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Posted: 1/24/2006 12:57:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2006 12:58:12 PM EDT by fight4yourrights]
Who gets the Lion's share of the blame?
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 12:57:47 PM EDT
Both.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:00:23 PM EDT
None of the above, it's Bush's fault.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:01:47 PM EDT
Both. No question.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:01:51 PM EDT
both - and the government.

You have a right to be in a union - I should have a right to say I don't want a unionized work force.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:04:52 PM EDT
Adam Smith
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:05:17 PM EDT
Both, plus the business environment here in the States.

1. Corporate bosses practically need dump trucks to deliver their salaries
2. Unions see this and ratchet up their demands accordingly
3. The cost of doing business is higher here than the third world.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:06:49 PM EDT
The Union for their greed and stubborness and the companies for either their unwillingness or inability to make cars that continually top the Japanese in reliability. The end results are cars that cost more than they should and don't perform as well as they could.

Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:06:56 PM EDT
Union
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:09:30 PM EDT






You have to be kidding me?


Reason? National Corporations...like GM, Ford, Pepsi, all of them that started out here are NOW "GLOBAL" Corporations.

They think GLOBALLY. This shit has been coming since the 1950's, but the American public was just too stupid to see it. GM is making designing cars here, that nobody want's to buy, for a REASON. The corporation wants to bust the Union, move it's manufacturing facilities overseas where they can use cheap labor and not have ANY of the enviromental laws to deal with...just pay off the local officials...and sell to a cheaply made car to a bunch of American dumbasses.

Reason why ALL manufacturing will go overseas and you'll see Americans standard of living go down...

1. Globalization by corporations that don't recognize nations anymore
2. Lawyers and unbelieveable law suits that award BILLIONS of dollars to a few people and it drives the cost of products up.
3. Government enviromental and safety laws, increasing the cost of EVERYTHING.
4. Greed and dumbass Americans that have to have it bigger and better than their parents and feel that the World owes them a "great" lifestyle. (I wanted more also. )
5. Stupid mis-management and greed by upper management.
6. Workers trying to get the most money out of the least amount of work.


Foreign car companies pay their employees almost as much as the big three union workers get. So "why" are the big three union employees to blame for all of this? What comes around, goes around...this shipping of jobs overseas will come back to bite the upper middle class, the middle class and everyone below. If you don't make $500,000 or have a business that deals with import/export, you eventually will be hurting too. American runs on it's ability to move and make things that move us, and when we get that shut down, everybodies screwed.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:19:36 PM EDT
Equal parts....dumbass union employees who want more than a company can give, fatcat corporate bigwigs who make sure they get their multi-million $$$ bonuses and percs no matter how bad they fuck up.

Now they can all stand in the unemployment line.

Maybe insolvency and bankruptcy can force them to do a 180...imagine that line workers getting paid commensurate to their job, and bigwigs who have to work and show results to make their paycheck. And then maybe vehicle costs may fall in line, instead of being artificially boosted by having to cover healthe insurance for a billion retirees....
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:20:16 PM EDT
Both the Unions and the company with some of the blame going to the government. It's obvious that the Unions got way too greedy, and deserve their share of the blame for the crappy quality and cost of American made cars. The auto makers also have designed, marketed and produced boring, over priced garbage and focused too much attention on things other than making cars. Instead of trying to solve their problems by building higher quality cars with interesting designs, they looked for a cheaper way to make the same old crap. Along comes NAFTA and now the auto makers can produce their shitty cars in Mexico cheaper.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:21:21 PM EDT
It's clearly management or lack of it. They can only manage two things, labor so they lay off and their own bank accounts, which they add to at every corner.

The CEO of Ford made 27 MILLION last year, his stock value went up 2 MILLION yesterday after the announced layoffs and closings.

He should be stripped of all his assests and thrown out on the streets and his wealth distributed to the ones who are going to lose their jobs.

Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:21:35 PM EDT
The market changed.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:22:41 PM EDT
Both + Government intrusion.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:25:35 PM EDT

Originally Posted By JohnnyP:

He should be stripped of all his assests and thrown out on the streets and his wealth distributed to the ones who are going to lose their jobs.




"Redistribute wealth".

Where have I heard that before?
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:28:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SHIVAN:
Both. No question.



+1 It definatly took two to tango here.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:30:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Old_Painless:

Originally Posted By JohnnyP:

He should be stripped of all his assests and thrown out on the streets and his wealth distributed to the ones who are going to lose their jobs.




"Redistribute wealth".

Where have I heard that before?



Comrade, everyone is equal in the Soviets eyes. Unless you are with the government.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:36:36 PM EDT

Clueless...absolutely clueless.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 1:49:55 PM EDT
Both. We have "imports" built in this country gaining market share, so it's not a quality of the American worker issue. Now, do those same plants have unions? I don't know. I do know that I got into a rental car today, a F-150, and the interior felt absolutely cheap. It reminded me of when I test drove a Colorado a couple of years ago. Contrast that with the Toyotas which just have the look and feel of being quality built cars and you start to understand why the market is moving towards the non-American owned companies.

Could it be the unions? Yeah, probably. Is it management? Yeah definitely. The market place is survival of the fittest and the big two are showing how out of shape they are.
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