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Posted: 2/9/2006 3:16:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/9/2006 3:17:09 PM EDT by julenissen]
The mother of all countries for worthless laws to "cut crime", the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland does it again.

"A nationwide amnesty in a bid to cut knife crime is expected to be announced today.

Such an amnesty would be the first for 10 years, when tens of thousands of knives and other weapons were handed into police stations following the stabbing of a headteacher."

http://www.24dash.com/content/news/viewNews.php?navID=7&newsID=2951
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 3:17:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By julenissen:
The mother of all worthless laws to "cut crime", the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland does it again.

"A nationwide amnesty in a bid to cut knife crime is expected to be announced today.

Such an amnesty would be the first for 10 years, when tens of thousands of knives and other weapons were handed into police stations following the stabbing of a headteacher."

www.24dash.com/content/news/viewNews.php?navID=7&newsID=2951


"cut" knife crime.

lol
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 3:21:50 PM EDT
Dear UK:

Your lawmakers are insane.

Sincerely, Zatu.
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 7:43:56 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 7:44:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/9/2006 7:45:23 PM EDT by fight4yourrights]






Time for the BUY BACK programs.........
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 7:51:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/9/2006 7:52:12 PM EDT by Yossarian]
I'm waiting for this.


Originally Posted By sherrick13:


He added: "Carrying knives your penis in your pants on the streets will not be tolerated. Every weapon penis handed in during the amnesty will be
a weapon unit that cannot be used in sexually assult crime against defenseless women."

The amnesty coincides with measures in the Violent Sexual Crime Bill, which is currently passing through Parliament, which raises the minimum age for buying using a penis a knife from 16 to 18. It also gives headteachers the power to search pupils for
weapons their penisses.

Link Posted: 2/10/2006 10:35:08 AM EDT
And by 2015 the story will read.....


Originally Posted By sherrick13:
Full story

Clarke launches amnesty on toothpics to reduce stabbings
By Nigel Morris, Home Affairs Correspondent
Published: 09 February 2006
A five-week nationwide toothpics amnesty is being launched in the summer in an attempt to drive down numbers of
stabbings.

More than 230 people were stabbed to death last year and concern over levels of toothpic crime have been highlighted
by the killing of City lawyer Tom ap Rhys Pryce last month.

Under the amnesty, which will run between 24 May and 30 June in England, Wales and Scotland, members of the public
can leave toothpics in drop-in bins which will be provided at police stations throughout the country without
fear of prosecution.

Charles Clarke, the Home Secretary, said: "Tackling toothpic culture, especially among young people, is paramount to
the safety of our communities, and I am determined to reduce the devastation caused by toothpic crime."

He added: "Carrying toothpics on the streets will not be tolerated. Every toothpic handed in during the amnesty will be
a weapon that cannot be used in crime."

The amnesty coincides with measures in the Violent Crime Bill, which is currently passing through Parliament, which
raises the minimum age for buying a toothpic from 16 to 18. It also gives headteachers the power to search pupils for
toothpics.

Link Posted: 2/10/2006 10:36:56 AM EDT
Anyone know what the penalty is for getting caught with a bladed "weapon"?
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 10:39:23 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 10:54:28 AM EDT
wait until somebody gets killed with a tire iron...then there will be traffic tie ups all over the country
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 11:06:23 AM EDT

Originally Posted By M4arc:



It would be funny if it weren't true. A government that won't even trust it citizens with "pointy or sharp things". It's like an article from The Onion but it isn't.

Link Posted: 2/10/2006 11:25:47 AM EDT
I'm not sure who said it first, but during every discussion about the UK's gun control, banning guns, banning replica gus, banning toy guns. Someone always, says: So when someone get stabbed will they try to ban knives? Apparently the answer is 'yes'. I also like the part where they called it 'knife culture', just like they blamed it on 'gun culture' when they were banning private ownership of guns.

Glad I don't live there, and I sure feel sorry for the people who do.

I predict in the next 30 years the UK will still have rampant assualt and violent crime even tho the entire country will be made of soft padded walls with no automobiles and no private ownership of any kind of property.

The penis comment was great. And as a counter point to men being equipped to be rapists does not neccesarily mean that they will become a rapist, women are equipped to be prostitutes, but that does not mean that they will become one. Just like people who own guns and knives does not mean that they will become violent criminals.


But what do I know.

We are the Government, we are here to protect you
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 11:28:34 AM EDT
Heh, I laugh at this but give the US a year or two, and some retard from NY or CA will try to ban all sharp pointy objects...
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 11:44:02 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/10/2006 11:53:07 AM EDT by vito113]
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 11:47:25 AM EDT
You can kill people with hammers. Hammers are dangerous.
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 11:53:19 AM EDT
They'll never learn...fuck 'em.
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 12:11:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
They'll never learn...fuck 'em.



Sad to say, I have generally the same opinion of their idiocy.
It is sad to see a society so terrified of its own shadow.


Link Posted: 2/10/2006 2:49:56 PM EDT
And in 2050 it will read.....


Clarke launches amnesty on bare hands to reduce bird flipping and finger assaults
By Nigel Morris, Home Affairs Correspondent
Published: 09 February 2050
A five-week nationwide bare hands amnesty is being launched in the summer in an attempt to drive down numbers of
finger assaults.

More than 230 people were fingered to death last year and concern over levels of finger crime have been highlighted
by the fingering of City lawyer Tom ap Rhys Pryce last month.

Under the amnesty, which will run between 24 May and 30 June in England, Wales and Scotland, members of the public
can leave their bare hands in drop-in bins which will be provided at police stations throughout the country without
fear of prosecution.

Charles Clarke, the Home Secretary, said: "Tackling finger culture, especially among young people, is paramount to
the safety of our communities, and I am determined to reduce the devastation caused by finger crime."

He added: "Carrying bare hands on the streets will not be tolerated. Every bare hand handed in during the amnesty will be a weapon that cannot be used in crime."

The amnesty coincides with measures in the Violent Crime Bill, which is currently passing through Parliament, which
raises the minimum age for owning a bare hand from 16 to 18. It also gives headteachers the power to search pupils for
fingers and bare hands.

Link Posted: 2/10/2006 3:05:51 PM EDT
Not only that, but one of the Medical Societies over there wants to ban the manufacture/importation of butcher knives. Nothing larger than a paring knife or some such. I kid you not, I read it on the internet.

OK, what's the next thing to go- can we get a poll?

My vote, cricket bats. Wicked things.......

Link Posted: 2/10/2006 3:19:55 PM EDT
How long before everyone is requierd to live in padded rooms, with plexi glass windows. Must eat with their bare hands, and check in with the local law enfoecement every 5 minutes.

That is rediculous. Everything can cause harm. Easy fix to all of this. Better parenting.
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 3:22:39 PM EDT
Watch out for people carrying rolling pins. Dangerous things, those.
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 3:25:08 PM EDT
Wait until some are beaten to death with bare hands. Will it be mandatory amputations? (Or maybe just shortening of the appendages)
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 2:20:53 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 2:37:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By vito113:
You know, you guys take what's printed in the shithole press too seriously....

FACT: Here in Britain, if someone breaks into my home I can beat the shit out of him, belt him with a bat, stab him, hit him with a hammer, hit him with an axe and if I really pissed I can shoot him too.

FACT: I've beaten the shit out of one guy with a Maglite while my wife beat the shit out of his buddy with a pickaxe handle for throwing a rock through one of our windows. We chased them down the street and beat them up, the cops came, we were not cautioned, warned, spoken to harshly or told we were naughty boys or girls.... the two perps were arrested and taken away.


ANdy



Let me see if I understand this.....

British way: We'll taunt you a second time!
American way: I'm your huckleberry.

I'll take our way, thanks for the fish.
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 2:43:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By vito113:

Originally Posted By julenissen:
The mother of all countries for worthless laws to "cut crime", the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland does it again.




This does not apply to Northern Ireland, COMPLETELY different laws on weapons there....





Care to elaborate?

Link Posted: 2/11/2006 3:08:20 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 3:11:09 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 3:37:20 AM EDT
I'm seriously starting to wonder...will the UK become an islamic state before France does? What are you people going to fight with?

Scott
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 3:38:10 AM EDT
[montypython]But what if someone comes at you with a pointed stick?[/montypython]
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 4:20:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/11/2006 4:25:31 AM EDT by AZMAN-1]

Originally Posted By vito113:
You know, you guys take what's printed in the shithole press too seriously....

FACT: Here in Britain, if someone breaks into my home I can beat the shit out of him, belt him with a bat, stab him, hit him with a hammer, hit him with an axe and if I really pissed I can shoot him too.

FACT: I've beaten the shit out of one guy with a Maglite while my wife beat the shit out of his buddy with a pickaxe handle for throwing a rock through one of our windows. We chased them down the street and beat them up, the cops came, we were not cautioned, warned, spoken to harshly or told we were naughty boys or girls.... the two perps were arrested and taken away.


ANdy



Obviously I don't live in the UK, so I'm in no position to say you are wrong, (not that I would anyway) but, if what you say is true, where do all the misconceptions regarding Britain come from?? Serious question, I'd really like to understand better....
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 4:30:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By vito113:
...FACT: Here in Britain, if someone breaks into my home I can beat the shit out of him, belt him with a bat, stab him, hit him with a hammer, hit him with an axe and if I really pissed I can shoot him too...



Shoot him with what?
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 4:52:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/11/2006 5:02:41 AM EDT by vito113]
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 4:55:31 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 5:00:01 AM EDT

Originally Posted By vito113:
I've beaten the shit out of one guy with a Maglite while my wife beat the shit out of his buddy with a pickaxe handle for throwing a rock through one of our windows. We chased them down the street and beat them up,

ANdy



NOTE TO SELF: if I ever visit Ireland, make sure not to piss off Andy's wife

Link Posted: 2/11/2006 5:03:37 AM EDT

Because the NRA keep wilfully using the Tony Martin case to serve it's own ends in the US.

Tony Martin (the Farmer) was charged with murder when he shot the two thugs who broke into his house because he broke the law, the same laws as in plenty of US States.

He had an unregistred firearm, he did not retreat, he had set an ambush, he did not give a warning, he shot two fleeing felons, one a juvenile, in the back, (The forensic evidence was that he had shot from almost point blank range), he did not call the police just left them to bleed...

The rules for using a firearm in self defence here in Britain are simple enough, you must attempt to retreat, if you cannot retreat, you must give a warning, if the warning is ignored you can shoot, you cannot shoot him if he turns and retreats, you cannot 'give chase' and shoot him if he runs away.

ANdy




These laws may apply to many US States, all the more reason I'm glad I live in AZ, I don't have to retreat, and I sure as hell don't have to give a warning shot!! It still sounds like an awfull lot of 'hoops' to jump through when one's life is in danger...ymmv...
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 5:08:34 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/11/2006 5:09:03 AM EDT by PeteCO]

Originally Posted By vito113:
Because the NRA keep wilfully using the Tony Martin case to serve it's own ends in the US.

Tony Martin (the Farmer) was charged with murder when he shot the two thugs who broke into his house because he broke the law, the same laws as in plenty of US States.

He had an unregistred firearm, he did not retreat, he had set an ambush, he did not give a warning, he shot two fleeing felons, one a juvenile, in the back, (The forensic evidence was that he had shot from almost point blank range), he did not call the police just left them to bleed...

The rules for using a firearm in self defence here in Britain are simple enough, you must attempt to retreat, if you cannot retreat, you must give a warning, if the warning is ignored you can shoot, you cannot shoot him if he turns and retreats, you cannot 'give chase' and shoot him if he runs away.

Recent case law now says, you can take 'pre-emptive' action if you believe an intruder may be armed with a firearm.

A farmer shot an intruder in his yard. At the court case, in which he was cleared, the Judge rulled that if you believe an intruder to be armed with a firearm it is 'reasonable' to shoot without a warning, even before he attempts to break into your home.

ANdy



That's the part I have a real problem with. Sounds like the laws are more concerned with being polite to the intruder than protecting the homeowner. Fucking craziness.

I WILL NOT, EVER retreat from my own home.
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 6:07:20 AM EDT
Noted...............DO NOT piss Andy's wife off..............



Originally Posted By spartacus2002:

Originally Posted By vito113:
I've beaten the shit out of one guy with a Maglite while my wife beat the shit out of his buddy with a pickaxe handle for throwing a rock through one of our windows. We chased them down the street and beat them up,

ANdy



NOTE TO SELF: if I ever visit Ireland, make sure not to piss off Andy's wife


Link Posted: 2/11/2006 6:37:07 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 7:27:01 AM EDT
While we all like to think we would blow someone away for breaking into our home, we should keep in mind that we will generally be charged with homicide and grand juried no matter what the circumstances. Even in Cali, we don't have to retreat in our own homes but we better make damn sure the burglar is facing us and represents a threat that a "reasonable person" would also recognize as a threat. Some jurisdictions consider introducing a gun into the situation as "escalating"; that even if the perp was a threat, confronting them with a firearm prompted behavior that might not have occured otherwise, state law be damned. I recently spoke with the Sheriffs department regarding this after a string of burglaries in our otherwise, somewhat rural and quiet upscale neighborhood. He said I'm generally in the clear if it's in my house but you do have to think about how it will look afterward. Even if it's some gangbanger visiting the nicer side of town, there is going to be a shit storm of biblical proportions to deal with. Don't believe all the "armed citizen" reports in American Rifleman. For every JH that ends with officer friendly saying it was a good shoot, there are plenty of others that turn the homeowners life upside down. Just the reality of life when you kill someone, regardless of the circumstances.

It's probably a lot tougher when someone get's really fed up with mulitple burglaries and assaults and decides that the "next person" is the one who is going to pay for all the previous trouble. It happens all the time in poorer neighborhoods where someone hears the nth B&E going down outside the window or their car, grabs the gun and shoots some (justifiably punk-ass, life-headed-nowhere, crack-smoking, gang-running, thievin') kid in the back as he's ripping the stereo out of the dash. Yeah, he probably had it coming as a "preemptive self-defense shooting" but the law in most places says that B&E is not a capitol crime; only a percieved immediate threat to our life or health is. We might wish it were otherwise...
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 7:36:34 AM EDT

Originally Posted By IDK:
While we all like to think we would blow someone away for breaking into our home, we should keep in mind that we will generally be charged with homicide and grand juried no matter what the circumstances. Even in Cali, we don't have to retreat in our own homes but we better make damn sure the burglar is facing us and represents a threat that a "reasonable person" would also recognize as a threat. Some jurisdictions consider introducing a gun into the situation as "escalating"; that even if the perp was a threat, confronting them with a firearm prompted behavior that might not have occured otherwise, state law be damned. I recently spoke with the Sheriffs department regarding this after a string of burglaries in our otherwise, somewhat rural and quiet upscale neighborhood. He said I'm generally in the clear if it's in my house but you do have to think about how it will look afterward. Even if it's some gangbanger visiting the nicer side of town, there is going to be a shit storm of biblical proportions to deal with. Don't believe all the "armed citizen" reports in American Rifleman. For every JH that ends with officer friendly saying it was a good shoot, there are plenty of others that turn the homeowners life upside down. Just the reality of life when you kill someone, regardless of the circumstances.

It's probably a lot tougher when someone get's really fed up with mulitple burglaries and assaults and decides that the "next person" is the one who is going to pay for all the previous trouble. It happens all the time in poorer neighborhoods where someone hears the nth B&E going down outside the window or their car, grabs the gun and shoots some (justifiably punk-ass, life-headed-nowhere, crack-smoking, gang-running, thievin') kid in the back as he's ripping the stereo out of the dash. Yeah, he probably had it coming as a "preemptive self-defense shooting" but the law in most places says that B&E is not a capitol crime; only a percieved immediate threat to our life or health is. We might wish it were otherwise...



Thank God for "make my day laws" and threshold laws. In my state, if he is in the house and not supposed to be there, he is presumed a deadly threat and I can act accordingly.
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 7:44:19 AM EDT
Technically, it's the same in my state. Inside the home is a presumption of deadly threat, no retreat required. But you know that state of mind will be brought to bear, you will probably be well-advised to hire an attorney, spend some $$$, having one handy could be considered planning on something like this. I'm just not expecting a merit citation and hearty congratulations if it goes down. I haven't seen much good go down when an ordinary citizen ends up in the judicial system for any reason.
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 8:05:19 AM EDT
Good luck trying to eat a steak in the UK.

Of course you could outlaw red meat. I hear its bad for you.
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 8:14:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By IDK:
Technically, it's the same in my state. Inside the home is a presumption of deadly threat, no retreat required. But you know that state of mind will be brought to bear, you will probably be well-advised to hire an attorney, spend some $$$, having one handy could be considered planning on something like this. I'm just not expecting a merit citation and hearty congratulations if it goes down. I haven't seen much good go down when an ordinary citizen ends up in the judicial system for any reason.



That's probably true, but if I wake up in the middle of the night and some fucker is in my bedroom, he's getting shot, period. I'm not going to expose my family to mortal risk because I am afraid of legal risk.

That said, the laws that favor the homeowner increase the chances of you being no-billed or not even arrested at all (which is the common outcome around here - the cops clean up the body and leave).
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 8:19:48 AM EDT
Oh sure....we know the criminals will turn in their illegal weapons. I would expect more logic in law-making from a 14 year old drunk teenage girl that is PMSing.
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 8:25:13 AM EDT
Hmmm... maybe in some States, but not in Texas.

In Texas, we have legal protection to use deadly force to protect our PROPERTY. If you break into my home intending to rob it, I can legally kill you.

And those "duty to retreat" ruless are utter crap. Whose home is it? Yours or the robber's?
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 8:27:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/11/2006 8:28:53 AM EDT by 3rdpig]
We keep saying "They'll never learn" but in fact it's us that won't learn. They know damn well it won't lower crime or make citizens safer and they don't care. They don't ban guns and knives to lower violent crime or make citizens safer, they do it to make THEMSELVES safer when they try to pass really absurd laws. Let them take your guns away and they know you can't fight back when they take away your speech, property, privacy, etc, etc.
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 1:57:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/11/2006 1:58:47 PM EDT by vito113]
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 2:57:39 PM EDT
When all British subjects turn in their pointy contrabands, a handful of Scots with their Claymores will come down the hill and conquer England.
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 3:02:16 PM EDT

"The types of people who hand in knives during an amnesty are law-abiding members of the public, not those that carry knives for criminal activities, self-defence or as a fashion accessory," he said.


So apparently all of those are now in one lump category, a target crowd they want to disarm. I want the criminals to be disarmed, but what the hell about the second two?

I wonder if they would agree that utility knives exist.
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 3:03:12 PM EDT
Boys my Gramps gave me a set of Arnold Palmer golf clubs - these in the wrong hands-(like a Kennedy)- could be mass-murder - serial killer weapons - cus there are 13 of em --- should i shipp these dangerous weapons to a "RED STATE" - or bury em in my backyard ???????
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 3:06:52 PM EDT
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