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Posted: 10/13/2005 9:45:54 AM EDT
Could it be registered as pistol to avoid the SBR requirement to get it to spec?
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 9:47:59 AM EDT
It depends on your state. When I was in MI a shop in Royal Oak (Target Sports) had a Steyr Aur with a 7" barrel for sale. SBR's are a no-no in MI, so this was registered as a pistol.
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 9:48:02 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/13/2005 9:48:54 AM EDT by A-nus]
No, the receiver needs be designated a pistol at birth, and there are probably certain criteria it need to meet to be considered a pistol
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 9:49:27 AM EDT
No, it has a buttstock.

Kharn
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 9:50:36 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Silesius:
Could it be registered as pistol to avoid the SBR requirement to get it to spec?



Not really, you need to be able to remove the stock. There's no "stock" per se on a P90. Its much like a Steyr AUG, you cant really remove the "stock" on an AUG and still have it function.

You can do this with other rifles; like the AK series or the Ar15 series. But rarely on bullpups; and the P90 is really just a very small bullpup.

So the answer is that it would have to be a SBR only. If allowed.
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 9:50:56 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/13/2005 9:51:32 AM EDT by RRTX]

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
It depends on your state. When I was in MI a shop in Royal Oak (Target Sports) had a Steyr Aur with a 7" barrel for sale. SBR's are a no-no in MI, so this was registered as a pistol.



How is that possible, if it has ever had a stock it can't be registered as a pistol. The AUG and P90 both have integrated stocks so I don't see how it would be possible.

Edit: someone beat me to it
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 9:51:16 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/13/2005 9:51:33 AM EDT by Lockedon]

Originally Posted By Kharn:
No, it has a buttstock.

Kharn



+1 SBR is your only option. Or a transferrable MG if you can get one.
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 9:52:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/13/2005 9:52:53 AM EDT by CRC]
Add a forward grip and try for an AOW
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 9:57:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/13/2005 10:01:44 AM EDT by mayday]

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
It depends on your state. When I was in MI a shop in Royal Oak (Target Sports) had a Steyr Aur with a 7" barrel for sale. SBR's are a no-no in MI, so this was registered as a pistol.




Steyr AUG with a 7" barrel. Thats impossible if its in .223. I have a 14" AUG and the barrel comes right back to the front grip where the gas piston begins. I just dont see how its possible to shorten the barrel any more than the 14" shown below.



p.s. For the record, the one pictured is NOT my AUG. I just didnt have the AUG at the office with me to take a picture of at this point. But its identical, except that it has an extended flash hidder welded on to make it 16"
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 10:02:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mayday:

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
It depends on your state. When I was in MI a shop in Royal Oak (Target Sports) had a Steyr Aur with a 7" barrel for sale. SBR's are a no-no in MI, so this was registered as a pistol.




Steyr AUG with a 7" barrel. Thats impossible if its in .223. I have a 14" AUG and the barrel comes right back to the front grip where the gas piston begins. I just dont see how its possible to shorten the barrel any more than the 14" shown below.

img.photobucket.com/albums/v690/burleysmythe1/14incha2aug.jpg

p.s. For the record, the one pictured is NOT my AUG. I just didnt have the AUG at the office with me to take a picture of at this point. But its identical, except that it has an extended flash hidder welded on to make it 16"



Thats even impossible on the 9mm AUG
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 10:10:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/13/2005 10:11:42 AM EDT by motown_steve]

Originally Posted By mayday:

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
It depends on your state. When I was in MI a shop in Royal Oak (Target Sports) had a Steyr Aur with a 7" barrel for sale. SBR's are a no-no in MI, so this was registered as a pistol.




Steyr AUG with a 7" barrel. Thats impossible if its in .223. I have a 14" AUG and the barrel comes right back to the front grip where the gas piston begins. I just dont see how its possible to shorten the barrel any more than the 14" shown below.





I don't make the news, I just report it. The AUG that they had looked just like that one too, only it didn't have the Beta C. The Flash hider was literally right at the end of the little area where the pistol grip attached (can't really call it a hand guard). I don't think it had the forward pistol grip though.
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 10:15:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/13/2005 10:26:14 AM EDT by mcantu]

Originally Posted By motown_steve:

Originally Posted By mayday:

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
It depends on your state. When I was in MI a shop in Royal Oak (Target Sports) had a Steyr Aur with a 7" barrel for sale. SBR's are a no-no in MI, so this was registered as a pistol.




Steyr AUG with a 7" barrel. Thats impossible if its in .223. I have a 14" AUG and the barrel comes right back to the front grip where the gas piston begins. I just dont see how its possible to shorten the barrel any more than the 14" shown below.

img.photobucket.com/albums/v690/burleysmythe1/14incha2aug.jpg




I don't make the news, I just report it. The AUG that they had looked just like that one too, only it didn't have the Beta C. The Flash hider was literally right at the end of the little area where the pistol grip attached (can't really call it a hand guard). I don't think it had the forward pistol grip though.



The problem is that if an AUG had a 7" barrel, it would come out just in front of where the trigger is
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 10:21:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/13/2005 10:23:41 AM EDT by Kharn]

Originally Posted By mcantu:
The problem is that for an AUG to have a 7" barrel, it would come out just in front of where the trigger is

And how would you 1. find an AUG reciever that had never been put in a complete buttstock and 2. design a new plastic stock that was not shoulder-fired?


Originally Posted By CRC:
Add a forward grip and try for an AOW

It cant be an AOW since its already a rifle.

Kharn
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 11:15:25 AM EDT
The real question is...

Is a reciever with a pad or nothing at all, still a reciever? Or is it a stock, if so then where does the reciever end and the stock begin?
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 11:50:19 AM EDT

Originally Posted By FunYun1983:
The real question is...

Is a reciever with a pad or nothing at all, still a reciever? Or is it a stock, if so then where does the reciever end and the stock begin?



Well on the AUG the receiver is the big metal thing that slides into the stock...dont know about the P90 though
Link Posted: 10/13/2005 2:35:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/13/2005 2:37:40 PM EDT by TheSneak]

Originally Posted By CRC:
Add a forward grip and try for an AOW



P90s already have a foreward grip.
Link Posted: 10/18/2005 3:17:25 AM EDT
SBRs are a no-no in MI, and in order to be registered as a pistol, the AUG would have to be between 26" and 30" in overall length. Anything under 26" is a SBR, anything over 30" is a rifle.
Link Posted: 10/18/2005 3:31:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2005 3:32:13 AM EDT by Kharn]

Originally Posted By metroplex:
SBRs are a no-no in MI, and in order to be registered as a pistol, the AUG would have to be between 26" and 30" in overall length. Anything under 26" is a SBR, anything over 30" is a rifle.

Federally, an SBR is under 26" or a barrel under 16", rifle is anything bigger than 26" overall and a 16" barrel. Where'd you get 30" from?

A pistol is completely different and must come from the factory books as a pistol. You cannot convert a rifle into a pistol (unless you want to pay the SBR tax, but then, its an SBR that happens to look like a pistol), but you can convert a pistol into a rifle and back again. AOWs can be made from pistols, but not rifles or shotguns since they are/were intended to be fired from the shoulder.

Kharn
Link Posted: 10/18/2005 4:13:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2005 4:24:40 AM EDT by metroplex]

Originally Posted By Kharn:

Originally Posted By metroplex:
SBRs are a no-no in MI, and in order to be registered as a pistol, the AUG would have to be between 26" and 30" in overall length. Anything under 26" is a SBR, anything over 30" is a rifle.

Federally, an SBR is under 26" or a barrel under 16", rifle is anything bigger than 26" overall and a 16" barrel. Where'd you get 30" from?

A pistol is completely different and must come from the factory books as a pistol. You cannot convert a rifle into a pistol (unless you want to pay the SBR tax, but then, its an SBR that happens to look like a pistol), but you can convert a pistol into a rifle and back again. AOWs can be made from pistols, but not rifles or shotguns since they are/were intended to be fired from the shoulder.

Kharn



30" is a MI thing.
I'm pretty sure SBRs are outlawed in MI... unless you can get by with an exception (if any). I do know you can have AK pistols and register them as pistols usually those are side-folders or under-folder AKs that measure between 26" and 30". Once registered as a pistol, I suppose you could carry the AK lol if it doesn't print. But yeah the receiver has to be registered as a pistol from the get-go.

I'm unsure about AOWs being allowed in MI (i.e. with the proper tax and paperwork, having a forehand grip for a Glock)
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:06:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Silesius:
Could it be registered as pistol to avoid the SBR requirement to get it to spec?



Just an update:
PS90 must be registered as a pistol in MI, but on the 4473, it is a rifle. To make it short: it's considered/treated as a pistol in MI but a rifle to the Feds. SBRs are not legal in MI, so it must remain in stock form with the 16.1" barrel. Check your state laws, MI requires anything with a 16" or longer barrel that has an overall length between 26" and 30" to be registered as a pistol. Longer than 30" is treated as a long gun.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:15:34 PM EDT
Anything with an OAL of under 30" is a "handgun" in Michigan.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:21:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
It depends on your state. When I was in MI a shop in Royal Oak (Target Sports) had a Steyr Aur with a 7" barrel for sale. SBR's are a no-no in MI, so this was registered as a pistol.



An AUG?
If it's got a stock (how could it not?) and a short barrel, it's a Short Barreled Rifle.

Michigan only registers rifles with lengths less than 30" as pistols so they can track them. It doesn't change federal law.
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