Its time to start issuing CIB-type badges to other MOSs---they see combat too. - Page 2

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Its time to start issuing CIB-type badges to other MOSs---they see combat too. (Page 2 of 3)

Posted: 10/23/2004 1:00:23 PM EDT

[#1]

Quoted:
Adam White, I didn't mean for my comment to make me sound like a blowhard, I was clarifying the reason why the Army only awards the CIB to infantry. I understand your reasoning behind the statement though, and I do appreciate the contributions that other MOS's make. Perhaps I should have inserted that disclaimer in my original post.

It doesn't bother me, I've been hearing it my whole career. Of course, I haven't had to watch anybody get killed only to later have some grunt spout off about how they are the only ones doing the real work.

In the end, the CIB is an incentive for recruitment. That is why even a non-infantry person assigned and serving in an infantry role in combat will not get one. I have no problem with that, most of us know what we do and don't need external motivation. I'll gladly allow the infantry to toot their horns, they have an important job to do and not enough people willing to sign up for it.

Posted: 10/23/2004 1:08:05 PM EDT

[#2]

From a Marine's perspective, allow me to chime in. My dad was a soldier, and from what I gather, it seems that what the CIB was originally, has changed and morphed over the years into something very different from its original intent.
It seem that NOW it is very much like the Navy/Marine Corps' "Combat Action Ribbon".
-except only for Infantry.

If you make a Combat Jump, I think that you should get the same recognition, regardless of your MOS.
If you see combat, the same should apply.

My 2 cents.

Posted: 10/23/2004 1:16:26 PM EDT

[#3]

Quoted:
If you make a Combat Jump, I think that you should get the same recognition, regardless of your MOS.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you. If you make a combat jump, you DO get a bronze star, regardless of your MOS.

Oh, and please allow me to brag and show off a little.

Posted: 10/23/2004 1:21:57 PM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
Quoted:
If you make a Combat Jump, I think that you should get the same recognition, regardless of your MOS.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you. If you make a combat jump, you DO get a bronze star, regardless of your MOS.

Oh, and please allow me to brag and show off a little.

tinypic.com/dzf68

That's what I mean. (I should have been more clear)
They don't deny that star, just because you might not be in an "Airbourne" unit.
There ougt to be a "badge" of equal blingyness for your Armyman outfits, even if you're not a grunt.

(heh, heh... "Armyman outfits"

)

Posted: 10/23/2004 1:25:01 PM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
IF YOU AIN'T INFANTRY....YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A REMF

No, it goes:"If you ain't Cav, you ain't shit!" If you must stir the pot.

Combat Armor Badge?

Combat Scout Badge?

WTF does 11 series get the and the 19's get the shaft, especially the Deltas, they are just as grunt-tastic as any 11 series.

I like this guy!! The 19D's get it done too.

Before I fully understood how things worked one of my goals was to earn a CIB like my father, grandfather, and uncle have. Being Cav, that sadly won't happen.

Oh well, I'll take a combat patch instead if they ever send me

Posted: 10/23/2004 1:31:26 PM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
From a Marine's perspective, allow me to chime in. My dad was a soldier, and from what I gather, it seems that what the CIB was originally, has changed and morphed over the years into something very different from its original intent.
It seem that NOW it is very much like the Navy/Marine Corps' "Combat Action Ribbon".
-except only for Infantry.

If you make a Combat Jump, I think that you should get the same recognition, regardless of your MOS.
If you see combat, the same should apply.

My 2 cents.

And thus we get to a primary reason the Army awards so many Bronze Stars (sans "V").

Posted: 10/23/2004 1:35:34 PM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
Fuck 'em. You want a CIB? Join the Infantry or go piss up a rope.

Some of us are being told we aren't needed as Infantry anymore.I think anyone who gets shot at should have a patch.

Posted: 10/23/2004 1:36:46 PM EDT

[#8]

My dad started out as a 19D. He switched his MOS and became a medic. He earned a Bronze Star with the V device. He definitely qualified for the Combat Medical Badge although I never did see one on his uniform. I remember, when I was a kid, that he was most proud of his 25th ID patch (Tropical Lightening) on his right shoulder. I used to look at that in awe. (It was a pretty cool armyman outfit, Cincinnatus

)

And on a side note, he was injured when his base camp was shelled - he took some shrapnel in the leg. He turned down the Purple Heart because he said he wasn't doing anything at the time it happened. I think about that whenever I hear the crap of John Kerry and his 4 PHs.

Posted: 10/23/2004 3:00:40 PM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:
Quoted:
If you make a Combat Jump, I think that you should get the same recognition, regardless of your MOS.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you. If you make a combat jump, you DO get a bronze star, regardless of your MOS.

Oh, and please allow me to brag and show off a little.

tinypic.com/dzf68

Where'd you get a combat jump? Just curious.

If I must go to combat I'd hope its a jump... but I really doubt the 82nd will be doing a combat jump anytime soon...

Posted: 10/23/2004 3:10:59 PM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:
Where'd you get a combat jump? Just curious.

Panama. Omar Torrijos International Airport. Dec. 20th 1989.

Posted: 10/23/2004 3:39:54 PM EDT

[#11]

The Combad Infantryman's Badge is doing what infantrymen are known for: it's doing its job.

It was created to add prestige for being in the infantry, a fairly thankless job. Yes, other MOSs do infantry jobs in combat, especially in the current operations. But after a year, they go home, and stop doing that job. They get ordered to do the job for a little bit of time. Infantrymen volunteered to do the job that (most) everyone got forced to do. After the deployment, infantrymen go home and continue to do the same thing in training for the next deployment while everyeone else goes back to doing their non-infantry job.

Yes, I understand that combat engineers, combat medics, forward observers, and scouts all volunteered to do infantry-like tasks, often with infantry units.

The CIB was created to give prestige to the Infantry and basically to make members of other MOSs jealous. It seems to be doing its job.

Posted: 10/23/2004 4:03:25 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
The CIB was created to give prestige to the Infantry and basically to make members of other MOSs jealous. It seems to be doing its job.

Posted: 10/23/2004 4:06:24 PM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Fuck 'em. You want a CIB? Join the Infantry or go piss up a rope.

Some of us are being told we aren't needed as Infantry anymore.I think anyone who gets shot at should have a patch.

I apologize if those words pissed anyone off. I honestly don't recall posting that.

tcsd1236, I agree with the patch sentiment - I believe that is what's currently happening. (shoulder patch on right sleeve.)

Posted: 10/23/2004 4:07:28 PM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
The Combad Infantryman's Badge is doing what infantrymen are known for: it's doing its job.

It was created to add prestige for being in the infantry, a fairly thankless job. Yes, other MOSs do infantry jobs in combat, especially in the current operations. But after a year, they go home, and stop doing that job. They get ordered to do the job for a little bit of time. Infantrymen volunteered to do the job that (most) everyone got forced to do. After the deployment, infantrymen go home and continue to do the same thing in training for the next deployment while everyeone else goes back to doing their non-infantry job.

Yes, I understand that combat engineers, combat medics, forward observers, and scouts all volunteered to do infantry-like tasks, often with infantry units.

The CIB was created to give prestige to the Infantry and basically to make members of other MOSs jealous. It seems to be doing its job.

You hit the nail on the head. Whose got that pic?

Posted: 10/23/2004 4:24:47 PM EDT

[#15]

I just wanted to state, for the record, (because I've been mis-interpreted here before) that I do not have a CIB. I do have an EIB but I'd swap it out in a heartbeat for a CIB.

The only things I've done was counter drug operations and that was more fun than dangerous.

Many thanks to those who've served in combat! Cheers!

Posted: 10/23/2004 4:27:47 PM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:
I just wanted to state, for the record, (because I've been mis-interpreted here before) that I do not have a CIB. I do have an EIB but I'd swap it out in a heartbeat for a CIB.

Many thanks to those who've served in combat! Cheers!

Ditto.

Posted: 10/23/2004 6:05:09 PM EDT

[#17]

Yea in a year I suspect your whole outlook on life will change.

FREE

Quoted:
Quoted:
I'll take more pride in my EIB (if I get it next week) than the CIB I'll undoubtedly have within the next year.

I seriously doubt that.

Posted: 10/23/2004 6:12:43 PM EDT

[#18]

HooaH!!!

My proudest moment was having my CIB pinned on.

FREE

Quoted:

I'm sorry, my EIB just doesn't hold a light to my CIB

Permanent Orders 19-57

Last Name, First Name, xxx-xx-xxxx (SSN) PFC Co B. 4th Bn. 325th AIR 82d Abn Div. Ft Bragg, NC 28307-5100

Announcement is made of the following award.

Award: Combat Infantryman Badge

Date(s) or period of service: Effective 12 January 1990

Authority: Paragraph 5-7, AR 672-5-1, USTAPC MSG 222200Z Dec 1989
Subject: Delegation of award Approval Authority and JTFSO MSG 090400Z Jan 1990
Subject: Change to Delegation of awards Approval Authority.

Reason: For satisfactory performance of duty as an infantryman in active ground combat

Format: 320

Posted: 10/23/2004 6:17:33 PM EDT

[#19]

Yea I agree.

I used to be a 19D with A trp 1/17 Cav here at FT Bragg for 4 yrs. I personnaly think scouts should be made a 11 series 11D perhaps as they do the same job as 11Bs(Delta companies that is) and 11Ms(which no longer exsists as an MOS)

I couldnt see myself in a Bradly or being anywhere else but Bragg so I reclassed to 11B.

Well it took me 13 yrs (10 with the 82nd) but finally I received my CIB.

FREE

Quoted:
IF YOU AIN'T INFANTRY....YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A REMF

No, it goes:"If you ain't Cav, you ain't shit!" If you must stir the pot.

Combat Armor Badge?

Combat Scout Badge?

WTF does 11 series get the and the 19's get the shaft, especially the Deltas, they are just as grunt-tastic as any 11 series.

Posted: 10/23/2004 6:28:46 PM EDT

[#20]

This was, IIRC, the original purpose of the Bronze Star...

Posted: 10/23/2004 6:33:22 PM EDT

[#21]

I think the army is too badge-happy. Badges should be reserved for the class A uniform. Leave the BDU's plain except for rank, name & service, the way the Marines are (or used to be anyway) Maybe a unit patch, too.

Sounds like the same comment I hear from soldiers who don't have Special Skills badges because they're too lazy to go to the school or they failed the school.

The CIB was started to give a little extra reward to infantrymen who in WWI and WWII suffered much higher rates of casulaties.

The CIB wasn't created until 1941. It's purpose was to provide an incentive to attract new soldiers into the ranks of the infantry and to keep those who were already there in place.

Fuck 'em. You want a CIB? Join the Infantry or go piss up a rope.

+100

Posted: 10/23/2004 6:34:50 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
Quoted:
IF YOU AIN'T INFANTRY....YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A REMF

No, it goes:"If you ain't Cav, you ain't shit!" If you must stir the pot.

Combat Armor Badge?

Combat Scout Badge?

WTF does 11 series get the and the 19's get the shaft, especially the Deltas, they are just as grunt-tastic as any 11 series.

I like this guy!! The 19D's get it done too.

Before I fully understood how things worked one of my goals was to earn a CIB like my father, grandfather, and uncle have. Being Cav, that sadly won't happen.

Oh well, I'll take a combat patch instead if they ever send me

hey, screw badges, I got my spurs.
you?

Posted: 10/23/2004 6:38:57 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
Quoted:
...
IF YOU AIN'T INFANTRY....YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A REMF

Hackworth.com is calling out to you...

+1 Adam

Between pilots, sailors, tankers... I think there are plenty of combat arms folks who would disagree with you, DSVET...

As would the infantrymen who they've fought alongside & supported, I'd immagine...

Each MOS has their job, there are some places armor can't go, some things infantry weapons can't hurt, and some threats that nothing on the ground can stop...

Posted: 10/23/2004 6:46:48 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:

IF YOU AIN'T INFANTRY....YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A REMF

then why when I was in Iraq, as a 19D Cavalry Scout, was I IN FRONT of my mechanized infantry battallion? explain that to me you uppity bullet catcher

Posted: 10/23/2004 7:01:26 PM EDT

[#25]

Patches? I worked hard to get into a unit so that I don't have to wear them.

Posted: 10/23/2004 7:48:38 PM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
Quoted:

IF YOU AIN'T INFANTRY....YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A REMF

then why when I was in Iraq, as a 19D Cavalry Scout, was I IN FRONT of my mechanized infantry battallion? explain that to me you uppity bullet catcher

Not being uppity...its called Espirit d'corps, something they taught back when I was in 3/15 Inf.
And for all you non infantry types, unbunch your fucking panties and knock the sand out of your pussy's, hell when I was in the different branches were always ragging each other. So ya'll need to lighten up.

Posted: 10/23/2004 7:59:04 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
...
IF YOU AIN'T INFANTRY....YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A REMF

Hackworth.com is calling out to you...

+1 Adam

Between pilots, sailors, tankers... I think there are plenty of combat arms folks who would disagree with you, DSVET...

As would the infantrymen who they've fought alongside & supported, I'd immagine...

Each MOS has their job, there are some places armor can't go, some things infantry weapons can't hurt, and some threats that nothing on the ground can stop...

No shit..thanks for enlightning me. I know every branch has its purpose, that's why we use combine arms tactics.

Posted: 10/23/2004 8:08:17 PM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

IF YOU AIN'T INFANTRY....YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A REMF

then why when I was in Iraq, as a 19D Cavalry Scout, was I IN FRONT of my mechanized infantry battallion? explain that to me you uppity bullet catcher

Not being uppity...its called Espirit d'corps, something they taught back when I was in 3/15 Inf.
And for all you non infantry types, unbunch your fucking panties and knock the sand out of your pussy's, hell when I was in the different branches were always ragging each other. So ya'll need to lighten up.

I agree. Some of my fellow non-infantry personnel are sounding dangerously like the AF guys from one of the interservice threads.

Posted: 10/23/2004 8:13:00 PM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

IF YOU AIN'T INFANTRY....YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A REMF

then why when I was in Iraq, as a 19D Cavalry Scout, was I IN FRONT of my mechanized infantry battallion? explain that to me you uppity bullet catcher

Not being uppity...its called Espirit d'corps, something they taught back when I was in 3/15 Inf.
And for all you non infantry types, unbunch your fucking panties and knock the sand out of your pussy's, hell when I was in the different branches were always ragging each other. So ya'll need to lighten up.

Holy crap dude,

I was a scout for 3/15, 3ID when we went in.
this really is a small world

and if you ask me, even if they wanted to give me an CIB, I wouldnt wear it. I got my spurs, a combat patch, and the personal satisfaction that I dont need a badge to remind me of how well hung I am

but seriously, I am extremely against giving out CIB's to everyone, its just not right, there is a reason why there is an I in there. the biggest group of people whining about these are REMFs, as in non combat arms types who defend themselves and then get all pissy about not getting an award for doing their jobs.

Posted: 10/23/2004 8:24:17 PM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

IF YOU AIN'T INFANTRY....YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A REMF

then why when I was in Iraq, as a 19D Cavalry Scout, was I IN FRONT of my mechanized infantry battallion? explain that to me you uppity bullet catcher

Not being uppity...its called Espirit d'corps, something they taught back when I was in 3/15 Inf.
And for all you non infantry types, unbunch your fucking panties and knock the sand out of your pussy's, hell when I was in the different branches were always ragging each other. So ya'll need to lighten up.

Holy crap dude,

I was a scout for 3/15, 3ID when we went in.
this really is a small world

and if you ask me, even if they wanted to give me an CIB, I wouldnt wear it. I got my spurs, a combat patch, and the personal satisfaction that I dont need a badge to remind me of how well hung I am

but seriously, I am extremely against giving out CIB's to everyone, its just not right, there is a reason why there is an I in there. the biggest group of people whining about these are REMFs, as in non combat arms types who defend themselves and then get all pissy about not getting an award for doing their jobs.

I was Charlie Co. 3/15 Inf. 24th ID (M), in the sandbox for round one. I saw ya'll on the tv when all the ground fighting was going on, bought back alot of memories best left alone. Ya'll done good. I wish they would have let us finish it right the first time, then we would not have had to go back.

You still down at Stewart? Nothing like Ft. Swampy. I haven't been down there in about 5 years, need to get down there and swing by the memorial that was erected for the guys we lost in Desert Storm, especially sense two of them on it we friends of mine in Charlie Co.

Posted: 10/23/2004 8:27:58 PM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:

I was Charlie Co. 3/15 Inf. 24th ID (M), in the sandbox for round one. I saw ya'll on the tv when all the ground fighting was going on, bought back alot of memories best left alone. Ya'll done good. I wish they would have let us finish it right the first time, then we would not have had to go back.

You still down at Stewart? Nothing like Ft. Swampy. I haven't been down there in about 5 years, need to get down there and swing by the memorial that was erected for the guys we lost in Desert Storm, especially sense two of them on it we friends of mine in Charlie Co.

no, I'm in my home sandbox in Arizona in the IRR. I'm out for good I'm afraid, the dust out there did nothing to help out a lung condition that I picked up in Bosnia and I dont think they'll take someone back with a 20% disability rating.
honestly I kind of miss Ft. Swampy, but then I remember the mosquitoes and gnats...........

Posted: 10/23/2004 9:22:30 PM EDT

[#32]

Quoted:
I'm sorry, my EIB just doesn't hold a light to my CIB

Permanent Orders 19-57

Last Name, First Name, xxx-xx-xxxx (SSN) PFC Co B. 4th Bn. 325th AIR 82d Abn Div. Ft Bragg, NC 28307-5100

Announcement is made of the following award.

Award: Combat Infantryman Badge

Date(s) or period of service: Effective 12 January 1990

Authority: Paragraph 5-7, AR 672-5-1, USTAPC MSG 222200Z Dec 1989
Subject: Delegation of award Approval Authority and JTFSO MSG 090400Z Jan 1990
Subject: Change to Delegation of awards Approval Authority.

Reason: For satisfactory performance of duty as an infantryman in active ground combat

Format: 320

I would give every other badge, award, etc. that I got to have earned the CIB.

But in passing I will mention that I talked to several 7th LID guys in Panama who had CIB's who told me that they were embarassed to have them as they didn't shoot anyone, were never in contact, etc. The were feeling guilty as others in the 7th had been in action and some had earned thiers the hard way.

Posted: 10/23/2004 9:29:31 PM EDT

[#33]

Quoted:

no, I'm in my home sandbox in Arizona in the IRR. I'm out for good I'm afraid, the dust out there did nothing to help out a lung condition that I picked up in Bosnia and I dont think they'll take someone back with a 20% disability rating.
honestly I kind of miss Ft. Swampy, but then I remember the mosquitoes and gnats...........

20% is still a go....... we have guys in the USAR getting 20%.

Posted: 10/23/2004 9:48:31 PM EDT

[#34]

Quoted:
Quoted:

no, I'm in my home sandbox in Arizona in the IRR. I'm out for good I'm afraid, the dust out there did nothing to help out a lung condition that I picked up in Bosnia and I dont think they'll take someone back with a 20% disability rating.
honestly I kind of miss Ft. Swampy, but then I remember the mosquitoes and gnats...........

20% is still a go....... we have guys in the USAR getting 20%.

really? once me and the doc figure out a way to get this crap under control, I'll have to look back into it. I'm getting really tired of civillians that take everything for granted.

Posted: 10/24/2004 11:10:08 AM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:
really? once me and the doc figure out a way to get this crap under control, I'll have to look back into it. I'm getting really tired of civillians that take everything for granted.

Please keep us posted on your progress.

Posted: 10/24/2004 2:27:16 PM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:
I just wanted to state, for the record, (because I've been mis-interpreted here before) that I do not have a CIB.

Good point. I don't have one either. But given the current deployment schedule, I doubt it'll be too long before I do. I just hope it's not posthumous, or even simply accompanied by a Purple Heart. I think I'd prefer to avoid needing a medic (or SGLI).

Posted: 10/24/2004 2:42:44 PM EDT

[#37]

I have no problem with some sort of combat ribbon... But, the CIB should stay Infantry. You don't give a Combat Infantrymans Badge to a tanker, some dude who drives a truck, ect. Come up with a combat ribbon or badge, fine.

Posted: 10/24/2004 2:48:29 PM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:
Quoted:
I'll take more pride in my EIB (if I get it next week) than the CIB I'll undoubtedly have within the next year.

I seriously doubt that.

+1

Posted: 10/24/2004 3:04:20 PM EDT

[#39]

Quoted:
Ask any non-infantry soldier why they are not infantry, and they will say something along the lines of:
"why the hell would I put myself through that misery?"
The combat infantry badge was designed to reward the grunts who slogged through month after month of continuous fighting (see Band of Brothers), in every terrain and weather condition.
Even now, the military must be prepared for every type of warfighting environment. MOUT is what we see now, in Iraq. That does not mean that infantry does not bear the brunt of the fighting, or that infantry will not have to fight in the jungle, desert, arctic, etc. environments in the future, in misisons where they patrol with 90 pound packs, on two hours of sleep a day (if they're lucky), and face death 24-7. No other MOS does what they (we) do.

Absolutely Fucking right on!!! NO other MOS lives and fights like Grunts, Period!!!! 11B1P

Posted: 10/24/2004 3:25:14 PM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:
Its about time the Army revises its policy on who gets the CIB and similar combat badges (combat medic, etc...).

In the old days, when there was actually a front line on the battlefield, I could understand giveing CIBs to only infantry. But now, in places like Iraq, there really is no "front line" and other MOSs are seeing combat--some of them alot of combat. Those people need to be given some type of badge. For example, 96Rs are not doing traditional 96R duties, but are now providing security and many are seeing action--why should't they get a badge? I am not saying issue the CIB to other MOSs--after all CIB is an Infantry badge--but give them something similar.

By the way, back in the day when I attended school on Sand Hill, I would have said no F'n way to this, but the times and the nature of war has changed. The Army needs to re-look at this policy an update 670-1.

Yes.

Oh wait! It's called a "combat patch", and you wear it on your right shoulder.

Posted: 10/24/2004 3:28:14 PM EDT

[#41]

Quoted:
Quoted:
.....By the way, back in the day when I attended school on Sand Hill, I would have said no F'n way to this, but the times and the nature of war has changed. The Army needs to re-look at this policy an update 670-1.

Great! Next thing you will want everyone to wear a beret.

Hey, QCMGR! Even better, why don't they just give everyone Cavalry Stetsons so that everyone feels 'elite', and good about themselves?

Posted: 10/24/2004 3:37:54 PM EDT

[#42]

Quoted:
Quoted:
From a Marine's perspective, allow me to chime in. My dad was a soldier, and from what I gather, it seems that what the CIB was originally, has changed and morphed over the years into something very different from its original intent.
It seem that NOW it is very much like the Navy/Marine Corps' "Combat Action Ribbon".
-except only for Infantry.

If you make a Combat Jump, I think that you should get the same recognition, regardless of your MOS.
If you see combat, the same should apply.

My 2 cents.

And thus we get to a primary reason the Army awards so many Bronze Stars (sans "V").

I was going back and forth on this. But since the Army was issuing Bronze Stars, and combat patches to EVERYONE, at least early on, who served in the combat zone, issuing CIB's to everyone IS overkill.

Since the "combat patches" are in effect combat "badges", the CIB should remain an infantry award.

Posted: 10/24/2004 3:42:23 PM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
From a Marine's perspective, allow me to chime in. My dad was a soldier, and from what I gather, it seems that what the CIB was originally, has changed and morphed over the years into something very different from its original intent.
It seem that NOW it is very much like the Navy/Marine Corps' "Combat Action Ribbon".
-except only for Infantry.

If you make a Combat Jump, I think that you should get the same recognition, regardless of your MOS.
If you see combat, the same should apply.

My 2 cents.

And thus we get to a primary reason the Army awards so many Bronze Stars (sans "V").

I was going back and forth on this. But since the Army was issuing Bronze Stars, and combat patches to EVERYONE, at least early on, who served in the combat zone, issuing CIB's to everyone IS overkill.

Since the "combat patches" are in effect combat "badges", the CIB should remain an infantry award.

Never were bronze stars issued to EVERYONE who served in a combat zone.

Posted: 10/24/2004 3:53:41 PM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

no, I'm in my home sandbox in Arizona in the IRR. I'm out for good I'm afraid, the dust out there did nothing to help out a lung condition that I picked up in Bosnia and I dont think they'll take someone back with a 20% disability rating.
honestly I kind of miss Ft. Swampy, but then I remember the mosquitoes and gnats...........

20% is still a go....... we have guys in the USAR getting 20%.

really? once me and the doc figure out a way to get this crap under control, I'll have to look back into it. I'm getting really tired of civillians that take everything for granted.

You said it, RedHorseman. I'm getting tired of all the civilian b00lsheet myself. AZNG needs some Infantry and some Cav, eh?

Posted: 10/24/2004 3:58:39 PM EDT

[#45]

Quoted:

Never were bronze stars issued to EVERYONE who served in a combat zone.

At the conclusion of "major combat operations", Iraqi Freedom, entire units were being issued Bronze Stars, w/o the V. The USMC posters here were upset saying the wholesale awarding of that medal "diluted" it's meaning. Also the MP Bde that Gen. Karpinksi ran, Abu Ghraib (sp?) as one of it's punishments didn't have unit wide Bronze Star awards.

EDIT------------------------

www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4243092/

'Medals inflation?'
More than 69,000 awards and other honors have been handed out by the Air Force for the Iraq war, according to Air Force Capt. Richard Johnson. The list also includes four Air Force Crosses, one step below the Medal of Honor, plus 21 Silver Stars and over 1,900 Bronze Stars.

The Army trails just behind with 40,000 medals issued and approved, including 111 Silver Stars and more than 13,000 Bronze Stars.

Posted: 10/24/2004 4:03:23 PM EDT

[#46]

I dont have the time to wade thru 4 pages of replies, but all I gotta say is Bullshit.

Everyone gets a combat patch. You want more bells and whistles to sew on your uniform go Airbone Infantry or STFU.

Posted: 10/24/2004 4:38:56 PM EDT

[#47]

Quoted:
Quoted:

Never were bronze stars issued to EVERYONE who served in a combat zone.

At the conclusion of "major combat operations", Iraqi Freedom, entire units were being issued Bronze Stars, w/o the V. The USMC posters here were upset saying the wholesale awarding of that medal "diluted" it's meaning. Also the MP Bde that Gen. Karpinksi ran, Abu Ghraib (sp?) as one of it's punishments didn't have unit wide Bronze Star awards.

EDIT------------------------

www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4243092/

'Medals inflation?'
More than 69,000 awards and other honors have been handed out by the Air Force for the Iraq war, according to Air Force Capt. Richard Johnson. The list also includes four Air Force Crosses, one step below the Medal of Honor, plus 21 Silver Stars and over 1,900 Bronze Stars.

The Army trails just behind with 40,000 medals issued and approved, including 111 Silver Stars and more than 13,000 Bronze Stars.

There were a helluva lot more than 13,000 soldiers in the combat zone.

If you have a link to a documented case of 100% of a unit being issued the Bronze Star I would like to see it, I have looked and have yet to find one.

The very numbers you psted shows your quote:

I was going back and forth on this. But since the Army was issuing Bronze Stars, and combat patches to EVERYONE, at least early on, who served in the combat zone, issuing CIB's to everyone IS overkill.

is far from the truth, unless the US Army managed to do the entire invasion of Irag with 13,000 soldiers.

Which of course it did not.

Posted: 10/24/2004 4:47:17 PM EDT

[#48]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
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no, I'm in my home sandbox in Arizona in the IRR. I'm out for good I'm afraid, the dust out there did nothing to help out a lung condition that I picked up in Bosnia and I dont think they'll take someone back with a 20% disability rating.
honestly I kind of miss Ft. Swampy, but then I remember the mosquitoes and gnats...........

20% is still a go....... we have guys in the USAR getting 20%.

really? once me and the doc figure out a way to get this crap under control, I'll have to look back into it. I'm getting really tired of civillians that take everything for granted.

You said it, RedHorseman. I'm getting tired of all the civilian b00lsheet myself. AZNG needs some Infantry and some Cav, eh?

you arent kidding
I'm kicking around the EOD route as all my scores are high enough to get in, and every time I worked with the EOD guys in Bosnia, and Iraq I had a blast(every pun intended) and found the work fascinating and I picked a lot of it up rapidly.

Posted: 10/24/2004 5:01:42 PM EDT

[#49]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

no, I'm in my home sandbox in Arizona in the IRR. I'm out for good I'm afraid, the dust out there did nothing to help out a lung condition that I picked up in Bosnia and I dont think they'll take someone back with a 20% disability rating.
honestly I kind of miss Ft. Swampy, but then I remember the mosquitoes and gnats...........

20% is still a go....... we have guys in the USAR getting 20%.

really? once me and the doc figure out a way to get this crap under control, I'll have to look back into it. I'm getting really tired of civillians that take everything for granted.

You said it, RedHorseman. I'm getting tired of all the civilian b00lsheet myself. AZNG needs some Infantry and some Cav, eh?

you arent kidding
I'm kicking around the EOD route as all my scores are high enough to get in, and every time I worked with the EOD guys in Bosnia, and Iraq I had a blast(every pun intended) and found the work fascinating and I picked a lot of it up rapidly.

Go for it - we have guys in their 50s going through EOD school right now - including one Viet Nam vet!

Posted: 10/24/2004 5:09:18 PM EDT

[#50]

Quoted:

I'm kicking around the EOD route as all my scores are high enough to get in, and every time I worked with the EOD guys in Bosnia, and Iraq I had a blast(every pun intended) and found the work fascinating and I picked a lot of it up rapidly.

Go for it, reclass soldiers tend to get thru EOD school much more successfully (wiser and more mature than newbies out of AIT). Get all the paperwork in and if it gets approved you can get attached to a EOD unit prior to your school date. At EOD school, just study your ass off and pay attention to DETAIL, if you can do that, you will do fine.

Just remember, they hand out other badges like candy but "Crabs" (EOD Badge) are given to a select and "deranged" few.

Let me know if you get in and if you are about to graduate, I'll drive down to buy you a well deserved drink, just remember to have your EOD coin on you at all times, EOD Techs love free beer.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Its time to start issuing CIB-type badges to other MOSs---they see combat too. (Page 2 of 3)

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