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Posted: 1/11/2006 4:30:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/11/2006 4:31:28 PM EDT by XDBACKUPGUN]
AK-47's and the SKS are state of the art weapons.



The show that just got over was all about evil ASSAULT weapons.



The show that is on right now...they are going after a gang armed with ASSAULT rifles.

Link Posted: 1/11/2006 4:31:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/11/2006 4:31:59 PM EDT by FieroLoki]
Something new? Or reruns?
Link Posted: 1/11/2006 4:34:37 PM EDT
Same episodes as last week.

I didnt get an anti-gun feel off of it. Just guys commenting on the weapons being encountered. Notice the Ak they were firing on the range was select-fire?
Link Posted: 1/11/2006 4:58:37 PM EDT
The officer claimed the evil AK had a 50 rd magazine
Link Posted: 1/11/2006 5:00:37 PM EDT
To much talking not enough action.
Link Posted: 1/11/2006 6:04:15 PM EDT
I want an SKS that can fire 600 rpm! and they called an SKS an Ak at least twice
Link Posted: 1/11/2006 6:09:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:
I want an SKS that can fire 600 rpm! and they called an SKS an Ak at least twice



And a SKS that fires AP ammo that is bought at the local store.
Link Posted: 1/11/2006 6:10:29 PM EDT
At least it's better that watching Dr. Phil or some BS like that.
Link Posted: 1/11/2006 7:09:29 PM EDT
Never hide your AK under your mattress, the Popo will always find it there
Link Posted: 1/11/2006 7:14:05 PM EDT
It is VERY anti-gun. I thought it would be a cool show, but I was wrong. Just whining about guns. Also, they repeatedly called an SKS modified to have a detachable 40 round magazine an AK-47. Its bad, but you get to see lots of windows break.
Link Posted: 1/11/2006 7:49:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bad_Aim:
It is VERY anti-gun. I thought it would be a cool show, but I was wrong. Just whining about guns. Also, they repeatedly called an SKS modified to have a detachable 40 round magazine an AK-47. Its bad, but you get to see lots of windows break.



It was worse than that, I'm fucking pissed at this shit.

It was a complete lie, they kept saying that the AK's and SKS the found were capable of firing 600 rpm, and then showed some guy shooing a F/A AK tearing up a brick wall, giving the impression that this is what those POS rifles they confiscated could do.

Then they found some crappy Mac 10 or something, and the cop claimed that it was a machine pistol that could spray bullets and just clean a room. To demonstrate this they had some guy firing a G18 at a bunch of water bottles, giving the impression that this crappy pistol with awful sights was a death machine.

I'm never watching this shit again.
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 6:43:05 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MudBug:

Originally Posted By Bad_Aim:
It is VERY anti-gun. I thought it would be a cool show, but I was wrong. Just whining about guns. Also, they repeatedly called an SKS modified to have a detachable 40 round magazine an AK-47. Its bad, but you get to see lots of windows break.



It was worse than that, I'm fucking pissed at this shit.

It was a complete lie, they kept saying that the AK's and SKS the found were capable of firing 600 rpm, and then showed some guy shooing a F/A AK tearing up a brick wall, giving the impression that this is what those POS rifles they confiscated could do.

Then they found some crappy Mac 10 or something, and the cop claimed that it was a machine pistol that could spray bullets and just clean a room. To demonstrate this they had some guy firing a G18 at a bunch of water bottles, giving the impression that this crappy pistol with awful sights was a death machine.

I'm never watching this shit again.




+1 here. Very anti gun show, and they selectively edit to show weapons in a negative light.

Did anyone else notice that this is the second week in a row where a Hi-Point 9mm carbine was seized in a raid?

In this weeks episode, the carbine was covered in camo tape (or shrink wrap), and the voice over from the JBT (trying to sound official, I love it when they do that) states " that is a 9mm Shoulder fired gun" - clearly, he did not know what it was.

Gotta love the hi-point. Dunham's in Michigan had them for sale in December for $140.00

Looks like, in Texas, the hi-point is the new TEC 9.
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 6:46:30 AM EDT
I caught it last week. Sensationalist. It makes for good TV, I suppose. I can't watch it. The anti-gun innueondos were over the top.
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 6:48:24 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DAC_2141:

Originally Posted By MudBug:

Originally Posted By Bad_Aim:
It is VERY anti-gun. I thought it would be a cool show, but I was wrong. Just whining about guns. Also, they repeatedly called an SKS modified to have a detachable 40 round magazine an AK-47. Its bad, but you get to see lots of windows break.



It was worse than that, I'm fucking pissed at this shit.

It was a complete lie, they kept saying that the AK's and SKS the found were capable of firing 600 rpm, and then showed some guy shooing a F/A AK tearing up a brick wall, giving the impression that this is what those POS rifles they confiscated could do.

Then they found some crappy Mac 10 or something, and the cop claimed that it was a machine pistol that could spray bullets and just clean a room. To demonstrate this they had some guy firing a G18 at a bunch of water bottles, giving the impression that this crappy pistol with awful sights was a death machine.

I'm never watching this shit again.




+1 here. Very anti gun show, and they selectively edit to show weapons in a negative light.

Did anyone else notice that this is the second week in a row where a Hi-Point 9mm carbine was seized in a raid?

In this weeks episode, the carbine was covered in camo tape (or shrink wrap), and the voice over from the JBT (trying to sound official, I love it when they do that) states " that is a 9mm Shoulder fired gun" - clearly, he did not know what it was.

Gotta love the hi-point. Dunham's in Michigan had them for sale in December for $140.00

Looks like, in Texas, the hi-point is the new TEC 9.

- I simply dont see the "anti-gun" message. Maybe my tinfoil isnt on tight enough.

As for the HiPoint carbines, those things are all over the place. We had a crack house hit here where the house owner had stashed one beside his drive way in case he needed to throw rounds at someone and dint have a pistol or something else on him.
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 6:49:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By XDBACKUPGUN:
AK-47's and the SKS are state of the art weapons.




They are weapons based on a military design that is, by the way, still in use. The SKS qualifies as a collector's piece, but the AK is still in use as an active combat weapon by many of the world's forces.



The show that just got over was all about evil ASSAULT weapons.



The show that is on right now...they are going after a gang armed with ASSAULT rifles.




Perhaps it was.

But there aren't many cops who relish the thought of going against bad guys armed with weapons that can defeat the vast majority of body armor.

Some take that fear to unhealthy extremes and support gun control.

Most don't.
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 6:50:25 AM EDT

Originally Posted By 1371:
The officer claimed the evil AK had a 50 rd magazine



There is such a thing as a 40 round mag for the AK, as well as a drum magazine that holds 75 rounds.
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 6:50:38 AM EDT

Originally Posted By NCPatrolAR:

Originally Posted By DAC_2141:

Originally Posted By MudBug:

Originally Posted By Bad_Aim:
It is VERY anti-gun. I thought it would be a cool show, but I was wrong. Just whining about guns. Also, they repeatedly called an SKS modified to have a detachable 40 round magazine an AK-47. Its bad, but you get to see lots of windows break.



It was worse than that, I'm fucking pissed at this shit.

It was a complete lie, they kept saying that the AK's and SKS the found were capable of firing 600 rpm, and then showed some guy shooing a F/A AK tearing up a brick wall, giving the impression that this is what those POS rifles they confiscated could do.

Then they found some crappy Mac 10 or something, and the cop claimed that it was a machine pistol that could spray bullets and just clean a room. To demonstrate this they had some guy firing a G18 at a bunch of water bottles, giving the impression that this crappy pistol with awful sights was a death machine.

I'm never watching this shit again.




+1 here. Very anti gun show, and they selectively edit to show weapons in a negative light.

Did anyone else notice that this is the second week in a row where a Hi-Point 9mm carbine was seized in a raid?

In this weeks episode, the carbine was covered in camo tape (or shrink wrap), and the voice over from the JBT (trying to sound official, I love it when they do that) states " that is a 9mm Shoulder fired gun" - clearly, he did not know what it was.

Gotta love the hi-point. Dunham's in Michigan had them for sale in December for $140.00

Looks like, in Texas, the hi-point is the new TEC 9.

- I simply dont see the "anti-gun" message. Maybe my tinfoil isnt on tight enough.

As for the HiPoint carbines, those things are all over the place. We had a crack house hit here where the house owner had stashed one beside his drive way in case he needed to throw rounds at someone and dint have a pistol or something else on him.



You must have missed the AK variant at the range busting up cinder block, with the officer commenting "Honestly, these are weapons of war. I don't see why anybody needs to own these".
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 6:52:09 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SubnetMask:

Originally Posted By NCPatrolAR:

Originally Posted By DAC_2141:

Originally Posted By MudBug:

Originally Posted By Bad_Aim:
It is VERY anti-gun. I thought it would be a cool show, but I was wrong. Just whining about guns. Also, they repeatedly called an SKS modified to have a detachable 40 round magazine an AK-47. Its bad, but you get to see lots of windows break.



It was worse than that, I'm fucking pissed at this shit.

It was a complete lie, they kept saying that the AK's and SKS the found were capable of firing 600 rpm, and then showed some guy shooing a F/A AK tearing up a brick wall, giving the impression that this is what those POS rifles they confiscated could do.

Then they found some crappy Mac 10 or something, and the cop claimed that it was a machine pistol that could spray bullets and just clean a room. To demonstrate this they had some guy firing a G18 at a bunch of water bottles, giving the impression that this crappy pistol with awful sights was a death machine.

I'm never watching this shit again.




+1 here. Very anti gun show, and they selectively edit to show weapons in a negative light.

Did anyone else notice that this is the second week in a row where a Hi-Point 9mm carbine was seized in a raid?

In this weeks episode, the carbine was covered in camo tape (or shrink wrap), and the voice over from the JBT (trying to sound official, I love it when they do that) states " that is a 9mm Shoulder fired gun" - clearly, he did not know what it was.

Gotta love the hi-point. Dunham's in Michigan had them for sale in December for $140.00

Looks like, in Texas, the hi-point is the new TEC 9.

- I simply dont see the "anti-gun" message. Maybe my tinfoil isnt on tight enough.

As for the HiPoint carbines, those things are all over the place. We had a crack house hit here where the house owner had stashed one beside his drive way in case he needed to throw rounds at someone and dint have a pistol or something else on him.



You must have missed the AK variant at the range busting up cinder block, with the officer commenting "Honestly, these are weapons of war. I don't see why anybody needs to own these".

- I saw the guy firing the select fire Ak at the range, but I must have missed the part where he said that. However, one comment doesnt make a show "anti-gun". Atleast to me it doesnt
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 7:00:07 AM EDT
NC PatrolAR -

Hey, I'm not trying to bash you, and you have a right to your opinion.

What I see is a show that is pro-Law enforcement. However, the show does sensationalize guns, especially those in the hands of anyone but law enforcement. I offer the demonstration of the fully auto glock, and the full auto sks/AK47 shooting cinder blocks as evidence.

There is a subtle message of "unless you are a Swat officer, then you should not have a gun" in this show.

There is a producer or someone on this show with an anti-gun agenda.

Link Posted: 1/12/2006 7:03:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DAC_2141:
NC PatrolAR -

Hey, I'm not trying to bash you, and you have a right to your opinion.

What I see is a show that is pro-Law enforcement. However, the show does sensationalize guns, especially those in the hands of anyone but law enforcement. I offer the demonstration of the fully auto glock, and the full auto sks/AK47 shooting cinder blocks as evidence.

There is a subtle message of "unless you are a Swat officer, then you should not have a gun" in this show.

There is a producer or someone on this show with an anti-gun agenda.


- Of course the show is going to be pro-law enforcement. And considering what the show is about, of course there is going to be a focus on firearms in the hands on criminals.

Far as the AK goes, I believe it was stated that it was taken off a suspect.
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 7:06:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By NCPatrolAR:
I simply dont see the "anti-gun" message. Maybe my tinfoil isnt on tight enough.




You gotta be kidding me, they intentionally try to mislead the people watching into thinking that the SKS's, and AK's they get are capapble of accurate fire out to 300 yards and can fire 600 rpm. That is what they said, and what the spliced in video of the F/A AK chewing up a brick wall was meant to portray.

They did the same thing with the Mac 10, a fucking turd of a pistol. The cop at the scene said it was a machine pistol capable of spraying bullets and cleaning a room, then to solidify that they splice in the film of a G18 spraying bullets at bottles filled with RED colored water.

This was anti gun propoganda film making that would make Leni Riefenstahl proud.
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 7:07:09 AM EDT

Originally Posted By NCPatrolAR:
I saw the guy firing the select fire Ak at the range, but I must have missed the part where he said that. However, one comment doesnt make a show "anti-gun". Atleast to me it doesnt



Then there were the comments that overstated the capabilities of the weapons, the recovered MAC-10 that somehow transformed into a G18 while being demonstrated, painting cinder block red (looked like a brick wall, but it wasn't) to show the "destructive power" of an "assult rifle" (anything will crumble cinder block), suggesting that an SKS could fire 600rpm, and calling one SKS an AK (not so much anti-gun as stupid, I suppose).

The show itself wasn't intended to be an anti-gun piece. It's about Texas SWAT teams. I wholly accept that people don't want to watch hours of unedited footage, while the guys go over mundane details at the station. I understand what watching a bunch of guys sitting at desks filling out MOUNDS of paperwork after each raid sucks. The show needs to be exciting. One way of doing that (unfortunately) is to sensationalize the guns - both those carried by SWAT and those carried by the bad guys. It makes for good TV, but someone not accustomed to being around these types of weapons WILL get the wrong idea, absent any other knowledge. I know. I used to be one of them.
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 7:10:05 AM EDT
I would love to see someone put 600 rounds through the barrel of an SKS or AK in a minute.


Link Posted: 1/12/2006 7:24:15 AM EDT



What is the big deal on the rate of fire for an Ak being listed as 600 rpm? Afterall, thats what it is
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 7:40:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By NCPatrolAR:


What is the big deal on the rate of fire for an Ak being listed as 600 rpm? Afterall, thats what it is



I can't pull my finger that fast.
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 7:41:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MudBug:

Originally Posted By NCPatrolAR:


What is the big deal on the rate of fire for an Ak being listed as 600 rpm? Afterall, thats what it is



I can't pull my finger that fast.



Jerk off less.
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 7:43:13 AM EDT

Originally Posted By NCPatrolAR:

Originally Posted By MudBug:

Originally Posted By NCPatrolAR:


What is the big deal on the rate of fire for an Ak being listed as 600 rpm? Afterall, thats what it is



I can't pull my finger that fast.



Jerk off less.



Link Posted: 1/12/2006 7:47:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/12/2006 7:47:45 AM EDT by SubnetMask]

Originally Posted By NCPatrolAR:


What is the big deal on the rate of fire for an Ak being listed as 600 rpm? Afterall, thats what it is



Well, since this is a site full of gun enthusiasts, we like to nit-pick a little. Assuming a select-fire, it has a cyclic rate of 600rpm. It wouldn't actually FIRE 600 rounds inside of 60 seconds, however. In the end, I concede that it's probably too much to ask that the officer state "cyclic rate".
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 5:46:13 PM EDT
No shit...He stated 50....not 40 or 75
Link Posted: 1/22/2006 6:37:54 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/22/2006 8:24:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2006 8:27:37 PM EDT by Brass_Belcher]
Just saw the tail end of this show. First let me say hats off to the Swat team for busting those scumbags. Unfortunately, this show was extremely anti-gun, and I don't see how anyone could miss that.

I found it ironic that a channel called Court-TV would try and spread this propaganda and lies. Courts are supposed to be factual and unbiased, guess this one just isn't. They are actually violating law by broadcasting false information. NBC was guilty of this, and I believe fined, right before the "assault" weapons ban where they would show footage of machine guns, and try to say these were the weapons that the ban would affect.

First thing I noticed was where the idiots say the AK and SKS fire 600rds per minute. Obviously there is no SKS or semi-auto AK-style weapon that fires 600rds per minute. Then, splicing the full-auto footage, and trying to make the statement that the guns they confiscated could do that was nothing short of anti-gun propaganda, trying to fool and sway opinion of the common uniformed person. Why the hell else would they be showing machine gun footage of totally different weapons?

Another thing I noticed was where one guy calls the SKS a "nasty weapon" that fires a "nasty round". Well I wonder where that guy stands on the issue? I guess deer rifle rounds and buckshot must be really "nasty" according to that guy.

Crap like this show needs to stop. I won't be watching this garbage any more, and I resent the fact they use Texas in their name. I'd urge fellow ARFCOM members (even better if your are SWAT) to send Court-TV a quick email letting them know they have their facts wrong and that you are upset about them spreading misinformation.
Link Posted: 1/23/2006 3:23:38 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Brass_Belcher:
First thing I noticed was where the idiots say the AK and SKS fire 600rds per minute. Obviously there is no SKS or semi-auto AK-style weapon that fires 600rds per minute.



That is only true if you don't know what a rounds per minute rating is.

You seem to think that it requires the weapon to be capable of firing 600 un-interrupted rounds in a minute. That is not true. The rate of fire of the average AK-47 IS around 600 rounds a minute, because every military organization and weapons manufacturer rates the RPM of the weapon by how fast it can empty a magazine. The P-90, for instance is rated around 900 rounds per minute. It has that rating because of the speed with which it cycles in fully automatic fire.

Because the P-90's magazine only holds 50 rounds and thus would depend on reloads which are going to be different from individual to individual, it is more standard and practical to use a figure based on the consistent rate at which the weapon cycles in fully automatic mode.




Then, splicing the full-auto footage, and trying to make the statement that the guns they confiscated could do that was nothing short of anti-gun propaganda, trying to fool and sway opinion of the common uniformed person. Why the hell else would they be showing machine gun footage of totally different weapons?



Perhaps because they were trying to indicate the way a machine pistol fires?? They obviously could not take a weapon that has yet to be used as evidence in court out to the range and zip away with it. It is entirely possible that the Ingram-like .45 caliber pistol they showed was fully automatic, but it is more likely that it wasn't.

I didn't see any intent to deceive in showing a Glock 18 firing when talking about machine pistols in general. Machine pistols ARE meant to hose down a small area.




Another thing I noticed was where one guy calls the SKS a "nasty weapon" that fires a "nasty round". Well I wonder where that guy stands on the issue? I guess deer rifle rounds and buckshot must be really "nasty" according to that guy.



The SKS is a semi-automatic weapon that fires an armor defeating 7.62x39mm round from a 10 to 40 round magazine. That makes it capable of dealing out a great deal of pain in a relatively short order. That makes it a nasty weapon. It's status as a nasty weapon is why I will soon buy one. While it will be a plinker for me, I can press it into service as a defensive weapon if the need arises.

Police usually define a "nasty" weapon as one that is capable of defeating their body armor. While a bolt action .30-06 is capable of defeating body armor, it isn't going to allow you to zap multiple officers in as short an order as something like a semi-auto AK or SKS will.



Crap like this show needs to stop. I won't be watching this garbage any more, and I resent the fact they use Texas in their name. I'd urge fellow ARFCOM members (even better if your are SWAT) to send Court-TV a quick email letting them know they have their facts wrong and that you are upset about them spreading misinformation.



I watched the episodes and saw no deliberate anti-gun agenda.
Link Posted: 1/23/2006 3:25:40 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Zhukov:
FWIW - from their perspective, any gun in the hands of a bad guy is bad news. I can understand why they're worried about them. Talking to Jeff last month at our kids' Tae-Kwon-Do class, he doesn't seem to mind private class III ownership. Same weapons in the hands of bad guys is another story.



And that is the point.

Police officers, when speaking on weapons, are usually speaking in the context of the people they deal with day to day.

SWAT cops don't deal with law abiding citizens on a daily basis. They are going after the worst of the worst. A VEPR-II in the hands of someone the SWAT team is going after is something they worry about. The same weapon in my hands doesn't concern them because I won't be using it to do battle with SWAT cops.
Link Posted: 1/23/2006 9:14:53 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Zhukov:
Just remembered this thread when I finally saw a couple of episodes. The guy that's the spokesman for Austin SWAT (Jeff Crawford) was my son's first soccer coach from a couple of years ago. He lives like a 5 minute walk just down the street and we see them every once in a while. Actually a real nice guy. Too weird to see someone on TV that you know.

FWIW - from their perspective, any gun in the hands of a bad guy is bad news. I can understand why they're worried about them. Talking to Jeff last month at our kids' Tae-Kwon-Do class, he doesn't seem to mind private class IIINFA ownership. Same weapons in the hands of bad guys is another story.



CLASS III is a DEALER not a weapon.
They are NFA WEAPONS.
Link Posted: 1/23/2006 9:24:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DAC_2141:
NC PatrolAR -

Hey, I'm not trying to bash you, and you have a right to your opinion.

What I see is a show that is pro-Law enforcement. However, the show does sensationalize guns, especially those in the hands of anyone but law enforcement. I offer the demonstration of the fully auto glock, and the full auto sks/AK47 shooting cinder blocks as evidence.

There is a subtle message of "unless you are a Swat officer, then you should not have a gun" in this show.

There is a producer or someone on this show with an anti-gun agenda.




I agree.. as a police officer, this show implies that the only cops willing or able to go after the bad guys are the ones in matching swat gear,,, how un-true... Most of the swat guys with my dept. are squared away guys you'd want watching your back. But, this elite unit of bravery bullshit is over the top... Of course the producers of the show build it up to be that way so I don't blame the officers for comments taken out of context...
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