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Posted: 4/4/2006 5:08:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/4/2006 5:11:10 PM EDT by LANCEMAN]

Conscientious objector awarded Medal of Honor in WWII buried with 21-gun salute

Last modified Tuesday, April 4, 2006 5:15 PM PDT

CHATTANOOGA, Tenn. -- The only conscientious objector to receive a Medal of Honor in World War II has been buried at a national cemetery with a 21-gun salute, although he refused to carry a weapon while serving as an Army medic.

Desmond T. Doss Sr., 87, died March 23 in Piedmont, Ala., where he and his wife, Frances, had been living with family.

A horse-drawn hearse delivered the flag-covered casket to the grave site Monday in the Chattanooga National Cemetery. Military helicopters flew overhead in a tribute formation.


Doss had endured ridicule for his beliefs but "remained true to his convictions even when it was not the most popular thing to do," said Patti Parks, a retired Navy commander and director of the Medal of Honor Museum in Chattanooga.

Doss, who refused to carry a weapon during his wartime service in the Pacific, was the subject of a book, "The Unlikeliest Hero," and a 2004 documentary, "The Conscientious Objector."

Medal of Honor Society records show he was among 3,461 recipients of the nation's highest military honor.

While under enemy fire on the island of Okinawa, Doss carried 75 wounded soldiers to the edge of a 400-foot cliff and lowered them to safety, according to his citation.

During a later attack, he was seriously wounded in the legs by a grenade. According to the citation, as he was being carried to safety, he saw a more critically injured man and crawled off his stretcher, directing the medics to help the other wounded man.

"He wanted to serve. He just didn't want to kill anybody," said a veteran who attended the service, Fred Headrick, 85. "Most all of them (Medal of Honor recipients) received their medal for killing someone. He received his by saving lives."





http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2006/04/05/military/12_32_444_4_06.txt
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 5:09:59 PM EDT
this guy is an example of what all pacifists should aspire to. you don't have to fight the war, but you can still do all you can for your country
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 5:16:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Napoleon_Tanerite:
this guy is an example of what all pacifists should aspire to. you don't have to fight the war, but you can still do all you can for your country



+1
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 5:22:18 PM EDT
Actually, Doss claimed he only saved 50 men. His CO claimed he saved 100.

The other interesting thing was that he carried a bible always. he lost it when he got wounded. After they retook the position his unit fanned out and searched for his bible so he could get it back.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 5:40:58 PM EDT
Got to respect that he did his selfless duty and stood by his beliefs.

He is not like the folks who claim that status just to stay safe. He has my repect.

RIP
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 5:43:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Napoleon_Tanerite:
this guy is an example of what all pacifists should aspire to. you don't have to fight the war, but you can still do all you can for your country



Very good point. Made of better stuff I think.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 5:50:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SteelonSteel:
Got to respect that he did his selfless duty and stood by his beliefs.

He is not like the folks who claim that status just to stay safe. He has my repect.

RIP



Amen! Ya gotta love Corpsmen and Medics. Rest In Peace, Doc.


Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:02:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SteelonSteel:
Got to respect that he did his selfless duty and stood by his beliefs.

He is not like the folks who claim that status just to stay safe. He has my repect.

RIP



Exactly. He is a United States Congressional Medal of Honor recipient. Nothing else matters.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:07:02 PM EDT
Incredible story. The thing about the guys in his unit fanning out and looking for his Bible shows how highly his fellow soldiers thought of him.



-K
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:08:12 PM EDT
Great story and a great American. Nothing wrong with not wanting to kill someone.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:12:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/4/2006 6:14:16 PM EDT by AvengeR15]
Hearing about an incredible guy like this makes me hate the godless commie pinko peacenik hippie crybaby "voices of dissent" that are taking over this country even more.

Doss proves that a man can hold unpopular beliefs and still do his duty for his country, and win the respect of everyone in the process.

Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:18:57 PM EDT


"He wanted to serve. He just didn't want to kill anybody," said a veteran who attended the service, Fred Headrick, 85. "Most all of them (Medal of Honor recipients) received their medal for killing someone. He received his by saving lives."



What kinda comment is this? Most of them received the medal for killing? Last I checked, a lot of people did a lot of killing in past wars and didn't receive medals. I could have sworn I read that the CMOH was given for extraordinary bravery above and beyond the call of duty...

I'm sure he meant it in the most respectful way possible... but it appears he's just belittling others accomplishments. Not impressed.

Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:21:25 PM EDT
I wonder if this guy was related to Alvin C York?
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:28:34 PM EDT
He certainly has my respect.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:34:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Napoleon_Tanerite:
this guy is an example of what all pacifists should aspire to. you don't have to fight the war, but you can still do all you can for your country



Well said... damn well said.

Amazing... I never know about him. Thanks for putting this thread up.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:39:03 PM EDT
There was a good peice in the local paper about him shortly after his death. He objected personally for religious reasons, but fully supported the war, and his country. He was very humble about his accomplishments, and held closely to his beliefs his entire life. Makes me think of the book the greatest generation. People had a different ethic then. I wonder if we were in a true world war, like ww2, would the country come together for the common good, or would we still have the anti military/treasonous scum we have had for the last 40 or so years, trying to undermine everything our military tries to do?
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:41:40 PM EDT
I have no issues with COs that serve with honor.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:56:13 PM EDT
May he rest in peace.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 6:56:36 PM EDT
Interesting story.

There is a guy in my sons company in Iraq whose wife is causing a media shitstorm now because she claims her husband is being harassed by the Army due to his religious beliefs.

The US Army Is Persecuting & Harassing My Husband

Said beliefs include not doing any type of military duty on Sundays.

I think I'll get ahold of my son and get this guys address so I can send him a tube of Preparation H cause he's gonna need it when the Army gets done with him.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 7:00:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Silhouetter:
I wonder if this guy was related to Alvin C York?



Exactly.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 7:04:41 PM EDT
Going into combat in the Pacific without a weapon?

That's pretty damn brave.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 9:44:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TRW:

Said beliefs include not doing any type of military duty on Sundays.



How did he get through Basic, out of interest?

NTM
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 9:53:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Special-K:
Incredible story. The thing about the guys in his unit fanning out and looking for his Bible shows how highly his fellow soldiers thought of him.



-K

Most combat troops think the world of their medic/corpsman, and woe to the poor asshole that messes with him.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 10:20:29 PM EDT
Mr. Doss was not the only one. Joe did not survive though.
http://www.virtualwall.org/dl/LapointeJG01a.htm
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 10:18:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Manic_Moran:

Originally Posted By TRW:

Said beliefs include not doing any type of military duty on Sundays.



How did he get through Basic, out of interest?

NTM

I never read that? He probably had no objections to firing a weapon, just not at someone else.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 10:30:12 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/7/2006 8:16:22 AM EDT by Luckdog]
You guys need to go to www.desmonddoss.com and order the DVD about him and show it to your family and friends.
Due to his true religious beliefs he could not harm another human and he was ostracized while in the military until he saved all those guys on Guam, Leyte and Okinawa.
He never said he would not serve his country- he wanted to and did but he could not harm another.
The story of his courage under fire and essentially certain death would be unbelievable if it were not true.
This is my favorite "movie".
Sorry to hear of his passing- he was a true American hero.
The DVD also addresses how Desmond handled "working" on his Sabbath.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 10:47:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By fossil_fuel:

Originally Posted By Napoleon_Tanerite:
this guy is an example of what all pacifists should aspire to. you don't have to fight the war, but you can still do all you can for your country



+1


+2
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 11:49:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Luckdog:
You guys need to go to www.desmonddoss.com and order the DVD about him and show it to your family and friends.
Due to his true religious beliefs he could not harm another human and he was ostracized while in the military until he saved all those guys on Guam, Leyte and Okinawa.
He never said he would not serve his country- he wanted to and did but he could not harm another.
The story of his courage under fire and essentially certain death would be unbelievable if it were not true.
This is my favorite "movie".
Sorry to hear of his passing- he was a true American hero.
The DVD also addresses how Desmond handled "working" on Sunday.



Actually, Saturday for Mr. Doss. Rest in peace, Sir.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 12:00:08 PM EDT
Friend of my wife's died in Vietnam. Served as a medic but refused to carry a weapon. Did not make thirty days in-country before he died there.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 12:02:45 PM EDT
Tag...
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 12:02:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TRW:
Interesting story.

There is a guy in my sons company in Iraq whose wife is causing a media shitstorm now because she claims her husband is being harassed by the Army due to his religious beliefs.

The US Army Is Persecuting & Harassing My Husband

Said beliefs include not doing any type of military duty on Sundays.

I think I'll get ahold of my son and get this guys address so I can send him a tube of Preparation H cause he's gonna need it when the Army gets done with him.



SHOMER SHABBAS!!!

had to do the Lebowski reference.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 12:04:05 PM EDT
Wow... I'd say he was just objecting to actually killing people, but he did serve, and he did an awesome job. He kicked major ass in his own right.

God rest his soul.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 12:05:16 PM EDT


While under enemy fire on the island of Okinawa, Doss carried 75 wounded soldiers to the edge of a 400-foot cliff and lowered them to safety, according to his citation.

During a later attack, he was seriously wounded in the legs by a grenade. According to the citation, as he was being carried to safety, he saw a more critically injured man and crawled off his stretcher, directing the medics to help the other wounded man.

"He wanted to serve. He just didn't want to kill anybody,"





This is all I have to hear to have the deepest respect for him. May God watch over him and may he rest in peace. He's earned it.

Link Posted: 4/5/2006 12:08:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Napoleon_Tanerite:
this guy is an example of what all pacifists should aspire to. you don't have to fight the war, but you can still do all you can for your country



I can't believe I'm telling you this...

but I actually think you hit it on the head.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 12:08:35 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 1:20:46 PM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:

Originally Posted By TRW:
Interesting story.

There is a guy in my sons company in Iraq whose wife is causing a media shitstorm now because she claims her husband is being harassed by the Army due to his religious beliefs.

The US Army Is Persecuting & Harassing My Husband

Said beliefs include not doing any type of military duty on Sundays.

I think I'll get ahold of my son and get this guys address so I can send him a tube of Preparation H cause he's gonna need it when the Army gets done with him.



this man is a fucking disgrace and has no business in the military.

Mr Doss had no option to join. most likely he was drafted and was able to hold onto his beleifs and not only serve honorbly but became a MOH winner to boot.

CO in today's military i have ZERO tollerance for. If they don't want to fight they do not have to join.

Rest in peace Mr Doss. The world is a better place because of what you did.



Go to the web site and do some reading.

Mr Doss wanted to join the Army and turned down a deferment so he could join the Army and serve.

He was a true hero in every aspect of the word.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 1:23:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:


CO in today's military i have ZERO tollerance for. If they don't want to fight they do not have to join.




Yep, I had a troop who clamed she was a CO & due to manning I was unable to kick her out even though her PIF was a foot thick.

She ended up going to the chapel & they deployed her to the sandbox unarmed where from what I understand all she did was cry and whine her entire tour.

She is now a NCO
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 2:48:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TRW:
Interesting story.

There is a guy in my sons company in Iraq whose wife is causing a media shitstorm now because she claims her husband is being harassed by the Army due to his religious beliefs.

The US Army Is Persecuting & Harassing My Husband

Said beliefs include not doing any type of military duty on Sundays. hink


After looking at this web site I found out that this coward's name is Chris Gorman and his email address is cmgorman24@yahoo.com. He is now trying to declare Conscientious Objector status, but only after he is facing a Court Martial for Article 15 violation. He should hear from us who have honorable served and hold our freedom dear.
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 8:48:07 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/6/2006 8:54:41 AM EDT by EOD_Guy]
I believe that Mr Doss did not like the term "conscientious objector." He preferred to think of himself as a "conscientious cooperator."

As an aside and not to denegrate the honors at the funeral, he did not receive a 21 gun salute. He was honored with three volleys from an honor guard with 7 rifles. There is a difference. a 21 gun salute is normally reserved for heads of state or former heads of state.
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 9:21:15 AM EDT
Check out this email response from this coward Chris Gorman:

Mr. Robert?
This is my second time over in Iraq. I fought the first time and during that time things changed for me. You clearly are NOT a man of morals or values. I guess I got that from your swearing at me. You know nothing of me, my family or what we've had to endure. I am sorry you feel that I am a coward. I think God would disagree. It takes a better man and a stronger man to stand up for what's right instead of taking order to do what's clearly wrong. As far as my wife doing all the work, well... I've done all that I can with what I have. I have contacted many people, it's unfortunate that my wife has all the resources and that she has had to endure all that she has had to. I am sure you don't get it. But, actually me standing up for what's right has made my life and my family's life easier. I am not a coward, I just believe in something other than killing people and invading a country that clearly doesn't want the U.S. there. I guess I can only hope and pray for your soul that one day, God will change YOUR life and then maybe you'd get it. But thank you for the email. It has proven my wife's interview to be very correct. That this no longer is a free country. Seeing as though you felt it necessary to call names and be upset for me having a different opinion and lifestyle than yours. My God bless your soul.
Chris and Heather

Robert <rhd_3@yahoo.com> wrote:
Chris,

Please read the following:

Conscientious objector awarded Medal of Honor in WWII buried with 21-gun salute

Last modified Tuesday, April 4, 2006 5:15 PM PDT

CHATTANOOGA, Tenn. -- The only conscientious objector to receive a Medal of Honor in World War II has been buried at a national cemetery with a 21-gun salute, although he refused to carry a weapon while serving as an Army medic.

Desmond T. Doss Sr., 87, died March 23 in Piedmont, Ala., where he and his wife, Frances, had been living with family.

A horse-drawn hearse delivered the flag-covered casket to the grave site Monday in the Chattanooga National Cemetery. Military helicopters flew overhead in a tribute formation.


Doss had endured ridicule for his beliefs but "remained true to his convictions even when it was not the most popular thing to do," said Patti Parks, a retired Navy commander and director of the Medal of Honor Museum in Chattanooga.

Doss, who refused to carry a weapon during his wartime service in the Pacific, was the subject of a book, "The Unlikeliest Hero," and a 2004 documentary, "The Conscientious Objector."

Medal of Honor Society records show he was among 3,461 recipients of the nation's highest military honor.

While under enemy fire on the island of Okinawa, Doss carried 75 wounded soldiers to the edge of a 400-foot cliff and lowered them to safety, according to his citation.

During a later attack, he was seriously wounded in the legs by a grenade. According to the citation, as he was being carried to safety, he saw a more critically injured man and crawled off his stretcher, directing the medics to help the other wounded man.

"He wanted to serve. He just didn't want to kill anybody," said a veteran who attended the service, Fred Headrick, 85. "Most all of them (Medal of Honor recipients) received their medal for killing someone. He received his by saving lives."

Chris, this guy even volunteered even though most around him were being drafted and second he declared C.O. status right then. He didn't wait and declare it after he was sent to Okinawa or lets see....IRAQ!

YOU VOLUNTEERED annnnd then YOU waited to declared CO status until it got scary...well tooo bad!

I knew of a few guys like you while I was in the USMC. It always amazed me at how hard someone like you will fight for this status, but when it came to the regular military stuff to do, you were a bunch of shitbags!

Another sign that you are lazy and a coward is that you are letting your wife do all the fighting for you on this. Sounds like she has the balls and you have...well you know what you have!

Being in a dangerous situation sucks, I know. But acting like a coward and leaving your buddies to do all the fighting/work is an act of treason in my opinion.

Grow a pair and take honor in serving your country.....or have fun serving the rest of your time in the Brig!!!

Here is my latest response to him:

This is my second time over in Iraq. I fought the first time and during that time things changed for me. That may be true, but your obligation to the government did NOT. You clearly are NOT a man of morals or values. I completed my tour of duty with honor and did not complain when things got tough, nor did my family over the long separations and hostile conditions. I guess I got that from your swearing at me. I had no idea you had such thin skin...have you never used a swear word while feeling passionate about an issue?? You know nothing of me, my family or what we've had to endure. 6 years in the Corps away from my family is fairly similar to what you are going through, however I did not bring on my family the public attention you so selfishly want. I am sorry you feel that I am a coward. I think God would disagree. Ultimately, God will decide that. For now, we have the NT scripture of Matthew 22:21, that goes directly against your stance, "Then He said to them, 'Give to Caesar what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's'". Meaning you made a voluntary obligation to serve your government...therefore God would expect you to fulfill it. To not fulfill this obligation would now be a sin against God. It takes a better man and a stronger man to stand up for what's right instead of taking order to do what's clearly wrong. What were your unlawful orders?? Who ordered them? Why have you not reported these alleged offenses? If you just disagree with the Iraq war, well sorry you joined the military and it is NOT a democracy...once you become a civilian, you can protest all you want. As far as my wife doing all the work, well... I've done all that I can with what I have. I have contacted many people, it's unfortunate that my wife has all the resources and that she has had to endure all that she has had to. The military provides ample rights to the defendant, you can even go hire a private attorney if you chose. No other military in the WORLD gives you these rights. I am sure you don't get it. But, actually me standing up for what's right has made my life and my family's life easier. I am not a coward, I just believe in something other than killing people and invading a country that clearly doesn't want the U.S. there. Once again, you don't have that democratic right to judge or disagree with what the government does, once you joined the military. The military is NOT a democracy. I guess I can only hope and pray for your soul that one day, God will change YOUR life and then maybe you'd get it. I do get it, but only for the grace of God is that possible! He saved me many years ago, and only by Him do I stand confident in my salvation. But thank you for the email. It has proven my wife's interview to be very correct. That this no longer is a free country. Tell me of another country that is more free than the US? If you know of one, then once you get out of the military, leave the US. No one will stop you...another freedom to enjoy! Seeing as though you felt it necessary to call names and be upset for me having a different opinion and lifestyle than yours. You bet my lifestyle is different! I don't go back on my word and backslide when the going gets tough, nor does my family. My God bless your soul. Thank you, as referenced above, my soul is graciously blessed. Keep enjoying the freedom you have to defend your stance, however cowardly it is.

Apparently you didn't get the "subtle" point of the attached obituary of that MOH WWII vet. He was a CO, yet still served his country with the Highest honor you can be awarded, yet never tried to get out or not work hard while in. If you get your CO status that doesn't not provide you a reason to leave the military before your enlistment is up. All it means, is that you don't have to shoot an enemy combatant. 90% of the military is in a support capacity, can't you do one of those jobs, even though you may not like it (ie sweep floors, KP duty, etc)? Your are a young man, don't move forward with this Courts Martial. If you get convicted, you will then have a FEDERAL CRIME on your head for the rest of your life, not to mention the Dishonorable Discharge you would also receive. Good luck with getting a job from anyone after that. Then again, you don't like this country anymore so just leave when you get the chance, as it would be better than living here with that on your record.

This guy makes me sick
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 4:15:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/6/2006 4:18:00 PM EDT by DougR]
I had a good friend in college, we both flunked out and were both drafted. He was killed just before I was drafted, and that was very heavy on my mind throughout my tour as a grunt.

He was a CO and also received the CMH. Two buildings at West Virginia University are named after him. I always wondered what he would have become if he had survived. I have read and re-read his citation.

www.1stcavmedic.com/cmhmedic/bennett.htm




Rank and organization:

Corporal, U.S. Army, 2d Platoon, Company B, 1st Battalion, 14th Infantry, 4th Infantry Division

Place and date:

Chu Pa Region, Pleiku Province, Republic of Vietnam, 9-11 February 1969. Entered service at: Fairmont, W. Va. Born: 7 April 1947, Morgantown, W. Va.

Citation:

For conspicuous gallantry and intrepidity in action at the risk of his life above and beyond the call of duty. Cpl. Bennett distinguished himself while serving as a platoon medical aidman with the 2d Platoon, Company B, during a reconnaissance-in-force mission. On 9 February the platoon was moving to assist the 1st Platoon of Company D which had run into a North Vietnamese ambush when it became heavily engaged by the intense small arms, automatic weapons, mortar and rocket fire from a well fortified and numerically superior enemy unit. In the initial barrage of fire, 3 of the point members of the platoon fell wounded. Cpl. Bennett, with complete disregard for his safety, ran through the heavy fire to his fallen comrades, administered life-saving first aid under fire and then made repeated trips carrying the wounded men to positions of relative safety from which they would be medically evacuated from the battle position. Cpl. Bennett repeatedly braved the intense enemy fire moving across open areas to give aid and comfort to his wounded comrades. He valiantly exposed himself to the heavy fire in order to retrieve the bodies of several fallen personnel. Throughout the night and following day, Cpl. Bennett moved from position to position treating and comforting the several personnel who had suffered shrapnel and gunshot wounds. On 11 February, Company B again moved in an assault on the well fortified enemy positions and became heavily engaged with the numerically superior enemy force. Five members of the company fell wounded in the initial assault. Cpl. Bennett ran to their aid without regard to the heavy fire. He treated 1 wounded comrade and began running toward another seriously wounded man. Although the wounded man was located forward of the company position covered by heavy enemy grazing fire and Cpl. Bennett was warned that it was impossible to reach the position, he leaped forward with complete disregard for his safety to save his comrade's life. In attempting to save his fellow soldier, he was mortally wounded. Cpl. Bennett's undaunted concern for his comrades at the cost of his life above and beyond the call of duty are in keeping with the highest traditions of the military service and reflect great credit upon himself, his unit, and the U.S. Army.






To My Loved Ones and Dear Friends:

Don't grieve for me, for I will be free
I'm following the path God laid for me.
I will take His hand when I hear Him call;
I must turn my back and leave it all.
I can not stay another day.
To laugh, to love, to work or play.
Tasks left undone must stay that way;
If my parting has left a void,
Then fill it with remembered joy.
A friendship shared, a laugh, a kiss;
Ah yes, these things, I too will miss.
Be not burdened with times of sorrow
I wish you the sunshine of tomorrow.
My life has been full, I savored much;
Good friends, good times,
A loved one's touch.
And the laughter of the children
I have known.
Perhaps my times here seems all to brief;
Don't lengthen it now with undue grief.
Lift up your heart and share with me,
God wants me now,
He will set me free.

---Author Unknown---
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