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Posted: 3/31/2006 5:04:44 PM EDT
Was it the Mcveigh thing? 88's? The liberal morons looking for a boogey-man?

The American militia has a long history like fighting at Bunker Hill/Breeds Hill, various battles during the Rev war, Battles of 1812, The Alamo and various other wars and skirmishes. A rich history with many heroes.

Some say the NG is now the militia. Some states have a state guard.

You get news stories of guys having their guns seized and belonging to a "militia". Yeah, there are shiitheads out there, but what about the guy who trains, isn't affiliated with any nutty group, responible etc?

Any mention now of militia and people cringe and act as if though you crapped in their lunch.

Where did it all go bad?
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:07:48 PM EDT
probably the same time as the OKC bombing
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:09:06 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:09:47 PM EDT
Slick Willy didn't do much to improve the militia image.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:12:09 PM EDT
OKC bombing. McVeigh claimed to have done the bombing as payback for Waco. The militia movement grew in noisiness between Waco and OKC, but OKC provided the Clintonistas the opportunity to demonize the militias -- which is why there has always been conspiracy talk that the feds secretly did OKC.

By the end of the '90s, it was a standing joke that 3 of every 4 militia members was an undercover FBI agent.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:12:58 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:13:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By roboman:
Slick Willy didn't do much to improve the militia image.



+1 During the Early days of the Clinton Administration, or maybe after Ruby Ridge. They had to villainize those who would support the RKBA when he was putting his disarmament plans into effect
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:27:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Aimless:
The "militia" craze was mostly a reaction to the Clinton administration. Maybe some of the problem was the media wanting to portray them as crazy gunnutz. However I shoot and take classes with a group of guys that can be up around 10-15 guys at various times of the year, but if one of them started trying to get us to wear rank patches and uniforms and use code words we would just laugh at him.



is that you brigadier admiral hat in your avatar?
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:38:43 PM EDT
The demonization and destruction of the militia has been the policy of the fascist state from the beginning, the state can only rule with a power monopoly, the media under the control of the FCC is what really did in the militia as far demonization goes, ofcourse the 34NFA and 1968 GCA was the crowning blow to the second amendment,

pay attention to the quote.



An instance within the memory of some of this house will show us how our militia may be destroyed. Forty years ago, when the resolution of enslaving America was formed in Great Britain, the British Parliment was advised by an artful man, who was governor of Pennsylvania, to disarm the people; that is was the best and most effectual way to enslave them; but that they should not do it openly, but weaken them, and let them sink gradually, by totally disusing and neglecting the militia.


-- George Mason at the Virginia Ratification Convention, June 14, 1788 Quote on Militia

Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:39:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/31/2006 5:41:04 PM EDT by jpman7]

Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Was it the Mcveigh thing? 88's?



I think at first it was the white supremacists, then came ol' tim mcveigh. The news media piled on and thus the bad image.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:56:03 PM EDT
Yep , tied it in with the Looney White Supremist movement, Neo Nazi's and the Crazy Constitutionalists. That and the Fat unwashed Hillbilly loser self proclamed Militia's that gave interviews for documentries and made themselves come off like total crazy gun toting morons !
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:59:20 PM EDT
Ignorance of what the militia is and how it works adds to peoples fear of it, the militia before the U.S.C. was compulsory, but was born of the township constable or peace officer, every ten households comprised a town ship and had their own constable or peace officer these constables were elected by the electors meaning the heads of the ten households.

The townships made a precinct and ten precincts made a county.

But it was up to the townships coordinating with the precincts that a muster of the militia happened every month.
The Peace Officer or Constable was a trusted member of the community as he worked for the Justice of the Peace most of his duties were making peace through justice.

There is no need for a state commissioned officer or the taxes to support him under the original system, the law was not easily used as a tool of injustice as it is today.

The militia today is seen as the demon from the shadows that would force people to be self sufficient and responsible for themselves, there are no free rides, no ruling elite under the original common law system of American government as it is truly self government leading to freedom and prosperity.

Link Posted: 3/31/2006 6:01:53 PM EDT
I think it was right after Waco and Ruby Ridge. Klinton caused the militia movement to go mainstream.
The demonization of the militia movement was in full force before OKC happened. OKC was just more liberal icing on the cake for the media pundits to stand on their podium and slander honest law abiding American citizens who were rightfully concerned about the dirrection the country was going. Those were some scary times and the bill of rights was hanging in the balance. Even now things are still not right. All Bush is doing is buying us a little more time before the hammer falls. The Patriot Act will be our undoing. Some liberal president (Hillary) will use it to declare all gun owners as terrorists and the Militia movement will be up and running again. Things will get worse before they get better. Rant Over!
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 6:04:20 PM EDT
Ask the "Montanna Freeman" or other groups like that.

My guess is about 1980 onward.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 6:06:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By tangeant:
Yep , tied it in with the Looney White Supremist movement, Neo Nazi's and the Crazy Constitutionalists. That and the Fat unwashed Hillbilly loser self proclamed Militia's that gave interviews for documentries and made themselves come off like total crazy gun toting morons !



We will always have "those types" with us but it is a media agenda, go to any large public gathering and you will always have one or two people with a negative appearance, that one person will be surrounded by the media as if it's the only one there and the example of all.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 6:59:59 PM EDT
The extreme right wingers, who wanted to overthrow the government, were tied to white supremacist movement, and OKC did in the militia movement in. Public opinion was easily turned against them.

Funny thing is now more than ever we need the militias. They should be here to protect the people when the government wont.

All those Mexican flags being raised all over the country sound ripe for militia handling since the cops, military and National Guard just stand there with their dicks in their hand


Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:16:05 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:20:04 PM EDT
When the liberals quit liking anything military, and ESPECIALLY anyony who has plans to defend themselves and their country from Socialist politico's!!

Hence the problem, American militias have always fought for their freedom and you can't have that when you intend to control people!!
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:22:34 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:25:10 PM EDT
McVeigh killed the militia movement. Militias were growing, and the Michigan Militia was even to the point of assisting the Michigan State Police in search and rescue when dumbass hikers would get lost and shit. After OKC that all came to an abrupt end.

Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:26:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By shotar:
Alot also had to do with the 350lb guy on the news show who was proudly waddling through the woods with his trusty SKS, demanding to be called Colonel although he had never been in the so called government's army, and spouting sedition.



Leave the SKS out of it. I like SKSs.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:27:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Where did it all go bad?



Militias are a lot of talk and no action. Where were the militias when the gulf coast was hit by Katrina? Where are they for any other disaster or when people are in need? Sitting on their fat asses talking about defending the Constitution (as they see it) and otherwise doing nothing.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:27:39 PM EDT
FWIW, my parrothead commo was part of a local effort to make life a little harder for the media.

I shoot CMP. Big deal. Many of us do.

Some of my fellow shooters can be pretty hard headed and a bit stupid.

Shortly after OKC, the local media was coming to matches for rapid fire string footage. Instead of wearing jeans and a shirt, a lot of the guys were wearing BDUs and playing right into the hands of the media.

BDUs? ARs? M14s?

OMG! It's a militia! Paramilitary training!!!

More than 1 local TV station played the angle that the CMP program was a cover for militia training, and one club came close to stopping the program because of bad media coverage.

Enter the parrothead cammo. Ain't no way in hell ABCD TV is going to sell the public that a guy shooting in an outfit like that is involved in a 'militia' training program.

What has happened to the word itself is a disgrace. One of the things I HATE about the media is that they tromp all over the 2nd Amendment, yet when they are even asked to, say, for example, hold a story back for a day or 2 to keep a foriegn enemy from getting useful information, the FIRST thing they do is hide behind the 1st Amendment.

There are times I would LOVE to destroy television transmitting towers.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:28:22 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Sukebe:

Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Where did it all go bad?



Militias are a lot of talk and no action. Where were the militias when the gulf coast was hit by Katrina? Where are they for any other disaster or when people are in need? Sitting on their fat asses talking about defending the Constitution (as they see it) and otherwise doing nothing.



were non .gov types allowed in to help?
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:29:08 PM EDT
there are the real constitutional militias as defined by the states, as availbale to the Governors and generally delineated by the State Laws, and then there are the pipedreams and the wet dreams of the ignorant. Those dream organizations and the stupid things they did, are the ones that made it easy for the MSM and most citizens to denigrate the "militia".
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:30:00 PM EDT
The fact that the inbred types started getting play on 60 minutes expounding the virtues of the "Turner Diaries" really didn’t help.

When ZOG became part of the militia lingo, militias were doomed
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:32:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:

Originally Posted By Sukebe:

Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Where did it all go bad?



Militias are a lot of talk and no action. Where were the militias when the gulf coast was hit by Katrina? Where are they for any other disaster or when people are in need? Sitting on their fat asses talking about defending the Constitution (as they see it) and otherwise doing nothing.



were non .gov types allowed in to help?



They can and did help but never get any credit,

remember this story ? ARMED MILITIA PROTECT NOLA NEIGHBORHOOD
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:32:46 PM EDT
The talk of Soviet tanks in the desert and UN invasions (while picturing the vehicles used by the OPFOR at JRTC) was another nail in their cofin.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:33:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:

Originally Posted By Sukebe:

Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew:
Where did it all go bad?



Militias are a lot of talk and no action. Where were the militias when the gulf coast was hit by Katrina? Where are they for any other disaster or when people are in need? Sitting on their fat asses talking about defending the Constitution (as they see it) and otherwise doing nothing.



were non .gov types allowed in to help?



What do you mean "were" There's a lot of people still in need of help. Volunteers are everywhere down there. How many militia convoys did you see heading south with manpower, tools and supplies looking to do some good? I'll answer for you, none.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:34:53 PM EDT
Read SEND IN THE WACO KILLERS--- Vin Suprinowics.

He documents the FBI and ATF involvement with the demonizing of the Militia

He talks about Operation Meggido and how it has and is playing out.

The book covers many subjects and will probably make you angry.

I am sure it isn't exaustive of the subject, but it is informative and might be a good starting point.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:36:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By STRATIOTES:

were non .gov types allowed in to help?



They can and did help but never get any credit,

remember this story ? ARMED MILITIA PROTECT NOLA NEIGHBORHOOD

"They" are residents of the neighborhood defending their property (a genuine militia). "They" aren't some lame ass unorganized militia running around the woods like fools and spouting off about the Constitution and defending their country.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 7:51:11 PM EDT
Lots of things did it. OKC was a BIG one (but hadn't the Michigan guys thron MCvey out? that didn't get in the press now did it?) The media ran out and found every fat assed "colonel" with a rebel flag on his car to interview that they could..splice it with images of people shooting guns, no matter where you get it and You've got scared soccer moms.


I respect the hell out of anyone willing to do real militia stuff, but in my experience they are far outnumbered by the idiots. Hell militia members are even badmouthed by RTKBA types, forgeting WHY we have the 2nd.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 8:09:41 PM EDT

Originally Posted By shotar:
Alot also had to do with the 350lb guy on the news show who was proudly waddling through the woods with his trusty SKS, demanding to be called Colonel although he had never been in the so called government's army, and spouting sedition.



Exactly who I thought about when I read this. I couldn't find the link to the web site, anyone have it? the picks are funny. Giant NEON green camouflaged M&M coming at you.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 8:12:02 PM EDT
The bank robbing neo nazis sure as hell didn't help.
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