Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Posted: 3/20/2006 6:56:20 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/20/2006 7:15:29 AM EDT by A-nus]
I have a cheep POS AK i think it is iterordance pure crap, I think the reciever is too soft, the trigger pin hole has worked its way to be about an 1/16" out and is now to big for the trigger pin. I just grought an RSA pin holder thing, but i want to try to harden the reciever, here is my crazy idea;

1) strip the gun, use an oxyasetilean(SP) torch to heat up the reciever (I have no idea ho hot it need to be)

2) once it gets red hot dunk it into a series of icewater bathes to cool it quickly.

3) spray pain. [edit] i meant paint but i like pain better

LOL just typing it out sounds crazy, but would this work at all?
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 6:57:51 AM EDT
I think you should visit dictionary.com before starting this project.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 6:58:51 AM EDT
Heating and cooling that fast might crack it.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 6:59:43 AM EDT

Originally Posted By falaholic1:
I think you should visit dictionary.com before starting this project.





Annealing

Oxy-Acetylene

And I'd just love to be able to spray "pain" all over the place

Sorry A-nus, just trying to help.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:00:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/20/2006 7:01:38 AM EDT by legonas]
go read the do it yourself forum in the AK section on how to propery heat treat a receiver. look for threads on building from flats.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:06:24 AM EDT
Holy crap dont use Ice water!! Use light oil!! The Ice water is too much of a shock on it will crack it! You will also find that its going to warp like 8 bitches in a bitch boat as soon as you get it hot..
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:08:58 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Fat_McNasty:
8 bitches in a bitch boat as soon as you get it hot..



Well that's a new one.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:09:38 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Fat_McNasty:
...You will also find that its going to warp like 8 bitches in a bitch boat as soon as you get it hot..




Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:10:35 AM EDT

Originally Posted By shop_rat45:

Originally Posted By Fat_McNasty:
8 bitches in a bitch boat as soon as you get it hot..



Well that's a new one.



Hahaha
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:11:01 AM EDT
Did you go to School in the GHETTO?
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:12:45 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:14:29 AM EDT
My spellcheck is not working and i typed it too quick,
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:16:48 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Fat_McNasty:
Holy crap dont use Ice water!! Use light oil!! The Ice water is too much of a shock on it will crack it! You will also find that its going to warp like 8 bitches in a bitch boat as soon as you get it hot..




+1

the 8 bitches in a bitch boat will be my quote for the day. I shall give credit.

Also I don't think you need to use oxy-acet torch. I would think to keep it from warping a good propane torch would do the job.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:17:24 AM EDT

Originally Posted By A-nus:
My spellcheck is not working and i typed it too quick,



I prefer it as it is.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:24:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By A-nus:
I have a cheep POS AK i think it is iterordance pure crap, I think the reciever is too soft, the trigger pin hole has worked its way to be about an 1/16" out and is now to big for the trigger pin. I just grought an RSA pin holder thing, but i want to try to harden the reciever, here is my crazy idea;

1) strip the gun, use an oxyasetilean(SP) torch to heat up the reciever (I have no idea ho hot it need to be)

2) once it gets red hot dunk it into a series of icewater bathes to cool it quickly.

3) spray pain. [edit] i meant paint but i like pain better

LOL just typing it out sounds crazy, but would this work at all?




Yep, you got it. That is the Darwin heat treating method for sure.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:28:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/20/2006 7:30:01 AM EDT by Fat_McNasty]

Originally Posted By shop_rat45:

Originally Posted By Fat_McNasty:
8 bitches in a bitch boat as soon as you get it hot..



Well that's a new one.



Its gonna be more crooked then Ted Kennedy!
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 7:50:52 AM EDT
AK receivers are made of a low carbon steel, so it's probably not very quench hardenable anyway.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 8:00:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By p-dog:
AK receivers are made of a low carbon steel, so it's probably not very quench hardenable anyway.



SO get it hot and put some graphite on it?



I don't know anything about AKs, or if case hardening would have the desired effect or not?
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 8:11:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By jchewie:

Originally Posted By p-dog:
AK receivers are made of a low carbon steel, so it's probably not very quench hardenable anyway.



SO get it hot and put some graphite on it?



I don't know anything about AKs, or if case hardening would have the desired effect or not?



Case hardening can be done DIY with several compounds on the market. One is called Casenit (tm).

Don't do this unless you have a furnace and can flame straighten the frame.

A better way is inductive hardening of the raceways.

Hitting ANY machined part with a torch is a quick way to distortion.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 8:13:38 AM EDT

Originally Posted By dedfella:

Originally Posted By Fat_McNasty:
Holy crap dont use Ice water!! Use light oil!! The Ice water is too much of a shock on it will crack it! You will also find that its going to warp like 8 bitches in a bitch boat as soon as you get it hot..




+1

the 8 bitches in a bitch boat will be my quote for the day. I shall give credit.

Also I don't think you need to use oxy-acet torch. I would think to keep it from warping a good propane torch would do the job.



+2

take advice from these guys. They know what they are talking about.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 8:14:22 AM EDT
Assuming that it’s made of a steel with enough carbon to harden…

And assuming it doesn’t warp when you heat it…

And assuming it doesn’t warp and crack when you quench it…

And assuming you don’t overheat the steel, and permanently damage it…

Then there’s a good chance you will dangerously overharden the steel. Hardened steel is very brittle and would likely break when used. You would need to temper the steel in an oven to draw out some of the hardness and toughen it up some. Your oven would work just fine for that. But then you need to know how hot the oven should be and how long to leave the receiver in.

One benefit of doing this would be that you could then sell the rest of the rifle as parts and use the money to help pay for an AR-15. Because if you try that with your receiver you are going to completely ruin it. Hopefully it will be ruined in an obvious way, otherwise you might get hurt when the receiver breaks from the heat mistreatment you gave it.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 8:28:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/20/2006 8:28:55 AM EDT by Ineedhelp]
Ok here is the answers to your questions:


1. Heating metal red hot with torch: GOOD to Go.

2. Quenching in ice water: NO BAD DONT DO IT. Quench in USED motor oil. This will allow the metal to cool SLOWLY which is what you want to do.


3. Spray PAIN over it: You can spray all the pain you want but it won't make the reciever look any better.....may I recommend a form of spray PAINT?
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 8:44:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/20/2006 8:55:03 AM EDT by AeroE]
Don't quench the reciever to anneal.

Darken the room, heat the receiver til it starts to turn color (red), and let it cool in the air. Don't run a fan or let the breeze blow through until the part has cooled. If you do this outside, wait til dusk. You can't see the color develop in full light.

Unless you use a hell of a big tip, you may need someone to help by heating the region away from your torch with a propane torch, just don't set each other on fire.

Another way -
Wrap the receiver in aluminum foil,
build a charcoal fire,
bury the reciever top, bottom, and insides in the charcoal,
let the fire burn out, and you are finished.
Use stainless foil if you can find some, but since this is a ghetto project, I say press on with kitchen supplies.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 8:58:31 AM EDT
You know it might be a lot simpler and perhaps safer to buy a new receiver.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 9:00:49 AM EDT
The annealing temperature is usually higher than the HT temp in most steels. You heat to the spec'd annealing temperature and allow it to cool either in a container of vermiculite or in the HT oven once turned off. This returns the steel to it's full soft condition.

To Harden, you raise the metal to the specified hardening temperature & quench in the specified media, water, oil or air. Then to temper the metal, you raise it to the spec'd temp for the RC hardness range you seek, tempering temp is much lower than the HT temp. you keep it there for typically an hour before quenching.

In doing the process, you will create scale due to the presence of oxy. You either have to use stainless tool wrap or HT in an inert atmosphere like argon.

From what I recall, many cheap AK's are spot HT'd which probably amounts to not much more than heating the holes around the wear points to an orange red and plunging into oil.


An example is ordinary O-1 oil hardening tool steel. You heat to 1450-1500 deg. F, quench in oil.

Temper to RC 62/62 you heat 1 hr. @ 300-350 deg, 58/60 400-450 deg, 48/52 800-850 deg.


Link Posted: 3/20/2006 9:07:09 AM EDT

Originally Posted By gks452:
You know it might be a lot simpler and perhaps safer to buy a new receiver.



+1. Or build one.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 9:26:04 AM EDT

Originally Posted By A-nus:

3) spray pain.



that's what AK's are for baby! spraying PAIN!!!


Link Posted: 3/20/2006 9:34:24 AM EDT
When building an AK from a flat, you must heat treat the pin holes. Simply heat it with a mapp gas torch til it's cherry red, then dunk it in water or light oil. Then heat it till its blue and let it air dry.

Check the AK side, they will say the same thing.
Link Posted: 3/20/2006 10:28:01 AM EDT

Originally Posted By gks452:
You know it might be a lot simpler and perhaps safer to buy a new receiver.





No fun in that.
Top Top