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Posted: 2/13/2006 4:46:10 PM EDT
My wife's 1997 Honda CR-V with 140,000 miles on it got the red engine warning light come on last week. I got a OBD2 reading this weekend and it read "P0441 EVPA Emission Control System Purge Flow Fault". I had the warning erased last night and and had my wife drive the today and it came back on.

So my question is what exactly does a EVPA canister do on a car and can my wife's CR-V live without one for a while? How much should it cost to have it replaced by a professional? We planned on keep the car for another 10-14 months and then get her a new one so can I just leave it alone?

Link Posted: 2/13/2006 4:50:40 PM EDT
Hell, I dunno 'bout new cars, but I've bypassed them in older vehicles on numerous occasions.

BTW, we just bought an '06 CRV, great ride for the wife. All I've heard from those who have older ones like your are rave reviews, makes ya feel good for your purchase.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 4:51:35 PM EDT
The problem may not simply be the canister. There could be a problem with the purge solenoid (circuit), the tank vent lines, the tank itself, gas cap, etc.

The car will live without it, but it will not pass a smog inspection if that applies in your area.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 4:53:53 PM EDT
It's illegal to bypass it
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 4:56:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/13/2006 4:57:11 PM EDT by yobo]
Okay, thats what I thought. I'll just leave it alone for now.

This has been a great car since the beginning.
Never had any problems... just standard oil/filter change, tires, batteries, etc.
Wife has her choice of next cars to another CR-V, RAV-4 or Murano with the CR-V the most likely choice.

No inspections in our state.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 4:57:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By yobo:

So my question is what exactly does a EVPA canister do on a car and can my wife's CR-V live without one for a while?



It acts as a charcoal filter while recycling your EGR gases. Yes, you can run for a while with it like it is. It may cause the computer to have a false reading, causing it to run too rich or too lean. Most likely the latter. Too little fuel is almost as bad as too much.



How much should it cost to have it replaced by a professional?


Hell, do it yourself. Buy it at Autozone (if available) & swap it in. It's not rocket science.



We planned on keep the car for another 10-14 months and then get her a new one so can I just leave it alone?


Yes, if the light doesn't bother you.

My .o2
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 5:01:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/13/2006 5:04:16 PM EDT by yobo]

Originally Posted By BobCole:


How much should it cost to have it replaced by a professional?


Hell, do it yourself. Buy it at Autozone (if available) & swap it in. It's not rocket science.



Maybe not for you but it is for me.
Filter/oil change is about as mechnical as I get.
I don't even know where it is.


Originally Posted By BobCole:


We planned on keep the car for another 10-14 months and then get her a new one so can I just leave it alone?


Yes, if the light doesn't bother you.

My .o2



I can put a pieces of tape over it
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 6:01:43 PM EDT
first place alldata (pretty much copied straight from manufacturers manual) says to look at is the EVAP purge control solenoid valve, followed by the circuit, then the throttle body purge port, then the tubing, then the PCM (unlikely).


Might want to take it to the dealer Honda TSB extended the emissions warranty to 14yrs/150,000mi on 97 CRV

98-081

March 18, 2003

Applies To:
1995 Accord V6 - ALL
1996 Models except Passport - ALL
1997 Models except Passport - ALL

Emissions Warranty Extension
(Supersedes 98-081, dated March 9, 1999)

Updated information is shown by asterisks and black bars.

BACKGROUND

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and the California Air Resources Board (CARB) have claimed that the On-Board Diagnostic (OBD) system in the affected vehicles does not fully perform in the manner that they believe is required. Specifically, they believe the OBD system is not sensitive enough to detect some engine misfire conditions.

In an effort to resolve this issue, American Honda has agreed to extend the emissions warranty on all of the affected vehicles and to provide emissions-related services during the warranty period.

WARRANTY EXTENSION INFORMATION

American Honda is extending the emissions warranty on all affected vehicles to 14 years or 150,000 miles, whichever comes first. The basic terms of this extended warranty are the same as given with the original Federal and California emissions warranties.

Federal Emissions Warranties - The time and mileage periods for the Emissions-related Design and Defects Warranty and the Emissions Performance Warranty are lengthened from 4 years or 50,000 miles to 14 years or 150,000 miles. All other terms, conditions, and exclusions still apply. All parts on the Emissions Parts List are now covered for 14 years or 150,000 miles, so the 5/50 notations on certain parts no longer apply.

California Emissions Warranties - The time and mileage periods for the Emissions Control Systems Defects Warranty and the Emissions Performance Warranty are lengthened from 4 years or 50,000 miles to 14 years or 150,000 miles. All other terms, conditions, and exclusions still apply. All parts on the Emissions Parts List are now covered for 14 years or 150,000 miles, so the 7/70 notations on certain parts no longer apply.

File a claim under this extension if:

^ The MIL comes on and the cause is traced to an emissions-related component.

^ The vehicle requires an emissions-related repair because it failed a mandated emissions test.

^ Any emissions-related component fails.


* If you cannot find the labor operation number for a particular emissions-related repair in the chart in this service bulletin, contact your local District Parts and Service Manager (DPSM) or call Warranty Dealer Support at 310-783-3240.*

REPAIR TIME REQUIREMENTS

According to the terms of the agreement, American Honda and the dealer have 45 days to resolve the customer's claim for repair under this warranty from the date the customer first brings in the vehicle. If you decide to refuse a customer's claim for repair under this warranty because you suspect accidental damage, tampering, or lack of proper maintenance, notify your DPSM immediately. This will allow American Honda to thoroughly investigate the customer's claim within the 45-day timeline.

ADDITIONAL SERVICES

In addition to the warranty extension, the following services are provided to owner's of affected vehicles.

Between 50,000 miles and 75,000 miles - If an affected vehicle comes in for service within this mileage range, inspect the OBD system. Follow the service manual procedure to retrieve any DTCs that are set. Then, replace the affected part(s). This inspection and any parts replacement are free of charge to the owner.

Between 75,000 and 150,000 miles - At this time the dealer should:

^ Inspect the OBD system again, and replace any parts that have caused a DTC to set.

^ Replace the distributor cap, rotor, ignition wires, and spark plugs.

^ Change the oil and oil filter.


All of the above services are free of charge to the owner. You must use Honda parts and fluids for this service.

CUSTOMER NOTIFICATION

American Honda will send a letter to all owners of affected vehicles notifying them of the terms of the warranty extension. This will be done immediately.

American Honda will send letters to all owners of affected vehicles, reminding them of the 50-75,000 mile OBD check, 5 years after the release of their models. This will begin in the latter part of 1999 for the 1995 models, etc.

American Honda will send letters to all owners of affected vehicles, reminding them of the 75-150,000 mile service, 9 years after the release of their models. This will begin in 2005.

WARRANTY CLAIM INFORMATION

The 50,000-75,000 mile OBD inspection, the 75,000-150,000 mile OBD inspection, the 75,000-150,000 mile service, and any emissions-related repairs must be filed on separate warranty claims. Warranty claims that combine any of these services will be rejected.

50,000-75,000 mile OBD inspection - Use the following information to file a warranty claim for the inspection.

This is an inspection only; no replacement parts should be used or listed on the claim. Any claim filed that is outside the specified mileage range, or that shows parts used, will be debited.

If the MIL is on, do not do the 50,000-75,000 mile OBD inspection or file a warranty claim for it; refer to Emissions-related repair.

Operation Number: 1235058

Flat Rate Time: 0.3 hour

Failed Part: P/N 37823-DOJ-CD1
H/C 6075626

Defect Code: 811

Contention Code: K44

Template ID: 98-081A

Skill Level: Repair Technician







Center-punch a completion mark below the first character of the engine compartment VIN.

75,000-150,000 mile OBD inspection - Use the following information to file a warranty claim for the inspection.

This is an inspection only; no replacement parts should be used or listed on the claim. Any claim filed that is outside the specified mileage range or that shows parts used, will be debited.

If the MIL is on, do not do the 75,000-150,000 mile OBD inspection or file a warranty claim for it; refer to Emissions-related repair.

Operation Number: 123511

Flat Rate Time: 0.3 hour

Failed Part: P/N 37823-DOJ-CD2
H/C 6075634

Defect Code: 812

Contention Code: K47

Template ID: 98-081C

Skill Level: Repair Technician







Center-punch a completion mark below the second character of the engine compartment VIN.

75,000-150,000 mile service - Use the following information to file a warranty claim for the replacement of ignition components and for the oil and filter change.

If the applicable ignition kit is not available, do not file a template claim. Submit a regular claim listing the individual components used.







No additional replacement parts can be claimed. Any claim that lists additional parts, or does not show the required parts, will be debited.

Failed Part: P/N 37823-DOJ-CD3
H/C 6075642

Defect Code: 813

Contention Code: K48

Skill Level: Repair Technician






Center-punch a completion mark below the third character of the engine compartment VIN.

Emissions-related repair - Use the following information to file a warranty claim for diagnosis and repair.


















Operation Number: Refer to the charts shown.

Flat Rate Time: Refer to the charts shown.

Failed Part: Use the part number of the replaced part.

Defect Code: 814

Contention Code: K49

Skill Level: Repair Technician

Any warranty claims submitted for emissions-related repairs that exceed the time or mileage limit, or that list non-emissions-related parts, will be debited.







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