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Posted: 2/18/2006 4:41:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/18/2006 4:44:24 AM EDT by 1dreamer]
From CNN http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/02/17/bootcamp.death/index.html
They picked on him so much, 'til they murdered my baby'

Friday, February 17, 2006; Posted: 4:50 p.m. EST (21:50 GMT)


Gina Jones, the mother of 14-year-old Martin Lee Anderson, says her son "didn't even have a chance."


PANAMA CITY, Florida (CNN) -- Florida authorities released a videotape Friday showing officers at a state-run juvenile boot camp striking and restraining a teenager, who collapsed.

Martin Lee Anderson, 14, died hours later and his family is blaming the state. They claim Anderson was choked, kicked and beaten by boot camp staffers.

"Martin didn't even have a chance," said the boy's mother, Gina Jones. "They picked on him so much, 'til they murdered my baby." (Watch officers take the boy to the ground -- 6:40)

The Bay County medical examiner ruled Thursday, however, that Anderson died January 6 from internal bleeding that resulted from sickle cell trait, which had not previously been diagnosed.

Sickle cell trait occurs when a person has one sickle cell gene. People with two of the abnormal genes have sickle cell anemia, which can lead to a variety of complications.

Anderson collapsed at the Bay County Sheriff's Office Boot Camp program on his first day there. He complained of having trouble breathing while running around a track as part of the entry process and collapsed. He died the next day.

The intake process at the facility is videotaped as a matter of policy.

The poor quality video -- which has no audio -- shows the teen and other youths doing push-ups before running around a small field. At times, uniformed officers pull some of the boys aside and place them against a wall, one by one.Restrained against tree

Later, at least five uniformed officers appear to restrain a boy -- identified by his family as Anderson -- against a tree. A woman in a white coat, who appears to be a nurse, looks on for a few minutes before walking away.

The boy falls to the ground and the officers try, without success, to pull him up by his arms.

Later, Anderson is shown on the ground as the officers stand around him. It is not clear from the video what they are doing.

As they stand back, the boy is lying on the ground, limp. Staffers pull him up by his arms and try to get him to walk. Repeatedly, he takes a small step, then falls to his knees. His movements indicate he may be lapsing in and out of consciousness.

The boy finally collapses to the ground and the woman with the white coat appears to use a stethoscope before performing CPR as other officers look on or walk back and forth.

The incident on the video tape lasts for about 10 minutes before paramedics arrive and take the teenager away on a stretcher.
No bruises found

After viewing the video, medical examiner Charles Siebert said he did not consider the restraint measures used to be excessive.

"None of the physical contact I observed could have caused his death," he said. He added that his examination of the body found no evidence of any blunt force trauma or bruising.

Siebert added that trouble breathing is a sign of sickle cell trait, a condition which medical authorities say has no other symptoms. It would not have been caught by the screening done before Anderson entered the camp, he said.

After his findings, Siebert said, the Florida Department of Law Enforcement uncovered past incidents when Anderson became short of breath in basketball practice.

Anderson's family and supporters were skeptical of the medical examiner's findings and called for an independent investigation.
Family alleges teen was beaten

The boy's parents, lawyer and local politicians held a news conference after the video was released, accusing the officers of choking the boy and kicking him while he was ill.

"There is no justification for that," said the family's attorney, Darryl Parks. "These are grown men."

Gina Jones said authorities are trying to cover up the cause of her son's death. She said she couldn't watch the entire tape because it was too disturbing.

The sheriff's office said restraint measures were used on Anderson for being "uncooperative."

The FDLE has concluded its investigation into the incident and has given its evidence to the state attorney, who will determine whether charges will be filed.

A federal probe into whether Anderson's civil rights were violated by the use of excessive force is also under way, according to the U.S. attorney's office. The investigation was asked for by the boy's parents and local leaders. Some want boot camps closed

After seeing the tape, Florida state Sen. Gary Siplin said he does not understand how the coroner reached his conclusion.

"We want the FDLE or the authorities to go and subdue and arrest those people who brutally beat, kicked and punched and choked Mr. Anderson, 14 years old," Siplin said.

Siplin and other African-Americans in and out of government want the boot camp facilities closed.

Florida operates five boot camps for troubled children as a substitute for prison.

Besides Anderson, two other black teens have died in boot camp custody, but Florida Gov. Jeb Bush said it is too early to call for the facilities to be closed.

"My heart goes out to the family," Bush said of Anderson's death. "This is the first time, I believe, that something like this has happened at a boot camp after many years.

"It's tragic, but to shut down the boot camps without having seen the investigation, with having seen what needs to be done, is a little premature."


Saw this this AM and I call it murder. There was no reason they needed at leat 5 to restrain him and then they wouldn't let the nurse do anything but watch. Damn them.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:06:58 AM EDT
what was the teen in for? Murder? Rape? stuff like that affects my judgement. Call it karma.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:14:39 AM EDT
Kid was an honor roll student and that was his first & last day there. Not sure why he was at the boot camp. The video makes me so angry, I wish I would have been there but then I'd be in a jail cell for assault & battery.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:21:00 AM EDT

Originally Posted By 1dreamer:
Kid was an honor roll student and that was his first & last day there. Not sure why he was at the boot camp. The video makes me so angry, I wish I would have been there but then I'd be in a jail cell for assault & battery.



Aren't they always "honor roll students"?

You get SENTENCED to boot camp. It's not canoes and outdoor crafts. He did SOMETHING to get put there.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:21:04 AM EDT

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:
what was the teen in for? Murder? Rape? stuff like that affects my judgement. Call it karma.



I forget what his issues were but I don't think they were violent crime stuff.

In this case, lawsuit might be appropriate.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:24:22 AM EDT
I saw the tape and heard of the accounts firsthand...he had a medical condition that was not realized. He was'nt "savagely" beaten...not that I could see. They were trying to help him up after he collapsed.

I am sure a couple of million dollars will make his family feel better about it.

I've seen them on t.v. locally 3 times, whinig abut racism and other sos mantras.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:26:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Johninaustin:

Originally Posted By 1dreamer:
Kid was an honor roll student and that was his first & last day there. Not sure why he was at the boot camp. The video makes me so angry, I wish I would have been there but then I'd be in a jail cell for assault & battery.



Aren't they always "honor roll students"?

You get SENTENCED to boot camp. It's not canoes and outdoor crafts. He did SOMETHING to get put there.



from cnn:

Anderson was arrested in June for stealing his grandmother's Jeep Cherokee and sent to the boot camp for violating his probation by trespassing at a school.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:28:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/18/2006 5:29:43 AM EDT by five2one]

Originally Posted By NAKED-GUNMAN:
I saw the tape and heard of the accounts firsthand...he had a medical condition that was not realized. He was'nt "savagely" beaten...not that I could see. They were trying to help him up after he collapsed.

I am sure a couple of million dollars will make his family feel better about it.

I've seen them on t.v. locally 3 times, whinig abut racism and other sos mantras.



One would think that boot camps would do medical physical exams and get medical records when they bring a kid in. They would for football camp.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:36:51 AM EDT


Not that I'm an expert in sickle cell, boot camp corrections, or beatings, but I'd be very suspicious too if I were the parent. Nor am I an expert in evaluating medical examiner stuff, but he attributed the cause of death to internal bleeding associated with sickle cell but didn't think the beatings or restraining had anything to do with that.

I'll trust the justice system to figure it out.

Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:44:40 AM EDT

Originally Posted By 1dreamer:
"Martin didn't even have a chance," said the boy's mother, Gina Jones. "They picked on him so much, 'til they murdered my baby."



Maybe "her baby" ought not to have broken the law.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:49:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Old_Painless:

Originally Posted By 1dreamer:
"Martin didn't even have a chance," said the boy's mother, Gina Jones. "They picked on him so much, 'til they murdered my baby."



Maybe "her baby" ought not to have broken the law.



I agree
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:51:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/18/2006 5:54:35 AM EDT by C-4]

Originally Posted By five2one:
I forget what his issues were but I don't think they were violent crime stuff.

In this case, lawsuit might be appropriate.



Hey idiot, did you even bother to read this part:


Originally Posted By five2one:
The Bay County medical examiner ruled Thursday, however, that Anderson died January 6 from internal bleeding that resulted from sickle cell trait, which had not previously been diagnosed.

Sickle cell trait occurs when a person has one sickle cell gene. People with two of the abnormal genes have sickle cell anemia, which can lead to a variety of complications.



The fucking Medical Examiner did an autopsy (google the word if you don't know what that is) and found he died as a result of his sickle cell trait.

In case you have a learning disability and don't know how to google:


Sickle cell trait usually is not regarded as a disease state because it has complications that are either uncommon or mild. Nevertheless, under unusual circumstances serious morbidity or mortality can result from complications related to polymerization of deoxy-hemoglobin S. Such problems include increased urinary tract infection in women, gross hematuria, complications of hyphema, splenic infarction with altitude hypoxia or exercise, and life-threatening complications of exercise, exertional heat illness (exertional rhabdomyolysis, heat stroke, or renal failure) or idiopathic sudden death (1-4). Pathologic processes that cause hypoxia, acidosis, dehydration, hyperosmolality, hypothermia, or elevated erythrocyte 2,3-DPG can transform silent sickle cell trait into a syndrome resembling sickle cell disease with vaso-occlusion due to rigid erythrocytes. Compound heterozygous sickle cell disease can be mistaken as uncomplicated sickle cell trait, particularly when an unusual globin variant is involved.


sickle.bwh.harvard.edu/sickle_trait.html

I took care of a lot of patients with sickle cell disease and a few with sickle cell trait and this is what happens when you stress/exercise them. While I'm the first to point out police/C.O. brutality, this is not one of those cases.

And yes, I'm sure he was just about to turn his life around.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:54:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By five2one:

Not that I'm an expert in sickle cell, boot camp corrections, or beatings, but I'd be very suspicious too if I were the parent. Nor am I an expert in evaluating medical examiner stuff, but he attributed the cause of death to internal bleeding associated with sickle cell but didn't think the beatings or restraining had anything to do with that.

I'll trust the justice system to figure it out.




You admit that you're not an expert, yet you don't believe the M.E.'s report.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 5:57:06 AM EDT
No reason to close the boot camp....
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 6:01:48 AM EDT

Originally Posted By five2one:

from cnn:

Anderson was arrested in June for stealing his grandmother's Jeep Cherokee and sent to the boot camp for violating his probation by trespassing at a school.



wow.. that gets you jail/boot camp time.. ?

i cant count the number of times I slipped the family car in Nuetral... rolled it out the drive way and took off....


wow..
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 6:04:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By C-4:

Originally Posted By five2one:
I forget what his issues were but I don't think they were violent crime stuff.

In this case, lawsuit might be appropriate.



Hey idiot, did you even bother to read this part:


Originally Posted By five2one:
The Bay County medical examiner ruled Thursday, however, that Anderson died January 6 from internal bleeding that resulted from sickle cell trait, which had not previously been diagnosed.

Sickle cell trait occurs when a person has one sickle cell gene. People with two of the abnormal genes have sickle cell anemia, which can lead to a variety of complications.



The fucking Medical Examiner did an autopsy (google the word if you don't know what that is) and found he died as a result of his sickle cell trait.

In case you have a learning disability and don't know how to google:


Sickle cell trait usually is not regarded as a disease state because it has complications that are either uncommon or mild. Nevertheless, under unusual circumstances serious morbidity or mortality can result from complications related to polymerization of deoxy-hemoglobin S. Such problems include increased urinary tract infection in women, gross hematuria, complications of hyphema, splenic infarction with altitude hypoxia or exercise, and life-threatening complications of exercise, exertional heat illness (exertional rhabdomyolysis, heat stroke, or renal failure) or idiopathic sudden death (1-4). Pathologic processes that cause hypoxia, acidosis, dehydration, hyperosmolality, hypothermia, or elevated erythrocyte 2,3-DPG can transform silent sickle cell trait into a syndrome resembling sickle cell disease with vaso-occlusion due to rigid erythrocytes. Compound heterozygous sickle cell disease can be mistaken as uncomplicated sickle cell trait, particularly when an unusual globin variant is involved.



sickle.bwh.harvard.edu/sickle_trait.html

I took care of a lot of patients with sickle cell disease and a few with sickle cell trait and this is what happens when you stress/exercise them. While I'm the first to point out police/C.O. brutality, this is not one of those cases.

And yes, I'm sure he was just about to turn his life around.



I can see you're having a little bit of an emotional reaction. I didn't say it was police brutality.

You are correct that I missed the part that it was undiagnosed and that certainly explains a lot. I assumed, wrongly, that his condition was known.

At least he won't be a criminal now.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 6:12:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By five2one:
I can see you're having a little bit of an emotional reaction. I didn't say it was police brutality.

You are correct that I missed the part that it was undiagnosed and that certainly explains a lot. I assumed, wrongly, that his condition was known.

At least he won't be a criminal now.



Sorry about that. I will be the first to jump on the abuse bandwagon if it is proven that some abuse took place, but from all the available information, this isn't one of those cases. The guards shouldn't feel guilty because of an undiagnosed medical problem.

Knowing the very little I do about the juvenile justice system, it probably took a lot to get him to the bootcamp in the first place. The probation violation was simply the last straw.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 6:12:35 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/18/2006 6:14:05 AM EDT by five2one]

Originally Posted By C-4:

Originally Posted By five2one:

Not that I'm an expert in sickle cell, boot camp corrections, or beatings, but I'd be very suspicious too if I were the parent. Nor am I an expert in evaluating medical examiner stuff, but he attributed the cause of death to internal bleeding associated with sickle cell but didn't think the beatings or restraining had anything to do with that.

I'll trust the justice system to figure it out.




You admit that you're not an expert, yet you don't believe the M.E.'s report.



I'd be suspicious -- I guess you wouldn't be. <snide remark edited>
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 6:21:40 AM EDT

Originally Posted By five2one:

Originally Posted By C-4:

Originally Posted By five2one:

Not that I'm an expert in sickle cell, boot camp corrections, or beatings, but I'd be very suspicious too if I were the parent. Nor am I an expert in evaluating medical examiner stuff, but he attributed the cause of death to internal bleeding associated with sickle cell but didn't think the beatings or restraining had anything to do with that.

I'll trust the justice system to figure it out.




You admit that you're not an expert, yet you don't believe the M.E.'s report.



I'd be suspicious -- I guess you wouldn't be. <snide remark edited>



I missed the 'snide remark'. I probably would have enjoyed it.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 6:21:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/18/2006 6:28:11 AM EDT by five2one]

Originally Posted By C-4:

Originally Posted By five2one:
I can see you're having a little bit of an emotional reaction. I didn't say it was police brutality.

You are correct that I missed the part that it was undiagnosed and that certainly explains a lot. I assumed, wrongly, that his condition was known.

At least he won't be a criminal now.



Sorry about that. I will be the first to jump on the abuse bandwagon if it is proven that some abuse took place, but from all the available information, this isn't one of those cases. The guards shouldn't feel guilty because of an undiagnosed medical problem.

Knowing the very little I do about the juvenile justice system, it probably took a lot to get him to the bootcamp in the first place. The probation violation was simply the last straw.



Ok, I'll confess a little too. I have worked at something like a boot camp. It was actually more of a long term residental system based on camping and outdoor life rather than the military model, but it is a lot the same. Lots of discipline and hard work.

I've seen a few zealous "counselors" put a beating or painful restraint hold on kids because of power and maybe even a little sadism rather than correction.

I don't know what happened here, but just like your have your experiences that would lead you to believe the ME and no negligence, I suppose I have some experiences that make me skeptical.

But I am in no way saying we should close the boot camps, or the counselors were racist or criminal, or even that I am convinced that the mother is deserving of money (especially after learning that the condition was undiagnosed).

eta: So maybe it is me who is having the emotional reaction. Cheers to friendly dialogue where I learned something.
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 6:38:49 AM EDT
Sure, close the boot camps, just turn them into regular jails, that will be so much better for their health.......because nobody ever dies in jail........
Link Posted: 2/18/2006 6:40:38 AM EDT

Originally Posted By five2one:
Ok, I'll confess a little too. I have worked at something like a boot camp. It was actually more of a long term residental system based on camping and outdoor life rather than the military model, but it is a lot the same. Lots of discipline and hard work.

I've seen a few zealous "counselors" put a beating or painful restraint hold on kids because of power and maybe even a little sadism rather than correction.

I don't know what happened here, but just like your have your experiences that would lead you to believe the ME and no negligence, I suppose I have some experiences that make me skeptical.

But I am in no way saying we should close the boot camps, or the counselors were racist or criminal, or even that I am convinced that the mother is deserving of money (especially after learning that the condition was undiagnosed).

eta: So maybe it is me who is having the emotional reaction. Cheers to friendly dialogue where I learned something.



Since it's time for confession:

I had a 'run-in' with a corrections officer once. I was on a rural road and had passed the turn-off for a pond. I went to make a U-turn but decided to let a car behind me pass first. I backed up onto the wide gravel public shoulder. The C.O., in the passenger seat of the other car (stopped and blocked my path), told me I couldn't 'park on my brother's property'. Very bright that one. I carefully explained that I was letting him pass and that I had no intention of parking there. The guy went ape-shit. Long and short, he was convicted of criminal threatening in the first trial by the judge, but found 'not guilty' in the second trial by a jury. He had the best defense attorney in the state. No joke.

I agree that a small percentage of people attracted to those types of jobs are true sociopaths. What can you do.

Despite my experience, I give them the benefit of the doubt. I would expect the same if my actions were under scrutiny.


Originally Posted By five2one:
eta: So maybe it is me who is having the emotional reaction. Cheers to friendly dialogue where I learned something.



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