts isnt just the ability to win fights. It should bring peace of mind through meditation, controlled breathing and mental conditioning. Most of the guys fighting in UFC these days are just assholes that conduct theirselves like they are literally in a prison yard.

If you look back to what UFC was founded for it had nothing to do with what UFC is now.

And for sure it isnt about if figthers today to could beat fighters from yesterday. I watch Pride more now. It maintains many of the traditional elements of martial arts.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 11:44:25 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 12:42:04 AM EDT
Tim Sylvia sucks. I laughed so hard i nearly crapped myself when he called out Fedor. If Andre kfto'd him and Mir arm barred his ass Fedor would demolish him. Sylvias stand up is sloppy and his ground game is non existant. Its kind of sad that the UFC is pushing him as a top contender.

I think Tito will probably steam roll Forrest. Forrest has fought mostly against cans with the exception of 3 fights and he lost 2 of them.

Link Posted: 4/9/2006 12:45:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By texastactical:
The problem with the old UFC rules was that often you would have a fresh alternate come in at the last minute because of an injury to another fighter. Then the alternate would end up winning.....not because he was the best fighter but because he was the freshest.



While that is true, I would say the level of technique in UFC has gone down as well. The amount of flailing fists hoping to score a clean shot is something you see in an elementry school.

When Gracie, Severn and Shamrock were UFC fighters it took far more skill, and the goal wasnt just to pummel.

I watch Gracie fight and it is literally a martial art system that flows like art, where every move is precise and effective. What I see with Liddel is bomb throwing and lots of luck.
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 1:02:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Variablebinary:

Originally Posted By texastactical:
The problem with the old UFC rules was that often you would have a fresh alternate come in at the last minute because of an injury to another fighter. Then the alternate would end up winning.....not because he was the best fighter but because he was the freshest.



While that is true, I would say the level of technique in UFC has gone down as well. The amount of flailing fists hoping to score a clean shot is something you see in an elementry school.

When Gracie, Severn and Shamrock were UFC fighters it took far more skill, and the goal wasnt just to pummel.

I watch Gracie fight and it is literally a martial art system that flows like art, where every move is precise and effective. What I see with Liddel is bomb throwing and lots of luck.



Liddell might throw bombs, but that doesn't mean he just gets lucky. His punches have a lot of accuracy too. Just one small misstep (like the last fight with Couture) and Liddell hits with a powerful counter, right on the button. In his second fight against Jeremy Horn, they were talking about how Horn felt he was a better technical boxer than Liddell. Then Liddell got through his defense and knocked him on his ass three or four times. I understand it looks sloppy, but I think a better term is unorthodox. With the success Liddell has had against the caliber of opposition he's faced, you have to give him credit for the skill he has.
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 1:21:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/9/2006 1:23:53 AM EDT by Agcsy]

Originally Posted By Variablebinary:

Originally Posted By texastactical:
The problem with the old UFC rules was that often you would have a fresh alternate come in at the last minute because of an injury to another fighter. Then the alternate would end up winning.....not because he was the best fighter but because he was the freshest.



While that is true, I would say the level of technique in UFC has gone down as well. The amount of flailing fists hoping to score a clean shot is something you see in an elementry school.

When Gracie, Severn and Shamrock were UFC fighters it took far more skill, and the goal wasnt just to pummel.

I watch Gracie fight and it is literally a martial art system that flows like art, where every move is precise and effective. What I see with Liddel is bomb throwing and lots of luck.



IMO you couldnt be more wrong. If you compare most top MMA strikers with a few exceptions to boxers then yes they will look like crap because boxers can focus on one thing where an MMA fighter has to know how to deal with all aspects of a fight.

Chuck doesnt look pretty standing up but he has KO power, very good sub defense and he is hard to take down. He wins because of that and because his fighting style works well inside of the cage.

Saying it took Severn, Shamrock, and Royce far more skill to win in the early UFC's is kind of silly. 95% of the people fighting in the early UFC's had no clue what they were doing.

Shamrock was already a true MMA vet before UFC started thanks to Pancrase so he already knew how to defend against subs, apply subs, and take downs.

Royce comes from what at the time was one of the best training camps for BJJ something that again 95% of the people in the UFC at the time had no clue about.

Severn had a strong wrestling backround that was about it. He can lay and pray with the best of them not much skill involved in taking down someone who doesnt know what a single leg, double leg, or body lock is.

Compare that to today where every fighter has sub skills, sub defenses, take downs/take down defense, and decent stand up. A can from today would have been champion back then.
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 1:33:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/9/2006 1:40:55 AM EDT by Variablebinary]

Originally Posted By Agcsy:

Originally Posted By Variablebinary:

Originally Posted By texastactical:
The problem with the old UFC rules was that often you would have a fresh alternate come in at the last minute because of an injury to another fighter. Then the alternate would end up winning.....not because he was the best fighter but because he was the freshest.



While that is true, I would say the level of technique in UFC has gone down as well. The amount of flailing fists hoping to score a clean shot is something you see in an elementry school.

When Gracie, Severn and Shamrock were UFC fighters it took far more skill, and the goal wasnt just to pummel.

I watch Gracie fight and it is literally a martial art system that flows like art, where every move is precise and effective. What I see with Liddel is bomb throwing and lots of luck.



IMO you couldnt be more wrong. If you compare most top MMA strikers with a few exceptions to boxers then yes they will look like crap because boxers can focus on one thing where an MMA fighter has to know how to deal with all aspects of a fight.

Chuck doesnt look pretty standing up but he has KO power, very good sub defense and he is hard to take down. He wins because of that and because his fighting style works well inside of the cage.

Saying it took Severn, Shamrock, and Royce far more skill to win in the early UFC's is kind of silly. 95% of the people fighting in the early UFC's had no clue what they were doing.

Shamrock was already a true MMA vet before UFC started thanks to Pancrase so he already knew how to defend against subs, apply subs, and take downs.

Royce comes from what at the time was one of the best training camps for BJJ something that again 95% of the people in the UFC at the time had no clue about.

Severn had a strong wrestling backround that was about it. He can lay and pray with the best of them not much skill involved in taking down someone who doesnt know what a single leg, double leg, or body lock is.

Compare that to today where every fighter has sub skills, sub defenses, take downs/take down defense, and decent stand up. A can from today would have been champion back then.



Lets not foget liddel's excellent skill at WWE acting. He is for sure better than Gracie at that.

For the record I think Kazushi Sakuraba is the best overall MMA fighter on the planet currently
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 1:42:04 AM EDT

Originally Posted By -Absolut-:
Shamrock is a has-been, not to mention an ass. I would NOT want to be on his team.



Shamrock is a never was. He was really great at marketing himself tho



Best pound for pound fighter in the world is in Pride Fc
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 1:47:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/9/2006 12:29:14 PM EDT by Shake]
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 1:54:12 AM EDT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkJY_Sf7C4I&search=fedor
+1 This mans an animal.
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 2:37:58 AM EDT
I agree with teh lidell comments, not a terribly large amoutn of skill (compared to other guys, not me!) but when you ahve a guy that with any one punch can send you to la-la land, it IS fun to watch. Heck, glancing blows from him, have done it.
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 10:57:24 AM EDT

Originally Posted By chapperjoe:
I agree with teh lidell comments, not a terribly large amoutn of skill (compared to other guys, not me!) but when you ahve a guy that with any one punch can send you to la-la land, it IS fun to watch. Heck, glancing blows from him, have done it.



Yeah because most of the guys in UFC flail just as much these days. Who has he fought really. Notice he keeps his ass out of Pride and does more UFC work because of the caliber of figther in Pride is much higher than UFC
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 11:09:50 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Glock63:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkJY_Sf7C4I&search=fedor
+1 This mans an animal.




My favorite fighter. One badass man.
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 11:15:11 AM EDT
I saw where Liddel went and got his ass handed to him in Pride. Can't remember who though....
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 11:30:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Beerswimmer:
I saw where Liddel went and got his ass handed to him in Pride. Can't remember who though....



He lost to Rampage Jackson. That was a few years ago. Chuck has improved tremendously since then and fights much smarter. He's always had the KO power, but now he's a more disciplined and accurate fighter.

As far as Kazushi Sakuraba being the best right now, that's pretty much impossible. He's a legend in Pride, but he's never beat Wanderlei in the 2 or 3 times they fought.

I can smell this turning into a Pride is better than UFC thread. They each have their strengths and weaknesses. They tend to protect their stars (Feeding Wanderlei cans) and a lot of their stars aren't doing so well right now (Wanderlei losing to Arona, then winning a questionable split decision in their rematch, Gomi getting choked out, Shogun breaking his arm against Coleman, etc.) and the only guy over there who is doing well enough to make the UFC look bad is Fedor. I'm not saying Pride is a bad organization, I order every Pride championship, but I hate seeing people talk about how much better Pride is than the UFC. They both have exciting fights with great fighters, and I don't think either one is better than the other.
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 11:35:33 AM EDT
+1 different rules. They are both great in their own way. Pride has alot more international stars and UFC is mostly homegrown. I hope that maybe they will have a face off tournament. For us fans!
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 11:36:43 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Variablebinary:

Originally Posted By chapperjoe:
I agree with teh lidell comments, not a terribly large amoutn of skill (compared to other guys, not me!) but when you ahve a guy that with any one punch can send you to la-la land, it IS fun to watch. Heck, glancing blows from him, have done it.



Yeah because most of the guys in UFC flail just as much these days. Who has he fought really. Notice he keeps his ass out of Pride and does more UFC work because of the caliber of figther in Pride is much higher than UFC



He keeps his ass out of Pride because he is signed with the UFC. Why doesn't Wanderlei come to the UFC and fight Chuck? It goes both ways.

As far as who he's beat, it's a long, long, long list. Couture twice. Jeremy Horn (which everybody now says Horn is a natural 185 lber, so it was a win, yet before the fight, everyone thought Horn would win). Tito Ortiz. Alistair Overeem. Babalu. Vitor Belfort. Bustamante. Guy Mezger. Randleman. And the majority of those are by KO. Hell, a couple of them are against Pride fighters. How well has Wanderlei done against the UFC? He lost to Tito and Vitor, both of whom Chuck beat. That's about as impressive a list of wins as you can get in MMA. He's avenged two of his losses, and his only unavenged loss is to Rampage. Everyone damns him because of that one loss which was several years ago, yet whenever one of Pride's stars loses (like Wanderlei losing to Arona), they make excuses. It's a double standard and it's ridiculous.
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 12:23:34 PM EDT
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