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Posted: 2/3/2006 12:53:15 AM EDT
Music that is. I remember listening to Metallica as a kid, and though it was heavy, I knew that someone would come along that was faster and grindier, and many groups have, some going well beyond the point of incoherency.

So where is metal going to go now?
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 12:56:01 AM EDT
Why do you think the death metal scene stagnated in the early 90's?
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 3:06:20 AM EDT
Some of that death metal became black metal and some others went the grind way.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 3:20:36 PM EDT
As long as it keeps changing it will remain interesting, at least to me.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 3:22:04 PM EDT
you want fast? check out the "music" genre called "speedcore". some of those "songs" get up to 1000 bpm.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 3:23:34 PM EDT
Sooner or later it will morph into something that Moby and Kanye West can produce.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 3:25:30 PM EDT
"heavy" is an opinion.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 3:37:30 PM EDT
I'm about 15 years out of my metal years, but do still have an ear (or what's left of it) for it. Most 'metal' bands are terrible today. BUT, it's not my choice, it's the kids choice, and as long as record companies don't lead them around by the nose ring, they will decide what survives and what fails.

One of my all time favorites was Fates Warning, and they are still together to a degree. However, they are very prog metal at this time, and while they have retained musicianship, they've lost some of the rage needed for good metal. It goes away with age, and is a natural progression. Hell, I'm into Jesse Cook now days anyhoo...
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 3:42:17 PM EDT
Maybe if Sharon feed Ozzie more food it'd get heavier.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 4:42:54 PM EDT
The only band that defines heavy metal, past or present is BLACK SABBATH ,there will never be another band that even comes close to their influence on'' metal' I've seen them perform with OZZY and DIO and they just kick ass, no glitz, no pyrotecnic bullshit, just pure heavy metal!
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 4:48:06 PM EDT
Mmmm...Swedish Melodic Death Metal.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 4:49:53 PM EDT
They can get harder, but the question is....

Can they get any better?

Here is something that many heavy metal artists can't seem to figure out:

meaning is a product of contrast.

A screm is heavy and intense....until I scream for multiple minutes.

Then is just becomes boring and flat, not longer intense.

Only a few heavy metal bands have really figured this out. The ones that have, that do it right, really are "heavy" and can bring the power home at the right times to really effect and emotionally influence their listeners.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 4:54:05 PM EDT
I am more into melodic than heavy, and (asbestos suit on) Steve Vai replaced all my earlier guitar-gods, including Eddie VH (except Jimmie H)

Listen to 'For Love of God' sometime (live), it still makes the hair on the back of my neck stand-up
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 4:58:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By yekimak:
I remember listening to Metallica as a kid



damn I feel old
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 5:03:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By NoVaGator:

Originally Posted By yekimak:
I remember listening to Metallica as a kid



damn I feel old



me too
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 5:12:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/3/2006 5:15:27 PM EDT by LVMIKE]
Use to listen to Metallica alot. Liked everything from the super old (8 minute long songs :o ) to even some of the newest stuff (little too artsy, but songs like Whiskey in the Jar were good). New bands have gone the route of Static X or System of a down (that is more punk tho), and just gone with incoherent lyrics and weird sounds. Only two bands that produce anything worthwhile seem to be Slipknot (who still makes stuff that doesn't sound like they are trying to be more mainstream) and Mudvayne (who started out fuckin' awesome and has gravitated towards a more Tool-like sound). If Mudvayne went back to the sound that made me like them (Dig, Internal Primates, Under my skin, etc) I'd be really happy. They just keeping making more songs that sound whiney, while trying to sound like Tool.

Don't even get me started on the self-important, materialistic, whiney shit that bands like Nonpoint or Avenge seven fold are playing... Fucking trend rock.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 5:13:10 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 5:13:39 PM EDT
all i can say is Hard Attack 27, RULES!!!
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 5:32:10 PM EDT
No, it's too commercial now. Not like the days when you did hear it on the radio, or when the music awards did'nt have a rock/metal category.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 6:08:40 PM EDT
Fu Manchu rocks pretty good...
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 6:19:56 PM EDT
good variety on the resident evil soundtracks.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 6:32:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By freeride21a:
all i can say is Hard Attack 27, RULES!!!



Sirius has good rock stations
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 6:39:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Ratgravy:
No, it's too commercial now. Not like the days when you did hear it on the radio, or when the music awards did'nt have a rock/metal category.

you will never hear real metal on the radio or on mtv. most people don't have a taste for metal, so commercial rock is about as hard as radio and t.v. will go.

at my last job, we could listen to whatever we wanted. i asked a few people if they were down with metal, and they told me they were. the next day, i put in some chimaira, nothing face, and dying fetus... the response i got from everyone was "what the fuck is that?". i had to explain to them that the avenged sevenfold and linkin park they listen to is not metal...



and in answer to the original question: no, i don't see it getting much harder without becoming completely incoherent. there's a lot of talent and great music out there... i like to think of it as a golden age for metal. i don't have the slightest idea which direction it will go in, but i just don't see it getting any better than it is now.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:16:16 PM EDT
yes it can get heavier, take a look at Meshuggah...There is absolutley no other band on this planet that sounds even close to their style. They are a genre of their own.

from wikiepedia:

"Meshuggah, whose name is taken from the Hebrew and Yiddish word for "crazy," is a five-piece Scandinavian metal/tech metal band from Umeå, Sweden who use extended polymetric passages, complex drum patterns, odd time signatures, angular, dissonant guitar riffs, and harsh, non-pitched vocals."

"Among the band's most recognizable qualities are lead guitar player Fredrik Thordendal's smooth, clean, Allan Holdsworth-esque solos, the churning, dissonant rhythm guitars and the polymetric drum beats. In a typical Meshuggah song, drummer Tomas Haake plays two separate rhythms: a standard 4/4 beat with his hands, and a completely different metrical subdivision with his feet. The guitars mostly follow the bass drum work, creating an awkwardly pulsating rhythmic pattern to work as the basis of the song."



"To take an example, the main riff of the song "New Millennium Cyanide Christ" from their 1998 album Chaosphere follows the aforementioned blueprint. Haake beats a rather slow 4/4 rhythm with his hands, while the bass drums and guitars play a repetitive 23/16 rhythm pattern on top of it. As the subdivided pattern is repeated, the pattern's accents shift to different beats on each repetition. After repeating the 23/16 pattern five times, a shorter 13/16 pattern is played once. These patterns sum up to 128 16th notes, which equals exactly 8 measures in 4/4 meter."





Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:45:59 PM EDT
Back around 86, two friends of mine had a beef. What was a heavier album. Hellhammer's Apocalyptic Raids or Sodom's In the Sign of Evil. At the time Metallica was for posers. Just a progression of Judist Priest. I went with Hellhammer. They were what I thought of as heavy. Slow, sludge, and noise. Great fun! I dug Sodom as well. But they were just a Venom ripoff. The only band that I've heard that can compare, in that style is Darkthrone. That shit is HEAVY. In my sence of the word anyway.

Everybody has thier own idea of what metal is. And I'm way past the point of caring. The greatest thing about metal is. There is ALWAYS an underground. It's always recreating it self for a new group of people. Words like "False and Poser" always ring true somewhere too someone. Metal will never go away. To many people identify with it. Now more than ever.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:47:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Alchemist:
Mmmm...Swedish Melodic Death Metal.



+1
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:51:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/3/2006 7:52:28 PM EDT by totalabuse]

Originally Posted By blacklisted:

Originally Posted By The_Alchemist:
Mmmm...Swedish Black Metal.



+1



Fixed. MARDUK!
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:53:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/3/2006 7:54:10 PM EDT by Hydguy]

Originally Posted By Ratgravy:
No, it's too commercial now. Not like the days when you did hear it on the radio, or when the music awards did'nt have a rock/metal category.

ANd the first Grammy winner for Hard Rock/heavy metal?

Jethro Tull.


They play a FLUTE FOR GOD'S SAKE!!!!!!!
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:55:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By totalabuse:
Back around 86, At the time Metallica was for posers. WTF????
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:57:40 PM EDT
Styles of Rock

Acid Rock
Adult Oriented Rock (AOR)
Album Rock
American Trad Rock
Angry Metal
Arena Rock
Aussie Rock
Black Industrial
Black Metal
Boogie Rock
British Metal
British Psychedelia
British Trad Rock
Celtic Rock
Christian Rock
College Rock
Comedy Rock
Country Rock
Death Metal
Deathcore (Brutal Death)
Doom Metal
Drone
Epic (Viking) Metal
Experimental Rock
Folk Metal
French Rock
Garage Rock Revival
Glam Metal
Glam Rock
Goth Doom / Dark Metal
Gothic Folk
Gothic Love Metal
Gothic Metal
Gothic Rock
Grindcore
Grunge
Guitar Virtuoso
Hard Rock
Hardcore
Heartland Rock
Heavy Metal
Horror Metal
Indie Rock
Instrumental Rock
J-Rock
Jam Bands
Kraut Rock
Melodic Death
Merseybeat
Neo-Classical Metal
Neo-Progressive
Noise Rock
NS Black Metal
Nuclear Metal
Pagan Metal
Pop Metal
Power Metal
Prog-Rock/Art Rock
Progressive Metal
Punk Rock
Retro-Rock
Rock & Roll
Rockabilly
Roots Rock
Scandinavian Metal
Shoegaze
Sludge Metal
Soft Rock
Southern Rock
Space Rock
Speed Metal
Stoner Metal
Straight-Edge
Surf Revival
Surf Rock
Sympho-Black
Symphonic Metal
Techno-Black
Techno-Death
Techno-Thrash
Thrash
Vampiric Metal

I might of left one or two out.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 8:02:51 PM EDT
I really enjoy Killswitch Engage, Shadows Fall, and As I Lay Dying.

(Along with early Metallica, Pantera, and Ozzy of course!!)

Long Live Randy Rhoads and Dimebag Darrel!
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 8:08:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/3/2006 8:22:37 PM EDT by totalabuse]
John575

"Kill'em all" Was no different than anything else at the time. Ride.... Was a good album for what it was. As was Master.... anything after that your on your own. Not trying too start anything. But there was alot of good stuff happening at the time. And for the underground types Metallica was nothing special. Like I said they were a progression of what was already playing stadiums. Look they're still here.(for better or worse) 95 0/0 of the bands I dug are gone, thankfully. Commercial appeal kills good bands.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 8:13:54 PM EDT
Black Dahlia Murder, Darkest Hour, Between The Buried and Me. So good.

Dunno where it will go, but I can't imagine it getting any 'heavier.'
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 8:40:20 PM EDT
BTW, the new In Flames album is out now. Pretty damn heavy.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 11:29:49 AM EDT
I have been bingeing on "horror Rock" lately, Wednesday 13, FDQ, and Murderdolls (all the same lead singer) mostly because it is something I had never heard before and it sounded cool. For some reason the songs about zombies are appealing, I do not know why

Link Posted: 2/4/2006 11:33:28 AM EDT
Back in the 80's I worshipped Metallica, Megadeth, and Iron Maiden. Now when I listen to their new stuff it's almost like listening to a different band. Slayer used to considered pretty hard at the time, now it sounds slow and old. I guess it all changes with new bands influenced by the older stuff trying to be heavier and faster.

I remember when I heard the Black Album for the first time I knew Metallica was dead
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 11:34:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Grivo_Mak:
Sooner or later it will morph into something that Moby and Kanye West can produce.



That will be when I drive "nine-inch-nails" into each of my ear drums
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 12:11:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Beerswimmer:
Back in the 80's I worshipped Metallica, Megadeth, and Iron Maiden. Now when I listen to their new stuff it's almost like listening to a different band. Slayer used to considered pretty hard at the time, now it sounds slow and old. I guess it all changes with new bands influenced by the older stuff trying to be heavier and faster.

I remember when I heard the Black Album for the first time I knew Metallica was dead



I know...I felt like I was ripped off.

Link Posted: 2/4/2006 12:18:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By capnrob97:

Originally Posted By NoVaGator:

Originally Posted By yekimak:
I remember listening to Metallica as a kid



damn I feel old



me too



Me three.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 12:23:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By yekimak:

Originally Posted By Beerswimmer:
Back in the 80's I worshipped Metallica, Megadeth, and Iron Maiden. Now when I listen to their new stuff it's almost like listening to a different band. Slayer used to considered pretty hard at the time, now it sounds slow and old. I guess it all changes with new bands influenced by the older stuff trying to be heavier and faster.

I remember when I heard the Black Album for the first time I knew Metallica was dead



I know...I felt like I was ripped off.




I thought I was hearing Skid Row.

Over time, I decided it's a very good rock album, just not the metal I was expecting.

Link Posted: 2/4/2006 12:25:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DriftPunch:
One of my all time favorites was Fates Warning, and they are still together to a degree. However, they are very prog metal at this time, and while they have retained musicianship, they've lost some of the rage needed for good metal. It goes away with age, and is a natural progression. Hell, I'm into Jesse Cook now days anyhoo...



Wow, Fates Warning. I played my "The Spectre Within" record a lot, and got it on CD as soon as the CD came out. Good stuff.

Link Posted: 2/4/2006 12:27:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By freeride21a:
all i can say is Hard Attack 27, RULES!!!



Jose is the man.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 12:29:29 PM EDT


Speaking of heavy...

I know "heavy" is subjective, but I picked up Starpping Young Lad's Alien album, and I'm digging it. Click the link if interested. They've got Gene Hoglan drumming for them, who I remember from Dark Angel in the mid 1980s.

Link Posted: 2/4/2006 12:54:12 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 12:57:43 PM EDT
The Wall Street Journal has an op-ed this week on "Cookie Monsters of Death Metal Music". I shit you not.
www.opinionjournal.com/la/?id=110007902
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 1:29:22 PM EDT
My god, guys,,,,,,,,,anybody ever remember AC/DC?!?!?

Put on the song Thunder, (I think that was the title) turn it up and enjoy! You young whipper snapers must of missed out?

Link Posted: 2/4/2006 1:31:30 PM EDT
You mean Thunderstruck? I think that came out in the 90's. WAAAAAAAAAAYY after they started. The #2 singer too.

Whipper snapper? How young are you?
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 1:40:39 PM EDT
Most all of the good metal is coming out of europe these days-

Emperor
Dimmu borgir
Early In flames(they have been mainstream nu-metal since ReRoute to Remain)
The Haunted
Children of Bodom


and on and on...

There has been another band that almost matches Black Sabbath in terms of influence-Judas Priest. 1976's Sad Wings of Destiny took metal from Sabbath's early sludge and doom sound to the more speedy, grinding sound. EVERY album from Sad Wings to Defenders of the Faith is pretty much a classic.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 1:41:05 PM EDT
Thunderstruck......thanks! It's in my CD rotation in my truck.

I'm a young 59 and can still can out drink, out fight, out ride, out shoot any whipper snapper.......oops that was just a movie.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 6:16:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By totalabuse:
Back around 86, two friends of mine had a beef. What was a heavier album. Hellhammer's Apocalyptic Raids or Sodom's In the Sign of Evil. At the time Metallica was for posers. Just a progression of Judist Priest. I went with Hellhammer. They were what I thought of as heavy. Slow, sludge, and noise. Great fun! I dug Sodom as well. But they were just a Venom ripoff. The only band that I've heard that can compare, in that style is Darkthrone. That shit is HEAVY. In my sence of the word anyway.

Everybody has thier own idea of what metal is. And I'm way past the point of caring. The greatest thing about metal is. There is ALWAYS an underground. It's always recreating it self for a new group of people. Words like "False and Poser" always ring true somewhere too someone. Metal will never go away. To many people identify with it. Now more than ever.



Man, Hellhammer brings back some memories. I listened to them at the same time I got into Celtic Frost's Dawn of Megiddo, and S.O.D.'s (Stormtroopers Of Death) Speak English or Die....that, IIRC, was Billy Milano's band, and they sang my favorite song of the time- The Milano Mosh. Damn, that was good stuff.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 6:22:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/4/2006 6:29:11 PM EDT by jr1092]

Originally Posted By AZ-K9:
BTW, the new In Flames album is out now. Pretty damn heavy.



+1 seeing them in Columbus next weekend and loookin forward to it.

As to comment on heavy music, check out dillinger escape plan...all of them math majors and some of them w/ their masters. defn not your ordinary metal
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