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Posted: 3/15/2006 8:14:28 AM EDT
As many of you know I collect WWI and WWII stuff (uniforms, flags, medals, etc.) but I saw something fairly unique in a guys collection the other night.

A "captured" American flag (taken by the Japanese, probably in the Philippines) with various Japanese kanji on it that was "recaptured" at some point during the war in the Pacific.

I had never seen anything like that before. I'm sure a few captured US flags exist in Japanese and German collections but I'd never seen one, let alone a retaken one. Seems to me a unlikely thing to happen.

And as collectors of these sorts of things need to be mindful of, probably a lot of blood associated with the item in question. Had pretty mixed emotions looking at it, among other things it was well battle worn.

Normally I jump at the chance to try and add rare items like that to my collection. But something just didn't sit well with me this time and I didn't even make an offer. Perhaps just as well, it wouldn't have been cheap.
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 8:39:47 AM EDT
I dont know Steyr I think the fact that it was recaptured just makes the sentimental factor even more relavent. If I were you I would have made an offer. But if it doesn't sit well with you then you did the right thing. Incidentally do you have scoped G43 or K 43 in your collection and if so can ya post a pic of it and tell me what you think of it???
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 8:44:13 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MrMurphy:
I dont know Steyr I think the fact that it was recaptured just makes the sentimental factor even more relavent. If I were you I would have made an offer. But if it doesn't sit well with you then you did the right thing. Incidentally do you have scoped G43 or K 43 in your collection and if so can ya post a pic of it and tell me what you think of it???



Don't have a G43 but seen a few. I was impressed, one day I'll grab one.
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 8:44:29 AM EDT
I don't see what the problem is.
If you collect WWI and WWII historical stuff then this flag is just another part of that history. The truth is that during WWII we got our ass kicked by the Japs during the opening months and then we got our ass in gear and kicked their ass all the way back. This flag was part of that history.

Link Posted: 3/15/2006 8:46:34 AM EDT

Originally Posted By yobo:
I don't see what the problem is.
If you collect WWI and WWII historical stuff then this flag is just another part of that history. The truth is that during WWII we got our ass kicked by the Japs during the opening months and then we got our ass in gear and kicked their ass all the way back. This flag was part of that history.




I guess it's differnet when it's "yours." Kinda like a blood stained GI uniform or a US helmet with a bullet hole.
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 8:47:31 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/15/2006 8:48:32 AM EDT by Colt_sporter]
I'm ppretty stuck on that on too. On one hand you have the creepyness...but still the history part... I dunno...seems too creepy to me...too many lost souls come with that piece of history...
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 8:50:54 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 8:52:34 AM EDT
SteyrAug, how about a M1 carbine with Nazi proofs on it? Captured from a US soldier, reissued, and recaptured. Would you own that?
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 8:53:26 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:

Originally Posted By yobo:
I don't see what the problem is.
If you collect WWI and WWII historical stuff then this flag is just another part of that history. The truth is that during WWII we got our ass kicked by the Japs during the opening months and then we got our ass in gear and kicked their ass all the way back. This flag was part of that history.




I guess it's differnet when it's "yours." Kinda like a blood stained GI uniform or a US helmet with a bullet hole.



I wouldn't have a problem with blood stained uniform or GI helmet with hole in it. I would have great respect for it and treat them with highest honor. Reality is that a lot of American blood was spilled in that war and I wouldn't want to stick my head in the sand and not face that fact. We didn't just kill the Jap and Huns... our boys and men died too. A lot of boys and men didn't come back home and I would honor them and remember their sacrifices.

Look at it this way, if you colllect WWII rifles would you only want to collect US rifles or Brits, Russians, Japs, Germans, Italians, etc. too?





Link Posted: 3/15/2006 8:56:49 AM EDT
How about a picture of Santa visiting wounded Germans?


Link Posted: 3/15/2006 8:57:17 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 8:58:01 AM EDT
I too collect WW2 memorabilia. I was given a sterling silver cigarette case that has a miniature German Wound badge in Gold (Verwunden Abzeichem im Gelt) mounted on it. I thought that was pretty cool in itself. I figured some GI during WW2 must have either bought it or taken it from a German POW. After a few days, I was looking at the item and realized there was some kind of stain on it that was a few inches in diameter in the ergraved stripes on the front of the case. I showed the item to my Mom who was a nurse for 20 years. She said it was most likely blood. I took the case to one of my old college professors who was a retired criminalist at the crime lab and he had a friend examine it and sure enough there was still blood on the cigarette case. 50 years had passed and the blood was still there. Creepy huh?
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 9:03:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MrMurphy:
Incidentally do you have scoped G43 or K 43 in your collection and if so can ya post a pic of it and tell me what you think of it???



I have one, I need to dig out my camera but I can probably arrange some photos of it if you want..

Haven't shot it (need to get the Apfeltor shooter's kit at the bottom of that link there before I shoot it), but it's a pretty neat thing.

Yes, I have a real ZF-4 and real mount for the scope as well.

Link Posted: 3/15/2006 9:03:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:
SteyrAug, how about a M1 carbine with Nazi proofs on it? Captured from a US soldier, reissued, and recaptured. Would you own that?



I dunno.
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 9:07:06 AM EDT
Different strokes for different folks.

When I was growing up I had a neighbor who only had only one leg and it didn't work too well. I never knew what happened but assumed he was born that way. One day my younger brother (I think he was 3 yrs old at the time) walked up to the neighbor and asked him what he did with his other leg. He replied that he lost it when he was away on a trip... then he turned to me and told me he stepped on a mine in Vietnam and that he lost one and damaged the other leg.

He was in Vietnam in the late 60's as a news photographer and stepped on a mine while out with some troops. Couple years later I was over at his house and he had a funny looking can thing on his fireplace. I asked him what it was and he said it was the casing of the mine that he stepped on. He said it was his lucky piece because it didn't kill him.
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 9:08:07 AM EDT
Interesting dilemna.

I could go both ways.

I just saw an article about a Protestant church in Germany built during the Nazi era. It has Swastikas throughout it and men in German helmets on the walls.

Would you restore it to show the history and remind people of what happened or would you let it crumble?

I think I would want the flag, but I don't think I would display it.
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 9:37:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SS109:
I think I would want the flag, but I don't think I would display it.



I don't see a problem with displaying it.

It says "you might take it briefly, we'll fucking come and get it".
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 10:13:32 AM EDT
it would depend on the price...there are fakes circulating and it would help to have an expert look at it.
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 10:25:08 AM EDT
I think it's better you collect and preserve it than some anti-war hippy burn it.
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 10:39:05 AM EDT

Originally Posted By shotar:

Originally Posted By yobo:

Look at it this way, if you colllect WWII rifles would you only want to collect US rifles or Brits, Russians, Japs, Germans, Italians, etc. too?








I would have a problem owning a gun that had killed Americans. I know its an emotional thing, but it would bother me. The only exception is as I cited before where I knew for sure that this particular gun had been taken from a dead enemy thus paying for the evil of its owner.



The gun didn't kill American's, its user did. Its an inanimate object. Atleast thats what we tell the left...
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