Quoted: Since you're the expert, I have a question. Fatties always whine about the media brainwashing us guys into thinking fat chicks aren't hot.  They imply this change happened recently.  When, in the history of print & motion pictures, did they show a bunch of fatties, if ever? Thanks!

Fatties in fashion predate "film" and much like Middle Age depictions of dragons, I believe "fat women in vogue" are just a myth.

Now the "stick thin" thing (Calista Flockhart) probably began with Twiggy in the 60s. And much like "fatties" I find stick figures pretty repulsive, Kate Moss would have been cute with an extra 20 pounds on her.

But standards of attractiveness have been more or less uniform (as can be seen from the first silent films to the present). Pretty sure most guys here would have wanted to do "Jane."

Quoted: Good stuff! I bet it was hard work watching all those provocative movies . This also serves to dispel one of my least favorite myths - that the past was some perfect, rosy place, where we had every freedom you could think of, everything was clean and polite, and everything's going to hell now. With this evidence, we see that the turn of the century had movies just as explicit as anything we could think up now, and that we have never really changed at all in that respect. Which brings me to my thesis and guiding philosoply: We are living in the Golden Ages. Pretty much everything is better now then it has ever been before. Every measure of standard of living has been increasing steadily worldwide for at least a century, if not longer. The state of worldwide freedom is better then it has ever been before, and looks like it will get even better in the years to come. Not just for one race or one country, but everyone, all over the world. Billions of people over the years would kill to have it as good as we do now, or die, that their families could have it this good. So why are there so many pessimists out there trying to diminish all the things we have accomplished over the years, and all the things we are working for now (usually using the imaginary loosening of morality as their main example)? Hell if I know. I recommend that they get a grip, read some history, appreciate all the things that we've accoplished over the last few thousand years or so, and help us go even further. For everyone else, just stop listening to all these negative people, and keep doing what you do. ETA: BTW, hope I didn't hijack your thread too much.

That was actually one of my initial points that you elaborated on.

And the "morality" of the olden days was not some idyllic standard that we used to all subscribe to but merely forced legislation. We didn't choose morality in movies anymoe than we chose to not own machine guns. But certain conservatives will try and convince you that only recent "degenerate" generations have interest in nudity and sexual themes and no past "golden age" generation ever had such thoughts and certain liberals will try and convince you that only recent "militant" types have any interest in military type firearms and machine guns and no "golden age" generation of the past had any interest in such things.

As for why "some" people want to try and return to this mythical golden age is simply because they cannot adapt to life and all that it is. Just as the Taliban wants to drag everyone back to the 1300s and live in caves there are certain elements in this country that want to go back to the so called "good old days" that never really existed. Certainly there were things that were better about past times (I don't think a lot of the crap we deal with today was tolerated) but they had a lot of problems too, many of which no longer exist. And in 100 years there will be people yearning to return to simpler times like the beginning of the 21rst century when life was carefree and problems didn't exist. And we certainly didn't have things like sexual thoughts and military firearms.

Quoted: Great work. I always believes the penduleum swings back and forth in cultures. Hopefully the gun penduleum is still going our way.

Seems to be. Despite all the smut out there to distract us we did get the AW Ban from being renewed and Kerry was defeated which probably staved off serious risk of new federal gun laws being passed.

Question:  How/Where did you find the screencaps for the earlier (silent) movies?

Quoted: Question:  How/Where did you find the screencaps for the earlier (silent) movies?

I have most of them in my library. A lot of old, rare stuff is out on DVD. The only one not on DVD that I need is "Sign of the Cross" and those screen shots were taken from a doucmentary which cited the film.

I wish somebody would get "Sign of the Cross" out on DVD.

Quoted: Bravo!!!  YEAH!!!  Perfect!!! I loved the original post and I LOVE the way you make the point about Freedom being the real issue.  Too many people think it's all fine and dandy to oppress others or limit activities that they have no wish to take take part in, even if that activity harms no one.  Sadly the whole Left/Right or Damnocrat/Republican linear way of thinking perpetuates this. Why can't people leave everybody else the hell alone?!?!  If there ain't a victim, there ain't a crime... mind your own business, for crying out loud!  (that goes for the "left" and the "right")

Sadly it's all too easy for people to throw into the "camp" mentality.

If a person likes to watch porn and has no interest in guns, it only takes conservatives who threaten his freedom to watch adult material to make him jump on the liberal bandwagon.

If a person likes guns but has no interest in adult material of a sexual nature, it only takes liberals who threaten his freedoms to own any gun he wants to make him jump on the conservative bandwagon.

And any person who wants the freedom to do either must pick and choose carefully because neither camp has all of their best interests in mind.

And it's not exclusively a Republican/Demcrat thing in every case. Republican President George Bush Sr. gave us the first AW Ban (89 Import Ban) and that one is arguably worse than the Clinton ban in that it has no sunset clause and notorious gun grabber Diane Feinstein as Mayor of San Francisco campaigned to have the O'Farrell Theater (run by the notorious Mitchell Brothers) closed down in an anti porn campaign in the 1980s.

The bottom line is if you don't share someone's values or beliefs it is often far too easy to deny them.

The ACLU as a secular group constantly seeks to deny First Amendment rights of those who are religious while claiming they are acting in accordance to the First Amendment. And many people of a religious nature would like to see a Constitutionally illegal establishment of a "state religion."

Sadly most Americans are only in favor of those "freedoms" which they approve of. And few are willing to make allowances for others and those freedoms they don't particularly care for.

And quite frankly I know how some people feel about sexual content in film. I "feel" the same way about male homosexuality. I personally find it distgusting, unatural, offensive and I simply DO NOT wish to ever see it.

But at the same time I would never support any law making homosexuality illegal or banning homosexual content in books, film or paid television.

Just like porn I don't think homosexuality should be on "public TV" nor should it ever be promoted in schools or any other public forum. Sadly this isn't the case and homosexuality often is promoted in schools and on public TV and other public forums.

But that is the ONLY restrictions I'd advocate and support. Much as I find it repellent I find the idea of me forcing MY values on others even more offensive and I will in turn not tolerate the same.

I think Americans should remain free to be homosexual if that is how they wish to live their life. They should be free to produce and view movies and books realted to that lifestyle if they choose to and NOBODY should be able to deny them their freedom.

Now just as with gun owners, they need to be accountable for their actions as a result of how they live their life. Pedophiles should be dealt with severely and I think we need to take practical steps to control the threat of AIDS. But I think these things also apply to heterosexuals who are pedophiles or have AIDS so it isn't specifically a homosexual issue.

And so long as you warn me about shows like "Queer as Folk" and spare me the damn parade (or at least give me a Heterosexual Pride Parade where strippers parade down the street and try and pick me up) I won't have any objections to someone being homosexual. Even if I don't have a damn thing in common and find the entire thing completely repulsive.

Quoted: You forgot the largest grossing (profits) film of all time...DEEP THROAT.

I figured I'd stay mainstream without delving into the history of X. Be kinda hard to stay CoC friendly.

Saturday Kabump.

Saturday Night Kabump.

Quoted: Man SteyrAUG, you sound like my kinda guy.  Usually, if/when I ever make the mistake of venturing anything "political" around here, I'm almost immediately called a "liberal" and lumped in with Michael Moore.    When basically my core beliefs in Freedom simply mean that everybody should be free to do whatever the hell they want to, as long as it doesn't victimize somebody else. (that and the fact that I think nearly ALL politicians are lying scumbags, whether they're a Damnocrat or a Republican) oh well.

Well I don't think ALL politicians are lying scumbags, just too many of them are. I'm sure there are some decent folks who work hard trying to do what is right who as a result never make the news.