Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: It's not the operator, it's the 7,000 pounds of steel being wielded by a soccer mom who's yakking on the phone, that swerves in front of you, and makes you dead. yup, two years ago i saw two 19 year old guys die right in front of me when a soccer mom ran over them.  she pulled out in front of them, they slammed into her suburban, for some reason she put it in reverse and backed over them That's messed up (ie, intent). What happened to the bitch?

If I were the DA, I'd go for 2 counts of second-degree murder.  That's awful.

Those that label a motorcycle as 'two wheeled death' aren't much better than those that cluck about having a firearm in the home as a disaster waiting to happen. A tool, used properly, is no danger to its operator.

Apples and oranges.  Your tool isn't the problem; it's the other guy's tool.

Also, I rarely see one being used properly.  Most use them for what they were designed for; high speed. I would do the same, which is why I don't have one .

Eddie

Get it. Then wrap it up in tinfoil and after the EMP kills all the cars, break it out.

They were a big fad a few years ago here with the Boys Who Want New Toys. Then a local neurosurgeon hit some gravel and doesn't have many neuros any more. Garages all over the neighborhood cleared out fast. If I ever contract an incurable disease I'm gonna get TWO.

Quoted: Quoted: Those that label a motorcycle as 'two wheeled death' aren't much better than those that cluck about having a firearm in the home as a disaster waiting to happen. A tool, used properly, is no danger to its operator. It's not the operator, it's the 7,000 pounds of steel being wielded by a soccer mom who's yakking on the phone, that swerves in front of you, and makes you dead. Lemme guess, you don't ride where there are cars, or you have cat-like senses?

True, the 2 times I got hit it was by someone that wasn't paying attention. I was licky that I excped both with only some brusing and a twisted knee.

Still though, I miss my scooter.

Quoted: Get it. Then wrap it up in tinfoil and after the EMP kills all the cars, break it out. They were a big fad a few years ago here with the Boys Who Want New Toys. Then a local neurosurgeon hit some gravel and doesn't have many neuros any more. Garages all over the neighborhood cleared out fast. If I ever contract an incurable disease I'm gonna get TWO.

Would you happen to know what kind of gear he/she had on?  Just curious.  Thanks.

I'm seriously considering buying a bike soon (already took MSF and have my 'M'), and I'm trying to get an idea of how many motorcycle fatalities or serious injuries are caused by something the rider could have easily prevented, such as a head injury with no helmet or reckless/drunk riding, and how much was "totally out of the blue" like badly placed gravel patches, deer, other drivers doing crap the rider couldn't have reasonably predicted, etc.).

Admiral,
I cant recall the exact number on the drinking thing but it was something like two-thirds of those involved in accidents had been drinking.

I had a bike and loved it until somebody tried to pass me on a back road (solid lines in 55 zone), hit my back tire on the way around and left me impaled on a tree after I went flying off the road.  Last thing I remember hearing before I hit was him flooring it down the road.  I was left for dead on the side of the road trapped under my hot bike (it hit the tree above me and then fell on top of me).  A lady and her kids stopped after they saw me in the ditch and were treated to a scene that probably still keeps those kids up at night....

If I had been in a car, I MAY have sustained minor injuries.  But because I was on a motorcycle with little weight (compared to a truck) or protection, I should have died.  I broke my back in 3 places, broke every rib (front and back), punctured both lungs, dislocated hip, broke legs, etc.  I still have the burn mark from the exhaust, the scars from the chest tubes and know when a storm is coming, BUT I AM GREATFUL TO BE ALIVE.  I'm now married with two daughters and enjoying one of the better parts of my life.  Sometimes I look at them and feel really dumb for risking their existance.  I will always remember my family saying goodbye to me as I went into the operating room.  Me - I don't ride any more.  I still take risks, though.  

I'm not here to tell anybody not to ride.  Don't ignore the risk, though - it's there.  I'm no spokesman.  In fact, I haven't talked about it in years.  I just get upset with people who claim it's no big deal or just like having a gun in your home.  It is a risk, and it can cost you everything.  If you understand that and are okay with it, then ride away!  

    Black Fox

I've ridden for many moons, but I'm currently bikeless.  I took out a little bike for a short spin a little while ago...ok...it wasn't exactly little.  It was a ZX-12R and Wow!  A ton of fun...er...rather about 512lbs of fun.  Stunning performance.  I looked at getting one (or a CBR1100XX) on two different occasions but ended up passing on it.  My wife brought it up the first time as a commuting possibility.  I could afford a used commuter car or a bike, but not both.  Basically it came down to one of risk.  If I had the funds to have a bike for a weekend jaunt where I wanted to go and when I wanted to, I might still get one.  But to have a bike that I have to drudge through rush hour traffic, regardless of weather, etc....I went with the car.  Plus the car has A/C in this Arizona heat.

I almost bought it today thanks to some stupid fucking early 30s year old bitch in an Excursion who was too busy talking and driving at 55mph to notice the light was red.  Stupid ass lady was probably complaining about the price of gas too as she was going to get her nails done.

No damn way I'd ride a bike on public streets.  Not until we have something resembling driving standards.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Those that label a motorcycle as 'two wheeled death' aren't much better than those that cluck about having a firearm in the home as a disaster waiting to happen. A tool, used properly, is no danger to its operator. This tool requires you to be really aware of the tools around you operating their tools before they take you out. No different than firearms.  Have you been to a public range lately?

Hey, don't be a tool.

Get a truck. They're safer.

Quoted: You are a lucky man to have such a loving wife. www.totalmotorcycle.com/pics/Motorcycle-Accident-Intersection1.jpg

You guys are idiots. I would say look at the stats and start a meaningful discussion, but why waste the time.
Motorcycles are pretty much as safe as the driver.
Excess speed, DUI,  and/or inexperience result in  most crashes.

Quoted: Quoted: You are a lucky man to have such a loving wife. www.totalmotorcycle.com/pics/Motorcycle-Accident-Intersection1.jpg You guys are idiots. I would say look at the stats and start a meaningful discussion, but why waste the time. Motorcycles are pretty much as safe as the driver. Excess speed, DUI,  and/or inexperience result in  most crashes.

You're only as safe as the people around you.

Damn, I want a bike so bad right now my pee pee hurts.  

I almost have enough cash to go get a nice used CBR 9545RR.  I don't want to finance anything.  

If you know what you are doing, get the bike.  

Screw all the babies who scream death machine.  

As Vincent said, "you get killed walking your doggie!"  

'nuff said...

If I did it'd be for country cruising and my literally 1/5th of a mile commute to work.  Instead of a truck and an accord it'd be a bike and a suburban or a supercab truck.

Quoted: You guys are idiots. I would say look at the stats and start a meaningful discussion, but why waste the time. Motorcycles are pretty much as safe as the driver. Excess speed, DUI,  and/or inexperience result in  most crashes.

Please tell me what I did wrong then?  I was hit from behind.  I'm really curious about this was a result of anything I did or how my safety as a driver had anything to do with it?  

Quoted: Screw all the babies who scream death machine. As Vincent said, "you get killed walking your doggie!"

True - but how many people get killed walking their dog versus riding a motorcycle?  So using your logic, please enjoy a jump out of a plane without a parachute at your earliest convenience and let us know how it goes.  After all, there's no such thing as risky in your book since you can get killed walking your doggie.....

Quoted: Those that label a motorcycle as 'two wheeled death' aren't much better than those that cluck about having a firearm in the home as a disaster waiting to happen. A tool, used properly, is no danger to its operator.

 

Yeah but  if I'm shooting my gun,   usually some other gun doesn't come flying out of nowhere and smash into me and turn me into catfood.

usually.

Bikes are a good thing.

Quoted: Quoted: Screw all the babies who scream death machine. As Vincent said, "you get killed walking your doggie!" True - but how many people get killed walking their dog versus riding a motorcycle?  So using your logic, please enjoy a jump out of a plane without a parachute at your earliest convenience and let us know how it goes.  After all, there's no such thing as risky in your book since you can get killed walking your doggie.....

How old are you?  12?  

Change your man-gina pad, take the rubber ball out of your mouth, and slide out the plug .  

This discussion is restricted to MEN ONLY.  Go do some housework and make me a sandwich.  

You are forbidden from this thread.  

enough of the damn whining.  Yes bikes are dangerous.  Yes you can improve your chances by being a safe, alert, trained rider.  No you still can't control the other idiots on the road.  Thats just reality.  I've been an EMT for 6 years, none of you is gonna tell me anything I don't know about bike wrecks.  Trust me I've seen it.  The point of this thread was talking about how cool my wife can be sometimes.  Once or twice she's come home and said.  I don't like that gun, lets get me one I do, and once.  I like this one I'm keeping it go find yourself another one.  Now she wants me to get a bike which is kinda cool.  It boils back down to the same thing as helmets/no helmets.  A wreck where the person doesn't have a helmet doesnt require any more tax payer money than a wreck with one.  So stop whining, and stop trying to impose your unwanted opinions on the people that know how relax.  Let your assholes stay so puckered you can't get a straight pin up them and we'll be over here living the good life relaxing having fun.  And yeah, we may die.  What kind of life did you have if you live to be 90 and never do shit out of fear of getting hurt and time wasted whining and complaining about other people and the fun they have.

Quoted: enough of the damn whining.  Yes bikes are dangerous.  Yes you can improve your chances by being a safe, alert, trained rider.  No you still can't control the other idiots on the road.  Thats just reality.  I've been an EMT for 6 years, none of you is gonna tell me anything I don't know about bike wrecks.  Trust me I've seen it.

Anecdote time!

The week after I bought my most recent car...that is, the week after I passed on buying a bike (a sweet CBR1100XX)...I saw a friend who's an EMT.  That same day he got a call of an accident.  He was less than a block away and was on the scene immediately.  An LEO saw the accident.  Basically a lady turned left in front of a bike.  The bike rider did nothing wrong and didn't stand a chance, the lady had been waiting to turn left for awhile and pegged it perfectly.

The rider went over the handlebars and his head (helmet was on) hit the B-pillar, the post between the front and rear window on her 4-door sedan.  My friend arrive right after it happened and he could tell the guy was dead.  The part that shook up my friend a little was what fell out of the guy's jacket and was laying next to him.  First was his wallet which had opened up and there was a family portrait of the rider and his wife and kids.  Second was his cell phone, which started ringing as my friend was on the scene!  The LEO took down the number and later the LEO told my friend that it was the guy's wife calling....all of 3 minutes after the guy died.

When I ride, I notice that I'm a wee bit jumpier than normal regarding other cars.  If a car doesn't stop quick enough, I'll nail the brakes or throttle or whatever's needed without causing an accident (yeah, that wouldn't be good!).  Most all the time, the car does see me and stops or finally does what it was supposed to.  But...about once every 3-4 weeks or so...the car doesn't stop and keeps going on it's merry way, and if I hadn't taken evasive action, I would have been another statistic.

Quoted: Quoted: You guys are idiots. I would say look at the stats and start a meaningful discussion, but why waste the time. Motorcycles are pretty much as safe as the driver. Excess speed, DUI,  and/or inexperience result in  most crashes. Please tell me what I did wrong then?  I was hit from behind.  I'm really curious about this was a result of anything I did or how my safety as a driver had anything to do with it?

When I rode I always checked my rear view mirror when I came to a stop, as recommended by other riders and MSF.

Quoted: Screw all the babies who scream death machine. As Vincent said, "you get killed walking your doggie!"

That funny, I always use that quote when people talk about getting killed on a motorcycle...

True - but how many people get killed walking their dog versus riding a motorcycle?  So using your logic, please enjoy a jump out of a plane without a parachute at your earliest convenience and let us know how it goes.  After all, there's no such thing as risky in your book since you can get killed walking your doggie.....

1) People die in cars too
2) Jumping out a plane without a chute is sure death, there are plenty of people who ride motorcycles their whole lives without dying.  To use that logic, putting a gun to your head and pulling the trigger would be "risky".  There is a difference between doing something relatively more hazardous than something else, and commiting suicide.
3) If you are afraid of anything dangerous you should just stay inside in a padded room.

Quoted: Quoted: It's not the operator, it's the 7,000 pounds of steel being wielded by a soccer mom who's yakking on the phone, that swerves in front of you, and makes you dead. yup, two years ago i saw two 19 year old guys die right in front of me when a soccer mom ran over them.  she pulled out in front of them, they slammed into her suburban, for some reason she put it in reverse and backed over them

Happened to a buddy of mine in HS. Riding a little mini-bike [the kind that looked like a miniature sport-bike] through an intersection, drunk couple in a suburban ran the light and plowed right over him at 50 mph. While he was laying in the street hemmoraging, they went to a convenience store to get breath mints. He lived for a day on life support before he expired.

All of the males in my family ride...except for me. The last major accident was my bro...he hit a culvert at 70+ mph. Bounced a couple of times, ended up wrapped around a tree. The paramedics had to cut the tree down to get him untangled. He spent 9 months in the hospital recovering. Of course, it was his fault...he says it was a front fork malf, But the fact is that he was racing. Also, he has totalled every bike he's ever owned by doing stupid shit.

My dad had a head on collision with an illegal immigrant while riding his triumph bonneville. The illegal was driving on the wrong side of the road one morning, my dad came around a corner and was blindsided. Broke shoulder, broke leg, 150 stitches in one leg and 35 in his ballsack .

I've lost several friends in bike crashes. Witnessed a few. The last one I saw, a kid on a sport bike lost control on I-45, and rode the concrete barrier for 100 yards or so. I pulled over to help [nobody else did]. Most of the left side of his body was missing skin, Part of his left foot was missing, part of his left hand was missing, all kinds of bone sticking out of body...poor kid. He was 18 or 19, riding a light bike on a windy winter day, with no experience and wearing cotton clothes and sneakers.  

Don't get me wrong, I like bikes, rode dirt bikes and some small street bikes when I was a kid, but I won't get one. Not a flame to anyone who rides...I just don't trust other folks on the road.

Quoted: Quoted: You are a lucky man to have such a loving wife. www.totalmotorcycle.com/pics/Motorcycle-Accident-Intersection1.jpg You guys are idiots. I would say look at the stats and start a meaningful discussion, but why waste the time. Motorcycles are pretty much as safe as the driver. Excess speed, DUI,  and/or inexperience result in  most crashes.

Can you cite a source to support that? I did a brief search, and found that motorcycle rider error was cited as a cause of two thirds of single vehicle accidents, but that the other driver is at fault in two thirds of the multiple vehicle collisions, and that failure of other drivers is the predominating cause of motorcycle accidents overall. That would support the posit that an individual cyclist's skill is no protection from a collision, and would appear to refute your claim that most crashes are caused by poor cyclist driving habits.
www.motorcycle-accidents.com/pages/stats.html

One thing I've noticed in 17 years as a medic is that the vast majority of motorcycle fatalities I've seen would have lived if they had been in the same collision as a belted car driver instead of being on a cycle. I've also been personally involved in four vehicle accidents. I was sitting still for three of them ( one parked, two sitting at red lights) and struck a deer the other time. Wasn't at fault in any of them, wasn't injured in any of them. At least two of them would have resulted in significant injury or death if I'd been on a bike instead of in a car / truck.

Chances are you will be involved in a motor vehicle collision sooner or later. You get to decide how well protected you'll be when that happens.

I also adjudicate disability claims as a side job. I get to read lots and lots of medical records pertaining to people who engage in risky behaviors, get injured as a result, and expect you and I to pay their medical bills and support them for the rest of their lives as a result. While I fully believe that an adult has the right to do what they want as long as it doesn't hurt others (smoke, ride a crotch rocket, get drunk and decide to go rafting), it galls me to see society as a whole paying for their actions.