Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Site Notices
Posted: 6/17/2001 10:25:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/17/2001 10:25:41 PM EDT by ms70]
In early last December I went to the show in Middletown, NY & ran into the table run by "Gunsmiths Shooting Products" of Harleysville, PA. He was selling nice cleaning rods. He didn't have the length I wanted but he said he would get it made for me & mail it. So I paid for the rod, S&H: $23.95. "It'll take a few weeks." Late January, no rod. I call. "Oh, we have a big order in & we have to fill that first. We'll get yours out in a few weeks." Ok....... Mid March, no rod. I call. "Oh, we have a big order in & we have to fill that first. We'll get yours out in a few weeks." Ok....... Mid April, no rod. I call. Same thing. This time I tell him to just mail my money back to me & forget the rod. 5 sec silence. "Hold on." Connected to a girl who takes all the info & said they'll send the check. You'll never guess the next part..... End of May: NO CHECK!! Surprise surprise surprise! Called back & the phone was disconnected. I posted this so you can be aware of this thief if you see him. And just in case the guilty party is on this board: [-!-]
Link Posted: 6/17/2001 10:30:30 PM EDT
I HATE those kinds of Thieves [pissed] If they are here, I give em a [-!-!-] too. People like that need to be put in prison, or worse[;)] [frag]
Link Posted: 6/17/2001 10:34:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/17/2001 10:32:06 PM EDT by zeus]
Death to all Gun Show thieves
Link Posted: 6/17/2001 10:34:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/17/2001 10:32:37 PM EDT by ms70]
Thanks guys! [beer]
Link Posted: 6/17/2001 10:35:30 PM EDT
Yup, makes you wonder how many people he did that too. A person like that can only show up at a certain place for a limited time... if that's his/her game. Gunshow= Carnaval...... lets go see what kind of 'freaks' are there. (No offence to members who do go and sell at shows.)
Link Posted: 6/17/2001 10:35:37 PM EDT
Please post his phone number and/or web address so that we can urge him to send out your merchandise ! It wasn't H*******, the gunshow whore,was it? (evil word was censored)
Link Posted: 6/17/2001 10:38:31 PM EDT
The phone was disconnected & no web site. Maybe if he steals from more folks he'll be able to afford a .com like "istealatgunshows.com" or something.
Link Posted: 6/17/2001 10:44:24 PM EDT
If you were in NY for the show, and the 'dealer' stated his place was out of PA...and he took your money...that is a FEDERAL crime of fraud involving interstate commerce... I don't know how exactly you would go about it...but, you may want to alert the proper authorities about this...at least have it reported and on paper...hopefully you kept your reicept!! I hate to hear about stuff like this...it makes reputable dealers look bad...and I am sorry to hear about it happening to you...ch
Link Posted: 6/17/2001 10:44:41 PM EDT
What a sack of shit... I H_A_T_E people like that... I agree. Dude, if you are on this board, I hope you get cancer. Yep....Cancer. Not just a bad streak of luck, or a dent in your car door, If you are such a pathetic loser as to rip off a fellow shooter for a measly twenty five bucks, pancreatic cancer to you, asshole.
Link Posted: 6/17/2001 10:52:31 PM EDT
If you had paid with a credit card you could have the charges reversed and get your money back no questions asked. Your credit card company will do it and credit back your account. You might also call the gun show operator and let him know what happened to you so he can keep this kind of trash out of it next time.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 12:00:29 AM EDT
It's hard to believe the lengths people will go to to screw others. I mean, who would risk getting their ass kicked over $23? If you're going to screw someone, you should do it big time, like the gun store that sold me the Colt MT6551 three days before the ban in December 1999. How's $1000 over retail sound? I kid you not, $1700. Serves me right for waiting until the last minute.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 12:39:34 AM EDT
Originally Posted By mattja: It's hard to believe the lengths people will go to to screw others. I mean, who would risk getting their ass kicked over $23? If you're going to screw someone, you should do it big time
View Quote
Well..If this guy is traveling to Shows and has various items (Not just cleaning rods per say) He is doing it "big time" Think of it....Sitting at a table 2 days and telling just about everyone interested that it will have to be shipped to you because it has to be made to order. He could have got 300-500 orders at $23.95 a pop =$11,975 at 500 orders for 2 days fraud. Travel show to show using different "props" that need to ship this guy is making a killing. He could be clearing 40k a month! Send me all the info you have phone number etc....please... Or he could have some real idiots working for him that forgot to mail your check.... John
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 1:46:51 AM EDT
Does your bank mail your returned checks to you? If so, then you at least have the bank info which the party used to cash the check. Good evidence unless a phony account was used. Maybe on of those shady Checks Cashed No ID joints.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 4:31:06 AM EDT
mattja
If you're going to screw someone, you should do it big time, like the gun store that sold me the Colt MT6551 three days before the ban in December 1999. How's $1000 over retail sound? I kid you not, $1700. Serves me right for waiting until the last minute.
View Quote
I don't know if it was your first AR type rifle,...but, How's $1k over retail sound compared to having NO AR type rifle while you're stuck in Kali?? Sounds to me that you screwed yourself and you know it...No need for sour grapes by taking a cheap shot at dealers who were trying to get the most profit on a scarce and soon to be extinct product!!! Also most of the dealers LOST a lot financially because of SB23 and SB15....Some even closed up for good..I too would of wanted to get as much of a mark up above retail if I knew my business was to deteriorate in 3 days...No one forced you to buy at $1700 3 days before the ban...But look at this way...You at least now have an AR to legally shoot in CA...I know of others who missed out and would now gladly pay the $1700 in the blink of an eye to legally own an AR type rilfe....I hardly see how ms70's screw-over situation compares to your perceived screw-over!!! You had a choice to get the rifle or not...ms70's did not have a choice...He was lied to numerously and legitimately ripped off ... Tell me you think paying $1700 was getting screwed big time, when you're shooting your AR at the range, while some on-looker wishes he had one too....You should really see yourelf as lucky and not feel that you got screwed big time!!!....During the weeks before SB23 took effect...everyone I know and myself included considered themselves just lucky to have gotten something than nothing.....even if we knew we overpaid....Difference is that you are still hung up on what you paid and don't really see that the use of your AR in CA is way more valuable than your $1700 cost... 23.95 is a cheap lesson learned....Never pay up front for future delivery unless you are dealing with a well known brick and mortar establishment...
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 5:48:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/18/2001 7:19:40 AM EDT by Striker]
Is this the guy? Gunsmith Shooting Products 431 Gruber Road Harleysville, PA 19438 Phone: (215) 256-9208 Fax: (215) 256-9208 Email: gunsmiths@guncare.com [url]http://www.gunsmith.nv.switchboard.com[/url] It seems he has a website shall we visit [}:D] edited to tweek the url link.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 6:55:15 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 7:10:35 AM EDT
ms70, EVERY complaint i have ever had about shows, involved the middletown gun shows - what's up with them??? sorry this happened to you, even though its only $23.00, its a matter of principle, and he should suffer! bratty up above might have a good point about it being federal now. ps. e-mail me if you ever want to shoot in the ulster co. area!
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 7:17:51 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Steve: Is this the guy? Gunsmith Shooting Products 431 Gruber Road Harleysville, PA 19438 Phone: (215) 256-9208 Fax: (215) 256-9208 Email: gunsmiths@guncare.com http://www.gunsmith.nv.switchboard.com It seems he has a website shall we visit [}:D]
View Quote
Get grid coordinates, call in heavy field artillery [heavy]
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 8:15:10 AM EDT
"i gotscrewed at a gunshow" thats like a dream i had the other night
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 8:28:39 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Steve: Is this the guy? Gunsmith Shooting Products 431 Gruber Road Harleysville, PA 19438 Phone: (215) 256-9208 Fax: (215) 256-9208 Email: gunsmiths@guncare.com [url]http://www.gunsmith.nv.switchboard.com[/url] It seems he has a website shall we visit [}:D] edited to tweek the url link.
View Quote
I ordered 2 rods AT THE SAME SHOW and never received them either. Fortunately, I was cash poor at the end of the day and had to use my credit card for the purchase. My credit card was charged twice! (4 rods + shipping for a total of $102.90 -- I only ordered TWO and NEVER RECEIVED ANYTHING). They keep giving me the runaround when I call. I am going to contact my credit card company directly. Good luck MS70 ! These folks are weasels.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 9:30:40 AM EDT
mattja - you should of come see me! i sold my preban 6551 for $1400, a post ban 6520 for $1150, a fal for $1200... ah well it's all in the past is it not? steve
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 9:35:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/18/2001 9:38:25 AM EDT by ms70]
Steve! Yes! That is the guy!! Thanks for the website & e-mail. Now I can give him some additional reminders! fattym4- Thanks for the invite. I'll keep you in mind!
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 9:37:32 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 9:44:16 AM EDT
It sucks bigtime when guys do you like that!! I love this board. Looks like you all have found the culprit and plan to roast his ass good. Be sure and report him to the credit card companys and you can fix it up for him real nice. They should not allow him to take credit cards in the future. If enough of you raise hell I bet he gives you your money back. Good Luck!!!
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 9:56:37 AM EDT
I got ripped off big time 7 years ago at a fun show. There was a place selling aftermarket barrels and stupid me pre-ordered one they didn't have in stock yet. 1 month later, nothing in the mail. 2 months later I see them at the fun show and ask where is my barrel. They tell me the manufacturer is backordered and I will get it asap. 3 months nothing. I see them again at the fun show and ask WTF is going on. I get some bs story about a brother in law stealing the ups shipment and I would be getting my barrel when the next shipment comes in. 4 months now still nothing. They aren't at the next fun show. Company phone is disconnected. All attempts at tracking them down, including inquiries with the fun show organizer turns up nothing. I hope they burn in hell for the $130 they stole from me. It took me 4 months to save up that money and it still pisses me off when I think about it.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 10:00:04 AM EDT
One reason I don't go to gun shows anymore.............
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 10:38:58 AM EDT
Well, I haven't been ripped off yet by the kettle corn people at the fun show.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 11:25:10 AM EDT
I can't understand it! Why would you order something at a gun show from a dealer you don't know when you could have probably ordered it from a reputable firm on the internet for the same price or less? I use my credit card for all mail order purchases, so if there's a problem I have a legal leg to stand on. I had a problem with a gun safe manufacturer/dealer in the L.A. area a couple of years ago. They tried to jerk me around, charged my credit card before shipping, then didn't deliver the safe, and then then tried to get me to take a lesser safe for the same money. I contacted my bank, protested the charge, and got the charge reversed. It took me a couple of months. The company's initials are SSS. I subsequently found out that this was their "modus operandi." I did document every phone conversation (date, time, and person I spoke to) which is necessary in situations like this. The company still advertises in Shotgun News and The American Rifleman.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 1:04:12 PM EDT
E-commerce wasn't around when I paid for the barrel I never receieved.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 1:14:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/18/2001 1:15:16 PM EDT by aod308]
"We take our quality one step beyond." [puke]
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 1:15:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/18/2001 1:13:39 PM EDT by aod308]
oops double post
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 4:34:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Big B: If you had paid with a credit card you could have the charges reversed and get your money back no questions asked. Your credit card company will do it and credit back your account. You might also call the gun show operator and let him know what happened to you so he can keep this kind of trash out of it next time.
View Quote
Good points all around. The guy operates out of state, he took your order, refused to ship. Contact your postmaster and file a complaint for interstate commerce fraud. Contact the show operator. By tracing the internet address, or with 411 in his area, you can find his address. Post to have AR15.comers in his area drop by to go "shopping" and harass the guy. If you sue him in small claims court, he will have to come to your state to defend himself. If you use a credit card, you must dispute the charge within 60 days or forget about it, it sticks wether it's fraud or not.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 5:50:11 PM EDT
Originally Posted By OldCorpsJoe: I can't understand it! Why would you order something at a gun show from a dealer you don't know when you could have probably ordered it from a reputable firm on the internet for the same price or less?
View Quote
Because this was a rod with features specific to this company. It was also a model specific to the gun I intended to use it on. Do you go to gun shows and only look? Why bother going if that's the case. You can get good deals from good people but I stepped in a bear trap. It happens & I want everyone to know this guy is out there. It's no reflection on good businessmen who sell at shows.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 6:19:14 PM EDT
Originally Posted By GrowingGrass: What a sack of shit... I H_A_T_E people like that... I agree. Dude, if you are on this board, I hope you get cancer. Yep....Cancer. Not just a bad streak of luck, or a dent in your car door, If you are such a pathetic loser as to rip off a fellow shooter for a measly twenty five bucks, pancreatic cancer to you, asshole.
View Quote
Yes, and may his gizzard go bad,too
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 6:28:05 PM EDT
ms70 You have already received some good advice on who to contact and file complaints with and where to file suit. I'd also like to add the following for your consideration. Alert the Secretary of State and/or the State Licensing Division, Department of Consumer Affairs in his state of registry. Advise the local BBB and Chamber of Commerce where he is based. Speak with someone in the State Bureau of Investigation about Consumer fraud. There are many ways you can cost this person much more than the approximate $25.00 you lost, in addition you may prevent him from doing this to someone else. [X] [X]
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 7:01:31 PM EDT
btt From: YOUR NAME HERE To: E-Mail the jerk, if this happened to you, you'd want all your "family members" at ar15.com to pitch in and help you out. Don't get nasty, just make sure that gunsmiths@guncare.com knows that you'll tell every shooter that you know that he's a rip off. If you live in PA, offer to visit his establishment in person to inquire why he would think anyone in the firemarms community would tolerate this kind of behavior.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 7:05:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Beachboy: ms70 You have already received some good advice on who to contact and file complaints with and where to file suit. I'd also like to add the following for your consideration. Alert the Secretary of State and/or the State Licensing Division, Department of Consumer Affairs in his state of registry. Advise the local BBB and Chamber of Commerce where he is based. Speak with someone in the State Bureau of Investigation about Consumer fraud. There are many ways you can cost this person much more than the approximate $25.00 you lost, in addition you may prevent him from doing this to someone else. [X] [X]
View Quote
Good point, contact the police and file charges. Then contact ATF and let them know that the guy is under investigation for fraud. If he has an FFL this could cause him some trouble. Take no prisoners!
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 7:15:25 PM EDT
His e-mail address appears to be dead.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 7:17:21 PM EDT
His e-mail address appears to be dead. [sniper]
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 7:18:31 PM EDT
My email to him: Man you guys suck!!! When are you going to send out all the fucking products that you have already charged customers for??? You pathetic bastards should develop cancer and die slow painful deaths. Cocksuckers. Balming
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 7:22:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/18/2001 7:23:11 PM EDT by ms70]
Originally Posted By xanadu: His e-mail address appears to be dead. [sniper]
View Quote
I just found that out too!! Came back "not delivered." Nothing happened to the others. Wonder if they got through. Anyone else not get through to the gunshow thief? I guess he's a deadbeat to his IP also.
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 8:45:04 PM EDT
Don't e-mail the bastard, go to his website and use his own contact form. As long as he is in business he cannot afford not to wade through all of our posts looking for real customers. I used a real looking name just to get him to open the mail. Just let him know that he is going to experience some grief over his actions.
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 9:25:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/19/2001 9:25:51 PM EDT by LilRhody]
"To Gunsmiyh shooting products Inappropriate business transactions like not sending a customer paid for products in a timely manner will be dealt with severely. Stealing a customer’s money will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the LAW. DO NOT MESS WITH THE MEMBERS OF THE AR 15. com FORUM we are all across the country and WILL run into you eventually." Hey MS70 there's my .02 for ya. Bastard no e-mail
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 4:14:16 AM EDT
buyer beware
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 4:55:45 AM EDT
Originally Posted By TROJAN: mattja I don't know if it was your first AR type rifle,...but, How's $1k over retail sound compared to having NO AR type rifle while you're stuck in Kali?? Sounds to me that you screwed yourself and you know it...No need for sour grapes by taking a cheap shot at dealers who were trying to get the most profit on a scarce and soon to be extinct product!!! Also most of the dealers LOST a lot financially because of SB23 and SB15....Some even closed up for good..I too would of wanted to get as much of a mark up above retail if I knew my business was to deteriorate in 3 days...No one forced you to buy at $1700 3 days before the ban...But look at this way...You at least now have an AR to legally shoot in CA...I know of others who missed out and would now gladly pay the $1700 in the blink of an eye to legally own an AR type rilfe....I hardly see how ms70's screw-over situation compares to your perceived screw-over!!! You had a choice to get the rifle or not...ms70's did not have a choice...He was lied to numerously and legitimately ripped off ... Tell me you think paying $1700 was getting screwed big time, when you're shooting your AR at the range, while some on-looker wishes he had one too....You should really see yourelf as lucky and not feel that you got screwed big time!!!....During the weeks before SB23 took effect...everyone I know and myself included considered themselves just lucky to have gotten something than nothing.....even if we knew we overpaid....Difference is that you are still hung up on what you paid and don't really see that the use of your AR in CA is way more valuable than your $1700 cost...
View Quote
Sour grapes? Hung up? Wow, I wish I could gain so much insight into another's personality through reading a single post. Man, I love the AR, and I'm happy I have it, but I'm not the kind of person who would sell water for $20 a gallon to hurricane victims. It sounds like you think that would be okay.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 4:24:35 AM EDT
Doesn't sound you're happy when you bad mouth a dealer who had something to sell which you were willing to pay for....and then equate that to being ripped off!!! Yes even for $1700, you should be greatfull and thankful that the Dealer had something to sell you....Like I said there are a lot of people who missed out and will never be able to own an AR in CA... Try Earthquake...it works better in CA!....Your insight into my personality from my post is so much better....Yes, I would sell you water for $20 a gallon during a huricane, just because you would be the first in line!!! Just as you were the first in line to pay $1700 for an AR right before closing time!!! IT was not the Dealers fault that CA decided to pass AW laws..It was not the Dealers fault that you were not aware of the '00 deadline and you didn't purchase at an earlier time for a lower price.... So tell me how your perceived rip-off experience compares to the legitimate one ofm70's???
Top Top