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Posted: 3/30/2006 3:57:47 PM EDT
keeping on the immigrant workforce theme i was wondering why we only see hispanics picking vegtables, washing dishes, hanging out at home depot, etc and not the other nationalities? such as the asians in vietnames, koreans, indians and other forms of hindu's these immigrants are seen more as owners of liquer stores and such, how the hell do they come into our country with this kind of money to open up a store? isnt our dollar worth a bunch more than theirs? so they would have to be absolute millionares in their homeland.....
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:00:10 PM EDT
it's not just them, they just have the numbers, so it looks like its only them. you go to certain spots in miami and you'll see hatians, dominicans, and others doing the shit jobs.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:01:04 PM EDT
When I was growing up most of those "grunt jobs" were held by high school kids figuring out the value of a hard earned dollar.

Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:01:39 PM EDT
They're not the only ones doing grunt work. It's been months since I've seen a Hispanic person working a manual labor job. Mostly around here you see whites and blacks doing them. I'll never understand the lie that only Hispanics do hard work when you see blacks and whites that are born here doing the vast majority of hard work.z
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:02:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/30/2006 4:03:15 PM EDT by Da_Bunny]
I picked apples one year. They made me work far away from the Mexicans so they wouldn't kill me. Don't think you can just walk out there and get a job. The Mexican Mafia will fuck you up.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:04:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Napoleon_Tanerite:
it's not just them, they just have the numbers, so it looks like its only them. you go to certain spots in miami and you'll see hatians, dominicans, and others doing the shit jobs.



It's a hard issue, isn't it? We don't want illegals to be here, but at the same time, who's going to do the dirty work? Most Americans (including myself) are not willing to do hard work for little pay. We are willing to do dirty awful hard works only if the pay is right. What is for us to do? I'd say the first answer lies on the government reducing regulations and reducing money that businesses must spend. Do you know that corporate tax stands at 37% right now? That's a lot. Not counting permits for all kind of stuff that cost boucoup $$$$$$$$.

Just my $.002
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:09:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stealth:
When I was growing up most of those "grunt jobs" were held by high school kids figuring out the value of a hard earned dollar.




me too - i was a dishwasher for my first job, you just dont see the high school kid washing dishes anymore.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:13:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stealth:
When I was growing up most of those "grunt jobs" were held by high school kids figuring out the value of a hard earned dollar.




+1

Around here all the jobs like Paperboy or cutting someones grass are all taken by older illigals
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:16:05 PM EDT
Hmmm....let's see here, if there was suddenly a shortage of low-skilled workers, what would happen? Would the jobs stop gettin' done? No apples picked? Tomatoes left on the vine? Or would employers start to offer slightly higher wages......


Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:19:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/30/2006 4:33:40 PM EDT by VoodooChile]

Originally Posted By zoom:
They're not the only ones doing grunt work. It's been months since I've seen a Hispanic person working a manual labor job. Mostly around here you see whites and blacks doing them. I'll never understand the lie that only Hispanics do hard work when you see blacks and whites that are born here doing the vast majority of hard work.z



Mexicans aren't as heavy in SC as they are in other places......yet..On top of that most SC Blacks are dirt poor and haven't realized that slavery ended awhile back
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:23:24 PM EDT
how about in OK? i know here in california they are FUCKING EVERYWHERE !!!!!!
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:27:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/30/2006 4:30:46 PM EDT by VoodooChile]

Originally Posted By 97guns:
how about in OK? i know here in california they are FUCKING EVERYWHERE !!!!!!



I'll get back to you as soon as the office janitor cleans out my trashcan

ETA..I becoming more aware of the situation as time passes..
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:35:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VoodooChile:

Originally Posted By zoom:
They're not the only ones doing grunt work. It's been months since I've seen a Hispanic person working a manual labor job. Mostly around here you see whites and blacks doing them. I'll never understand the lie that only Hispanics do hard work when you see blacks and whites that are born here doing the vast majority of hard work.z



Mexicans aren't as heavy in SC as they are in other places......yet..On top of that most SC Blacks are dirt poor and haven't realized that slavery ended awhile back



have you ever been here?
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:35:57 PM EDT
around here the newly arrived are out picking crops. but the ones that have been here awhile are working in the mills and meat packing plant's. one of my good friend's lost his job as a supervisor at one of those plant's becuase the company got his hispanic assistant to do the job for $4.80 less an hour. the only thing that realy pisses me off is you can tell when INS is coming the plant will be empty of workers becuase they were given the day off with pay.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:41:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/30/2006 4:43:59 PM EDT by VoodooChile]

Originally Posted By legonas:

Originally Posted By VoodooChile:

Originally Posted By zoom:
They're not the only ones doing grunt work. It's been months since I've seen a Hispanic person working a manual labor job. Mostly around here you see whites and blacks doing them. I'll never understand the lie that only Hispanics do hard work when you see blacks and whites that are born here doing the vast majority of hard work.z



Mexicans aren't as heavy in SC as they are in other places......yet..On top of that most SC Blacks are dirt poor and haven't realized that slavery ended awhile back



have you ever been here?



Yup, my family lives in Charleston..My Dad grew up in Charleston and I lived there for awhile before I left for college..worked jobs in and around Charleston during the summers..spent a lot of time and made friends with people there ...black and white
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:46:13 PM EDT
Ive got mixed emotions about this situation, aliens are taking up all the americans jobs but on the otherhand a lot of americans want something for nothing, in my area mexicans are know to be hard workres for little pay. I own a construction business and lets just say that a lot of the "caucasion males" that I have hired have been to lazy or to proud to do my type of work. At $15/ per hour Ive had to fire laborers becase they simply "didnt want to pick up a shovel and throw some asphalt" I can hire 3 mexicans for the same rate that will work their dicks into the dirt and be proud as hell of 5 bucks an hour. On the downside, one of my friends works for a huge home building contractor who uses close to 45 percent mexican labor. The contractor cut the pay rate so far down that my friend could no longer afford to even make the drive to work and back.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:46:31 PM EDT
They are not... What it comes down to (and I'll use stucco work because that is what someone said on the local news) they will do stucco for minium wage, while my buddy and his crew get $15+ a hour.

Cheap labor ? We have all these welfare people who get money, food, housing, and sit around watching soaps all day. They can have the benefits, minium wage, and get off their asses. To be honest, most of them need some exercise anyway.

Funny thing from my POV, the Mexicans (illegal, legal) here seem to really bust their ass working... Yet, from all my trips to Mexico proper, they are friggin lazy as fuck down in their home country.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:47:31 PM EDT
I would gladly pick fruit and dig ditches. If the pay was equivalent to the labor involved.

Since it is not, and I am capable of finding work that does pay well, I do not do those things.

See, illegals have the added benefit of riding in clown cars and living in 1910-style slum tenement conditions. When you have four families sharing a dilapidated three bedroom house, it makes the meager money stretch much, much further. Same as when seventeen workers are all kicking in to fill up the Dodge minivan that they all cram into to drive to the fields. The gas dollar goes much further than in the white-man's version of carpooling, that generally involves no more than four to five occupants in the same vehicle.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 4:57:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AcidGambit:
welfare people ... sit around watching soaps all day.



Exactly. You can sit on your ass in front of the TV, you can sit on your ass in an office.

You can sit on your ass in front of the TV, you can sit your ass in a Martha Stewart or Kathie Lee sweat shop.

You can sit on your ass in front of the TV, you can sit your ass at a button and watch cars go down the assembly line for GM union pay.

You can sit on your ass in front of the TV, you can sit on your ass and pull a handle to press license plates.

There are plent of jos one can do sitting down.

Fuck welfare. Government sponsored work programs are the answer. You want money, you will be forced to work. You don't want to work? Fucking starve. Your kids will be taken and given to families that will raise them to be productive.

I say we make armies of sweat shop workers, and hire them out to the lowest bidder, to make T-shirts and towels and all the cool shit that we buy that says 'Made in China' on it, right here in the US. Underbid the Indians and Pakistanis for telephone tech support. Most of the welfare trash in this country speaks English just about as well, anyway, as uneducated as the majority of them are.

Don't want to be a low-bid, slave labor force for your first of the month check? Haul your ass out, and get a real damned job.

My apolgies if this post has seeming racial undertones. It's not that way. I don't give a shit what color or nationality you are. You suck up welfare or disability or other public assistance needlessly, and you are little more than shit on my bootheel.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 5:04:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 97guns:
keeping on the immigrant workforce theme i was wondering why we only see hispanics picking vegtables, washing dishes, hanging out at home depot, etc and not the other nationalities? such as the asians in vietnames, koreans, indians and other forms of hindu's these immigrants are seen more as owners of liquer stores and such, how the hell do they come into our country with this kind of money to open up a store? isnt our dollar worth a bunch more than theirs? so they would have to be absolute millionares in their homeland.....



Many are here illegally, have no education, speak no english and poor as dirt. Its the only jobs available to them. My thoughts.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 5:05:10 PM EDT
It isn't just mexicans doing the grunt work!

I was a janitor for 2 years my first jobs! i busted my ass for 12-24 hours a day 6-7 days a week for min wage, no mileage, no OT, late at night. I worked two or three jobs non stop for a long time. I have been there. I worked with illegals, yup, and I made alot more than them. My boss paid them $3 an hour UTT. I got around $5. Now I make 4-6 times as much sitting on my ass pressing buttons and saving the world daily, sometimes twice a day! I did the job no one wanted, cause I needed money. There are americans to do ALL jobs.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 5:09:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By azcopwannabee:
It isn't just mexicans doing the grunt work!

I was a janitor for 2 years my first jobs! i busted my ass for 12-24 hours a day 6-7 days a week for min wage, no mileage, no OT, late at night. I worked two or three jobs non stop for a long time. I have been there. I worked with illegals, yup, and I made alot more than them. My boss paid them $3 an hour UTT. I got around $5. Now I make 4-6 times as much sitting on my ass pressing buttons and saving the world daily, sometimes twice a day! I did the job no one wanted, cause I needed money. There are americans to do ALL jobs.




might world-saving buttom presser!
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 6:01:36 PM EDT
For some reason American employers are under the mistaken impression that unskilled workers should be cheap…

Well just who the fuck told them that?

There’s this little thing called “Supply and Demand.” If an American won’t go out in the sun and do manual labor for $6.00 an hour the problem isn’t that Americans are lazy, it’s that the employers are cheap.

Everyone wants to have a cushy office job in a nice air conditioned environment. I gave up truck driving because I could make more money as a computer tech. Now the trucking companies are bitching that they don’t have enough drivers… Well No Shit, pay better and you’ll get more people. In a Free Market economy there is one and ONLY one reason that a business doesn’t have enough qualified people… They aren’t paying enough.

There’s also a salary structure tied into the system that says education is worth more than hard work. (Set up by college graduates no doubt.) And that has to change. Maybe that janitor deserves to be paid more than an accountant or computer tech. And the Free Market is never wrong about what someone is worth. If the market dictates that a janitor makes more than the CEO then that’s the way things should be.

Maybe if we can stop the influx of illegal we will see middle class wages start to rise again.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 6:02:47 PM EDT
Because no matter how shitty the job is here, its twice as good as what's in Mexico.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 6:04:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By zoom:
They're not the only ones doing grunt work. It's been months since I've seen a Hispanic person working a manual labor job. Mostly around here you see whites and blacks doing them. I'll never understand the lie that only Hispanics do hard work when you see blacks and whites that are born here doing the vast majority of hard work.z



Could it be because the whites and blacks don't matter to our government any more?
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 6:04:32 PM EDT
Because our homegrown slobs get paid from welfare to sit on their asses all day instead of work.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 6:14:17 PM EDT
When I went to NOLA (pre-Katrina) in Jan 05 I didn't see a single hispanic working the BS jobs as many people call them. YMV, but I saw mainly black and some whites doing the jobs there.

Gives a big FU to the lie about who will and who won't work.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 6:19:10 PM EDT
First, when I first moved to this country, I would have loved to have earned some extra money doing grunt labor (especially when I was literally broke and down to one meal a day), but (1) it was illegal for me to do so under my visa status, and (2) I was warned I would get f'd up royally by one of my Argentinian friends. So not only do you have a population working for very low/illegal wages, they also resort to illegal means to keep others from doing the work. Kind of a weird "union" of sorts.

It also seems that way because most of the immigrant populations out of Asia emphasize education and entrepreurism to get ahead. You don't see two and three generations of other immigrant populations settling for whatever they can find and not pushing for more. The central/south American/mexican immigrants are pretty much the only group I can think of where a father will encourage his son to settle for being a dishwasher like he has been. It's changing somewhat, but in the past that demographic has been content to emphasize family and not working too hard to elevate their positions.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 6:22:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/30/2006 6:23:20 PM EDT by offctr]
WE pay for it in more than one way.
1. there is an entire class of people in this country who are paid to do NOTHING all day.
2. they do not just take jobs that Americans "will not take" they lower the wage scale on several types of work that american would otherwise do but a Mexican will do it CHEAPER.
3. since they are undocumented employers that use them typiclly do not have workmans comp insurance or have to pay things like unemployment benifits to the state and federal govt.
(lesser wages, lower costs means increased profits for the Co's that use them)
BTW it is not just the co's that use them typiclly there are kickbacks to general contractors from subs and others to avoid any close scrunity even though on most construction sites you cant turn arouns without tripping over a mexican.
4. years ago I could easilly get 14-15 bucks and hour framing or roofing in the summertime if I found myself in a slow work period --nowadays no-one would touch that when they can get 2-3 mexicans at 8-10 bucks an hour cash --no liability if one gets hurt and no overtime pay etc.



Stop paying welfare to able bodied people and kick out all the mexicans and after an adjustmant period you will see Americans getting paid to do jobs they "wont do"


BTW if one more politician complains about how much of a "tough decision" "tough task" or "tough situation" a particular piece of legislation is to craft/negotiate/pass I'm gonna explode --hell yeah its a "tough job" --if you dont like it step down and dont run agian. quit complaining you wussies and do the job YOU ran for. You wanted OUR vote WE gave it to you now shut-up and get back to work.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 6:23:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stealth:
When I was growing up most of those "grunt jobs" were held by high school kids figuring out the value of a hard earned dollar.



Like he said, high school kids don't work anymore which creates an abundance of labor and service jobs for whoever wants them.

$10 an hour is a lot of money for a mexican. Even 7-8 bucks an hour is a lot compared to what they probably make in their own country. Supposedly $20 billion a year is sent to Mexico from illegals working in the U.S. That translates to a LOT of Mexican dollars.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 6:26:09 PM EDT

Originally Posted By zoom:
They're not the only ones doing grunt work. It's been months since I've seen a Hispanic person working a manual labor job. Mostly around here you see whites and blacks doing them. I'll never understand the lie that only Hispanics do hard work when you see blacks and whites that are born here doing the vast majority of hard work.z



That depends on where you live. You can't drive six blocks here without seeing at least a dozen mexicans doing yard maintenance, streets, or construction. Ever been to a hotel in Las Vegas? Mexicans have a virtual monopoly on hotel maintenance/ maid work. You can see why they think our economy will collapse without them.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 6:29:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/30/2006 6:41:53 PM EDT by ShadowCompany]

Originally Posted By Lindy_Hoppin_Gun_Nut:

Originally Posted By Napoleon_Tanerite:
it's not just them, they just have the numbers, so it looks like its only them. you go to certain spots in miami and you'll see hatians, dominicans, and others doing the shit jobs.



It's a hard issue, isn't it? We don't want illegals to be here, but at the same time, who's going to do the dirty work? Most Americans (including myself) are not willing to do hard work for little pay. We are willing to do dirty awful hard works only if the pay is right. What is for us to do? I'd say the first answer lies on the government reducing regulations and reducing money that businesses must spend. Do you know that corporate tax stands at 37% right now? That's a lot. Not counting permits for all kind of stuff that cost boucoup $$$$$$$$.

Just my $.002



The side to this equation that people forget about is how much it COSTS to have all these illegals doing the "dirty" jobs. While many Americans don't want to do this work, we essentially subsidize the illegals to do these kinds of jobs. Look at health care. Look at the criminal justice system. Look at taxes. Look at schools. All these services they get for FREE (except for criminal justice - they just contribute to that expense).

You think we don't PAY to have them doing these jobs???

Also, +1 on having 20 mexicans paying for one minivan and an apartment. Imagine if you had even four other people helping pay for your transportation. You could all work for $8/hr and feel good about it.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 6:43:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/30/2006 6:45:49 PM EDT by LANCEMAN]

Originally Posted By 97guns:
keeping on the immigrant workforce theme i was wondering why we only see hispanics picking vegtables, washing dishes, hanging out at home depot, etc and not the other nationalities? such as the asians in vietnames, koreans, indians and other forms of hindu's these immigrants are seen more as owners of liquer stores and such, how the hell do they come into our country with this kind of money to open up a store? isnt our dollar worth a bunch more than theirs? so they would have to be absolute millionares in their homeland.....




These "grunt" jobs don't pay as bad as you might think. In the early 90's I had several friends from families involved in agriculture. A couple of examples:

- Illegals raking and bailing pine straw. Most typically took home $500-800 (15 years ago) a week tax free and sent money back home to Mexico or Honduras or wherever they were from . They got paid by the bail.

- Picking squash. Got paid by the box. Making $500 a week (15 years ago) was no problem for those guys.

They busted their asses for it, don't get me wrong but they were making decent money in the end for what they did. A friend's older brother used to buy something like 10 cases of beer a day (Natural Light and Busch for $7-8 a case) then drive around to the camps and sell beers for $1 a piece. It was pretty damn smart since most of the workers had no ID and were scared of going into town so they were happy to see him. The guy used to make $700-800 a week selling beers to the illegals, at least he was getting some of it back.

Around here there just weren't enough workers to do the work. You would have high school kids hanging/cropping tobacco or throwing watermelons but there weren't near enough (we had one high school in the entire county with 800 kids total) for the amount of work that had to be done. Some brought in legal immigrants with work permits but there were a bunch of illegals around.

Don't see that many around here anymore due to the decline in agriculture over the last 15 years. Nobody grows watermelons or squash these days. The bigger guys that have survived have more modern equipment so we don't have that many migrant workers because there isn't that much demand anymore. Still see pine straw crews though but I think those guys earn every cent they make.
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