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Posted: 12/20/2005 7:05:23 PM EDT
[#1]
That thing has the ground clearance of a low-rider minivan.
 bob |
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Posted: 12/20/2005 7:16:58 PM EDT
[#2]
Finally,
I've been saying Hummers were crap since the Army adopted them in the 80's. Jeeps rule. |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 10:24:17 AM EDT
[#3]
I know what they look like.  Take a look at the front fenders and the rail down the side. Straight with crisp edges like the MUTT. None of the flowing curves like the Jeep has. |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 11:10:18 AM EDT
[#4]
General Dynamics Land Systems RSTV ETA: I can't believe the USMC is gonna buy a $70+ million V-22 and fly that little turd around on the inside. 
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Posted: 12/21/2005 11:28:18 AM EDT
[#5]
So, it's a modern MULE? 
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Posted: 12/21/2005 11:32:30 AM EDT
[#6]
Description:
The Internally Transportable Vehicle (ITV) will be a highly mobile weaponscapable light strike platform that can support a variety of operations. It will provide MAGTF ground combat units with a vehicle that is internally transportable in CH-53 and MV-22 aircraft. It also will provide reconnaissance units equal or greater mobility than the Marine Air-Ground Task Force MAGTF maneuver elements they support, thereby enhancing their mission performance and survivability. This is a joint program with U. S. Special Operations Command; the Marine Corps is the lead service. Operational Impact: The ITV will play a key role in Ship To Objective Maneuver, allowing MAGTF commanders to take maximum advantage of the speed and range offered by the MV-22 and CH-53 by deploying ground units equipped with highly mobile light-strike vehicles armed with heavy or medium machine guns. The Interim Fast Attack Vehicle is currently fielded and is deployable inside the CH-53 aircraft, but the GCE currently has no ground mobility platform that can deploy inside the MV-22. Program Status: The ITV Program is in the System Development and Demonstration Phase. A Request For Proposals was published in February 2004, with a contract awarded to General Dynamics Ordnance and Tactical Systems in November 2004. Initial operational capability is scheduled for January 2007, when one infantry battalion receives eight ITVs. News Release – Walnut, California, USA – November 11, 2004. CM Automotive Systems has been selected by American Growler an Ocala, Florida based-company as the CTIS supplier for a Marine Corps vehicle. The Marine Corps Systems Command has awarded General Dynamics Ordnance and Tactical Systems, St. Petersburg, Florida, a contract for the delivery of both Expeditionary Fire Support System (EFSS) and the V-22 Internally Transportable Vehicle (ITV). The prime mover for the EFFS (a towed 120 mm rifled mortar and a towed ammo supply trailer) and the ITV,V-22 fueled-powered vehicle will be built by American Growler who teamed up with General Dynamics and together presented a vehicle for this competition which was much more technologically advanced than the other competing vehicles. The contract, the information says, has an initial value of $18 million with options which if exercised, will bring the total cumulative value of the contract to $300 million. Work for this contract which was competitively procured via the Internet is expected to be completed by September 30, 2005. All this doesn't surprise me. Anyone who's read The All American Wonder or another history of the military Jeep knows it was conceived and developed as a lightweight vehicle. This is a return to that concept. When I was at Ft. Knox in the early '80s, the Army was doing M151 versus HMMVW mobility tests, and the M151 displayed superior off road mobility. I also know from experience that when an M151 or other lightweight vehicle gets stuck, a squad of men can muscle it free, when a Hummer will require a lot more men or a recovery vehicle. |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 11:36:47 AM EDT
[#7]
Someone stole my golf cart and painted it green!
I think I see my clubs in the back Check the POST NUBER>.........................<<<<<<<<<<<SHOT OUT! |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 11:38:03 AM EDT
[#8]
What no cooler of cheap domestic beer? 
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Posted: 12/21/2005 11:54:22 AM EDT
[#9]
I was in several artillery units that transitioned from the M151 to the HMMWV and there was no comparison on off-road capability. The HMMWV could negotiate obstacles far better than the Jeep. Yes, the Jeep is easier to recover , but I've never had to recover a HMMWV (and (I've rolled HMMWVs and buried them up to the hubs). The only problems we had in Germany and Korea was that the trails and ruts were already cut for Jeep width. That said, I agree about the need for a light vehicle. The HMMWV isn't a great idea when you've got only two people and personal gear. The Army should have considered a newer version of the Jeep (or continued to upgrade Jeeps with roll-bars and other safety equipment). |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 12:28:19 PM EDT
[#10]
The advantage may have been limited to wooded terrain. I only heard second hand information about the tests. I know there were lots of places in Germany and KY where you could get in an M151 where you could not get in a wider vehicle (without pushing over or cutting down trees). The military needs a lightweight diesel powered vehicle that will fit in the V22 and CH53 and is safer than the M151 was.. |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 12:30:32 PM EDT
[#11]
You mean the V-22 isn't the go anywhere, do anything, mach 2+ dreamboat we've all heard about? |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 12:43:51 PM EDT
[#12]
Looks kind of like the Humvee-like golf carts crossed with a Willy's. |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 12:51:03 PM EDT
[#13]
Stupid Question Time...
Anyone know if a modern Jeep TJ will fit inside of a V-22? I'm wondering why nobody in the .gov bothered to think about militarizing the current, 2005/06 widely available Jeep Wrangler (Rubicon package even) and using that? Why re-invent the damn wheel? And if for some reason it will not fit in a V-22, then why was the Osprey made so darn small? Is it just me, or does the .gov lack a certain amount of common sense... -Gator |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 12:52:24 PM EDT
[#14]
What? Didn't you ever see a M151A2 with ROPS, safety nets, and seat belts/ shoulder harness? At the end of the M151 they had updates for all of this. |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 1:02:10 PM EDT
[#15]
Someone needs to tell Growler about ground clearance.
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Posted: 12/21/2005 1:03:00 PM EDT
[#16]
Ahem..... M151-A2 Combat Attack Vehicle      |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 1:30:05 PM EDT
[#17]
Better yet, an LJ. Unlimited Rubicon. If you can get one off the lot for $25k, I'll bet the military could have them with Jeeps CRD engine, for $15k in quantity. Strip out the carpet and the 'luxury items' and you're done. And there's already a whole industry to make parts, mods, etc. Seems like it would be easier and cheaper. If they'll fit in a V-22. ETA: Known off road ability, too. |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 1:52:52 PM EDT
[#18]
Not meaning to hijack the thread, but where can you get an Unlimited Rubicon for $25K off a lot someplace? Lowest price I've seen is $27K.
-Gator |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 1:56:32 PM EDT
[#19]
Which is why I said, "continued to upgrade Jeeps with roll-bars and other safety equipment". |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 1:59:42 PM EDT
[#20]
I was going to post just that. |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 2:02:08 PM EDT
[#21]
If they'd sell one with a stripped down interior and the CRD for 15 grand, I'd buy one right now. |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 2:05:27 PM EDT
[#22]
How many thousand? I'm thinking that as a quantity number. Buy a thousand, all identically equipped, no features whatsoever... |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 2:06:31 PM EDT
[#23]
Rumors only. |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 2:07:25 PM EDT
[#24]
It will strike fear in the hearts of the enemy when the U.S.M.C. shows up to the battle in clown cars.
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Posted: 12/21/2005 2:08:36 PM EDT
[#25]
LMFAO! |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 2:32:52 PM EDT
[#26]
I remembered this and found it online: The military version of the Wrangler – the Jeep Wrangler TJL – continues the Jeep legend that began in 1941 when the American Army needed a tough and versatile cross-country vehicle. The result was the world’s first purpose built four-wheel drive vehicle – the Willys MB, nicknamed the ‘Jeep’. For the modern military, the Jeep Wrangler TJL has been modified to handle additional payloads with a heavy-duty axle, cargo bay and upgraded suspension. It features seating for eight people and a wheelbase 22 inches longer than the standard civilian vehicle. Power comes from a 4.0-litre PowerTech™ six-cylinder petrol engine mated to a five-speed manual transmission, or, for the first time in a Wrangler, the TJL will be available, from 2005, with a four-cylinder 2.8-litre diesel engine. Jeep showed the TJL and the COMBAT (Commercially BAsed Tactical) Truck at a military trade show in the UK a while back. Question in - would it fit in a V22 or CH53?  |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 2:34:26 PM EDT
[#27]
When's the CJ model going to be released
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Posted: 12/21/2005 2:40:22 PM EDT
[#28]
If they want armor and the ability to fit in a CH53, they should look at Wiesels  Or a BV-206S 
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Posted: 12/21/2005 2:41:46 PM EDT
[#29]
The liberals aren't going to like that.
1. NOT made in France. 2. No armor. |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 2:56:06 PM EDT
[#30]
Me Like
Looks like My Jeep.
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Posted: 12/21/2005 3:19:31 PM EDT
[#31]
Time to sell the car. I NEED that JEEP!!! |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 3:19:50 PM EDT
[#32]
I know. I'm just listing my specs. The sticker doesn't have to say 15, but the street price ought to be. An honestly, with nothing but the DOT necessary luxuries, why couldn't they sell a jeep for that, or maybe a little more? |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 4:41:02 PM EDT
[#33]
I think they do start at around $17K for a base model Wrangler with a 4 banger and a 6-spd manual trannie, 4wd and not much else. Like anything else, once you start piling on all the goodies, you can spend 10 grand more for the top of the line Rubicon long wheelbase model.
-Gator |
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Posted: 12/21/2005 5:16:41 PM EDT
[#34]
Now they are just being ridiculous.
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Posted: 12/22/2005 7:48:50 AM EDT
[#35]
ATVs ARE THE MILITARY'S VEHICLE OF CHOICE in the current war against terrorism. While massive tanks and Humvees were effective for the flatlands of the Gulf War, on the world's most rugged and unpredictable terrain, their largesse has rendered them almost useless. The Allied Forces had to look for alternative means of transportation. But other than mules and horses, what could be relied upon to climb the narrow, rocky trails up the mountains of Afghanistan?
The one ground vehicle that has seen substantial action is the same vehicle that millions of North Americans use every day for hunting, farming and weekend trail riding- the all-terrain vehicle (ATV). "The ATV has taken us off the roads and out of the deserts and enabled us to get into the mountains where the enemy in Afghanistan is hiding," said a military spokesman for Operation Enduring Freedom. "(We've) always looked for ways to enable troops to cover a lot of ground and open terrain. The need for that has never changed." Polaris Industries Inc. says it has shipped nearly 100 of its ATVs overseas for military use since the September 11 terrorist attacks. The Sportsman 700 Twin (pictured above) is the latest of the manufacturer's machines to be tapped for use in Operation Enduring Freedom. Their ATV is a powerhouse compared to the mules and horses normally used to navigate the treacherous topography that is the Afghani mountain trails, Polaris says. The Sportsman 700 Twin's large displacement engine and high ground clearance make it ideal for pursuing Taliban and Al-Queda forces from cave to cave. "We've been developing better and stronger ATVs since 1985, and it's good to know our machines are contributing to the war on terrorism," said Bennett Morgan, Polaris' ATV division general manager. "Our products have always been ideal for hunters and farmers, but we're very proud to know the military is using them with great success in Afghanistan."  www.aaro.ca/May%2023-Aug22-02-NwsBfs.html |
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Posted: 12/22/2005 8:39:23 AM EDT
[#36]
I have some hours in the M973A1 SUSV and they are the shit in deep ass snow. We used them to drive up to the base of the Gulkana Glaicier and ran all over Black Rapids training area with them. Deep snow and mountains are where they should live. They can run 55 miles an our down a paved highway without doing damage to the road. I think they are great vehicles and the chopped armored model looks very interesting.
operator out... |
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Posted: 12/22/2005 8:41:45 AM EDT
[#37]
the problem with the TJL is the gasoline engine. they should have used the commonrail diesel from the liberty. there is a big push to have 1 fuel on the battlefield. jet fuel. especially in the Corps. why spend the money to convert 30yr old M151s to diesel? after spending all that money you still have a 30yr old trucks. ever seen what Marines can do to a vehicle in 6mo? let alone 30yr.
the inside of the osprey is tiny. not a lot bigger than a CH-46 and this new solution is much better than a quad purchased COTS. youve got to seperate the wheat from the chaff in this thread. theres lots of good insight and lots of fantasy passed off as fact (like the tool who said the g-wagon will fit in the osprey) but the bottom line is the Corps should get some credit for thinking outside the box on this one to create a new concept of tactics capitalizing on the ospreys speed and depth of penetration into and beyond the littoral zone. |
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Posted: 12/22/2005 8:42:24 AM EDT
[#38]
So which politician(s) has friends/contributors in the business that will benefit from making this POS with my tax dollars?
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Posted: 12/22/2005 8:45:48 AM EDT
[#39]
It's an option. See Essayons post. |
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Posted: 12/22/2005 8:47:06 AM EDT
[#40]
From the quote in my first post above: "the TJL will be available, from 2005, with a four-cylinder 2.8-litre diesel engine" (obviously not to US civilians though  ) I agree with much of your post, though - the Corps doesn't need 30-year-old diesel M151s and should get credit for trying to capitalize on the ospreys capabilities.
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Posted: 1/4/2006 3:14:58 PM EDT
[#41]
link |
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Posted: 1/4/2006 3:24:42 PM EDT
[#42]
Read up on the development of the original Jeep or watch the History Channel show on the Jeep. It had its share of problems too. |
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Posted: 1/4/2006 3:35:52 PM EDT
[#43]
Nice but does it work?
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It's not looking too good for this prototype. Not anytime soon anyway.