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Posted: 8/10/2001 11:30:12 AM EDT
I have decided that a shotgun, in addition to an AR-15, is an ideal weapon to defend myself and my country. I have settled on the Mossberg 590 or the Remington 870 and wish to here from people who own one or both of these, the strong and weak points of each. I do not just wish to hear which one you think is better, I wish to hear why.
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 11:34:10 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 11:38:30 AM EDT
Moss makes a tactical shotgun that has bayonet It is set up like a trench gun. Looks very kool and is moderately priced.
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 11:56:53 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 1:24:40 PM EDT
You’re probably already aware of it, but the safeties are substantially different. If you’re a lefty or if someone not gun conversant (like a wife) will be using the shotgun, the Mossberg’s tang safety might be a better way to go. Both will do the job. I prefer the 870 – I think the action’s a little smoother.
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 1:26:30 PM EDT
Not trying to be the fly in the wax, but have you considered a benelli? [beer]
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 1:31:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2001 1:31:17 PM EDT by Watch-Six]
Either of those two will do fine. The 870 would be my preference. The 870 has stouter parts in the bolt and in my opinion is easier to disassemble/reassemble. It's also nearly impossible to wear one out. I do prefer the safety on the Mossberg. I have owned both, and both are good guns. The Benelli is better still.
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 1:36:25 PM EDT
I dont know what budget you want to spend, but the benelli is an awesome shot gun. It does have the fastest semi action, and most reliable bolt setup out there. I have a Super M90 that will take 2.75 or 3" shells. They make another model that will shoot 3.5" shells but I could not justify another $100 for that ability. There are plenty of good 3" defensive loads, without needing a 3.5" shell. It is a semi auto and the action is smooth as silk. A very shootable shotgun. Just food for thought! [beer]
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 1:47:50 PM EDT
I have both shotguns you mention plus a Winchester 1300. I prefer the Winchester over the rest. Smoother and faster pump action. The Rem 870 has the most after-market parts if that is what you are into.
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 2:18:10 PM EDT
I think I am going to go with the 590. All I plan on doing is tactical sights, a tactical light, a barrel shroud, and a side saddle to carry extra shells. Has anyone had the plastic trigger group fail? Does anybody know if metal replacement parts are made for the trigger group? And for those who own a 590, how much was it?
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 2:27:50 PM EDT
I have an 870, and I like it very much. The only thing I don't like about it is the safety. My 870 is the cheaper Express model. The Express doesn't have the nice, blue finish or the American walnut stocks of the 870 Wingmaster. My Express is flat black (parkerized?) with hardwood stocks--for my purposes, this is just fine. I have never tried the Mossberg, but I don't care for the way it looks. I like the looks of the 870. I have tried the Winchester Defender. A buddy had one with an 18" barrel with a bead front sight. We tried shooting slugs in it, and they didn't go anywhere near where the thing was aimed. Of course, we only tried the slugs we had on hand (maybe another brand would do better), and we only tried that one Defender. However, in handling both, I preferred the 870. My Express came with the 28" barrel with screw in chokes. I bought a 20" barrel with rifle sights and screw in chokes. The 870 always put the slugs close to point of aim. Using the screw in rifle tube, it did not properly stabilize the Remington bronze sabot slugs. Presumbably, a fully rifled barrel would. Other slug loads worked better, but none gave great accuracy. I understand that the Vang Comp barrel gives excellent performance with 00 and 000 buckshot. I am considering getting one of those. And perhaps some peep sights.
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 4:37:52 PM EDT
One can't beat a shotgun for home defense. I found a China made Hawk(ya I know) at second store for penny's on the dollar that I could not pass up. This device is a clone of the 870 and works perfect. To bad it was produced in a country that I dislike. 12 ga.w/a 7 shot capacity, perfect for under the bed..
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 4:46:54 PM EDT
I have owned the 870 and 590-A1. I liked the Remington a lot - but I ended up selling it. I think that the 590A1 is easily a better value! Tyler
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 4:52:37 PM EDT
[green][size=5][b]REMINGTON 870[/green][/size=5][/b] I've owned both, both are good, but the 590 rattled and sounded cheap. The 870 is steel, I like it better. [img]http://wsphotofews.excite.com/028/Vi/Oh/by/9B17964.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 6:59:34 PM EDT
if you go pump, the 870 cant be beat. but consider the extra for a benelli tactical. i have a super 90 and i want a hi cap tactical. my super is great for shooting, but wth an action that fast you need more than 4-5 shots
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 7:53:35 PM EDT
Hi Cal, I looked at all of these about two years ago and decided the Moss 590 Mariner was for me. It's 8+1, cycles like a dream, and fits me to a tee. I love the Marinecote finish, and it is great to have it on my boat. I discovered the Marinecote heatshield was a good idea after repeated rapid fire. It is a little tricky the first time you take it apart, but you'll get the hang of it. If I was looking for one now, though, I'd get the Moss 590A1. This is the one that our Armed Forces buy, and it is completely milspec. It has 8+1, bayo lug (same bayo as M16), and steel trigger guard. VERY impressive. Let us know what you get, and how you like it. Pepper
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 8:03:05 PM EDT
Remington is offering a $25 rebate currently on the express models. If you are in CA, The Turners Grand Opening Sale in West Covena has them on sale. With the rebate the price is $199 for the HD and $244 for the 7 shot.
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 8:15:44 PM EDT
Well, between the 2 I would go 870. I've got both remingtons and mossbergs and all of them are good guns. I just personally think the 870 feeds a little better and is a little heavier duty. But like HighlandMac said, if you can go, Benelli, If you find one used for a decent price snatch it up. I lucked up and found an SL120 M1 in 99% for $375. It is amazing but I understand that finances can be tough. I probably could never afford one new. Matt
Link Posted: 8/10/2001 8:19:17 PM EDT
I say 590A1 with the ghost rings. I have used mine from the cold of the Alaskan tundra to the hot Mississippi sun. Mine has gone off a 30 foot mud slid (with me) In Alaska then we both fell in a nice cold lake it had mud,dirt,twigs leaves and almost everything that was on the Alaskan floor in the barrel and action. I just racked it once and the action still worked great. In Mississippi I was going through a shooting class(taught by my uncle.Just for me) I played GI Joe for 8 hours a day for 5 days. Jumping in to mud,sand and dirt and engaging target off at 100yd and I never had one malfunction in the 1000rd I shot of 00 buckshot and slug. I have used mine Turkey hunting and skeet shooting(Sorry it was all I had.) It did great in all of it and I got my first bird with it. I love my 590A1 and it is the last gun I'd ever sell. Also the 590A1 to this day as I know is the only shotgun that has passed military testing and that is 5000rd of 00 buckshot with out a malfunction and it is not aloud to discharge from being dropped from heights from 30 feet and other various thing. But like they said try to shoot them both if you lived in IL Id let you try mine. Good luck and you will be happy with what ever you get.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 12:10:12 AM EDT
I recently pondered the same question... 870 or 590A1 or Benelli M1S90? $250 or $450 or $850? I bought the 870. The money I saved will go towards a combat shotgun class. Screw the add-on gizmos; my shotgun is not a catalog model prettied up to sell crap: -Side saddle shell carrier... if it can't be solved with 7 shots of 00 buck, I should have grabbed the AR15. -Tactical sling... HD shotgun isn't gonna be carried for extended periods of time. -Pistol grips... hahaha, what a joke. -Vented handguards... just how many rounds are you planning on firing? -Bayonet mount... funnier than a pistol grip. -Ghost ring sights... how long is your hallway? -The list goes on... In the end, just ask yourself if all the doodads truly increase the effectiveness of your weapon in YOUR situation. I am not a soldier nor a SWAT team breecher nor a patrol cop. The objective of MY shotgun is to decisively stop an advancing adversary in the confines of my home.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 4:40:01 AM EDT
I agree with you on some of your statements 8200, and I am not trying to argue. With that in mind, consider the side saddle shell carrier; when can having extra ammo on hand for your weapon be a bad thing? The same can be said for the sights. Tyler
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:27:13 AM EDT
Originally Posted By tylerdurden1201: I agree with you on some of your statements 8200, and I am not trying to argue. With that in mind, consider the side saddle shell carrier; when can having extra ammo on hand for your weapon be a bad thing? The same can be said for the sights. Tyler
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How well does the side saddle retain the ammo if the shotgun is dropped or used to butt stroke someone? The extra ammo there may be a good idea, but I feel like the speed feed stock would be better. Just wondering if there is any real world experience out there?
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:45:21 AM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer: both are good in my opinion. the mossburg has a plastic trigger group which i don't like but so far has not been a problem.
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If you don't like the plastic then there is always the M590A1 with a metal trigger housing and safety.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 10:53:10 AM EDT
As a gun owner, police officer, SWAT, and ex-military, I can tell you that the 870 is clearly superior to any shotgun already mentioned, including the Benelli. I have 2 Benellis, one being the 14 inch model. I also own the Beretta 1201, an 870, and had a "Mossi." In a gunfight, the professionals I have worked with have always preferred the 870 for it's simplicity and well-known reliability. I've been in dozens of SWAT classes and military bases, and I can say that I've seen about a dozen Benelli's break or hangup during the course. I can only remember an 870 hanging up once, and I think the operator simply short stroked it- although they adimmantly denied it at the time. Regarding accessories, the speedstock is a definite NO. The shells tend to fall out because of recoil or manipulation. Side saddles, ghost-ring sights, and a Sure-Fire light mount would complete an already superior weapon. Stay away from pistol grips and folding stocks. Learning to handle weapons in a "universal" manner is worth gold when it really matters. Just my .02 cents worth from past experience and several actual encounters with the "elephant." ***ptp
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