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Posted: 2/1/2006 9:54:20 AM EDT
Title speaks for itself.

How would YOU fix the border/illegal immigration issues?
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 9:55:30 AM EDT
Vote for a president who will!
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 9:56:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 9:58:23 AM EDT by Jon_C_]
I call it the "Great Wall of Mexico".



*edited* Smaller photo.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 9:56:50 AM EDT

Originally Posted By KeMiCaLs:
Vote for a president who will!



They'll promise you anything to get in office. That's out.

Pretend for a minute you are the President. What would you do to secure the country's borders?
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 9:56:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 9:57:53 AM EDT by thebeekeeper1]
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 9:58:06 AM EDT
Lots of manpower on the borders. A large wall wouldn't hurt (some emporoer of china seems to have thought it would work). IMMEDIATE deportation of ANY ILLEGAL immigrant. Jail time obviously will not work, that'd be giving them way too much. A 1% national sales tax to fund this adventure...I'd be willing to pay it.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 9:59:19 AM EDT


+

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 9:59:27 AM EDT
Build a REAL wall along the border. Perimeter fencing, comprehensive border inspections and document checks at entry points.
Man it 24/7/365 with armed border patrol.
Use sophisticated technology to detect and deter illegals.
Use the immediate areas all along the border as a training area for our military.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:00:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 10:00:36 AM EDT by ALPHAGHOST]
moat, mines, machine guns, and "minutemen"

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:01:23 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:01:36 AM EDT
Simple


The same as DMZ between North and South Korea.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:02:11 AM EDT
Make illegal immigration a felony.

Make hiring an illegal a felony.

This needs to be attacked from the demand side.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:02:33 AM EDT
Several HUGE military bases right on the border. BP patroling in between. Huge navy base at the border at the pacific border [ move the city, tough shit ]. Huge navy base at the gulf of America end [ gotta change that name, fuck mexico ].

Military ain't going to put up with any illegals walking across their bases. Lots of live ammo practice going on. Arty ranges. Bombing ranges. Shooting ranges. All, right ON the border.

rj
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:02:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1:
The bitchers NEVER offer solutions--especially realistic ones. It's just a lot of bluster and mindless griping on the internet. It sure gets old. A few here can interject their crap into a thread on any topic.

Personally, I would like to see the "invasion" treated like an invasion--complete with mines and machine gun nests. But, we all know that's NOT going to happen. There is no easy/quick answer.



You're right. You've probably seen many more of these threads than i have, too.

I just wanted to hear some solutions...

It doesn't help when the Lefties of the world bleat about how stopping illegal immigration is "racist" to their little bleeding hearts.

I'll start:

* A real, solid wall on the Mexican border. Even if it's berms and not a reinforced concrete structure. Rig it with some kind of sensor to detect people.

* Same (for the most part) goes for the Canadian border. I love Canada but, well, Canada should appreciate it too.

* Quick-reaction teams stationed every, oh, 10 miles. Ideally with choppers.

* A licensing and tracking plan for day workers.

I can't think of more but I'd just like to see more security. It's too late, I know, but better late than never.

On a separate note: Has anyone else seen the Border Patrol commercials on TV yet? I caught my first one last night. I was shocked.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:03:49 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:04:31 AM EDT
Land mines.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:04:44 AM EDT
1) Convert old military bases into immigrant holding facilities. Until we find out who you are, and why you're here, you're not getting deported.

2) Mandate by Executive Order thatl local LE will enforce immigration law, any local agency that refuses to comply loses all federal funding.

3) The Wall-build it.

4) Make it a felony to knowingly hire illegal aliens

5) Make it a felony to knowingly enter or remain in this country illegally, do your time in #1.

6) Re-interpret the Constitution so as to rescind the "anchor baby" loophole.

Thats all I can think of for the moment.

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:05:13 AM EDT

Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1:
The bitchers NEVER offer solutions--especially realistic ones. It's just a lot of bluster and mindless griping on the internet. It sure gets old. A few here can interject their crap into a thread on any topic.

Personally, I would like to see the "invasion" treated like an invasion--complete with mines and machine gun nests. But, we all know that's NOT going to happen. There is no easy/quick answer.

Edit: SEE WHAT I MEAN?? In the time it took me to type the first part of this post we have idiocy aplenty.




Build a REAL wall along the border. Perimeter fencing, comprehensive border inspections and document checks at entry points.
Man it 24/7/365 with armed border patrol.
Use sophisticated technology to detect and deter illegals.
Use the immediate areas all along the border as a training area for our military.


Real solutions that would work.

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:05:33 AM EDT
My stab?

Well I'd use the fance idea to setup well patroled choke points where they would either have to scale a razor wire fence and crawl through some more wire or try to sneak past the choke point. Fence the area where survival is easiest and leave the terrian to take care of it where it's harshest.

A law making placement of food and water stations a crime, when placed to aid illegal crossings. Destroy any such that are found and allow private citizens to do the same.

No discression, if you are caught for anything by any LEO without valid resident status, then your deported or rot in detention.

No you will not stop it dead, but it will make it more difficult and more likely to result in failure.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:06:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By PAEBR332:
Make illegal immigration a felony.

Make hiring an illegal a felony.

This needs to be attacked from the demand side.



+1

We need to remove all the benifits for coming here illegally: free medical care, free schooling, etc..

Cheers
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:06:54 AM EDT
$10,000 fine per illegal hired by any establised company. Third offense becomes a felony and gets
you $100,000 fine and jail time. Kill the demand and you'll curb the supply.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:06:55 AM EDT
huge fines and jail time for employers of illegals with a reward for people who turn the employers in. problem solved over night.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:07:02 AM EDT
I'm sure no one here will like my answer, but the solution is actually relatively simple.

Eliminate Welfare
Eliminate Medicaid/Medicare
Eliminate the minimum wage


That would change the dynamics such that the majority that would be interested in coming across the border would be those wanting to work for an honest living and not coming here to feed off the .gov teat. If they're willing to work for an honest living, who cares if they come here. Also, locals would be forced to get off their ass and work (even if it's for little money), thus filling in many of the jobs that are currently being taken by immigrants. The net effect would again reduce the number coming across because there would be less job opportunity for them.

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:07:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 10:08:08 AM EDT by KeMiCaLs]
A massive,Deep, alligator infested Mote..Butted right up to a huge wall.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:07:32 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:07:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1:

Originally Posted By SPECTRE:
Build a REAL wall along the border. Perimeter fencing, comprehensive border inspections and document checks at entry points.
Man it 24/7/365 with armed border patrol.
Use sophisticated technology to detect and deter illegals.
Use the immediate areas all along the border as a training area for our military.



Your share for this comes to $2000/yr. above what you are paying now in taxes. You can simply add it as an extra to your 1040 in a few weeks. No complaining about the taxes it takes to accomplish your own desires.



Where do you come up with those numbers ?
Besides, we have more than enough money coming in. It just needs to be allocated correctly.
The MAIN issue is a LACK OF WILL to fix the problem.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:08:16 AM EDT
First strickly inforce laws against people who employ illegals. Second eliminate any medical or social bennefits, illegals would not be eligible. This would greatly reduce the numbers coming here for none criminal activities.

Next would be securing the border, that is what we have a military for. Which would be alot easier since there would be alot less reason for illegals to come meaning the ones coming are coming because of criminal activities.

Last phase would be rounding up and exporting the ones we have here, local law enforcement and state national guards would be put to this task. One way bus rides or air flights.

It is not that difficult, it just takes the nuts to do it.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:08:30 AM EDT
Wall or fence on most of not all of the border, with armed posts.

Felony for a company to hire an illegal with a HUGE $$$ fine. Random inspections of company's employment records to verify legality of such employees.

CMOS
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:09:36 AM EDT

Originally Posted By PAEBR332:
Make illegal immigration a felony.

Make hiring an illegal a felony. With mandatory time in Club Fed for the hiring supervisor, and a $50k fine for the company, per incident.

This needs to be attacked from the demand side.



My small contribution to a very good idea.

CO
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:09:36 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Moe-Ron:

Originally Posted By PAEBR332:
Make illegal immigration a felony.

Make hiring an illegal a felony.

This needs to be attacked from the demand side.



+1

We need to remove all the benifits for coming here illegally: free medical care, free schooling, etc..

Cheers



+2, I addition to hardening the borders this needs to be done as well.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:10:21 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:10:42 AM EDT
Stricter laws on hiring that make it hard for an illegal to be hired, (especially as a TSA employee, ) and then stiff fines to employers that are caught breaking these laws. The law of supply and demand is hard to circimvent, ..drugs are a good example. Shine the spotlight on employers and we'll have less people coming across the border and more time to catch the real bad guys, smugglers and terrorists. A big fuckin ugly wall is an admission of corruption.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:10:48 AM EDT
Kinky Friedman, a DEMOCRAP running for the governor of Texas, has an interesting proposal to combat illegal border crossings called the 'Five Mexican General Plan.'

Here's Kinky explaining it himself:

"The 'Five Mexican Generals Plan', which was suggested to me by my adviser on border issues, former Texas Ranger Joaquin Jackson. We divide the border into five jurisdictions, assign each one to a Mexican general, and put two million dollars into bank accounts that we control, one for each general. Then, each time we catch an illegal crossing through a general’s jurisdiction, we withdraw five thousand dollars from that account. That’ll solve the problem ... The Hispanic activists I’ve talked to say it’s crazy enough that it just might work..."



Eric The(Don'tAsk,Don'tTell...WhatHappenedToCurbTheFlow)Hun
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:11:22 AM EDT

Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1:

Originally Posted By SPECTRE:
Build a REAL wall along the border. Perimeter fencing, comprehensive border inspections and document checks at entry points.
Man it 24/7/365 with armed border patrol.
Use sophisticated technology to detect and deter illegals.
Use the immediate areas all along the border as a training area for our military.



Your share for this comes to $2000/yr. above what you are paying now in taxes. You can simply add it as an extra to your 1040 in a few weeks. No complaining about the taxes it takes to accomplish your own desires.



So it would take $230B per year (non farm employment x $2000) to impliment his ideas?
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:11:32 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:11:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1:

Originally Posted By SPECTRE:

Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1:
The bitchers NEVER offer solutions--especially realistic ones. It's just a lot of bluster and mindless griping on the internet. It sure gets old. A few here can interject their crap into a thread on any topic.

Personally, I would like to see the "invasion" treated like an invasion--complete with mines and machine gun nests. But, we all know that's NOT going to happen. There is no easy/quick answer.

Edit: SEE WHAT I MEAN?? In the time it took me to type the first part of this post we have idiocy aplenty.




Build a REAL wall along the border. Perimeter fencing, comprehensive border inspections and document checks at entry points.
Man it 24/7/365 with armed border patrol.
Use sophisticated technology to detect and deter illegals.
Use the immediate areas all along the border as a training area for our military.


Real solutions that would work.




What would all this cost? You and I get to pay for it--don't forget that part.



In general terms, other than the wall, we have most of the pieces available.
We have the border patrol. We have the technology available. Training our troops there or elsewhere costs the same.
So we cut the pork spending and fund it, no tax increase.
Why you fight this so hard is amazing to me.
I invite you to come spend some time here and we'll see how quickly your outlook changes.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:11:53 AM EDT

What would all this cost? You and I get to pay for it--don't forget that part.



I'm sure the money we save in healthcare and education would pay for it in the long run.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:12:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By vsound:
I'm sure no one here will like my answer, but the solution is actually relatively simple.

Eliminate Welfare
Eliminate Medicaid/Medicare
Eliminate the minimum wage


That would change the dynamics such that the majority that would be interested in coming across the border would be those wanting to work for an honest living and not coming here to feed off the .gov teat. If they're willing to work for an honest living, who cares if they come here. Also, locals would be forced to get off their ass and work (even if it's for little money), thus filling in many of the jobs that are currently being taken by immigrants. The net effect would again reduce the number coming across because there would be less job opportunity for them.




That's a whole 'nother ball of wax right there!

Aside from the healthcare system, how would a non-resident "feed off the .gov teat"? Honest question, I don't know the answer to.

I agree with you FWIW, but it doesn't seem like the illegal immigrant Mexicans are the ones on the dole - correct me if I'm wrong. Many of the illegal immigrants are here to work, right? Bigger problems with "domestic" lower class individuals (not a racial thing, just the people who aren't working, white and black)
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:13:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1:

Originally Posted By SPECTRE:
Where do you come up with those numbers ?
Besides, we have more than enough money coming in. It just needs to be allocated correctly.
The MAIN issue is a LACK OF WILL to fix the problem.



I just made mine up. Where did you get your "more than enough money coming in" figure?



Just look at what the gov't takes from us each year.
It's a matter of spending it where its needed and cutting the pork.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:14:40 AM EDT

Originally Posted By EricTheHun:
Kinky Friedman, a DEMOCRAP running for the governor of Texas, has an interesting proposal to combat illegal border crossings called the 'Five Mexican General Plan.'

Here's Kinky explaining it himself:

"The 'Five Mexican Generals Plan', which was suggested to me by my adviser on border issues, former Texas Ranger Joaquin Jackson. We divide the border into five jurisdictions, assign each one to a Mexican general, and put two million dollars into bank accounts that we control, one for each general. Then, each time we catch an illegal crossing through a general’s jurisdiction, we withdraw five thousand dollars from that account. That’ll solve the problem ... The Hispanic activists I’ve talked to say it’s crazy enough that it just might work..."



Eric The(Don'tAsk,Don'tTell...WhatHappenedToCurbTheFlow)Hun



Wouldn't the Coyotes just reimburse the generales?
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:14:40 AM EDT
Build a concrete wall about 50' high all along the border.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:16:48 AM EDT
Another vote for removing the Anchor Baby loophole and massive fines/felony for employing illegals...
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:17:21 AM EDT
Nothing that ignores the primary motive of the illegal alien will work. You could erect a wall 1,000 feet high and they will still find a way around it. Why? Because Mexico is corrupt, racist and ignorant of their poorest citizens.

The only way to stop the illegal immigration is to CHANGE Mexico. Good luck in doing that. We have become the reservation for the Native Americans since Mexico doesn't want them. look as Chiapas where the Zapatistias have been pushing for a fair shake.

Mexico has no use for these people, just like the Mariel Boat Lift of the early 1980s where Castro emptied his prisons onto the shores of the US.


I say we invade Mexico AGAIN and straighten out the mess. Anything else is just pissing in the wind.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:19:08 AM EDT

Originally Posted By macman37:

Originally Posted By EricTheHun:
Kinky Friedman, a DEMOCRAP running for the governor of Texas, has an interesting proposal to combat illegal border crossings called the 'Five Mexican General Plan.'

Here's Kinky explaining it himself:

"The 'Five Mexican Generals Plan', which was suggested to me by my adviser on border issues, former Texas Ranger Joaquin Jackson. We divide the border into five jurisdictions, assign each one to a Mexican general, and put two million dollars into bank accounts that we control, one for each general. Then, each time we catch an illegal crossing through a general’s jurisdiction, we withdraw five thousand dollars from that account. That’ll solve the problem ... The Hispanic activists I’ve talked to say it’s crazy enough that it just might work..."



Eric The(Don'tAsk,Don'tTell...WhatHappenedToCurbTheFlow)Hun


Wouldn't the Coyotes just reimburse the generales?


The 'coyotes' would have to bump up their fees to at least more than $5,000.00, to pay off the Generals...



Eric The(Beancounting)Hun
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:19:21 AM EDT
Open fire.


Declare it year-round border-jumper season.
Infiltrate our borders illegally and you are a threat.
We neutralize the threat.
Problem solved.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:20:35 AM EDT

Originally Posted By pyro6988:
Simple


The same as DMZ between North and South Korea.



+1, There is no reason to speculate about how to prevent unauthorized border crossings. The experiment has already been done.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:21:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 10:22:57 AM EDT by Jon_C_]

Obviously many employers are aware they employ illegals--but many have no way of knowing. You'd be amazed how creative illegals are with such things as Social Security cards and such. It's very tough to document citizenship.


That is a very true statement. My roommate owns a nursery and deals with this with his employees. All of them have paperwork, even if he's sure they're illegals.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:22:39 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:26:56 AM EDT
There's a two-fold problem. 1. There are already a lot of illegal immigrants who've made it across and are living throughout the US. 2. There are more immigrants planning on entering the US.

A wall is very expensive and can be breeched since the US/Mexican border is very long. Even if immigrants get past the wall, there is nothing that's going to deport them as long as they don't commit any crimes, as is the case now.

My suggested solution, 1. Increase manpower in Immigration and Customs Enforcement and US Border Patrol. 2. Pass laws giving federal, state, and local law enforcement the power to deport illegal immigrants. 3. Deport Mexican illegal immigrants to the southern most location in Mexico. Deport all other illegal immigrants back to their country.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:27:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1:

Originally Posted By SPECTRE:
Why you fight this so hard is amazing to me.
I invite you to come spend some time here and we'll see how quickly your outlook changes.



You are simply misunderstanding my view. I absolutely DO NOT "fight this so hard." I absolutely LOATHE the invasion from the south. I hate every one of the POS fucks who invade this country--and would prefer to see them killed in the process of invading us--which would quickly end the invasion once word got out that those attempting to invade were dying in the process. Many times I have posted (including in my first post in THIS thread) what I would LIKE to see done--mine the border (cheap and VERY effective) and have MG nests every so often to get the ones who slip through the mines.

BUT--none of that is going to happen. Call me old and cynical but I've been active in politics for quite a few years and I have seen first hand the inertia and resistance to change found in every part of the government. This kind of thing--

Originally Posted By SPECTRE:
Just look at what the gov't takes from us each year.
It's a matter of spending it where its needed and cutting the pork.



. . . is nothing short of Polyanna pie-in-the-sky wishful thinking. NOTHING in the government gets cut or removed. NOTHING. The status quo is very firmly entrenched and is NOT going to go away--including the tolerance of illegals invading this country. My view is only realistic--not "fight(ing) this."



We agree that mines and machine guns would be effective but would never be used.
However, my suggestions would work as well and could be implemented with minimal effort and cost.
In the grand scheme of things building a wall isn't a big deal. Not even a wall, a good fence along with good enforcement and the technology aspect would do the trick.
Do those things and go after the employers who hire them, end the instant citizenship for babies and it would fix the problem.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:27:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By macman37:

Originally Posted By vsound:
I'm sure no one here will like my answer, but the solution is actually relatively simple.

Eliminate Welfare
Eliminate Medicaid/Medicare
Eliminate the minimum wage


That would change the dynamics such that the majority that would be interested in coming across the border would be those wanting to work for an honest living and not coming here to feed off the .gov teat. If they're willing to work for an honest living, who cares if they come here. Also, locals would be forced to get off their ass and work (even if it's for little money), thus filling in many of the jobs that are currently being taken by immigrants. The net effect would again reduce the number coming across because there would be less job opportunity for them.




That's a whole 'nother ball of wax right there!

Aside from the healthcare system, how would a non-resident "feed off the .gov teat"? Honest question, I don't know the answer to.

I agree with you FWIW, but it doesn't seem like the illegal immigrant Mexicans are the ones on the dole - correct me if I'm wrong. Many of the illegal immigrants are here to work, right? Bigger problems with "domestic" lower class individuals (not a racial thing, just the people who aren't working, white and black)



It's quite common that once they come here, they either get fake IDs so it looks like they're eligible, or they have kids within our borders so that they can then begin collecting welfare, unemployment, free schooling, free healthcare, etc.
If they get a job using fake IDs, then suddenly they become eligible for Medicare/Medicaid, which is free healthcare. If they are receiving paid-for insurance, then I don't have a problem with them using that, but the free stuff is what bothers me. If they lose the job, but have the fake IDs, then they can collect unemployment, welfare, etc.
Soon-to-be moms will come here, have the child (which makes them a citizen), then the mom and the child are suddenly eligible for welfare and free healthcare, etc.

Admittedly, I don't have statistics on the above, but I have a friend that's in the Border Patrol, and he relays these types of stories all the time.

True, there are many, many domestics on the dole. That's the flip side of the plan. If you eliminate the freebies, then they will have to go to work and will fill many of the job opportunities currently being taken by the immigrants. Without job opportunities or freebies, then the immigrants don't have the incentive to come...... no need for expensive walls and firepower.
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