Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Posted: 2/25/2006 1:27:25 PM EDT
Winchester quits making the lever guns, and Colt is barely seen thriving in the 1911 arena. Why is this? And what was the reason for their downfalls?
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 1:27:55 PM EDT
They haven't had a GOOD new gun in decades.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 1:29:31 PM EDT
It's harder to stay on top than it is to fight your way there.

No new/ground breaking stuff.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 1:29:37 PM EDT
If you keep on making the same thing that has already flooded the market years ago, your business will fail. Any company needs to try to stay ahead of the curve and make new products the masses will want.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 1:31:39 PM EDT
Colts downfall was the 80 series, and their attitude towards civilian AR sales. Winchester doesnt make any guns anymore period. FN already owned them, and will be using the tooling for the 70 series bolt guns to make their SPR/PBR guns and the shotgun tooling will go towards the FN line of police/tactical shotguns.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 1:32:01 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 2:49:54 PM EDT
Its the MBA mentality where every management decision is geared towards the next quarter's earnings statement, but no thought is given to the company's viability next year, or in 5 years.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 2:59:43 PM EDT
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there. Their S70 reissue 1911s are outstanding and well worth the $250 premium over a SA milspec full of MIM parts. They are introducing a gas piston monolithic system. The only problem I have with Colts finding them to buy in the first place.



Can't say the same about Winchester, it has been down hill there since 1964.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 3:01:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By STG77:
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there.



I hope you're right, I just bought a Colt AR. I've always thought highly of Rock River's AR-15.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 3:06:45 PM EDT

Poor management, Unions, Less poor management from competitors, Foreign ownership, Unions....
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 3:06:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By STG77:
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there. .



That statement is just comical. They are making AR's less or equal to the quality of others for more money. The name just doesn't have it anymore, you have to back it up with quality products and make them available.

Bill3508
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 3:08:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By STG77:
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there.




?
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 3:11:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bill3508:
Originally Posted By STG77:
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there. .



That statement is just comical. They are making AR's less or equal to the quality of others for more money. The name just doesn't have it anymore, you have to back it up with quality products and make them available.

Bill3508




Um, ok. Whatever you want to believe.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 3:11:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Mak:

Originally Posted By STG77:
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there.




?




Link Posted: 2/25/2006 3:19:20 PM EDT
Well it is sad to see both companies to loose market share. But that is way it goes.

Colt lost the AR15 market, 1911 market, and single action market. I think it had to do with price. Why buy a Colt AR, or Single action when you can find one else where for less.

Too bad, they do buid wonderful firearms.

Winchester lost out to Uberti and lack a new firearms.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 3:28:55 PM EDT
Colt became the Apple Computer of the gun world in that they decided they were too good for the plebians.

The last Win94 I bought was functional, but the overall fit and finish was lower than what the Italians were/are making. If Winchester cared so little for their products, they deserved to die out.

Remember, it is the design and the product that matter, not the company. The Winchester that is fading away had little if anything to do with the Winchester of WWII and earlier. They lost their way, their soul, and their market.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 7:49:16 PM EDT
If you dont listen to your customers, you lose business.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 9:22:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SIG-24-7:

Originally Posted By STG77:
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there.



I hope you're right, I just bought a Colt AR. I've always thought highly of Rock River's AR-15.



If RRA's AR15s are the same quality as their 1911s, then they make Colt look like HiPoint or Jennings.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 9:23:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/26/2006 1:07:26 PM EDT by WIZZO_ARAKM14]
I'd say lack of innovation got them.

WIZZO
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 9:26:22 PM EDT

Originally Posted By STG77:
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there.



Guess that was in the early 80s, eh?
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 9:38:15 PM EDT
Corporate Accountants running the businesses instead of business-savvy shooters. The Exec's who make decision lose touch with the what shooters are really looking for.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 10:29:11 PM EDT
Most jingoists here might not wanna here this BUT, American Guns in General have been in a bad decline. Most of the top guns for Mil & police are European. Yeah, you know the crazy socialists who don't know anything about guns? The big names now are H&K , FN-herstal, SIG, Glock, some isrealis,Czech CZ, Croatia etc. We seem to be innovative in Gangster guns! kel-tec, hi-point etc. Or we just breathe some life into an old gun like Kimber or Les bayer. The one bright spot i can think of is Barrett. We refuse to innovate, reject what is new (plastic frames), and nobody seems to be into Engineering/Design anymore, better to be a rapper right?
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 10:36:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By nf9648:

Originally Posted By SIG-24-7:

Originally Posted By STG77:
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there.



I hope you're right, I just bought a Colt AR. I've always thought highly of Rock River's AR-15.



If RRA's AR15s are the same quality as their 1911s, then they make Colt look like HiPoint or Jennings.



you mean the same people who dremil on m4 feed ramps
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 10:36:43 PM EDT
Colt was crazy to stop offering the Python.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 11:13:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/26/2006 12:20:57 AM EDT by warlord]
GunLvrPHD: Colt is still making the Python, but they are charging something like $1,000
From what I understand, building a Python requires 100% hand labor, each assembler is given a box of parts and told here make a Python, the gun files and stones all of the part to assemble one.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 11:25:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/25/2006 11:25:50 PM EDT by Followthehollow]

Originally Posted By nf9648:

Originally Posted By SIG-24-7:

Originally Posted By STG77:
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there.



I hope you're right, I just bought a Colt AR. I've always thought highly of Rock River's AR-15.



If RRA's AR15s are the same quality as their 1911s, then they make Colt look like HiPoint or Jennings.



They are.
I dunno about making Colt look like Hipoint or Jennings, but RRA AR's are definatly top of the line.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 11:39:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By STG77:
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there. Their S70 reissue 1911s are outstanding and well worth the $250 premium over a SA milspec full of MIM parts. They are introducing a gas piston monolithic system. The only problem I have with Colts finding them to buy in the first place.



Can't say the same about Winchester, it has been down hill there since 1964.



I'll buy a Colt AR when they have mil spec FCG pins.
Until then....it is Stag/Bushy/RRA for me.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 11:56:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By thedoctors308:

Originally Posted By STG77:
Last I checked, Colt was still making the best ARs out there. Their S70 reissue 1911s are outstanding and well worth the $250 premium over a SA milspec full of MIM parts. They are introducing a gas piston monolithic system. The only problem I have with Colts finding them to buy in the first place.



Can't say the same about Winchester, it has been down hill there since 1964.



I'll buy a Colt AR when they have mil spec FCG pins.
Until then....it is Stag/Bushy/RRA for me.



+1


Link Posted: 2/26/2006 7:34:48 AM EDT

Originally Posted By warlord:
GunLvrPHD: Colt is still making the Python, but they are charging something like $1,000
From what I understand, building a Python requires 100% hand labor, each assembler is given a box of parts and told here make a Python, the gun files and stones all of the part to assemble one.



I thought they announced years ago they were not making it or any other revolver anymore???

If they are sill being made I need to start saving.
Top Top