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Posted: 12/20/2005 4:58:00 PM EDT

I watched Shooting USA this week and the show featured the End of Trail shooting match. I thought it just looked cool as all hell, shooting steel challenge COFs with six guns and double barrel shotguns. However, the last thing I need right now is another expensive shooting hobby.

Anyone here into it?

Link Posted: 12/20/2005 5:11:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 5:13:58 PM EDT
A simple "no, I don't." would suffice.
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 5:25:15 PM EDT
Rules enforement on dress will vary from place to place. Jeans, a flannel shirt & a pair of cowboy boots ain't asking too much, IMO.

Aside from that, the guns are required to be historically semi-accurate. By that, it means you can use a modern single action with a transfer bar safety, i.e. Ruger Vaquero for example. Uberti also has this design, IIRC? Shotguns are allowed to be hammerless, no clue if there's two classes with and/or without. Rifle is lever action of your choice, no doubt.

One thing I have noticed about SASS shooters: rare is one who also shoots IDPA, IPSC, 3-Gun, Bulls-eye, etc. Seems like they "settle in" on that sport as much for the social gathering as anything else, IMO.

SASS is one of the few shooting sports I've never tried although I've shot their guns at a range. One thing I learned with my very first handgun ever, a Colt New Frontier single action, is that *I* cannot reload a SA very quickly. Coupling that slowness (at least for me) with a fixed sight revolver with a less-than-ideal front sight blade that makes bulls-eye shooting totally out of the question, means I wouldn't have too good a time shooting it. And no one likes a poor sport while shooting, no?
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 6:41:52 PM EDT
I would like to try it. Hell, shooting is fun.

Link Posted: 12/20/2005 7:02:27 PM EDT
Also check out www.western3gun.com/

They are an offshoot of SASS. But they have added movement while shooting, unlike SASS. I know one of the guys that help start it and he is one of the best shooters out there and knows what the hell he is talking about.

GlockSpeed31
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 7:04:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By David_Hineline:
They have stupid rules, they make rules against technology, they insist you play dress up.

They require guns of a style before a certain year, yet if you show up with a model 97 Wichester Pump shotgun they will make you download it to 2 shots because it's not fair to the double barrel shooters. If you choose a 12" real coach gun double like what would have been truly period rather than modern 18" shotgun they will refuse you to use that weapon. If you choose a semi auto loader of the time, they will ban you once again it's not fair to those who can only afford wheel guns.

They will force you to pick a silly identity and dress in costume. They will download thier guns to the point that you will have to push the bullet through the paper targets.

But if you like to play dress up, go for it.



Thanks for the info. I didnt know this stuff.
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 7:06:05 PM EDT
I am a CAS fan. I was shooting a couple matches a month until this past year. Got busy with the kids and their activities and I think I made it to 3 matches all summer.

I find it quite enjoyable. Yes, you do dress up. Yes, you do create a persona. Yes, there are specific rules to weapons. Yes, it is some of the most fun I have had shooting in 20 years.

I guess it should be fairly obvious by Mr. Hineline's response that CAS isn't for everybody. I would recommend that you find a local club and go to a couple of shoots just to watch. Talk with folks, check out the equipment, ask questions. If it is something you are interested in, most clubs are pretty informal for the monthly shoots. I know our club will let you shoot no matter what you are wearing as long as you are trying to accumulate the gear.

It can be quite expensive if you try to outfit yourself all at once. When I started, I purchased a pair of Ruger Vaqueros and used the rifle and shotgun of another shooter. You will find that CAS is full of folks that just want to help you get started and have fun. He let me shoot his stuff until I could afford to purchase my own. I added a marlin rifle, and then a '97. I have since switched to a coachgun and have pretty much gone over to the "darkside" as they say by shooting black powder.

I never fail to have a smile on my face after a day of "playing" cowboy. It is a lot of fun. At least I think so and apparently many others do as well since CAS is the fastest growing shooting sport going.

Cavu
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 7:51:17 AM EDT
Every sport has weird rules you have to get used to. IDPA has the no comps, all the rest have no crossdraw holsters, etc.. This is no worse than the rest as far as rules go. What the is the point of playing cowboy if you want to shoot a broom handle mauser or a 1911 model. Go somewhere else for that.
As for dressing up, I have a shirt that is a cowboy shirt and a hate. All for under 50 bucks. I spend more than that in ammo each time I go.

As for light loads, so what. Let others shoot what they want. There is a limit on what you can shoot since you have to shoot lead, and you don't want to get hit by the back splatter anymore than the guy next to you. You could shoot 38 to make life easier, but I like the 45.

I enjoy SASS as much or more than IDPA. But I always wanted to be a cowboy. Mostly the stages vary from place to place. For the most part the only reloading you do is with the shotgun. I have had to load one round in my rifle because mine only holds 9, and once on a single stage I had to reload one round in a pistol. It is the only sport I get to shoot two guns at the same time, so I have fun with that.

Run and gun was always fun to me so I will look at the other link provided.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 8:06:51 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BobCole:

SASS is one of the few shooting sports I've never tried although I've shot their guns at a range. One thing I learned with my very first handgun ever, a Colt New Frontier single action, is that *I* cannot reload a SA very quickly.



FYI,

There were several top-break actions that are historically accurate. Beretta has a nice modern version of these that I've been eyeing for a while.

www.berettausa.com/product/spotlight/spotlight_replicas_main.htm

the Laramie is the one you want.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 5:19:05 PM EDT
Yes, I'm aware of the Schofield-type guns made by S&W & Uberti, among others. Didn't know about the Beretta though, thanks for the heads-up!

Link Posted: 12/21/2005 5:27:07 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 5:33:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/21/2005 5:35:08 PM EDT by TUMOR]

Anyone here into it?


The wife and I are..........it's an awesome good time!

Great people.

Great shooting.

You'd be surprised how fast those single actions and leverguns can be!



There are TONS of clubs down in Florida, here's a site that will list them for you:

http://www.sassnet.com/AClubs-FL-001A.php
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 5:39:28 PM EDT

They have stupid rules, they make rules against technology, they insist you play dress up.
They will force you to pick a silly identity and dress in costume. They will download thier guns to the point that you will have to push the bullet through the paper targets.
But if you like to play dress up, go for it.



I am SO GlAD you don't like to have fun...........if you're that whiney then Cowboy Shooting is glad you went elsewhere.
Adios
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 5:55:48 PM EDT
Used to do it with my dad and grandparents.

It was alot of fun I used to shoot duilest (one handed) then switched to frontiersman same as dualist but cap and ball pistols and black powder loads in your rifle and shotgun)

Just had trouble finding the time to reload all that ammo.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 6:00:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By cyrax777:
Used to do it with my dad and grandparents.

It was alot of fun I used to shoot duilest (one handed) then switched to frontiersman same as dualist but cap and ball pistols and black powder loads in your rifle and shotgun)

Just had trouble finding the time to reload all that ammo.



Yeah, the reloading is the tough part. I was fine when I was shooting smokeless. I set up my room with a Dillon 650 and can crank out 45 colt ammo pretty quick. When I switched over to black powder, it slowed the reloading process dramatically. To me, that is my biggest gripe with BP, it isn't the clean up, it is the slower reloading process.

Link Posted: 12/21/2005 6:12:16 PM EDT
Does wearing a cowboy hat and chewing tobacco while shooting IDPA count.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 6:35:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/21/2005 6:36:23 PM EDT by A_Free_Man]
I have a friend that CAS's, with a really OUTSTANDING mustache! I don't know if it is compulsory.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 6:48:15 PM EDT
Not into it (too much other shooting stuff going on), but think it would be a lot of fun.

Just be extra careful with your quick-draw, spinning, holster shot .....

Seriously.

Careless & stupid hurts. Sometimes much more.



Article published Dec 18, 2005

Man killed in accident at shooting range
Witnesses say man shot himself practicing cowboy action shooting.

AUSTIN L. MILLER
STAR-BANNER

OCALA NATIONAL FOREST - A 39-year-old man accidentally shot himself to death at a gun range Saturday while practicing a popular sport called cowboy action shooting.

The Marion County Sheriff's Office identified the man as Chadwick M. Bogard, 39, of Kingsport, Tenn. According to the Sheriff's Office, he was married and had children. Deputies also said he was in the area on a job interview. Deputies said the man has a wife and children.

Sheriff's deputies said they received the shooting call at 9:45 a.m. from the Forest Road 88 Gun Range. When they arrived the man was unconscious. He was transported to Shands Hospital in Gainesville, where he died shortly before 3 p.m.

"At this point, it appears accidental and no foul play is suspected," said sheriff's Capt. Fred Vyse.

Authorities said the man appeared to be a cowboy action shooting fan, and he was at the range practicing. Eyewitnesses told them he had two single-action revolvers - a .357-caliber Magnum in each hand - and was firing .38-caliber rounds in the weapons back and forth.

They determined that at about the eighth shot, the weapon somehow rotated toward him and discharged, striking him in the abdomen.

"I heard him say, 'I'm shot,' " said Bill Hayter, an employee of the Star-Banner who was standing next to the man. "I saw him slumping to the ground and I called 911."

Hayter said bystanders propped up the man's feet and head and performed CPR.

Kat Kelley, a spokeswoman for the Florida Fish & Wildlife Conservation Commission, said Saturday that the agency constructed and maintained the building and the range. However, Kelley said they do not own the range, as it is on U.S. Forestry property.

Kelley said since the 1990s, the agency is only aware of two accidents on the range, both of which occurred in the 1990s. In the first case, blood was found on the range but there were no reports of anyone being injured there. The second incident was in the late 1990s when a man's weapon exploded. Three people, including the gun owner, suffered minor injuries.

Web sites dedicated to cowboy action shooting describe it as a fast growing sport. The weapons used are mostly older style guns, and the shooter attempts to hit as many targets as he can in the shortest time possible.

"This is a rarity," said Johnny Nelson, from Roswell, N.M., of the shooting.

__________
Austin L. Miller may be reached at austin.miller@starbanner.com or 867-4118.

Link Posted: 12/21/2005 8:12:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Cavu:

Originally Posted By cyrax777:
Used to do it with my dad and grandparents.

It was alot of fun I used to shoot duilest (one handed) then switched to frontiersman same as dualist but cap and ball pistols and black powder loads in your rifle and shotgun)

Just had trouble finding the time to reload all that ammo.



Yeah, the reloading is the tough part. I was fine when I was shooting smokeless. I set up my room with a Dillon 650 and can crank out 45 colt ammo pretty quick. When I switched over to black powder, it slowed the reloading process dramatically. To me, that is my biggest gripe with BP, it isn't the clean up, it is the slower reloading process.


yeah even with a blackpowder drop tube its sloooow.
was also reloading my dads ammo. deal was If I loaded the ammo hed pay my match fee's.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 8:25:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By David_Hineline:
They have stupid rules, they make rules against technology, they insist you play dress up.

They require guns of a style before a certain year, yet if you show up with a model 97 Wichester Pump shotgun they will make you download it to 2 shots because it's not fair to the double barrel shooters. If you choose a 12" real coach gun double like what would have been truly period rather than modern 18" shotgun they will refuse you to use that weapon. If you choose a semi auto loader of the time, they will ban you once again it's not fair to those who can only afford wheel guns.

They will force you to pick a silly identity and dress in costume. They will download thier guns to the point that you will have to push the bullet through the paper targets.

But if you like to play dress up, go for it.



Jesus H. Christ you're the most hate-filled motherfucker I've ever come across. You're worse than a liberal's spoiled teenage son.

I can't imagine there's anything people do, anywhere (and I'm including hot sex) that you would find appealling or not shit on somehow.

If I were you, I'd kill myself. (That's advice, btw.)
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 8:36:51 PM EDT
i think its a bit silly...at least up here they close down the whole range when these people come in for dress up..I mean..cowboy action shooting. Some of these guys have like 2 ft beard. They shun anything other than what they use. If you show up at the range and someone that uses blackpowder or is a Cowboy action shooter is there, forget it..you WILL get comments. "What you need a machine gun for" , "I see you brought an assault rifle with you", etc.

They like to stand outside to shoot a metal plate twice for the day and pretend they are in a town in the west back in the 1800s...then I come in with my rifles and they look at me like I have three heads because I dont have a revolver or lever action rifle.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 8:54:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By David_Hineline:
They have stupid rules, they make rules against technology, they insist you play dress up.

They require guns of a style before a certain year, yet if you show up with a model 97 Wichester Pump shotgun they will make you download it to 2 shots because it's not fair to the double barrel shooters. If you choose a 12" real coach gun double like what would have been truly period rather than modern 18" shotgun they will refuse you to use that weapon. If you choose a semi auto loader of the time, they will ban you once again it's not fair to those who can only afford wheel guns.

They will force you to pick a silly identity and dress in costume. They will download thier guns to the point that you will have to push the bullet through the paper targets.

But if you like to play dress up, go for it.



Damn, could you just be a little more of a curmudgeon? Is "Bah Humbug" your favorite saying? Lighten up, Francis.

Woody
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 8:56:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ar556223:

Originally Posted By David_Hineline:
They have stupid rules, they make rules against technology, they insist you play dress up.

They require guns of a style before a certain year, yet if you show up with a model 97 Wichester Pump shotgun they will make you download it to 2 shots because it's not fair to the double barrel shooters. If you choose a 12" real coach gun double like what would have been truly period rather than modern 18" shotgun they will refuse you to use that weapon. If you choose a semi auto loader of the time, they will ban you once again it's not fair to those who can only afford wheel guns.

They will force you to pick a silly identity and dress in costume. They will download thier guns to the point that you will have to push the bullet through the paper targets.

But if you like to play dress up, go for it.



Thanks for the info. I didnt know this stuff.



Neither does the asshole spouting nonsense.

For example, I've never been to a Match either at the club, national or international level that required that a 97 to only take 2 rounds, stoking it up was fine. Although it's a toss up who can get 6 shots off first a good double shooter or a 97 shooter both starting with a benched empty weapon. Since a 12" coach gun generally falls afoul of various laws it kind of makes sense not to allow them. The muzzle velocity is usually required to be up around 700-800 fps minimum, because that pretty much guarantees the pill will splatter and not come back. When you're shooting against steel plates as close as 10 yards you sure as hell don't want anything coming back. I guess if you could find a 1895 vintage autoloader you could use it at most club matches. But you're pretty much not going too find too many that can stand the rigors of the sport, even if they fit the 1895 rule.

The only reason Winchester 1897s and other pump shotguns are allowed is that there were some in the movie "The Wild Bunch" and that was one of the movies the founders patterned some of their shoots after. If they had it to do over (20/20 hindsight) they would have left it at wheel guns, side by sides and lever rifles in pistol calibers for the basic shoots. Side shoots involving single shot external hammer rifles, rifle caliber lever rifles. Wild Bunch shoots are popular, the rules are relaxed to allow 1911s, and WW1 vintage long guns.

(I think somebody got his butt waxed by some of the ladies and has been too embarassed to go back. That or calibers starting with .4are too intimidating)

Used to shoot CAS a lot but started working weekends. Yeah you better reload because you may run between 150 and 300 rounds a shoot of pistol ammo. BP isn't real conducive to loading by progressive presses.

You wanna see something funny watch Pa Danby showing them young bucks he can still move good, going to the shoot under the wagon position with his trapdoor going belly down rather than kneeling the way the shorter shooters could. (Wagon bottom to low for me to do it kneeling) And discovering that my 6 45-70 rounds on my belt are between me and the ground. Tarnation.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 9:16:25 PM EDT
CAS can be a lot of fun. I've been doing it for about 6 years.

SASS Forum (Single Action Shooting Society) is at sassnet.com/forums/

The handbooks are available online in Adobe Acrobat format www.sassnet.com/Shooters-Handbook-001A.php

Link Posted: 12/21/2005 9:36:11 PM EDT
I shoot it. Have a great time with it. As for dressing up, lets see a hat and a pair of boots vs, all the go fast tactical webgear, knee pads, etc. In the usual ARFCOM manner, I do BOTH!.

Great people, the first time I went they loaned me guns and ammo. Had a blast.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 10:48:21 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 2:36:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/22/2005 2:37:00 PM EDT by WWoodworth]

Originally Posted By David_Hineline:
IPSC shooters shoot jacked up high velocity rounds at steel at the same distances all the time and fear of spatter back is not an issue.


Or maybe jacketed ammo spatters less that full lead rounds...

The fact that 12" sawed off shotguns banned makes sense to you proves that SASS is for you.
Yes! Let's advocate the practice of making illegal weapons (for lots of people)

The fact that you would consider starting with an unloaded gun means you are perfect for SASS.
Absolutely. Learning to load (or reload) quickly under stress is such a bad thing!

The fact that you think getting beat by a girl with superior shooting abilities is an insult means that dressing up like a manly man cowboy and dis-respecting women means SASS is perfect for you.

Maybe if I understood what the f**k you are talking about, I could respond. But here's what I do know:

If constantly pissing on people by spewing shit that is either idiotic, condescending, or just plain pathetic is what you like, it means that ASS is the perfect name for YOU!

Woody
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 9:48:46 PM EDT

Originally Posted By David_Hineline:
IPSC shooters shoot jacked up high velocity rounds at steel at the same distances all the time and fear of spatter back is not an issue.

The fact that 12" sawed off shotguns banned makes sense to you proves that SASS is for you.

The fact that you would consider starting with an unloaded gun means you are perfect for SASS.

The fact that you think getting beat by a girl with superior shooting abilities is an insult means that dressing up like a manly man cowboy and dis-respecting women means SASS is perfect for you.



You really can't read either. Your Mama know your dribbling at the computer again? Did I ever say that I would consider starting with an unloaded gun? NO, I said that when starting with unloaded guns a good shooter with a double can often beat a pump gunner.

You really must have been beat by a 10 year old girl, you sure are whining like one.. Probably a good thing you don't like it. You don't sound like the kind of guy anybody here would want to be around.

Next time you show up at a 3 gun match, why don't you try to use a 12" shottie.
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