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Posted: 12/23/2005 11:03:32 AM EDT
on Thu, Dec. 22, 2005

Associated Press
DAYTON, Ohio - The Pentagon has approved flight testing for a revolutionary
jet engine believed to be capable of propelling an airplane faster than any
other aircraft powered by petroleum-based jet fuel.

The engine is part of a $212 million program being managed at
Wright-Patterson Air Force Base.

The X-plane designation puts the project in the ranks of other flight
research programs that began with the X-1 rocket plane in which Chuck Yeager
broke the sound barrier in 1947.

Lab research indicates the engine, known as a scramjet, can propel an
aircraft at more than five times the speed of sound. Researchers hope to fly
five to eight unmanned X-51As at speeds up to seven times the speed of
sound, or about 4,600 miles per hour.

The flights are scheduled for December 2008 through January 2009 and are to
be launched from Edwards Air Force Base in California.

NASA made headlines last year when its unmanned, scramjet-powered X-43A
reached nearly 10 times the speed of sound, or about 7,200 miles per hour.
But it burned hydrogen, a less practical fuel, and the engine only fired for
about 10 seconds - just long enough to prove it could work.

The X-51A program is aimed at demonstrating practical technology for future
military craft, including ultra-fast cruise missiles, global-range bombers
and reusable satellite launchers.

The X-plane designation is important when budgets are being written, said
Robert Barthelemy, a retired Air Force executive who directed the X-30
National AeroSpace Plane program in the 1990s.

"It puts it in a category all by itself," Barthelemy said Wednesday.
The X-30 was an effort to develop a scramjet-powered manned airplane that
could fly into orbit without booster rockets. Congress canceled the X-30
program as costs grew and technical challenges proved tougher than
expected - especially the scramjet engine.

"I think the flying of a scramjet engine is crucial," said Barthelemy.
Scramjets work at speeds that would melt conventional jet engines, but they
require exotic materials. And air goes through them in a supersonic blast,
making the process of mixing and burning fuel an extreme challenge.

Pratt & Whitney Space Propulsion of West Palm Beach, Fla., is building the
flight engine, and Boeing Integrated Defense Systems of Huntington Beach,
Calif., is building the air vehicle.

During the flight tests, a converted B-52 will release an X-51A at 45,000
feet above the Pacific Ocean. A rocket engine will boost the 1,400-pound,
14-foot-long craft to about five times the speed of sound. Then the scramjet
will light, accelerating it to six or seven times the speed of sound.

Program Director Charles Brink said the goal is five to 10 minutes of
scramjet-powered flight for a dash of up to 600 nautical miles. The vehicle
will fall into the sea and not be recovered, but scientists hope the data it
beams back will prove the accuracy of their lab work, allowing them to begin
designing an operational engine.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 11:14:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 11:15:34 AM EDT by jkstexas2001]
They have a pulse detonation powered plane that flies faster than Mach 6, probably even goes as fast a Mach 9. It is approximately 100 feet long and looks like a flattened football. They only fly it at night because of its distinctive contrail pattern.

While we're at it, we have another plane that makes no sound, has a set of advanced LCD panels on the bottom that display what is above the plane, making it virtually invisible at night or during the day, the only thing that is visible is a slight distortion in the sky, and it also uses a means of propulsion that no other plane in existence uses to date, enabling it to do some rather unique manuevers, not capable of being performed by conventional jet aircraft using convention flight control surfaces.



Link Posted: 12/23/2005 11:15:36 AM EDT
Why the charade? Everybody knows they have already mastered this. The mach 7 seismic disturbances from New Mexico to the sandbox in an oval racetrack pattern are a dead giveaway.

Link Posted: 12/23/2005 11:21:18 AM EDT
Well, they never release any real info until it is already old technology. So as impressive as this seems, we can bet that there are already much more impressive systems either in use or development.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 11:34:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
They have a pulse detonation powered plane that flies faster than Mach 6, probably even goes as fast a Mach 9. It is approximately 100 feet long and looks like a flattened football. They only fly it at night because of its distinctive contrail pattern.

While we're at it, we have another plane that makes no sound, has a set of advanced LCD panels on the bottom that display what is above the plane, making it virtually invisible at night or during the day, the only thing that is visible is a slight distortion in the sky, and it also uses a means of propulsion that no other plane in existence uses to date, enabling it to do some rather unique manuevers, not capable of being performed by conventional jet aircraft using convention flight control surfaces.






More info on this please!
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 11:36:51 AM EDT
Sounds like the plane they nicknamed the "Pumpkin seed"............it's supposed to detonate the fuel just outside the rear of the plane, kinda like surfing a shockwave


Originally Posted By bulldog1967:

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
They have a pulse detonation powered plane that flies faster than Mach 6, probably even goes as fast a Mach 9. It is approximately 100 feet long and looks like a flattened football. They only fly it at night because of its distinctive contrail pattern.

While we're at it, we have another plane that makes no sound, has a set of advanced LCD panels on the bottom that display what is above the plane, making it virtually invisible at night or during the day, the only thing that is visible is a slight distortion in the sky, and it also uses a means of propulsion that no other plane in existence uses to date, enabling it to do some rather unique manuevers, not capable of being performed by conventional jet aircraft using convention flight control surfaces.






More info on this please!

Link Posted: 12/23/2005 11:51:29 AM EDT
The guys at Edwards AFB and other say its not a real well kept secret out there. I think this is a valid research program but I know we have black aircraft that are flying in the desert that are faster than the Blackbird. The racetrack patterns posted above are real interesting when you read the history of the A-12 and the SR as thats exactly what they were doing during the proving phases of that program.

I WANT TO BELIEVE, lol
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 12:26:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 12:29:09 PM EDT by jkstexas2001]
I have been doing extensive research using open sources.

The second plane, which is invisible from the ground, can stop on a dime, change flight direction at right angles yet fly as fast as a conventional jet, without making sound. Imagine an invisible, silent aircraft coming to stop over a combat zone, and Delta operators repelling out of it onto a rooftop. I firmly believe this plane exists. It is also rather large, larger than a fighter jet.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 12:28:41 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jasondcrum:
The guys at Edwards AFB and other say its not a real well kept secret out there. I think this is a valid research program but I know we have black aircraft that are flying in the desert that are faster than the Blackbird. The racetrack patterns posted above are real interesting when you read the history of the A-12 and the SR as thats exactly what they were doing during the proving phases of that program.

I WANT TO BELIEVE, lol



We would not have discontinued the SR-71 program without having something better. There are applications where UAV's simply do not fit the bill, and satellites are easy to defeat, because it is known when they are overhead.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 12:31:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 12:31:57 PM EDT by jkstexas2001]

Originally Posted By KA3B:
on Thu, Dec. 22, 2005

Associated Press
DAYTON, Ohio - The Pentagon has approved flight testing for a revolutionary
jet engine believed to be capable of propelling an airplane faster than any
other aircraft powered by petroleum-based jet fuel.




This is quite true. The pulse detonation engine which propels the plane I referred to which goes Mach 9 uses methane as fuel, most likely.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 12:34:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
I have been doing extensive research using open sources.

The second plane, which is invisible from the ground, can stop on a dime,squishing the flesh bags inside change flight direction at right anglescartoonishly making the fleshbag's seatbelt cut them like Wile E Coyote running through a harpsichord, yet fly as fast as a conventional jet, without making sound. Imagine an invisible, silent aircraft coming to stop over a combat zone, and Delta operator's repelling pureed remains pour out of it onto a rooftop. I firmly believe this plane exists. It is also rather large, larger than a fighter jet.



Fixed it for ya.

Link Posted: 12/23/2005 12:36:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TheOtherDave:
Why the charade? Everybody knows they have already mastered this. The mach 7 seismic disturbances from New Mexico to the sandbox in an oval racetrack pattern are a dead giveaway.


Link?

Kharn
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 12:37:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
We would not have discontinued the SR-71 program without having something better.



Then why did we spend a few hundred million in the late 90's to bring some SR-71s back to service?
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 12:41:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sherm8404:

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
I have been doing extensive research using open sources.

The second plane, which is invisible from the ground, can stop on a dime,squishing the flesh bags inside change flight direction at right anglescartoonishly making the fleshbag's seatbelt cut them like Wile E Coyote running through a harpsichord, yet fly as fast as a conventional jet, without making sound. Imagine an invisible, silent aircraft coming to stop over a combat zone, and Delta operator's repelling pureed remains pour out of it onto a rooftop. I firmly believe this plane exists. It is also rather large, larger than a fighter jet.



Fixed it for ya.




Not true. Boeing, I believe, has invested millions of dollars research into a new type of flight technology that most people consider to be science fiction. This is well known and documented. You can laugh or post BS or whatever you wish. One very reputable member of this board HAS SEEN this aircraft, and described what it did in flight. There are folks who camp out outside bases where these experimental aircraft are tested, and they film them.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 12:42:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sherm8404:

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
I have been doing extensive research using open sources.

The second plane, which is invisible from the ground, can stop on a dime,squishing the flesh bags inside change flight direction at right anglescartoonishly making the fleshbag's seatbelt cut them like Wile E Coyote running through a harpsichord, yet fly as fast as a conventional jet, without making sound. Imagine an invisible, silent aircraft coming to stop over a combat zone, and Delta operator's repelling pureed remains pour out of it onto a rooftop. I firmly believe this plane exists. It is also rather large, larger than a fighter jet.



Fixed it for ya.




... , my thoughts exactly
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 12:46:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tomislav:

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
We would not have discontinued the SR-71 program without having something better.



Then why did we spend a few hundred million in the late 90's to bring some SR-71s back to service?



They can fly the SR-71 day or night. It uses a conventional, though very powerful and advanced, propulsion system. The first plane I referred to, which uses methane pulse detonation, creates a unique contrail that looks like donuts on a rope, and it started drawing so much attention that they can only flight it at night. It is also extremely loud, far louder than the SR-71. Speed measurments have been made that show this aircraft to travel in excess of Mach 7. Photographs exist of the contrail. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that this plane exists. The principles of the engine operation were in the public domain.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 12:54:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 1:00:02 PM EDT by jkstexas2001]

Originally Posted By Winston_Wolf:

Originally Posted By sherm8404:

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
I have been doing extensive research using open sources.

The second plane, which is invisible from the ground, can stop on a dime,squishing the flesh bags inside change flight direction at right anglescartoonishly making the fleshbag's seatbelt cut them like Wile E Coyote running through a harpsichord, yet fly as fast as a conventional jet, without making sound. Imagine an invisible, silent aircraft coming to stop over a combat zone, and Delta operator's repelling pureed remains pour out of it onto a rooftop. I firmly believe this plane exists. It is also rather large, larger than a fighter jet.



Fixed it for ya.




... , my thoughts exactly



Newtonian Physics was superceded by Quantum Physics and by The General Theory of Relativity. Exactly why would a major Defense Contractor invest nearly a billion dollars into research in the field of antigravity, if there were nothing to it. According to General Relativity, Gravity and Inertia are interconnected. If the effects of Gravity can be cancelled out, then it follows logically so are the effects of inertia. I fully understand the BS flags, laughing smily faces, etc. If this area is BS and this stuff is not possible, why are so much of your tax dollars going into researching this technology? It is the only explanation I can come up with that ties together evidence from numerous eyewitnesses, and it is a lot more plausible than what the kooks say about UFO's or backward engineered UFO's, etc.

The direction of research appears to be that there is a way to cancel out the effects of gravity using some sort of electromagnetic field. Russian Physicists, the same type of folks who discovered the principles of Stealth Technology, have developed proofs of this possibility - you can read the research papers, unless they have been pulled off of the internet.

Regarding the LCD technology, years ago it was tested on the bottom of an F-15 fighter, making it invisible from the Ground. Boeing recently announced the existence of a prototype stealth plane that is rumored to have LCD technology so that it can fly during the day without being detected.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 12:56:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
I have been doing extensive research using open sources.

The second plane, which is invisible from the ground, can stop on a dime, change flight direction at right angles yet fly as fast as a conventional jet, without making sound. Imagine an invisible, silent aircraft coming to stop over a combat zone, and Delta operators repelling out of it onto a rooftop. I firmly believe this plane exists. It is also rather large, larger than a fighter jet.





Hey, we're going to need something to transport the Mobile Infantry powersuits to the DZ.


Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:09:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 1:17:38 PM EDT by jkstexas2001]
Nick Cook, editor of Jane's Defense Weekly, has done extensive research into experiments the Germans did in the 40's, nicknamed the Nazi Bell. The test site still exists in Germany. The experiments were early investigations into the effect of electromagnetic fields cancelling out the effects of gravity, resulting in lift. They were moderately successful. That was sixty years ago. I believe they have made significant progress since then, but it is highly classified.

Here is the book he wrote:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0767906276/104-4171750-8604734?v=glance&n=283155

It is on sale at Amazon. Being the editor of Jane's, he is far from being an "Art Bell" type.

Here are some comments from the Amazon link:

" To simplify in the extreme: Cook has found evidence that Nazi scientists had tapped into zero point energy the quantum energy that possibly exists within vacuums in amounts that make nuclear energy look like a joke (enough energy in the space of a coffee cup, Cook explains, to boil the world's oceans six times over). When WWII ended, Nazi secrets were plundered by the U.S. Army, which spirited them, along with many of the German scientists themselves, into "black" programs not acknowledged by the government and which may have produced working aerospace technology based on zero point. Through his cover as a Jane's reporter, Cook seeks out the stealthy wonks of this top-secret world, but readers will have to wade through some opaque thumbnail descriptions of the science and arcane WWII history to understand what he and others are getting at. It is well worth it.
Copyright 2002 Cahners Business Information, Inc."
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:16:35 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:19:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
...Photographs exist of the contrail. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that this plane exists. The principles of the engine operation were in the public domain.



From FAS:


In addition, a closer examination of the published photographs reveals a significant irregularity in the spacing between the donuts on the rope. This would seem to be inconsistent with the normal functioning of a pulse detonation engine.

While various assumptions might be brought forward to reconcile these observations with theory, the evidence is not obviously consistent with the presence of a pulse detonation engine.

And the unusually loud, rumbling sonic booms reported along the California coast actually have a precedent in a deep black program well prior to the 1970s era THAP. According to an historical Lockheed document, during test flights at high altitude, the Lockheed A-12 "Oxcart" (an SR-71 predecessor) would make an "ominous rumble on the ground.<20> Thus, while the reports of unusual auditory signatures may be indicative of the existence of some type of advanced air vehicle, they do not appear to constitute conclusive evidence of the existence of an Exotic Propulsion Aircraft.



*Shrug* I'll take the word of FAS over that of 'dreamlandresort dot com' (or any of the other colorful sites that come up when I google 'donut contrails'.)

Do 'donut contrails' exist? Sure. Do we know what causes them? Nope.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:20:01 PM EDT
Twenty years ago, if I had posted we had developed aircraft invisible to RADAR, you would have said the same thing. With people of Cook's caliber saying that this technology exists, you cannot dismiss it. You do know that Jane's Defense Weekly is the most authoritative and reputable source of Defence Technology information in the world?
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:21:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 1:22:38 PM EDT by Winston_Wolf]

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
Originally Posted By Winston_Wolf:
Originally Posted By sherm8404:
Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:

It is the only explanation I can come up with ...
... read as: "My best guess"

LCD technology so that it can fly during the day without being detected.
... On the modern battlefield and airspace, the visible light spectrum is not much threat at all in the grand scheme of things.

Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:22:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tomislav:

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
...Photographs exist of the contrail. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that this plane exists. The principles of the engine operation were in the public domain.



From FAS:


In addition, a closer examination of the published photographs reveals a significant irregularity in the spacing between the donuts on the rope. This would seem to be inconsistent with the normal functioning of a pulse detonation engine.

While various assumptions might be brought forward to reconcile these observations with theory, the evidence is not obviously consistent with the presence of a pulse detonation engine.

And the unusually loud, rumbling sonic booms reported along the California coast actually have a precedent in a deep black program well prior to the 1970s era THAP. According to an historical Lockheed document, during test flights at high altitude, the Lockheed A-12 "Oxcart" (an SR-71 predecessor) would make an "ominous rumble on the ground.<20> Thus, while the reports of unusual auditory signatures may be indicative of the existence of some type of advanced air vehicle, they do not appear to constitute conclusive evidence of the existence of an Exotic Propulsion Aircraft.



*Shrug* I'll take the word of FAS over that of 'dreamlandresort dot com' (or any of the other colorful sites that come up when I google 'donut contrails'.)

Do 'donut contrails' exist? Sure. Do we know what causes them? Nope.



I am taking into account that information ALONG with other information, such as seismic recordings in the areas where they tested experimental aircraft. It is all this evidence, taken together, that causes me to reach that conclusion.

Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:25:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Winston_Wolf:

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
Originally Posted By Winston_Wolf:
Originally Posted By sherm8404:
Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:

It is the only explanation I can come up with ...
... read as: "My best guess"

LCD technology so that it can fly during the day without being detected.
... On the modern battlefield and airspace, the visible light spectrum is not much threat at all in the grand scheme of things.




In combination with RADAR and Infrared invisibility technologies, it makes for a significant tactical advantage. F-117 and B2 missions are currently flown at night. Imagine being able to task stealth aircraft during both the day and the night.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:25:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
Twenty years ago, if I had posted we had developed aircraft invisible to RADAR, you would have said the same thing. With people of Cook's caliber saying that this technology exists, you cannot dismiss it. You do know that Jane's Defense Weekly is the most authoritative and reputable source of Defence Technology information in the world?



1) It was not a JDW publication, so don't try to make it seem as if it was.

2) He is making money off of people like you.

3) 20 years ago, why weren't you guys telling us about the F-117 or B-2? No, we got that goofy crap about the 'F-19'. Sheesh.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:35:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 1:37:19 PM EDT by jkstexas2001]

Originally Posted By Tomislav:

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
Twenty years ago, if I had posted we had developed aircraft invisible to RADAR, you would have said the same thing. With people of Cook's caliber saying that this technology exists, you cannot dismiss it. You do know that Jane's Defense Weekly is the most authoritative and reputable source of Defence Technology information in the world?



1) It was not a JDW publication, so don't try to make it seem as if it was.

2) He is making money off of people like you.

3) 20 years ago, why weren't you guys telling us about the F-117 or B-2? No, we got that goofy crap about the 'F-19'. Sheesh.



I did not mean to imply that it was a JDW publication, just that Cook, having been its editor for ten years, cannot simply be dismissed as an Art Bell type. He found concrete proof that a new type of flight was discovered and demonstrated by German Scientists - and that, like Van Braun, we acquired them and their research after WWII.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:39:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By brouhaha:
jkstexas2001,

Have you ever, by any chance, worked at a gunstore? Or maybe had a table at a gunshow?



I'm thinking he's more like the guy in the commercials "Off to Make the Donuts" and needs stuff like this to make his life more interesting?

Anyway I'm going over to the Zero Grav lab now as we just completed work on the Glock 19 sized deathray gun....
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:45:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
I did not mean to imply that it was a JDW publication, just that Cook, having been its editor for ten years, cannot simply be dismissed as an Art Bell type. He found concrete proof that a new type of flight was discovered and demonstrated by German Scientists - and that, like Van Braun, we acquired them and their research after WWII.



If he found 'concrete proof', then why are we having this discussion?

A review of the book in question.



In the end it is the lack of evidence, and of traceable sources, that renders this book almost valueless as either history or science. Worse, it may unwittingly be delivering political propaganda, glorifying fictional Nazi achievements, of which I am sure neither author nor publisher would approve.



It sounds like great fodder for a Discovery Channel special or something like that, but as stunning proof of Nazi flying saucers or ZPMs? Not so much.

Besides, we all know zero point modules really exist!


Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:51:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Forest:

Originally Posted By brouhaha:
jkstexas2001,

Have you ever, by any chance, worked at a gunstore? Or maybe had a table at a gunshow?



I'm thinking he's more like the guy in the commercials "Off to Make the Donuts" and needs stuff like this to make his life more interesting?

Anyway I'm going over to the Zero Grav lab now as we just completed work on the Glock 19 sized deathray gun....



No, I am a person very interested in technology, among other things. Ten years ago, I became interested in "adaptive" or "active camouflage", something else you have probably not heard of, that can make people and vehicles practical invisible by being able to blend into their surroundings in a far superior manner to conventional methods. I read the research papers, published by universities, that talked about experiments based on how the way the Octupus could change it colors could be replicated in the lab. For vehicles, the method most favored involved LCD panels that could change colors to adapt to surroundings. Most of these papers went offline about the same time DARPA started mentioning projects on their site regarding research into these areas, back in the late 90's. I really don't care if I get made fun of. A few years ago, I started researching aircraft. Again, If I am so full of BS -- why is the Defense Industry spending so much money into researching this new flight technology? These folks working at Boeing, Lockheed-Martin are the best and brightest minds in this country. Are you smarter than they are? If they think there is something to this technology so that they would invest almost a billion dollars into researching it, don't you think there is something to it, and that they at a minimum have prototypes, since you do not invest that amount of money without proof of concept craft that prove the craft actually fly?

Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:54:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tomislav:

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
I did not mean to imply that it was a JDW publication, just that Cook, having been its editor for ten years, cannot simply be dismissed as an Art Bell type. He found concrete proof that a new type of flight was discovered and demonstrated by German Scientists - and that, like Van Braun, we acquired them and their research after WWII.



If he found 'concrete proof', then why are we having this discussion?

A review of the book in question.



In the end it is the lack of evidence, and of traceable sources, that renders this book almost valueless as either history or science. Worse, it may unwittingly be delivering political propaganda, glorifying fictional Nazi achievements, of which I am sure neither author nor publisher would approve.



It sounds like great fodder for a Discovery Channel special or something like that, but as stunning proof of Nazi flying saucers or ZPMs? Not so much.

Besides, we all know zero point modules really exist!

www.southport58thscouts.co.uk/Atlantis/images/ZPM.jpg



The Fortean Times is hardly a reputable source. The review I posted earlier WAS from a reputable source. The very nature of the technology immediately causes ridicule from everyone except physicists. That is because it is associated with science fiction (Star Trek, etc). At one time, Satellites and travel to the moon was also science fiction.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 2:00:40 PM EDT
I'm more of a fan of the OPEN CYCLE nuclear-powered bomber.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 2:03:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By QuantumPion:
I'm more of a fan of the OPEN CYCLE nuclear-powered bomber.



There is something to be said about a bomber that can stay airborne months at a time.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 2:09:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 2:10:26 PM EDT by Forest]

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
Ten years ago, I became interested in "adaptive" or "active camouflage", something else you have probably not heard of,





These folks working at Boeing, Lockheed-Martin are the best and brightest minds in this country. Are you smarter than they are?

Hmm I know alot of those folks a Boeing, Lockheed, Northrop-Grummn, GE Astrospace etc. I've worked with them for years on projects some of which I KNOW you have never heard of, others I'm sure your familier with.

Now I work at one of the labs that does all that initial research the DOD pours money into then we turn it over to industry so they can build upon what we learned; we also do the testing for many programs so the military can be sure what their buying does what the contractor says it can do. Does that make me smarter or just as smart? I don't know, you tell me.

BTW you might be surprised to find out Janes gets things wrong - more often then you might think.

I'd also suggest you run the numbers on potential energy from Methane vs Jet Fuel (and some of the more exotic blends) and see which one will propel a vehicle faster...
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 2:14:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
At one time, Satellites and travel to the moon was also science fiction.



Very true. And guess what? Nazi ZPM-powered flying saucers will forever remain science fiction.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 2:27:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 2:28:19 PM EDT by gunman0]

Originally Posted By Forest:

Originally Posted By brouhaha:
jkstexas2001,

Have you ever, by any chance, worked at a gunstore? Or maybe had a table at a gunshow?



I'm thinking he's more like the guy in the commercials "Off to Make the Donuts" and needs stuff like this to make his life more interesting?

Anyway I'm going over to the Zero Grav lab now as we just completed work on the Glock 19 sized deathray gun....



Watch out, I've heard those things have tendency to go critical, or KB if you will.

I love all of this anti gravity and inertia discussion. It's kinda like the "inertial dampers" in Star-Trek. Having no inertia would make things very difficult to operate. The way to overcome inertia is simply to accelerate and decelerate the entire vehicle, components, and pilots simultaneously. Heck, if you overcome inertia, most of the mechanical components would fail to function.

And yes, there are productive anti gravity experiments that have also successfully conquered the inertia problem by accelerating/decelerating objects as a whole. But they are in massive laboratories with huge electromagnets that consume ridiculous amounts of power and use superconductors. All to achieve a tiny floating spider.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 2:33:24 PM EDT
An interesting eyewitness account. Clearly not a UFO, as it had the standard markings on the outside of military aircraft, but one that is not public knowledge. There are a large number of sightings of this particular US aircraft. I am sure they are not all taking LSD, as some would like to believe.

==========================================================================

I was walking back to my motor home after wildboar hunting in an unpopulated area that I lease for hunting. The sky was clear; wind calm and the sun had just set. The sky was growing darker and darker blue straight above and stars were beginning to show. The sky was becoming black in the east. The setting sun was still keeping the western horizon illuminated and indirect lighting from the west made it possible to see my way without a flashlight.

I had my .243 Win. Remington 700 varmint rifle of which I am a quite an accomplished shooter. It is considered a "high-powered" rifle. I do quite a bit of bench rest competitive shooting with it as well as hunting. The rifle is set up with a high-tech "Leupold" optical sight, (scope) which is extremely accurate and highly specialized for great light gathering ability and performs best in low light conditions. It is not what is called a "night vision" sight. The scope magnifies the target image with great sharpness and definition and the magnification is adjustable from 4.5 to 14 times that of the natural image.

Upon my return to the motor home, I was tired after a long walk. I had carried quite a bit of equipment with me. I sat on a chair, took my eyeglasses off and toweled my face as it is already becoming hot in Texas. While I rested, without my glasses on, I noticed three very "unfocused" lights to my south and these lights were moving toward me. Immediately I put my glasses back on and saw what I believe was a UFO. (SEE ATTACHED ANIMATIONS) (a) Is the appearance of the vehicle without my glasses on and (b) is the view I had with my glasses on.) (I drew the images on my pc) The object approached from the south-southwest and while moving north-north east, passed almost directly overhead making no sound whatsoever. I estimate its altitude to be somewhere about 800 feet and its airspeed speed approximately 30 mph. It "floated" and did not fly as it obviously had insufficient airspeed to fly. (I am a Physicist & an FAA Licensed Pilot) While the sky was almost entirely black behind it, I could clearly see its underside as it was illuminated from the fading sunlight to the west. I estimate that the machine was about 60 feet wide and 80 feet long and 10 feet thick at the rear. Under its belly, there was a straight line going from its leading tip toward the center of the aft edge of the fuselage, which was perpendicular to its travel. This straight edge clearly showed its shape to be three-dimensional. The straight line showed that its belly was V-shaped, much like the hull of a speedboat. It was similar to the space shuttle as when viewed from in front and below the shuttle.

This machine was directly over me and I was alone in the middle of nowhere, therefore, I felt quite "uneasy." It made no threatening moves whatsoever, but I aimed my rifle at it and through the riflescope, which was set on 8.5 power, I could clearly see surface detail in explicit detail. The machine’s surface detail appeared to be covered with well-fitted tiles, much like the ceramic tiles used on the United States Space Shuttle. Then in the fading light, I noticed a distinct marking.

This marking was absolutely shocking, as I could actually read it! It was white print outlined in black on a red arrow pointing toward a rectangle of sorts. The arrow pointed at a something rectangular that I cannot define, but I clearly could read these three words, “EMERGENCY RELEASE and RESCUE.” In the same place were other words that appeared too fuzzy to read. I suspect that these words were “PULL FOR...” Instantly I realized that this was a military machine and no “flying saucer.” I felt much better as I knew that these were surface details that were intended to help rescue people access and then be able to remove the pilots on board in the event of a crash.

I kept the crosshairs on the center of the aircraft as it disappeared into the darkness but as I realized it was “one of ours” and it was not a threat to my own personal safety (I think) I put the rifle safety back on. I can see however that others may have “defensively” shot at it --- and that may have resulted in a crash of the vehicle.

I am somewhat “pissed off” at the military as while this area is directly under the Ft. Hood, Texas MOPA and practice flights are flown daily, really - they should not be taking chances like this where someone on the ground could actually be shooting the damned things down! I am sure that the military pilots (if it even had a crew…) were aware of my presence but they NEVER expected possible “offensive action” to be taken against them on this low level flight. The last thing I would have ever have wanted would have taken a “defensive” shot and then find American military pilots onboard in the wreckage.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 2:37:49 PM EDT
For all the tinfoil powered flying saucer types.

What possible reason would the military have for devloping such super technology (mach 9 aircraft, UFOs etc) and keep it so secret that they can't use it? All the while pouring money into more mundane experiments and aircraft.

Next week when I'm going to get my lunch I think I'll stop by the quantum communications lab and see if they've got that teleporter finished yet...
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 2:40:11 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 2:41:15 PM EDT
Tagged for ANdy's reply...
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 2:44:21 PM EDT
while everyone is wondering about flying saucers, nuclear bombers, invisible camo suits with power up options, the real weird stuff is being developed in test tubes. ethnic, sub-specie targeted viral agents that than can modify targeted human (or any specie DNA) to do things like reduce IQs of target populations by 20 to 60 points, induce mass sterization in second generations, modify digestive systems of target groups to inhibit the ability to digest certain proteins, carbohydrates and sugars.. just to name a few..

next big war aint gonna be fought with flying saucers, unmaned piloted drones, rods of gods, delta ninjas or robots.....
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 3:10:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 3:14:54 PM EDT by jkstexas2001]

Originally Posted By Forest:
For all the tinfoil powered flying saucer types.

What possible reason would the military have for devloping such super technology (mach 9 aircraft, UFOs etc) and keep it so secret that they can't use it? All the while pouring money into more mundane experiments and aircraft.

Next week when I'm going to get my lunch I think I'll stop by the quantum communications lab and see if they've got that teleporter finished yet...



Surveillance, rapidly getting counter-terrorist units to distant locations where time is a major factor (we are going to detonate this weapon in one hour, etc) situations. Being able to insert forces into a situation unseen. Boeing's recent announcement of their very small stealth aircraft - what is its purpose? Its too small to carry bombs or any weapons. What is its intended purpose?
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 3:12:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By st0newall:
...the real weird stuff is being developed in test tubes. ethnic, sub-specie targeted viral agents that than can modify targeted human (or any specie DNA) to do things like reduce IQs of target populations by 20 to 60 points...





You are giving us a first-hand account, I presume?
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 3:17:18 PM EDT
There are distinct DNA differences between Orientals and Caucasians. If the Chinese invented a virus that only killed Caucasians, that would be a problem, and it is within the realm of possibility with today's technology. I don't know about the other stuff.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 4:06:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
. Boeing's recent announcement of their very small stealth aircraft - what is its purpose? Its too small to carry bombs or any weapons.



Says who?

It would also make a heck of a survailence platform.


As for Mach 9 getting spec ops to places in a hurry - duh then people would have to see it and we'd know about it.... And considering you'd have to base the aircraft near the spec ops units.. Sorry it don't fly (pun intended).
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 4:08:56 PM EDT
At least the Bigfoot people have grainy photographs and 'casts' of imprints.

You guys don't even have a bad photo, you have to rely on a anonymouse internet story?

Thanks for you confidence in our ability to produce Star Wars technology in complete secrecy, you give us way too much credit (or you've been watching too much Stargate SG-1).
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 4:24:09 PM EDT

Originally Posted By st0newall:
...the real weird stuff is being developed in test tubes. ethnic, sub-specie targeted viral agents that than can modify targeted human (or any specie DNA) to do things like reduce IQs of target populations by 20 to 60 points...



I think they've been using it on Democrats.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 4:55:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 4:57:40 PM EDT by Dave_A]

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:

Originally Posted By sherm8404:

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:
I have been doing extensive research using open sources.

The second plane, which is invisible from the ground, can stop on a dime,squishing the flesh bags inside change flight direction at right anglescartoonishly making the fleshbag's seatbelt cut them like Wile E Coyote running through a harpsichord, yet fly as fast as a conventional jet, without making sound. Imagine an invisible, silent aircraft coming to stop over a combat zone, and Delta operator's repelling pureed remains pour out of it onto a rooftop. I firmly believe this plane exists. It is also rather large, larger than a fighter jet.



Fixed it for ya.




Not true. Boeing, I believe, has invested millions of dollars research into a new type of flight technology that most people consider to be science fiction. This is well known and documented. You can laugh or post BS or whatever you wish. One very reputable member of this board HAS SEEN this aircraft, and described what it did in flight. There are folks who camp out outside bases where these experimental aircraft are tested, and they film them.



I have allways maintained that today's 'space alien UFOs' are tomorrows USAF superweapons...

Optical stealth, BTW, has been discussed for years... There was some speculation, several years back, that the Air Force would try to mate such technology with the F-22...
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 5:00:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Forest:
At least the Bigfoot people have grainy photographs and 'casts' of imprints.

You guys don't even have a bad photo, you have to rely on a anonymouse internet story?

Thanks for you confidence in our ability to produce Star Wars technology in complete secrecy, you give us way too much credit (or you've been watching too much Stargate SG-1).



It's far more believable than 'space aliens'...

The past record (with radar stealth) indicates that there would be some minor leakage wrt the existance of the technology (see 'F-19') followed by 'what it really is' a few years later... So far, the 'F-22 optical stealth' fits the pattern...
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 5:32:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Dave_A:
So far, the 'F-22 optical stealth' fits the pattern...



F22s don't hover, fly sideways, or run on methane.

Complex LCD adaptive camoflauge is too heavy and isn't needed. A simple paintjob and illuminating underneath will provide more than enough 'invisibility' should it be needed.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 5:44:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 5:45:22 PM EDT by dport]

Originally Posted By CitySlicker:
Tagged for ANdy's reply...


[ANdy reply mode]Whatever adaptive camo you come up with it will still be POW3N3D by a Eurofighter with IRST and Meteor missiles.[/ANdy reply mode]

ETA: All in good fun Andy.
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