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Posted: 1/3/2006 12:03:54 AM EDT
Ok. I know that muzzle flash is caused by unburnt powder being burnt outside of the barrel but does anyone have any more info on it?

Also, I really would like to make one of my rifles a flame thrower just for fun. How do they do it in Hollywood? The guns on TV have massive flames!! Is there any wya to enhance it without just adding more powder to the case? Any help is appreciated.

Kris
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:07:03 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:19:08 AM EDT
tag
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:21:32 AM EDT
Why not build a flamethrower?


Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:22:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By shop_rat45:
How do they do it in Hollywood? The guns on TV have massive flames!!
Kris



Havent you seen Point Break? Get a lighter and a gas hose...
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:30:31 AM EDT
The shorter the barrel the bigger the flame, i'm building an ak with a 7 inch barrel, once its done we'll meet up at the pit at dusk and have some fun with it. Joe
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:34:53 AM EDT
There was some video a while back on here, these guys were making light loads for the .44 mag and they had like 12 foot long muzzle flashes, it was great. 180-gr bullets is all i remember. There is also a "flash enhancer" that I just read about the other day in the full auto forum. SOme classIII guy makes them.

Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:36:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By motorcityman:
The shorter the barrel the bigger the flame, i'm building an ak with a 7 inch barrel, once its done we'll meet up at the pit at dusk and have some fun with it. Joe



Think .357mag with a 2" barrel.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:39:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Mauser101:
Think .357mag with a 2" barrel.



True brother but rethink 7.62x39 and a 100rd drum bump firing.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:43:57 AM EDT

Originally Posted By shop_rat45:
Ok. I know that muzzle flash is caused by unburnt powder being burnt outside of the barrel but does anyone have any more info on it?

Also, I really would like to make one of my rifles a flame thrower just for fun. How do they do it in Hollywood? The guns on TV have massive flames!! Is there any wya to enhance it without just adding more powder to the case? Any help is appreciated.

Kris


Remember what Marlon Brando said about Hollywierd, "everything is bullshit, bullshit." With that said, the guns they use fire blanks, with I believe bit of flashpowder to enhance the muzzle flash.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:50:27 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:56:26 AM EDT
Can you use a slower burning powder to increase the flash? I remember reading on another forum about someone reloading for a 45/70 pistol with IMR 7828, and it had a huge flash. He claimed the flash would hit the paper 10 feet away. Of course a group of posts about how nice a self-defense round that would be. If the bullet doesn't get him, you'll light his clothes on fire or scare him to death.z
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 1:07:05 AM EDT
Yep, slower powder and/or shorter barrel.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 1:10:50 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/3/2006 1:12:21 AM EDT by Maggot]
some hollywood weapons use a propane thing to make muzzle flash.

There is a link somewhere with a m1919 .30 cal with like a 12 inch barrel, it's awesome.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 11:43:18 AM EDT
why don't you send your question to the Gunny on mail call !!! I am sure he will have the appropiate answer for you !!!!
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 11:48:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By warlord:

Originally Posted By shop_rat45:
Ok. I know that muzzle flash is caused by unburnt powder being burnt outside of the barrel but does anyone have any more info on it?

Also, I really would like to make one of my rifles a flame thrower just for fun. How do they do it in Hollywood? The guns on TV have massive flames!! Is there any wya to enhance it without just adding more powder to the case? Any help is appreciated.

Kris


Remember what Marlon Brando said about Hollywierd, "everything is bullshit, bullshit." With that said, the guns they use fire blanks, with I believe bit of flashpowder to enhance the muzzle flash.



Somebody in the movie forum said that they use a lot of extra gun powder in their blanks too for the big flashes. I'm not sure how true that is, but take it with a grain of salt. They said it in the movie gun cliche thread in response to me saying that the huge flashes aren't always doctored (there is test video of the FX crew for Aliens testing various weapons for large muzzle flashes).
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 11:54:13 AM EDT
I want a LOUDNER for my gun!

-Sledge Hammer
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 11:58:46 AM EDT
Smokeless powders are coated with additives that prevents light from being generated at the normal temperature of the powder in gas form. To get a good flash you'll have to either get powder with no flash inhibitors or raise the temperature of the gas leaving the barrel.

If you're looking for off the shelf stuff I find Blue Dot to be one of the "flashier" powders.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:02:43 PM EDT
I would imagine the recipe is some combination of this:

1) Short barrel
2) No bullet or light bullet
3) Max powder charge
4) Slow burning, flashy gun powder
5) rapid fire
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:18:04 PM EDT
Don't they make enhancers??
I remember reading something about that
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:19:58 PM EDT
Get a Bushy AR Pistol and no muzzle brake.


Then let me know which range you will be shooting it at, cause I'm going to be a long ways from it...
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:38:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By shop_rat45:
Ok. I know that muzzle flash is caused by unburnt powder being burnt outside of the barrel


Um, no. That can contribute to muzzle flash but mostly muzzle flash is caused by incandescence from the expanding pressure wave of gas from the muzzle. Flash suppressors work by breaking up or redirecting that "bubble" of pressure.

The hollywood flash is usually caused by a constrictor at the muzzle to increase back pressure for operation with blanks, which produces a jet of high pressure gas from the muzzle. They also have modified flash suppressors which are similar to a muzzle break, which direct gas both forward and radially out from the slots. You can't make a live ammo firing weapon look like the ones on TV because you are seeing the effect of blank firing adapters.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:41:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Harlikwin:
I want a LOUDNER for my gun!

-Sledge Hammer



He did not want a Loudner he had one, He was shooting in a Qualification course and pulled out what looked like a Supressor, his female cohort asked what is that a silencer? He said , "No its a Loudner"
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:43:41 PM EDT
my buddy who worked special effects for movies including a zombi movie coming out said they use gas guns, propane. I've seen a mg42 set up like that, it sounds real but it has that huge fake flash on it.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:46:52 PM EDT
Short barrels with no FH.
HK51K complete with trans sear.

Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:47:35 PM EDT
You could get dragon's breath for a 12 gauge.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 12:55:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/3/2006 12:56:53 PM EDT by Stryfe]

Originally Posted By Alien:

Originally Posted By warlord:

Originally Posted By shop_rat45:


With that said, the guns they use fire blanks, with I believe bit of flashpowder to enhance the muzzle flash.



Somebody in the movie forum said that they use a lot of extra gun powder in their blanks too for the big flashes. I'm not sure how true that is, but take it with a grain of salt.


IIRC in either the SWAT, or HEAT, extras when they are talking about the weapons they mention that they used heavier charges in the blanks to get the guns to cycle. One result of this was a larger than real flash.

My vote goes for using 5.56 ammo in a pistol with no flash hider.
It's safe and easy.
I've seen flash through my Cav Comp during the day when shooting XM193.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 1:02:56 PM EDT
In the final shootout in Scarface, with Al Pacino, they had the camers and the gun set up so the shutter would only take when the gun was fired, so it got the flash every time.

I forget the specifics, but it's on the DVD extras. Maybe I'll watch it later and see exactly what they say.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 1:23:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stryfe:
My vote goes for using 5.56 ammo in a pistol with no flash hider.
It's safe and easy.
I've seen flash through my Cav Comp during the day when shooting XM193.



.308 pistol.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 1:40:01 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 1:43:44 PM EDT
Just buy one of the Bushmaster 11.5" barrels that has the 5.5" flash hider permanently attached. They'll flash like crazy.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 3:22:34 PM EDT
Buy a Mosin Nagant M38 or M44 or M91/59. All the muzzle flash and noise you could ever want.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 3:40:53 PM EDT
My recipe for flash is:

27.5 Grains of WCC-844 surplus powder, CCI #41 primer, LC case and Win. 55 fmj bullet with a taper crimp.

Remove flash suppressor.

Real neat!



You get the idea.

Danny

The above load may not be safe in your weapon.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 3:56:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By CAR-10:
You could get dragon's breath for a 12 gauge.



That was a joke when I tried it. All we saw were a few sparks.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 4:04:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Mustang50:
why don't you send your question to the Gunny on mail call !!! I am sure he will have the appropiate answer for you !!!!



thats a good idea

try tappn a flash hider from the back and put it on backwards
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 4:05:28 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 4:28:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tweak:

Originally Posted By JellyBelly:
Smokeless powders are coated with additives that prevents light from being generated at the normal temperature of the powder in gas form. To get a good flash you'll have to either get powder with no flash inhibitors or raise the temperature of the gas leaving the barrel.

If you're looking for off the shelf stuff I find Blue Dot to be one of the "flashier" powders.



+1, covered in depth in Elements of Ordnance



IIRC, they are called deterrents, or retarders.

Been awhile since I saw it.

Danny
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 4:53:10 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 5:11:51 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 11:07:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tweak:

Originally Posted By Minuteman419:
IIRC, they are called deterrents, or retarders.



a coating on the powder was the most used method



Coatings are called different things by different manufacturers. Retarder seems to be what I've encountered most. I think "retarder" is probably the most correct term for the coating.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 11:15:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By gaweidert:
Buy a Mosin Nagant M38 or M44 or M91/59. All the muzzle flash and noise you could ever want.



+2 on the M44...it'll give a nice flame show with cheap ammo.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 11:20:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lumpy223:
FLASH IS FUN!


groups.msn.com/_Secure/0RgCFAvIUSuBq*2liesDVPv1cSYFbBwibcOl*UdvgHim3­nWsWgUw99X4og2fuQK6NLdAic4sT5z135uTKqpqiZoVo5­nRGPVmdXlsH38XcUBk/ShortM16.JPG?dc=4675428274758943027

I had a BM 14.5 that I had a Smith Brake installed on, and it made a flash like that in bright sunlight.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 12:17:12 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 1:49:48 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 2:10:53 AM EDT
Put 1 part horse hair to 4 parts powder.

Nevermind, just buy some Wolf!
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