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Posted: 2/14/2006 6:13:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/14/2006 6:14:05 AM EDT by motown_steve]
I see that they have 10mm, but no one ever throws it into any of the debates. How come? Does anyone own a 10? Does anyone like it?
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:16:51 AM EDT
Aint that the preferred caliber of Vic Mackey?

Oh wait, he's fictional so he probably doesn't count.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:17:49 AM EDT
Because 9mm and .45 are the best rounds.....of you can't hit center mass use .45....if you are good at shot placement stick with the 9mm.....no need to "go bigger"....



Oh...and...10mm is too powerful for your average arfcommer.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:19:04 AM EDT
I thoroughly enjoy the 1006 I purchased ~ 10 years ago. Very ergnomic and a great shooter.


Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:19:54 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/14/2006 6:22:28 AM EDT by Fat_McNasty]
No its a piece of crap.. The .38 is a much better round.

Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:20:11 AM EDT
Got one, shoot it, love it. I don't shoot it much because I don't reload much anymore. Ammo can be a bit more expensive.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:22:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/14/2006 6:25:19 AM EDT by Cross_Steel]
Everything I've read about the 10mm has been positive. (Except the availability and price of ammo) I was hoping this caliber would experience a revival after the Clinton Ban expired. I know hunters who have killed wild boars with their Glock 20. I know a sheriff's deputy(part of the drug task force) that carrys one. With all the meth heads he has to deal with he wants something with stopping power and capacity.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:27:20 AM EDT
The 10mm is a fantastic performer.

The problem is that there are no top-notch defensive loads for the 10mm and the practice ammo is EXPENSIVE.

If you don't mind high-dollar ammo or if you reload, a 10mm is a great caliber to own.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:28:38 AM EDT
They do. It's called .40 cal
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:30:15 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:34:02 AM EDT
Those who knock iit haven't tried it. It is a round with something special. It just feels different somehow. Good stuff, with a huge range of loads possible. The Glock 29 is perhaps the only weapon that will do everything from concealed carry to bear hunting. Everyone I know who has ever tried the 10 just loves it. I think the major reason you don't see it more is just because the market niche never really developed.

As for ammo -- you won't find it in your local store but it is available for a reasonable price through the net, and there really are some kick-ass defensive loads out there.

But the best answer is -- try it yourself.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:34:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Cypher214:

The problem is that there are no top-notch defensive loads for the 10mm and the practice ammo is EXPENSIVE.




There are (Doubletap) they just aren't easily available..
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:36:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By VoodooChile:

Originally Posted By Cypher214:

The problem is that there are no top-notch defensive loads for the 10mm and the practice ammo is EXPENSIVE.




There are (Doubletap) they just aren't easily available..



I forgot that doubletap offers a Gold Dot.

Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:36:09 AM EDT

Originally Posted By VoodooChile:

Originally Posted By Cypher214:

The problem is that there are no top-notch defensive loads for the 10mm and the practice ammo is EXPENSIVE.




There are (Doubletap) they just aren't easily available..



I don't know about that. I consider anything that requires a phone call/internet order and answering the door when the UPS guy knocks to be "easily available".
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:38:52 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mcnielsen:
They do. It's called .40 cal



+1
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:43:30 AM EDT
Don Johnson carried a Bren 10mm in Miami Vice, which made him better than Chuck Norris


On the other side I have a couple of 10mm's a Colt Delta Elite and a Smith 1006, great pistols but ammo is on the spendy side
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:45:56 AM EDT

Originally Posted By wolfman97:
The Glock 29 is perhaps the only weapon that will do everything from concealed carry to bear hunting.



Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:50:18 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:52:16 AM EDT
Lots of people own 10mm's.
But it's expensive to shoot, and there aren't a lot of platforms out there for it.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:52:39 AM EDT
I like the 10mm. Never owned a pistol that shot it,but I like it.Too bad it didn't catch on more. Just one of those things.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:54:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By VoodooChile:

Originally Posted By Cypher214:

The problem is that there are no top-notch defensive loads for the 10mm and the practice ammo is EXPENSIVE.




There are (Doubletap) they just aren't easily available..




Double is easily available. Did you any back order issues with Mike?
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:55:53 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Wave:
FBI guys run around with the H&K MP5 in 10mm.

I have a S&W 1066 that is a joy to shoot.

DoubleTap Ammunition rocks!




DT does rock and so do SW 10** series!!!
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 6:57:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/14/2006 6:58:01 AM EDT by MTUSA]

Originally Posted By ARKAN_the_Tiger:
Aint that the preferred caliber of Vic Mackey?

Oh wait, he's fictional so he probably doesn't count.



Looks like you beat me to the punch on the avatar with that Chinese kid smokin'

Damn you!!!
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 7:28:17 AM EDT
McUzi
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 7:49:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/14/2006 7:54:07 AM EDT by warlord]
Factory 10mm is really powerful stuff. Just compare the stats of the 10mm versus the commonly available 9mm, 45ACP, 357Rem Mag. The 10mm treads pretty close to the lower end of 41Rem Mag. I don't have the numbers at the moment, but it easily most powerful cartridge available in a service pistol envelope.

True, one of the big draw backs on the 10mm, is that is limited and is not available at the local Wall-Mart. For those folks wanting and/or shooting 10mmACP, reloading is the key reloading your own ammo is a must. You can load the 10mm from mild to wild. I have a Colt Delta Gold Cup with the original factory frame etc. I load my ammo to 45ACP levels to prevent the abuse on the frame, but with a minor adjustment to the powder measure it can shoot full-power loads, or if I feel rich factory ammo is a delivery man away. The cost of loading the 10 is about the same as load that of the 45ACP. The difference of smokeless powder used between the 10 and 45ACP is mostly negligible.

BTW: About 10 years ago, I had the oppurtunity to shoot a real HK MP5/10. And it is definitely more powerful than a standard MP5 9mm Para. You have to really brace yourself, otherwise it will knock you off-balance. I could squeeze off 3 3-shot bursts no problem, the nice HK people only gave me 10 rounds.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 7:58:01 AM EDT

Originally Posted By warlord:
Factory 10mm is really powerful stuff. Just compare the stats of the 10mm versus the commonly available 9mm, 45ACP, 357Rem Mag. The 10mm treads pretty close to the lower end of 41Rem Mag. I don't have the numbers at the moment, but it easily most powerful cartridge available in a service pistol envelope.

True, one of the big draw backs on the 10mm, is that is limited and is not available at the local Wall-Mart. For those folks wanting and/or shooting 10mmACP, reloading is the key reloading your own ammo is a must. You can load the 10mm from mild to wild. I have a Colt Delta Gold Cup with the original factory frame etc. I load my ammo to 45ACP levels to prevent the abuse on the frame, but with a minor adjustment to the powder measure it can shoot full-power loads, or if I feel rich factory ammo is a delivery man away. The cost of loading the 10 is about the same as load that of the 45ACP. The difference of smokeless powder used between the 10 and 45ACP is mostly negligible.

BTW: About 10 years ago, I had the oppurtunity to shoot a real HK MP5/10. And it is definitely more powerful than a standard MP5 9mm Para. You have to really brace yourself, otherwise it will knock you off-balance. I could squeeze off 3 3-shot bursts no problem, the nice HK people only gave me 10 rounds.



170gr at 1300-1400fps That was the original Norma Factory load.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 8:05:23 AM EDT
G29. The choice of marmots everywhere.

Link Posted: 2/14/2006 8:25:36 AM EDT

Originally Posted By wolfman97:
Those who knock iit haven't tried it. It is a round with something special. It just feels different somehow. Good stuff, with a huge range of loads possible. The Glock 29 is perhaps the only weapon that will do everything from concealed carry to bear hunting. Everyone I know who has ever tried the 10 just loves it. I think the major reason you don't see it more is just because the market niche never really developed.

As for ammo -- you won't find it in your local store but it is available for a reasonable price through the net, and there really are some kick-ass defensive loads out there.

But the best answer is -- try it yourself.



Sounds like what some people used to say about the .41 magnum (minus the Glock reference of course).
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 8:27:06 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 8:30:40 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BallisticTip:
web.fastermac.net/~twist/Pics/g20_left_6inch_light.jpg



A buddy of mine claims that with that barrel and the right loads, that you can defeat level 3 body armor. Know anything about that?
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 8:32:16 AM EDT
I'd like to, but I have relatively small hands.

The grip on the G20 and G29 are too blocky for me.

The Colt Delta Elite 10mm and S&W 1xxx series are out because I am boycotting both companies.

The Bren Ten is discontinued.

Not sure who (if anybodhy) makes a single-stack 10mm any more.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 8:43:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/14/2006 8:45:59 AM EDT by warlord]

Originally Posted By bmick325:

Originally Posted By wolfman97:
Those who knock iit haven't tried it. It is a round with something special. It just feels different somehow. Good stuff, with a huge range of loads possible. The Glock 29 is perhaps the only weapon that will do everything from concealed carry to bear hunting. Everyone I know who has ever tried the 10 just loves it. I think the major reason you don't see it more is just because the market niche never really developed.

As for ammo -- you won't find it in your local store but it is available for a reasonable price through the net, and there really are some kick-ass defensive loads out there.

But the best answer is -- try it yourself.



Sounds like what some people used to say about the .41 magnum (minus the Glock reference of course).


True, I remember when the 41REm Mag came on the scene, and it was billed as the round to do everything. As all of us know for a revolver, it is possible. One of the reasons why the 41Rem Mag didn't attain the huge popularity especially in LE was just the name "magnum," that was enough to turn off many town fathers and leaders in LE, liablility lawyers have manage to turn the word "magnum" as being the equivalent meaning as "excessive use of force" in the eyes of the public, ie read "jury." Now if the S&W and Remington called the round 41 Tactical or Express or some more innocous name, I feel that the outcome would've been different.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 8:43:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/14/2006 8:47:13 AM EDT by VoodooChile]

Originally Posted By MTUSA:

Originally Posted By VoodooChile:

Originally Posted By Cypher214:

The problem is that there are no top-notch defensive loads for the 10mm and the practice ammo is EXPENSIVE.




There are (Doubletap) they just aren't easily available..




Double is easily available. Did you any back order issues with Mike?



Sorry, when I mean easily available I meant pick up a box while getting some diapers at Wal-mart easy...Most of the Doubletap I bought was from a local guy who was getting his at a discount because he ordered in bulk. Mailorder/internet isn't too bad but it isn't something I do on a regular basis with ammo..yet...I sold my G29 awhile back but will probably get a G20 fairly soon.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 9:00:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By txgp17:
Lots of people own 10mm's.
But it's expensive to shoot, and there aren't a lot of platforms out there for it.



expensive, I can reload practice rounds for 10.00 per 100 same as 9mm. I can also reload the best defensive ammo @ 22.00 per 100

I shoot my 10mm all the time, but I also enjoy shooting 45ACP as much. I'll leave the 9mm to girly men
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 9:03:27 AM EDT
I have and shoot a 10mm, it's my favorite 1911 pistol. The only reason I have .45s is because ammo is hard to find at the corner store for a 10mm.

Yes I reload for my 10mm.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 9:08:45 AM EDT
Just ask SC_Texas

I don't know that much about it, but my impression has been that full-house loads are excessive in terms of penetration and recoil and such, and most people prefer lower power defense loads. .40 S&W is supposed to be about the same as the lower power loads in a smaller package.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 9:32:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/14/2006 9:32:51 AM EDT by txgp17]

Originally Posted By thelastgunslinger:

Originally Posted By BallisticTip:
web.fastermac.net/~twist/Pics/g20_left_6inch_light.jpg

A buddy of mine claims that with that barrel and the right loads, that you can defeat level 3 body armor. Know anything about that?

With the right loads, a .380 ACP could defeat IIIA BA. Maybe even a .25 Auto. The operative word being: THE RIGHT LOAD. Meaning extemely hot load with a tungsten or hardend steel penetrator.

I handload, and I've got a GLOCK 20, although no 6" barrel. I know the awesome power that this pistol can generate, but until I witness it, I'm going to respectfully call on a conventional lead/copper 10mm bullet penetrating a IIIA vest in good condition.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 9:40:48 AM EDT
Absolutely the finest handgun cartridge ever developed. Anybody who disagrees is an idiot.
Link Posted: 2/14/2006 9:50:41 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/14/2006 9:51:30 AM EDT by recoiljunky]

Originally Posted By ARKAN_the_Tiger:
Aint that the preferred caliber of Vic Mackey?

Oh wait, he's fictional so he probably doesn't count.



That's what I've always suspected, but I'm not good at IDing firearms in movies and TV.

As for this thread, I would have said "dupe" but I like the 10mm too much to do that.

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=433009&page=5

As for the "unavailable ammo theory", you're posting on the net already, whyn ot just travel on over to www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/index.php and pick up a box or two. Mike is an excellent fellow and will personally help you pick out the cartridge that best suits your needs.

As for the 10mm in general:
Recoil will not break your wrist.
It does not cause frames to crack.
It is not just a little bigger than a 9mm.
Ammo is readilly available.
There are plenty of manufacturers who chamber guns in 10mm- Kimber, Dan Wesson, Glock, EEA plus some discontinued models made by Colt, S&W, etc.
There are a few sites dedicated to the round- 10mmtalk.com , Glock Talks's The 10 Ring, etc.
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