Unbelievable..... I do hope that by the 2006 vote many of your fellow countrymen will say no.  Is it just me or does the world seem to be heading toward its boiling point?

Oh, I forgot. What  do you think Cromwells ghost is doing right about now? I bet he is not too pleased with what has happened.....

Andy,
as soon as your hitch is up, move!
Preferably somewhere NFA friendly.

Quoted: Dont give up Andy. You guys didnt give up when the Japanese bombed London! On a serious note, it looks bad for you guys. How is that people let these things happen? I mean, I understand the mechanics of it but how do people keep forgetting history or missing the obvious warnings? I am only a recent student of this countries great history and the brilliance of its Founders but their uncanny forethought astounds me. They left us with a Constitution and Bill Of Rights to save us from this shit. Yet still, there are those in this country that would throw that all away and subjugate themselves to the chains of slavery for a few magic beans. The uncanny stupidity and foolishness of people based on greed, envy and selfishness astounds me as well. Andy, I hope you buried some guns man. You may have nothing left but revolution.

Your Constituition is a wonderful document… I never ceased to be amazed how casually so many American regard it… As you say, your countries founding fathers had astounding forsight, anyone would think thay had forseen this sort of EU mess happening over there and written the document to stop that ever happening over there.

How did this happen over here? Easy! You buy the sheeple!

FACT: 42% of the population of Britain now recieve some sort of State Funded Welfare Benefit! And they are promised more jam tomorrow! Join the EU and you will get lots more lovely social welfare benefits the Pro Euros say… great say the sheeple! More 'free money'! were do we sign!

Andy

Well, we might have the guns, but with the brainwashing thats going on in the schools and media the numbers that would unite & use those guns are diminishing at a rapid rate. I say that from personal observation of 50+ years. ie.; we have to vote to determine if marriage is 1 man + 1 woman.   In germany, it wasn't just the disarming of the populace, there was the brainwashing propaganda (Hitler youth, etc.) and moral decline that gave evil the power. when nazi control was firmly established, there were a whole lot of guns around, they took 'em all over europe, north africa & other parts of the globe...."when america ceases to be good, it will cease to be great"

Oh, how the mighty have fallen.

There seems to be a conservative revolution going on over here, but Europe's sliding back into Socialism. I have to wonder where this will lead in 10-20 years or so. Will we have to bail Europe out again?

Can't we just trade California for the UK ???

That way I can drive to Scotland...

I am truly sorry. I have always had a deep seated repect for the UK. This is a shame for the world. Stay strong.

I fear that the fall of the UK will speed the inevitable loss of the US.

i lived in the UK for 7 years. this sucks dude. i feel your pain. fuck the EU. they suck

Well I'm bettin' that the Brit's will see the writing on the wall (EU=An inordinant amount of FRENCH influence in Europe and extract themselves from this.

So who's taking votes on the anti-Christ? I'm going for Schroeder or Jerac (French leader...can't spell)

Quoted: Well I'm bettin' that the Brit's will see the writing on the wall (EU=An inordinant amount of FRENCH influence in Europe and extract themselves from this.

One can only hope

Welfare and socialism are ruining this country too.

Doesn't Europe have a lot of welfare?

Aren't a lot of homes government owned??

CRC

Quoted: So who's taking votes on the anti-Christ? I'm going for Schroeder or Jerac (French leader...can't spell)

I thought skerry was the anti-Christ  

Quoted: Welfare and socialism are ruining this country too. Doesn't Europe have a lot of welfare? Aren't a lot of homes government owned?? CRC

Here in Britain 42% of the population get Welfare Handouts…with two kids you get 'child tax credits' even if you earn £27,000 pa, (@ $50,000 pa). its much higher in mainland Europe and we have a much higher level of private home ownership.

I'm looking forward to reading the Newspaper editorials tomorrow… hopefully they will realise that we are on the edge of the abyss and now is the time for action and become openly anti EU.

Andy

Quoted: and finland proudly tells the e.u. to bugger off! hoorah!

Finland is already a full member of the EU…they have also adopted the Euro as their currency.

Andy

Sorry to laugh. I'm not making light of the situation; I feel it's more a reaction due to the absurdity of this whole notion.


Near-hysterical laughter, if you will.


shakes head

Andy,
There is always room at Casa de dport. And there are plenty of jobs in the sea going industry around here.

Quoted: Can't we just trade California for the UK ??? That way I can drive to Scotland...

Now there's an idea!  Stop in at a real Watney's Pub somewhere along the way....  Maybe we could work some sort of a deal for Denmark too so DK-Prof could drive home for vacations (and visit Tivoli Gardens)?  So much of Europe is wonderful....  too bad France is in the middle of it.

Quoted: The EU has gone from "bad" to "terrible" idea   Idiots - all they will do is destroy everything good in europe by trying to homogenize and equalize everything with the third-world countries in the south of Europe.

Hey man, I am from the " third-word countries"  of the south europe... Can I ask you how many times have you been in Italy or Spain?

Quoted: Quoted: where the hell is king arthur when you need him Spinning in his grave along with Winston Churchill… Andy

But look at the bright side - Neville Chamberlain and Clement Atlee are probably happy now.

Quoted: Quoted: The EU has gone from "bad" to "terrible" idea   Idiots - all they will do is destroy everything good in europe by trying to homogenize and equalize everything with the third-world countries in the south of Europe. Hey man, I am from the " third-word countries"  of the south europe... Can I ask you how many times have you been in Italy or Spain?

The Dutch have a long-held grudge agains the Italians .

Quoted: Quoted: The EU has gone from "bad" to "terrible" idea   Idiots - all they will do is destroy everything good in europe by trying to homogenize and equalize everything with the third-world countries in the south of Europe. Hey man, I am from the " third-word countries"  of the south europe... Can I ask you how many times have you been in Italy or Spain?

Italy is a notable exception, well the northern part anyway Paolo!

Portgal, Spain, Greece, Sicily… many parts are almost third world!

BTW Paolo… I'm pretty disgusted at the Eurofascists in Brussels blocking Italy's new EU Justice Minister Rocco Buttigliones appointment because he has 'conservative Christian values'… just about sums up the whole state of this rotten and politically corrupt EU mess.

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=288813

Andy

I've been to Spain and it's come a long way.

My mom's family is from there and she said under Franco they visited.

Donkey carts even in the 1970's.

CRC

Quoted: Quoted: The EU has gone from "bad" to "terrible" idea   Idiots - all they will do is destroy everything good in europe by trying to homogenize and equalize everything with the third-world countries in the south of Europe. Hey man, I am from the " third-word countries"  of the south europe... Can I ask you how many times have you been in Italy or Spain?

My parents live in Spain - I go there quite often.

But perhaps I was overly vague - it's not ALL southern European countries I meant - but when you go to places like the countryside of Portugal for example, or the eastern parts of Turkey (who will soon start the process of joining the EU) it's like you went back over 100 years in a time machine!  Go further into the Balkans - and potential future member of the EU and it's like you've back in the middle ages - does Albania even have electricity?  


I didn't mean to imply that Italy or Spain were necessarily like that - although parts of Greece do make me wonder - sorry I was being unclear.

Andy, I was an enthusiast Eu supporter up to four years ago.

Then something changed when I realized that this EU, that was a good idea full of good intentions, is NOT the one I had in mind.

I believed of a EU of people, where basic rights were granted and the rest will come through your efforts and talents. A place where your freedom is granted, and culture is to make people to pursue their dreams.

The first disillusionement is the attitude of EU toward Israel and Jews in general. In 60 years only awareness of antisemitism has changed, but the old ghost is all but dead. With France and Germany going to bed all the time with Arabs, and the EU (Solana speaks for all...) behaving partially in favour each single time of Palis side, I ask myself which future my mixed culture family can have.

The second disillusionemet is, asking around through the Internet, to see that in ALL Europe, and I am bloody serious guys believe me or not, guns ownership restrictions are on the same guidelines ALL OVER EUROPE: Italy, Netherland, Spain, France, Belgium are limiting gun ownership ALL in the same direction. GB (sorry to say Andy...) was fucked up long time ago. Looks like Dianne Feinstein is the President of the EU Commission... And this is worring, if you think, because looks like there is a plan. And, imho, there is, and if I think to the implications, I am thinking to emigrate somewhere else soon.

The other thing that hit me is the hate toward USA. Leftist and Rightis are all united to push against USA and to paint their people as a bunch of rough cowboys with zero culture but with a gun always ready to shoot. The Leftist are hating USA because they won the the Cold War and defeated Communism. The Rightist are hating USA because they won the WWII and defeated fascism. Both, don't loose occasions to take out episodes of both conflicts to paint a portrait of US govt. no better than any other, Nazi included, and to give an idea that after all there is no real democracy in USA.
I study military history, and I got upset also when there are episodes where US soldiers acted as criminals (ie, Patton executerd 400 italian soldiers that surrendered during Sicily invasion in '43 without shooting a single shot... or the Laconia episode...). But... shit... IT WAS WAR!!! And at that time, MY government was a dictatorship that declared war to USA! WE WERE THE ENEMY! And concerning other episodes, if I were the US commander in Malmedy, I would also gave the order to take no prisoner for one week after that a bunch of SS soldiers shot MY comrades...
No gratitude... What the hell of people is this European people? And when you speak with them and you ask how many americans did they speak with, they shake their shoulders, not knowing what to answer...

Last, but not least, the defence issue. Just an episode: Recently France complained inthe EU defence commission that Italy (actually leader of helicopter building in Europe...) is not adopting other helicopters but only italian ones... I never heard anything so hypocrite and dumb than this. France is not adopting anything not thought designed and build in France! They were only pissed off because they lost the bid to supply our Forest Dept. with new helos... MEANWHILE, they are sabotaging all the efforts to have a really valid EU jet figther like the Typhoon because all the rest of EU partners refused to give the majority of the orders (and of the money) to Aerospatial to build the airplane... no european army, like this. And NOT with the pussy submitted and orwellian " big brother" mentality and culture they are building with the new generation, that is plain and simple trained not to think, to obey, and to get everything doing nothing...

Where the hell is the EU I was dreaming?

Someone here told that Latvia and Moldavia shouldn't count like UK.

Wrong.

They should count exactely the same when the moment came.

One of the main reason why I don' t like THIS EU is because instead to be a union of sovereign nations with same dignity, there are some of them that see this as an occasion to count more than others. To have something that is called " European Union"  but when it matters only a couple of them are leading all the rest, shit... is something UNBEARABLE to me. It is like to share expenses and effort to build a common house and when finished, you sleep in the bathtube and the other is sleeping inside your bed...

ok... just my 2 cents.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: The EU has gone from "bad" to "terrible" idea   Idiots - all they will do is destroy everything good in europe by trying to homogenize and equalize everything with the third-world countries in the south of Europe. Hey man, I am from the " third-word countries"  of the south europe... Can I ask you how many times have you been in Italy or Spain? My parents live in Spain - I go there quite often. But perhaps I was overly vague - it's not ALL southern European countries I meant - but when you go to places like the countryside of Portugal for example, or the eastern parts of Turkey (who will soon start the process of joining the EU) it's like you went back over 100 years in a time machine!  Go further into the Balkans - and potential future member of the EU and it's like you've back in the middle ages - does Albania even have electricity?   I didn't mean to imply that Italy or Spain were necessarily like that - although parts of Greece do make me wonder - sorry I was being unclear.

Shit... you're RIGHT...

Quoted: Quoted: How does the media over there play it? Are the Pro-EU, Anti-EU or indifferent?   My impression from reading Danish news is that a lot of people are not expecting it to be approved in all the referendums that will take place about this (at least 9 countries, possibly more, will have referendums)

Why the hell would a dutchman read the Danish news?
Makes no sense.
Churchill's true dream was the United States and England re-united.
What do you say, Andy?
y'all up to it?

Quoted: Andy, I was an enthusiast Eu supporter up to four years ago. Then something changed when I realized that this EU, that was a good idea full of good intentions, is NOT the one I had in mind. I believed of a EU of people, where basic rights were granted and the rest will come through your efforts and talents. A place where your freedom is granted, and culture is to make people to pursue their dreams. The first disillusionement is the attitude of EU toward Israel and Jews in general. In 60 years only awareness of antisemitism has changed, but the old ghost is all but dead. With France and Germany going to bed all the time with Arabs, and the EU (Solana speaks for all...) behaving partially in favour each single time of Palis side, I ask myself which future my mixed culture family can have. The second disillusionemet is, asking around through the Internet, to see that in ALL Europe, and I am bloody serious guys believe me or not, guns ownership restrictions are on the same guidelines ALL OVER EUROPE: Italy, Netherland, Spain, France, Belgium are limiting gun ownership ALL in the same direction. GB (sorry to say Andy...) was fucked up long time ago. Looks like Dianne Feinstein is the President of the EU Commission... And this is worring, if you think, because looks like there is a plan. And, imho, there is, and if I think to the implications, I am thinking to emigrate somewhere else soon. The other thing that hit me is the hate toward USA. Leftist and Rightis are all united to push against USA and to paint their people as a bunch of rough cowboys with zero culture but with a gun always ready to shoot. The Leftist are hating USA because they won the the Cold War and defeated Communism. The Rightist are hating USA because they won the WWII and defeated fascism. Both, don't loose occasions to take out episodes of both conflicts to paint a portrait of US govt. no better than any other, Nazi included, and to give an idea that after all there is no real democracy in USA. I study military history, and I got upset also when there are episodes where US soldiers acted as criminals (ie, Patton executerd 400 italian soldiers that surrendered during Sicily invasion in '43 without shooting a single shot... or the Laconia episode...). But... shit... IT WAS WAR!!! And at that time, MY government was a dictatorship that declared war to USA! WE WERE THE ENEMY! And concerning other episodes, if I were the US commander in Malmedy, I would also gave the order to take no prisoner for one week after that a bunch of SS soldiers shot MY comrades... No gratitude... What the hell of people is this European people? And when you speak with them and you ask how many americans did they speak with, they shake their shoulders, not knowing what to answer... Last, but not least, the defence issue. Just an episode: Recently France complained inthe EU defence commission that Italy (actually leader of helicopter building in Europe...) is not adopting other helicopters but only italian ones... I never heard anything so hypocrite and dumb than this. France is not adopting anything not thought designed and build in France! They were only pissed off because they lost the bid to supply our Forest Dept. with new helos... MEANWHILE, they are sabotaging all the efforts to have a really valid EU jet figther like the Typhoon because all the rest of EU partners refused to give the majority of the orders (and of the money) to Aerospatial to build the airplane... no european army, like this. And NOT with the pussy submitted and orwellian " big brother" mentality and culture they are building with the new generation, that is plain and simple trained not to think, to obey, and to get everything doing nothing... Where the hell is the EU I was dreaming? Someone here told that Latvia and Moldavia shouldn't count like UK. Wrong. They should count exactely the same when the moment came. One of the main reason why I don' t like THIS EU is because instead to be a union of sovereign nations with same dignity, there are some of them that see this as an occasion to count more than others. To have something that is called " European Union"  but when it matters only a couple of them are leading all the rest, shit... is something UNBEARABLE to me. It is like to share expenses and effort to build a common house and when finished, you sleep in the bathtube and the other is sleeping inside your bed... ok... just my 2 cents.

I will freely admit that I know little to nothing about EU structure, but it sounds liek something akin to the  US Constitution's "Great Compromise" - that led to the bicameral legislature - is in order, too much power seems to be held in a few small places.  The genius of the US Senate and electoral college system becomes more apparent every day.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: How does the media over there play it? Are the Pro-EU, Anti-EU or indifferent?   Churchill's true dream was the United States and England re-united. What do you say, Andy? y'all up to it?

I would be perfectly happy if the British Government started negotiations to join the Union as the 51st State!

Seriously though, I think we should pull out completely from the EU, disengage completely 100%, we are the Worlds 4th largest economy, we can go it alone, and then we should join the NAFTA.

The only countries we have been able to depend on when the SHTF has been The United States, Canada, Australia and New Zealand… the English Speaking Democracies, always with us

Andy

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: How does the media over there play it? Are the Pro-EU, Anti-EU or indifferent?   Churchill's true dream was the United States and England re-united. What do you say, Andy? y'all up to it? I would be perfectly happy if the British Government started negotiations to join the Union as the 51st State! Seriously though, I think we should pull out completely from the EU, disengage completely 100%, we are the Worlds 4th largest economy, we can go it alone, and then we should join the NAFTA. The only countries we have been able to depend on when the SHTF has been The United States, Canada, Australia and New Zealand… the English Speaking Democracies, always with us Andy

+1

Quoted: Who all is in the EU? The 25 will be……Austria; Belgium; Cyprus; Czech Republic; Denmark; Estonia; Finland; France; Germany; Greece; Hungary; Ireland; Italy; Latvia; Lithuania; Luxembourg; Malta; Netherlands; Poland; Portugal; Slovakia; Slovenia; Sweden; Spain; United Kingdom I probably should have asked who isnt in it. I see, conspictuous by their absence..Switzerland and the Norges.

AW FREAKIN' CRAP !!!!!!!!!! My DUMBASS cousins signed on ????? They should have known better.

Another Eurosceptic Brits take on the EU and why it is a bad thing for Britain……

The UK is the world's 4th largest economy. The largest in Europe and the only EU economy that still has growth, albeit a smaller than expected growth. Monetary union will mean the propping up of the faltering ecomonies of Europe by the strong. Read the UK supporting the EU.

Oil. Pure and simply. The UK owns 80% of the mineral rights in the South Atlantic. Oil and minerals believed to be in excess of all that pulled out of the planet during the later half of the 20th century. Hence the Falklands War. Norway has the other 20%. Norway voted No to joining the EU because these minerals will have to be exploited when the reserves currently being tapped in the rest of the world runs out. Once this happens the UK becomes a power again. The EU want this oil.

The German/French plan is further expansion of the EU. They expect us to pay. The economies of prospective members such as Turkey, will never reach the fiscal measures without billions in handouts.

The Europeans are fair weather friends. The British are seen as a necessary evil by the Germans, French and Belgiums. This is not a new phenomina, it is entrenched in a thousand years of rivalry.

A European guide to Europe has just been published. Written by the Belgians, it contains a potted history of each country over the last century. In the UK entry, no mention of the UK and the US bailing Europe out during the first or second world war. France claiming De Gaul liberated France alone, but from what? And no mention of the Nazis in the German entry!

The political correctness forced on us by Brussels is a tool of subversion. Bring into question the motives or atitudes of the Europeans towards Britain and you are branded as a racist/xenaphobic. They have managed to stifle debate. Once people are scared to speak, how long before they are scared to think?

10 REASONS WHY BRITAIN SHOULD LEAVE THE EUROPEAN UNION

(The current exchange rate is about $1.85 = £1)


1. To end the drain on the country's finances.

The government puts the net 'contribution' cost of our EU membership (1999) at £8.5 billion (equal to almost 4p of income tax) and the current estimates put it at £11 billion. The pro-EU Institute of Directors calculated it as more than double - and rising. Indirect costs - complying with regulations, loss of earnings from farming, fishing, etc., raise the overall cost still further.

Withdrawal from the EU would yield Britain a £25 billion Independence Dividend.

2. So that we can restore the full authority of Westminster, where the MP's we elect defend our interests, rather than accept rule from Brussels by bureaucrats we neither vote in nor have power to dismiss.

Four out of five of our laws now come direct from the EU. Because EU officials and Commissioners are specifically required NOT to take account of the interests of their own country, such legislation may disregard Britain's national interest!

Creating Regional Assemblies for each of Britain's Euro-Regions will cause a massive expansion in bureaucracy and administration costs and drive further wedges between Westminster, County & District Councils and the voters.

3. So that we can pursue 'British' policies for agriculture and fishing, based on optimal self sufficiency and the maximisation of our natural resources.

EU 'Common' Policies for fishing & farming are expensive, wasteful, cruel, immoral as well as harmful to the environment and the developing world. British farmers are weighed down by bureaucracy and form filling and constrained by inappropriate quotas. Their 'green pound' incomes are determined by the value of sterling on the world's foreign exchanges – even if they never export!

4. The EU Single Market, with its fanciful 'level playing field' and a mass of costly regulations, sets member state against member state - whilst preventing each from capitalising on its own individual strengths.

The City of London will be (deliberately) weakened by 'financial services' legislation carried by the votes of EU countries with no comparable financial sectors of their own. Similarly, our position - unique within the EU - as a world leader in the art & antiques trades, is threatened by 'harmonised' VAT.

5. Staying in the EU will mean eventually having to join the euro. As a result, control of the economy will pass to the European Central Bank, which is required to treat the entire EU area as one economy.

Although exporters complain about the "strong" pound (they really mean the weak euro), the slightest weakening of sterling makes everyone nervous about inflation.

When EU 'harmonisation' has raised costs and taxes here to the levels of those in France and Germany, what businesses will come and set up - or remain - here?

6. The EU is yesterday's idea. Unlike the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA), it is not a free trade zone but a protectionist Customs union.

Even small, non-EU countries trade with the EU on better terms than those of Britain – but without the cost and loss of self-government EU membership entails. EU regulations impose extra costs on every business in the country – including the 90% that never export and those that export only to non-EU markets.

Ongoing EU trade disputes with America, and Brussels' reluctance to accept WTO rulings that don't go in its favour, harm British exporters.

7. The EU is dominated by France and Germany. For forty years, their heads of government have been meeting twice yearly to set their common agenda.

EU enlargement will reduce Britain's voting rights from the present 15% to less than 10%. It is dangerous and naive to think we have any real influence – let alone be able to defend our vital interests against France's unbridled hostility to America and the Anglo-Saxon 'model'.

8. The EU will oblige Britain to abandon the centuries old democratic and legal systems that have been embraced by countries throughout the world.

Our legal system will be turned upside down as we go over to the Napoleonic code system: we will be deemed guilty until proved innocent, liable to virtually unlimited detention without charge (in the absence of habeas corpus) and lose the right to trial by jury. The banning of imperial measures is designed to deny British companies any 'natural' advantage when quoting for American contracts.

9. In order to retain full control over our borders and armed forces.

Jurisdiction over who may enter and remain in Britain must be the sole preserve of our Westminster parliament.

Britain's armed services are for defending Britain's interests, not for allowing the French to indulge their long-standing obstructive hostility to America and Nato.

10. So that we do not bind and betray future generations.

Being in the EU means that all our national resources - gold reserves, North Sea Gas & Oil, fish stocks – will have to be placed at the disposal of the EU. The debts of Continental pension funds will become the debts of our children - who may not even be assured pensions of their own. The 'acquis communautaire' (= ratchet) process ensures that EU legislation is unlikely ever to be repealed or amended.

Andy

My guess is it will last five to seven years, but it might go ten. I cannot but believe that GB will figure it out eventually, and there is no way the French and Germans can stop themselves from shitting on everyone in sight. Hopefully that is not wishful thinking.

Was it Socrates who said that "Democracy will last only as long as it takes the public to realize that they can vote themselves ever increasing amounts of money from the public treasury"?

Fuck it, what's one more world war to save the UK! We did it twice and I'm sure we can do it a third time. This time the Huns can keep the Frogs. I say that we only do this on one condition, the British subjects have their right to bear arms reinstated.

So, how many years til we fight a war with the EU? Twenty-five, thirty?

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: How does the media over there play it? Are the Pro-EU, Anti-EU or indifferent?   Churchill's true dream was the United States and England re-united. What do you say, Andy? y'all up to it? I would be perfectly happy if the British Government started negotiations to join the Union as the 51st State! Seriously though, I think we should pull out completely from the EU, disengage completely 100%, we are the Worlds 4th largest economy, we can go it alone, and then we should join the NAFTA. The only countries we have been able to depend on when the SHTF has been The United States, Canada, Australia and New Zealand… the English Speaking Democracies, always with us Andy

That would be kinda cool if the UK joined the US.  Talk about those rebellious colonies coming full circle!

I wonder how that would effect politics here, though - that would be 2 Senate seats from a likely very anti-gun state.

If we split the UK into England, Scotland, etc. - would there be any pro-gun bastions to speak of?

Maybe we could get the western Canadian provinces to join as well?

Fuck the EU - two can play at this game.

Why do I keep thinking Star Treck every time I read about the EU?

I know very little about what is going on across the pond, but it seem to
me that the "EU" thinks its going to be the future of the WORLD.

Andy, you were right when you said that most Americans are ignorant to the
value of our Constitution. But there are A Whole Lot of us who don’t.
And we will never let it be taken away from us.
Even if Kerry is elected. ( I would love to see him try and push that BS on us  )

We are here we are armed, Get a Visa brother.
How big is your family? I am sure we have room.


ETA:  " EU Tomorrows Vision for Yesterdays Communism "

tag

Quoted: That would be kinda cool if the UK joined the US.  Talk about those rebellious colonies coming full circle! I wonder how that would effect politics here, though - that would be 2 Senate seats from a likely very anti-gun state. If we split the UK into England, Scotland, etc. - would there be any pro-gun bastions to speak of? Maybe we could get the western Canadian provinces to join as well? Fuck the EU - two can play at this game.

 CAN WE SAY OWNED

Quoted: Quoted: That would be kinda cool if the UK joined the US.  Talk about those rebellious colonies coming full circle! I wonder how that would effect politics here, though - that would be 2 Senate seats from a likely very anti-gun state. If we split the UK into England, Scotland, etc. - would there be any pro-gun bastions to speak of? Maybe we could get the western Canadian provinces to join as well? Fuck the EU - two can play at this game.  CAN WE SAY OWNED

I just got this weird image in my head of a giant "Risk" game board.  Right now, our pieces are working on the middle east, while another team is working on Europe.

Quoted: My guess is it will last five to seven years, but it might go ten. I cannot but believe that GB will figure it out eventually, and there is no way the French and Germans can stop themselves from shitting on everyone in sight. Hopefully that is not wishful thinking. Was it Socrates who said that "Democracy will last only as long as it takes the public to realize that they can vote themselves ever increasing amounts of money from the public treasury"?

Not sure, but is was a greek (eruipides (spelling)).  Our country is starting down that road as well.  Mabey voting should be earned, not a God given right.  Just a thought, Land ownership=voting rights.

Works for me !!!

Quoted: Quoted: Can't we just trade California for the UK ??? That way I can drive to Scotland... Now there's an idea!  Stop in at a real Watney's Pub somewhere along the way....  Maybe we could work some sort of a deal for Denmark too so DK-Prof could drive home for vacations (and visit Tivoli Gardens)?  So much of Europe is wonderful....  too bad France is in the middle of it.

Works for me...

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: where the hell is king arthur when you need him Spinning in his grave along with Winston Churchill… Andy Not exactly, "I see no reason why..there should not ultimately arise the United States of Europe" Winston Churchill, 1946 (at the Hague, no less) The man was the brilliant mind of the 20th century. Ideed he did, but he was talking about a freedom loving and capitalist Europe… not this socialist mess dreamed up by France and Germany… ANdy I liked it better when France and Germany hated each other. Those two countries are accomplishing now what neither Napoleon or Hitler were able to do alone.

Just remember who gets the call when mainland Europeans screw something up...

Yeah, that's right... US...

United In Diversity

That is as fine of an example of DoubleSpeak as has ever been uttered.

How with this change affect the relationship the US has had with the UK for so many years now?

Will UK foreign policy vis-à-vis the US now be at the will of EU ministers?

What about the coming muslim invasion via Turkey?  Isn't full Turkish membership inevitable?