My stupid ex-army brother-in-law and the legandary tumbling 5.56

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - My stupid ex-army brother-in-law and the legandary tumbling 5.56

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:03:02 AM EDT

I went to my sister's house yesterday for the game and I had a 5.56 round in my pocket as I always do. My BIL wanted to see it so I tossed it to him and he begins to tell my sister, and I quote "This is the round we used in the army. The reason they are so deadly is because thay tumble as they fly through the air."
WTF... he served six years in the army. Was in Iraq and Germany for most of those six years. I have no military experiance and had to give HIM a lesson.

What a freakin tool.

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:06:38 AM EDT

[#1]

Not everyone who served is a ballistics expert. I hope you took the time to educate him in a non-confrontational manner.

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:07:00 AM EDT

[#2]

Not all .mil are ammo experts.

There are alot more that believe the very same thing.

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:08:23 AM EDT

[#3]

actually when i went through basic in 1988 that was taught by the drill instructors as fact.

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:08:56 AM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
I went to my sister's house yesterday for the game and I had a 5.56 round in my pocket as I always do.

Why do you always carry a 5.56 round in your pocket?

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:10:59 AM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
Not everyone who served is a ballistics expert. I hope you took the time to educate him in a non-confrontational manner.

It was non-confrontational, I am not an ass, he is family. I even directed him to the ammo-oracle.

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:12:20 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
actually when i went through basic in 1988 that was taught by the drill instructors as fact.

same thing was taught in 87.

that is why it can go in the big toe and out the top of the head.

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:13:06 AM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
Quoted:
I went to my sister's house yesterday for the game and I had a 5.56 round in my pocket as I always do.

Why do you always carry a 5.56 round in your pocket?

Just to play with. It is better to fidgit with that then play pocket pool.

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:17:04 AM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
actually when i went through basic in 1988 that was taught by the drill instructors as fact.

I didn't know that. He started basic in 1999. Are they still teaching that?

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:18:51 AM EDT

[#9]

I once had to go so far as to get a peach basket and a football to demonstrate.

They grab the concept REAL quick when asked to spiral it in and then tumble it in.

Once I also asked an "expert" to explain why the 4 mags I fired into a target produced 80 perfectly round holes instead of some big rips where they went in sideways.

He quickly changed the subject!

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:26:12 AM EDT

[#10]

HELL..........if all 5.56 and 7.62x39 tumbled.............I would love it even more!

MORE DAMAGE!!!!!!!!

Posted: 2/6/2006 5:54:21 AM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
actually when i went through basic in 1988 that was taught by the drill instructors as fact.

That's true. I was in the AF, and in the 1960's, when the ar 15 was first introduced that's what the instructors said. ANd, they then proceeded to fire it into a can to compare to the M1 carbine. Never did explain how the entry hole was this tiny round thing.

Posted: 2/6/2006 8:57:03 AM EDT

[#12]

the story comes from the old days of the ar-15/m-16. orginally, the twist was 1-14" it did not perform accurately in cold weather for the Air Force, so it was dropped to 1-12". tumbling bullets came from early models in Vietnam with the 1-14" twist, which did not stabilize the 55 grain round very well. the same thing can happen with 55 gr. bullets in the 1-7" twist barrels. the bullets will "keyhole" in the target. thats why their is a 1-9" twist now,to stabilize the 55 gr,and 62gr,and 63gr. tracer round

Posted: 2/6/2006 9:19:57 AM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
actually when i went through basic in 1988 that was taught by the drill instructors as fact.

And when I went through, the drill sgts told us if the the gas tube got pinched/broken, the bolt would blow up in our faces.
I controlled the urge to raise my hand and explain the nuances of direct impingement systems...I got smoked enough just minding my own business.

Posted: 2/6/2006 9:28:11 AM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
the story comes from the old days of the ar-15/m-16. orginally, the twist was 1-14" it did not perform accurately in cold weather for the Air Force, so it was dropped to 1-12". tumbling bullets came from early models in Vietnam with the 1-14" twist, which did not stabilize the 55 grain round very well. the same thing can happen with 55 gr. bullets in the 1-7" twist barrels. the bullets will "keyhole" in the target. thats why their is a 1-9" twist now,to stabilize the 55 gr,and 62gr,and 63gr. tracer round

Why does the FM sitting in front of me say 1/7 right hand rifling then?

Posted: 2/6/2006 9:42:24 AM EDT

[#15]

Does he also espouse the ".50 BMG can't be fired at personel" BS as well?

Posted: 2/6/2006 9:43:27 AM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:
the story comes from the old days of the ar-15/m-16. orginally, the twist was 1-14" it did not perform accurately in cold weather for the Air Force, so it was dropped to 1-12". tumbling bullets came from early models in Vietnam with the 1-14" twist, which did not stabilize the 55 grain round very well. the same thing can happen with 55 gr. bullets in the 1-7" twist barrels. the bullets will "keyhole" in the target. thats why their is a 1-9" twist now,to stabilize the 55 gr,and 62gr,and 63gr. tracer round

correct
incorrect

1:7 twist barrels stabilize 55gr bullets just fine. Read the Ammo Oracle

Posted: 2/6/2006 9:44:51 AM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:
Does he also espouse the ".50 BMG can't be fired at personel" BS as well?

That was definitely a pervasive myth in the army when I was being trained.

Posted: 2/6/2006 9:45:26 AM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:
HELL..........if all 5.56 and 7.62x39 tumbled.............I would love it even more!

MORE DAMAGE!!!!!!!!

They do all tumble... in FLESH, NOT in AIR.

You DON'T want tumbling in air because that's horribly inaccurate.

Posted: 2/6/2006 9:52:43 AM EDT

[#19]

I guess that rifling is just there to make it look pretty when you look into it.

Posted: 2/6/2006 9:58:08 AM EDT

[#20]

tag

Posted: 2/6/2006 9:59:57 AM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:
I went to my sister's house yesterday for the game and I had a 5.56 round in my pocket as I always do. My BIL wanted to see it so I tossed it to him and he begins to tell my sister, and I quote "This is the round we used in the army. The reason they are so deadly is because thay tumble as they fly through the air."
WTF... he served six years in the army. Was in Iraq and Germany for most of those six years. I have no military experiance and had to give HIM a lesson.

What a freakin tool.

Unfortunately this little piece of misinformation goes around pretty frequently in the Army. I sometimes think it is allowed to continue on purpose so that soldiers have more confidence in such a tiny little bullet.

Posted: 2/6/2006 10:07:24 AM EDT

[#22]

"How come the bullet always hits the target nose on and makes a .223 hole instead of a hole the length of the bullet as it "tumbles" through the target?"

Posted: 2/6/2006 10:08:13 AM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
actually when i went through basic in 1988 that was taught by the drill instructors as fact.

1989 was the same thing

Posted: 2/6/2006 10:11:24 AM EDT

[#24]

Yup.....1983, got the same tumbling bullit 101 class at the Benning School for Wayward Boys. Also, the .45ACP is the best manstopper class. This one included such legandary antecdotes as "even if you hit them in the pinkie, they're goin down.

Posted: 2/6/2006 10:14:04 AM EDT

[#25]

my bad, it was the 1-12" that didnt stabilize the heavier bullets, and they had the keyhole prob. also,as far as the .50 goes, i fired it plenty in the army, and you werent firing at personnel, you were firing at their equipment.ie web gear, rucksacks,weapons,etc. so i think the .50 is just fine to disable equipment on the battlefield.

Posted: 2/6/2006 10:17:02 AM EDT

[#26]

It is still being pushed as fact by DI's. (my son went through a year ago.)
His CO also fed him a line of shit about .50 cal too. (that if it goes by you it will kill you from the shockwave. ) And the CO is a OIF1 vet.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - My stupid ex-army brother-in-law and the legandary tumbling 5.56

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