Quoted: Great movie, but when the guy shoots himself in the head and it is "no big deal" I mean come on..........

He basically just shoots himslef through cheek.

Quoted: I felt the movie was awesome, a real mind bender. The concepts presented in the movie - not just the big ones - were excellent. .

The concepts?  The concepts are basically this:

That men can't be held responsible for their debts and their actions because society trains them to hitch their wagons to women who will screw everything up, and advertising forces them to make credit card purchases that they shouldn't have to pay off.  That doing a fair days labor for pay is demeaning and beneath the true goal of glory in men:  hunting/gathering.

That gratuitous violence is the only language men can truly share.  Everything else is a construct of the society that 'owns' them.

That our society will be better when we've abandoned civilization and technology and gone back to a tribal hunter/gatherer society where the strong hunters flourish.  Example quote "I look forward to the day when men dry the hides of deer on I94 in the shadow of the sears tower"

I loved watching the movie, have it, and watch it every now and then since the imagery is intoxicating.  When Brad Pitt walks into the bar with his red leather coat on and people start following him into the basement... that's strong male comradarie that is appealing to anyone.    However, as muddled and silly as the messages in fight club turn out to be, It can't be considered a great movie.

Quoted: Very interesting movie, but I don't want to watch it again.  Too fucking sadistically brutal.  I don't feel like subjecting myself to that again.

I didnt notice. Its nothing like Resevoure dogs, Pulp fiction, American History X, Saw, The Devils Rejects, Hostel, ect when it comes to "brutality"

Quoted: Quoted: I felt the movie was awesome, a real mind bender. The concepts presented in the movie - not just the big ones - were excellent. . The concepts?  The concepts are basically this: That men can't be held responsible for their debts and their actions because society trains them to hitch their wagons to women who will screw everything up, and advertising forces them to make credit card purchases that they shouldn't have to pay off.  That doing a fair days labor for pay is demeaning and beneath the true goal of glory in men:  hunting/gathering. That gratuitous violence is the only language men can truly share.  Everything else is a construct of the society that 'owns' them. That our society will be better when we've abandoned civilization and technology and gone back to a tribal hunter/gatherer society where the strong hunters flourish.  Example quote "I look forward to the day when men dry the hides of deer on I94 in the shadow of the sears tower" I loved watching the movie, have it, and watch it every now and then since the imagery is intoxicating.  When Brad Pitt walks into the bar with his red leather coat on and people start following him into the basement... that's strong male comradarie that is appealing to anyone.    However, as muddled and silly as the messages in fight club turn out to be, It can't be considered a great movie.

Part of the point is that both the wussie Narrator and the violent character Tyler Durden are not whole people. Only when both sides of the personality are reconciled with eacy other does the movie end.

Quoted: Quoted: I felt the movie was awesome, a real mind bender. The concepts presented in the movie - not just the big ones - were excellent. . The concepts?  The concepts are basically this: That men can't be held responsible for their debts and their actions because society trains them to hitch their wagons to women who will screw everything up, and advertising forces them to make credit card purchases that they shouldn't have to pay off.  That doing a fair days labor for pay is demeaning and beneath the true goal of glory in men:  hunting/gathering. That gratuitous violence is the only language men can truly share.  Everything else is a construct of the society that 'owns' them. That our society will be better when we've abandoned civilization and technology and gone back to a tribal hunter/gatherer society where the strong hunters flourish.  Example quote "I look forward to the day when men dry the hides of deer on I94 in the shadow of the sears tower" I loved watching the movie, have it, and watch it every now and then since the imagery is intoxicating.  When Brad Pitt walks into the bar with his red leather coat on and people start following him into the basement... that's strong male comradarie that is appealing to anyone.    However, as muddled and silly as the messages in fight club turn out to be, It can't be considered a great movie.

You're a real "glass is half empty" kind of guy aren't you?




For me, I took away different notions from the movie and considered the characters presented as deliberately distorted caricatures.

Quoted: Quoted: I felt the movie was awesome, a real mind bender. The concepts presented in the movie - not just the big ones - were excellent. . The concepts?  The concepts are basically this: That men can't be held responsible for their debts and their actions because society trains them to hitch their wagons to women who will screw everything up, and advertising forces them to make credit card purchases that they shouldn't have to pay off.  That doing a fair days labor for pay is demeaning and beneath the true goal of glory in men:  hunting/gathering. That gratuitous violence is the only language men can truly share.  Everything else is a construct of the society that 'owns' them. That our society will be better when we've abandoned civilization and technology and gone back to a tribal hunter/gatherer society where the strong hunters flourish.  Example quote "I look forward to the day when men dry the hides of deer on I94 in the shadow of the sears tower" I loved watching the movie, have it, and watch it every now and then since the imagery is intoxicating.  When Brad Pitt walks into the bar with his red leather coat on and people start following him into the basement... that's strong male comradarie that is appealing to anyone.    However, as muddled and silly as the messages in fight club turn out to be, It can't be considered a great movie.

Um, didn't you get the memo that Tyler Durden is INSANE?  

"You're too old and you're tits are too big"

I liked the book but I still think they could have done alot better in certain parts of the movie. I love the movie and all, but it's no where near my top 20 list.

You're too... uh... uh...  BLONDE!!!!

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I felt the movie was awesome, a real mind bender. The concepts presented in the movie - not just the big ones - were excellent. . The concepts?  The concepts are basically this: That men can't be held responsible for their debts and their actions because society trains them to hitch their wagons to women who will screw everything up, and advertising forces them to make credit card purchases that they shouldn't have to pay off.  That doing a fair days labor for pay is demeaning and beneath the true goal of glory in men:  hunting/gathering. That gratuitous violence is the only language men can truly share.  Everything else is a construct of the society that 'owns' them. That our society will be better when we've abandoned civilization and technology and gone back to a tribal hunter/gatherer society where the strong hunters flourish.  Example quote "I look forward to the day when men dry the hides of deer on I94 in the shadow of the sears tower" I loved watching the movie, have it, and watch it every now and then since the imagery is intoxicating.  When Brad Pitt walks into the bar with his red leather coat on and people start following him into the basement... that's strong male comradarie that is appealing to anyone.    However, as muddled and silly as the messages in fight club turn out to be, It can't be considered a great movie. Um, didn't you get the memo that Tyler Durden is INSANE?

I did.  However, the people who consider the ideas of the movie excellent and compelling aren't paying enough attention, in my opinion.

Quoted: You're a real "glass is half empty" kind of guy aren't you? For me, I took away different notions from the movie and considered the characters presented as deliberately distorted caricatures.

I agree in principle that one could construe the radical, anarchist bullying and assault  in the movie as simply a 'strange period' in the main characters life, and that the ideas expressed by the tyler durden character as part of this abberation.  He does seem dismayed at the end when 'where is my mind' is playing in the background and the buildings are falling, as if he realizes that he's gone too far.   There isn't much else in the way of ideas or concepts that the movie is about, though.
The ideas and concepts of the movie, besides the somewhat interersting and intricate interlaced delusional split, are essentially a cesspool of vile trash tarted up and presented as cool.  If you keep that in mind, it's an enjoyable ride.

Quoted: Quoted: You're a real "glass is half empty" kind of guy aren't you? For me, I took away different notions from the movie and considered the characters presented as deliberately distorted caricatures. I agree in principle that one could construe the radical, anarchist bullying and assault  in the movie as simply a 'strange period' in the main characters life, and that the ideas expressed by the tyler durden character as part of this abberation.  He does seem dismayed at the end when 'where is my mind' is playing in the background and the buildings are falling, as if he realizes that he's gone too far.   There isn't much else in the way of ideas or concepts that the movie is about, though. The ideas and concepts of the movie, besides the somewhat interersting and intricate interlaced delusional split, are essentially a cesspool of vile trash tarted up and presented as cool.  If you keep that in mind, it's an enjoyable ride.

as for ideas and concepts, there was a lot of buzz regarding the nietzche/schopenhauer influence uopn the film.  while significant, i think this pales before the freudian ideas. with that in mind, can you provide me with a better dramatic example of the battle between the id and the superego?

Quoted: as for ideas and concepts, there was a lot of buzz regarding the nietzche/schopenhauer influence uopn the film.  while significant, i think this pales before the freudian ideas. with that in mind, can you provide me with a better dramatic example of the battle between the id and the superego?

That's a good question.  However, I don't think there is a clearly demarcated difference between the two psyches, and that the id/superego analogy is flawed in this case.  Certainly the tyler durden character would appear to be the ID, but the main character engages in behavior that is manifestly not based on previous influences in his life, ie, beating someone to disfigurement, performing so poorly at work as to need to resort to blackmail.

Also, I think I can find a better dramatic battle between the ID and superego, and one that fits more acceptably into the definitions of these:  The scene in Superman III where clark kent fights with evil, drunk, lascivious superman.  While an implausible literal example of this fight, the characterizations were spot on.

Fight Club the movie is far better than Fight Club the book.

I've watched Fight Club hundreds of times - never gets old.

That's a good question.  However, I don't think there is a clearly demarcated difference between the two psyches, and that the id/superego analogy is flawed in this case.  Certainly the tyler durden character would appear to be the ID, but the main character engages in behavior that is manifestly not based on previous influences in his life, ie, beating someone to disfigurement, performing so poorly at work as to need to resort to blackmail. Also, I think I can find a better dramatic battle between the ID and superego, and one that fits more acceptably into the definitions of these:  The scene in Superman III where clark kent fights with evil, drunk, lascivious superman.  While an implausible literal example of this fight, the characterizations were spot on.

superman III is an interesting example, but i would be inclined to view the image of superego as clark kent rather than superman.  i would say instead that superman is the ego--the actualized self.  and as kent is merely a guise, the analogy would be rather imperfect.

my interpretation of FC is that the narrator represents the superego (ethics vice morals) up until he first meets tyler, the unbound id.  at the point of the psychological split, the narrator becomes the ego--the battleground upon which the id and the superego fight. to my way of thinking, the behaviors exhibited by the narrator (blackmail, rage) actually represent the integration of the latent "pitt/id" facet into the previously "norton/superego" dominated ego.  in other words, the split is the beginning of reintegration.

[edit:  tags]

--i was expecting something wierd, but not that messed up

If the guys arguing the point of the film listen to the audio track with Edward Norton, he describes it as what happens when frat boys drink too much beer and read Nietzsche. Tyler Durden isn't insane because he doesn't exist. He's a manifestation of the narrator's insanity.

Quoted: Quoted: Um, didn't you get the memo that Tyler Durden is INSANE?   No, technicallly unknown (Cornelious?) is insane.

I think you missed the point. Unknown, Narrator, Jack, Cornelius... he IS Tyler Durden.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Um, didn't you get the memo that Tyler Durden is INSANE?   No, technicallly unknown (Cornelious?) is insane. I think you missed the point. Unknown, Narrator, Jack, Cornelius... he IS Tyler Durden. No, I think you missed the quote from the movie.   Tyler tells hat to unknown. Unknown "You're insane!" TYler "No.  technically, you're insane"

"You won this time... but I'll be back!!!"

Well, I gotta tell you: I'd be very, very careful who you talk to about that, because the person who wrote that... is dangerous.And this button-down, Oxford-cloth psycho might just snap, and then stalk from office to office with an Armalite AR-10 carbine gas-powered semi-automatic weapon, pumping round after round into colleagues and co-workers. This might be someone you've known for years. Someone very, very close to you.

my personal fave film of all time.....

"I am Jacks smirking revenge!"




[bartender] Uhhhhhhh is this a test?

[Jack] Your an idiot!

Quoted: Well, I gotta tell you: I'd be very, very careful who you talk to about that, because the person who wrote that... is dangerous.And this button-down, Oxford-cloth psycho might just snap, and then stalk from office to office with an Armalite AR-10 carbine gas-powered semi-automatic weapon, pumping round after round into colleagues and co-workers. This might be someone you've known for years. Someone very, very close to you. my personal fave film of all time.....

I can't believe it took 3 pages for someone to post that.

I remember my wife saying "Hey, you have an Armalite don't you?"

"Working jobs we hate to buy shit we don't need."

Quoted: to my way of thinking, the behaviors exhibited by the narrator (blackmail, rage) actually represent the integration of the latent "pitt/id" facet into the previously "norton/superego" dominated ego.  in other words, the split is the beginning of reintegration. [edit:  tags]

That's the first thing I've heard that seems to give the film a sense of dramatic purpose beyond titillation, even while its social themes remain inane and silly.