Quoted: Quoted: And you guys (red shirts) are AGAINST planned parenthood (at least funing for groups such as)? More kids growing up on welfare = more adults looking for govt. handouts = more Democrat voters. That a tougher call, but I'm for Life. I think more education, more pregnancy prevention, and more legal adoptions. My wife and I are college educated, high income, and can't have kids.  We don't adopt largely because of the expense and the nightmare of adoption today. Almost everyone I know that has adopted has had to go overseas, and that's still a nightmare. If my taxes weren't supporting all those single moms, they would need to give up their children for adoption, which IMO would be a far better thing than having a 15 y/o raise a baby.

Remember Planned Parenthood is not ALL about abortions. You can tell people not to screw all day long and they still will. At least give them something to wrap it with.

Quoted: Remember Planned Parenthood is not ALL about abortions. You can tell people not to screw all day long and they still will. At least give them something to wrap it with.

I don't know if the Feds or the State need to fund it.  There are plenty of private organizations that do the job.

Quoted: Quoted: Remember Planned Parenthood is not ALL about abortions. You can tell people not to screw all day long and they still will. At least give them something to wrap it with. I don't know if the Feds or the State need to fund it.  There are plenty of private organizations that do the job.

The federal / state government will pay down the road , the cost of a few condoms is alot less then the cost of a person on welfare , or in prison.

I am paying taxes and I want some more value for my dollar

I don't really care what the result of this divide is, as long as it comes while I, and not my children, have to deal with it.  If liberals and conservatives manage to live in peaceful co existance, fine.  That would be ideal.  If there is some civil war in which large numbers of our population die, fine.  Even if I am one of them.  Dying defending my RKBA beats not knowing if my children will have too, IMHO  

Hoppy8420

Few comments based on what I've read here:

1]Can we come together as a nation?
Only when the socialists quit trying to cram their agenda down our throat and recognize that we also are entitled to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. If they continue to try to grow gov't and increase it's control over our lives then there will be a fight. It will be inevitable.

2]The country was more divided during Nam. No question. The differnece now is that the right has had enough of all your liberal bullshit. As far as I am concerned they can either pull their head out of their ass or piss off and die.

3]

We are all americans, first and foremost.

Tell it to the f'ing socialists. They hate America, and abhor what it stands for. They believe America stands for baby murder and letting some pervert screw a goat in front of your kids.
We might be better off without alot of you. Hell the whole world might be better off.

4]Socialists can't even stick together with the rest of us during a War. Their disamy at allowing conservatives any autonomy is so great that they would see this country destroyed rather than have a return to some sensible conservative values.

5] Gun Control? Incremental? Maybe, maybe not. The gov't would likely do this incrementally but their are plenty of socialists who insist on cramming their entire agenda down our throat no matter how we feel about. They'll try. I'll lock and f'ing load. Piss on 'em.

6]Entitlements.
Without same they have NO political clout. Everything they have in the way of political power is based on using the money of the working class in this nation to buy votes from the "mob" which is increasing exponentially in this country. I say we are better off without them.
The key to conservatism and common sense in this country is to eliminate "entitlements". You ain't entitled to shit. Neither is you 15 year old slut daughter, you pierced and tattooed 16 year old son, etc, etc, etc. Get a job or get the fuck out.

7]TJ, you are correct....But it is almost unavoidable at this point. The ensuing economic collapse is coming, driven by ridiculous fiscal policy, loss of jobs and a burgeoning debt thanks, once agian, to the ridiculous and unamerican entitlement mentality which pervades our society. With that and the impending implosion of the middle east will come WWIII. Better get prepared for it.

8]Zaphod, you quote my sigline??!!
Scary!


Fuck 'em. We're the ones with the guns.

All I can say is that those people on DU are messed up!  their mindset boggles me.  It's spooky to see so many people that can't think beyond 2 dimensional arguments.  They don't realize that we are at war with an enemy that cuts innocents heads off.  That killed innocents by the thousands on 9/11 and all they can think about is being the political party in power?!?!  Writing that the conservatives know they're wrong because they aren't fighting us too tough??!?!!  We're trying to get them to realize that we are not the nme, the terrorists are.  If they don't realize this by now, maybe they should leave this country.  What will it take to get these people to realize that this war on terrorism could possibly be the most important issue mankind has ever seen?  Ten 9/11s?  100 - 9/11s???  A nuclear bomb going off in NYC?  Biochemicals going off in LA???  What do they need to become unified once again?  Even if they did it wouldn't be for very long...they listen to the liberal media and politicians as if it were from God himself.  (They don't like the thought of there being a God because that would mean their Gov't isn't the most powerful entity in the universe) They never challenge anything from their power-hungry sources.  Blah blah blah I know its all been written before, but why don't they see it?!??!?

Quoted: How can the two opposing views POSSIBLY be reconciled?  Example: The left says that nothing in the Constitution wouild prevent complete disarmament of the general citizenry, because the 2nd Amendment only prohibits states from disarming their National Guard units. How can YOU honestly just 'agree to disagree' with that?  Do you think the left will agree to disagree, or do you think that they really do have complete civilian disarmament in mind? That's just one issue.  The problems are seen on both sides as so fundamental to our way of life that neither side can compromise or back off from their beliefs.

DoubleFeed, the American people have the right to espouse whatever bizarre belief they wish.
We have had commies, kkk, nazis, Shakers, Mormons, socialists, violent patriots, genocidal Indian killers, robber barons, capitalists, and a huge variety of other oddities amongst our own people before.
It is the power of the vote that decides what path we follow.
If enough of our fellow American citizens decide to take a path we do not agree with, and can influence the Supreme Court to say it is Constitutional, we HAVE NO CHOICE.
They win.
That is the people speaking, and we all know how easily the Supreme Court can be influenced in it's interpretation of the Constitution.
We are WAY past the point of being absolutists with our Constitution, we have allowed too much as precedent already.

Yet NOW, the ruling party followers suggest we KILL the opposition?
One has the right to be as stupid and bigoted politically as one chooses in America.
This is a fundamental right.
When our government arrests or allows it's dissidents to be murdered, the country is no longer what our Founding Fathers intended.
In fact, it becomes exactly what they tried to make sure it would NOT be.

I am certainly NOT a liberal leftist, but to do what some here suggest, would make me a fascist, and I am not that either.
We are a representative Republic, and if our masses are blind and stupid, they will elect the government that they deserve.

Quoted: If it comes down to an actual hot war with these fascists I am willing to be on the barricades. you gonna beat me to death with your protest sign?

I can’t believe there are still people of our ilk who still believe liberals are all harmless.

MEMO:  Liberals are quite capable of violence and have no problem initiating it at the drop of a hat.  

I’ll site two encounters I have had myself with liberals and workplace violence, and the recent spat of Republican campaign office break-in’s and demonstrations.  

Carry on.

ETA:  TJ says it best.  +1 for polarization to the point of economic collapse.

Quoted: Quoted: How can the two opposing views POSSIBLY be reconciled?  Example: The left says that nothing in the Constitution wouild prevent complete disarmament of the general citizenry, because the 2nd Amendment only prohibits states from disarming their National Guard units. How can YOU honestly just 'agree to disagree' with that?  Do you think the left will agree to disagree, or do you think that they really do have complete civilian disarmament in mind? That's just one issue.  The problems are seen on both sides as so fundamental to our way of life that neither side can compromise or back off from their beliefs. DoubleFeed, the American people have the right to espouse whatever bizarre belief they wish. We have had commies, kkk, nazis, Shakers, Mormons, socialists, violent patriots, genocidal Indian killers, robber barons, capitalists, and a huge variety of other oddities amongst our own people before. It is the power of the vote that decides what path we follow. If enough of our fellow American citizens decide to take a path we do not agree with, and can influence the Supreme Court to say it is Constitutional, we HAVE NO CHOICE. They win. That is the people speaking, and we all know how easily the Supreme Court can be influenced in it's interpretation of the Constitution. We are WAY past the point of being absolutists with our Constitution, we have allowed too much as precedent already. Yet NOW, the ruling party followers suggest we KILL the opposition? One has the right to be as stupid and bigoted politically as one chooses in America. This is a fundamental right. When our government arrests or allows it's dissidents to be murdered, the country is no longer what our Founding Fathers intended. In fact, it becomes exactly what they tried to make sure it would NOT be. I am certainly NOT a liberal leftist, but to do what some here suggest, would make me a fascist, and I am not that either. We are a representative Republic, and if our masses are blind and stupid, they will elect the government that they deserve.

Then what, pray tell, is the reason for a constitution? We are not a democracy. We are a representative republic with a Constitution that protects the people from the knee jerk reactions of a bunch of socialist retards. Fuck with that at your own peril.
Yeah, you all can try to destroy the Constitution incrementally but I, and some others like me, WILL fight. I hope you all like the taste of lead.

Hey, who's the fucking new troll?

FNT?

I like it.

foad troll

TXL

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Goatboy has specifically requested NO HOTLINKS TO DU So, I'll respect that. Me too. I'm just curious if anyone other than GB knows the reason for the request. No one else needs to. It's his board. Period. Hasn't this been beaten to death already? Yes--the answers are the same as they were last week when this was beaten to death because Red_Beard "had nothing better to do than argue."  I do, so reread last week's session:  www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=281328&page=2

I'm just curious how hotlinking causes problems. You don't know. I don't know, and I'm not going to ask the only person who does. So, I'll just ask once in a while, in hopes that someone who knows more about this sort of thing can answer.

DoubleFeed, unless you want us to become like the Soviets, the nazis, or any other garden variety fascists, we must fight them at the ballot box, not in the streets or in kamps.

To do otherwise destroys the freedom of Americans to choose their own government, no matter how bad a choice they make.
To enforce your intentions on their possible majority is as evil as them sabotaging your possible majority.
It is called FASCISM.
Americans have the right to choose their representation, even if some of us disagree with what the majority may choose.

We DO NOT kill fellow Americans for their beliefs in this country.
The voters have the final word.
A second civil war would be the end of this Great Experiment we know as the United States.
We are supposed to be free.
Free to be as left wing or as right wing as we choose.

And until state's rights are restored fully, (THAT got taken away the LAST time we did the Civil War thing), majority WILL rule in the country, through the vote and the Federal government.

Our protections as a Republic have been long ago thrown away, and the will of the majority has been imposed.
It is a bit late to close the barn door on all of the third worlders that have been imported to vote democrat though, perhaps people should not have been so afraid to be tagged as "racists" for suggesting otherwise.

Quoted: Most of them are American citizens, same as you.

Citizenship is meant to be a privilege  - not a "right".

Don't equate me with those people who happen to live within our Nation, but are obviously so filled with hate of their homeland that they have forfeited their Citizenship.

To espouse leftist and thinly veiled socialist views is traitorous and betrays the Founders of our Republic.

To mandate foreign approval as part of our policy decision-making process is traitorous and betrays the Founders of our Republic.

"'Tis our true policy to steer clear of permanent alliances, with any portion of the foreign world... Why quit our own to stand upon foreign ground?--Why by interweaving our destiny with that of any part of Europe, entangle our peace and prosperity in the toils of European ambition, rivalship, interest, humour or caprice? " Geo. Washington

Why is the "Kumbayah Gap" widening in this country? It's very simple:

For liberalism to succeed it has to have MASS FORCED PARTICIPATION. It cannot work if only some play along. It HAS to be EVERYONE. That is the fundamental difference between our 2 sides. Conservatism, in general, is a "hands off-leave me be" type of mentality. Conservatism is comfortable with the status quo. Liberalism, on the other hand, has to be ACTIVIST and change every damn thing to their liking. Hell, they even arrogantly call themselves "progressives" (as if anyone who doesn't agree with their cockimamy schemes is  "regressive").

They love to talk about the right "marching in lockstep" as if we're some kind of friggin' Nazi's goosestepping in downtown Berlin. Quite the contrary. THEY are the ones trying to cram their twisted, UN-AMERICAN (yes, I said UN-AMERICAN and meant it) agenda down our throats in unison.

One good thing has come from the Vietnam legacy. Conservatives saw what happened when liberals ruined a war effort as a stepping stone to the ultimate re-design of society---it was their "birthing" so to speak. Many of us today have sworn we will NEVER allow that to happen again because we are so disgusted by what the last 35 years has brought us. It started with an anti-war rallying cry and spread like a cancer to all facets of societal life. No, there will be no "compromise" and yes, the gap will widen.

I'm unashamed to say I HATE those people and their ideas. I will do all humanly possible to resist their agenda being forced down my throat, at the ballot box now but however necessary in the future. I guess I'm one of those unyielding folks who make up both sides in this fight. So be it!

And I might remind everyone that just because the "majority" may think or support something doesn't necessarily make it right. Some things CANNOT be removed just because the "majority" deems it so. Those things are constitutional freedoms, UNALIENABLE RIGHTS.        

Quoted: Why is the "Kumbayah Gap" widening in this country? It's very simple: For liberalism to succeed it has to have MASS FORCED PARTICIPATION.

ABNAK - well said for a country bumkin in flyover country!  

Quoted: DoubleFeed, unless you want us to become like the Soviets, the nazis, or any other garden variety fascists, we must fight them at the ballot box, not in the streets or in kamps.

I will not allow them to dismantle the Constitution under ANY circumstances. Period. If that means fighting them in the streets then so be it. Grow some or go back to DU.

Hexagonal - I think you make some very good points.


However, our Constitution is a Contract that lays out the parameters for a government that we were all willing to live under.

Part of that contract was protecting our Rights against the unwashed masses - hence we aren't a Democracy.


You talk about the will of the people and the vote.   What if 51% of the population wanted to reinstitute slavery?   You okay with that?




Here's a bigger question for you - what happens when we are split 50/50, and neither side is willing to budge, and neither side can live under the tyranny of the other?   I think we are there.

They want to take more control of my labor (money) and my life (gun control, etc..), and they claim we have our issues too (Patriot Act comes to mind)

What happens when we are essentially split into 2 camps on most issues?  Who wins?  Who moderates that?

Quoted: Hexagonal - I think you make some very good points. However, our Constitution is a Contract that lays out the parameters for a government that we were all willing to live under. Part of that contract was protecting our Rights against the unwashed masses - hence we aren't a Democracy. You talk about the will of the people and the vote.   What if 51% of the population wanted to reinstitute slavery?   You okay with that? Here's a bigger question for you - what happens when we are split 50/50, and neither side is willing to budge, and neither side can live under the tyranny of the other?   I think we are there. They want to take more control of my labor (money) and my life (gun control, etc..), and they claim we have our issues too (Patriot Act comes to mind) What happens when we are essentially split into 2 camps on most issues?  Who wins?  Who moderates that?

The courts. The same courts which have been stacked, by the socialists over the past 4 decades, with activist  judges who legislate from the bench and "interpret" the Constitution in ways that would befound anyone with any degree of common sense or decency.
No, we will end up fighting. Either that or kneeling to the boot. Not going to happen here, that is for damn sure.

Quoted: Quoted: [They're breeding faster than we are. And you guys (red shirts) are AGAINST planned parenthood (at least funing for groups such as)? More kids growing up on welfare = more adults looking for govt. handouts = more Democrat voters.

BIG ASS +1!

Quoted: Quoted: Fuck 'em. We're the ones with the guns. They're breeding faster than we are.

Actually, they're not.  They believe in abortion and a woman's right to choose.  I believe in having as many kids as I can support, which currently stands at 3.  All of them but the 8 month old have expressed an interest in shooting.  Friday, my 6 year old, the oldest, is going to get her first .22LR.

Our children may very well be the last generation to know such things as a RKBA.

Again, only if we that do believe in the RKBA and freedom don't produce a generation that feels the same way.  We have a duty to perpetuate our beliefs, way of life, and above all else, freedom!

Remember the Alamo, and God Bless Texas...

Quoted: Quoted: And you guys (red shirts) are AGAINST planned parenthood (at least funing for groups such as)? More kids growing up on welfare = more adults looking for govt. handouts = more Democrat voters. That a tougher call, but I'm for Life. I think more education, more pregnancy prevention, and more legal adoptions. My wife and I are college educated, high income, and can't have kids.  We don't adopt largely because of the expense and the nightmare of adoption today. Almost everyone I know that has adopted has had to go overseas, and that's still a nightmare. If my taxes weren't supporting all those single moms, they would need to give up their children for adoption, which IMO would be a far better thing than having a 15 y/o raise a baby.

If you really want to adopt, the easiest way is to become a foster parent.  My in-laws adopted three that way.  The real issue is that most people want babies, not the 3+ year olds that are left in the system.

Remember the Alamo, and God Bless Texas...

Should be a walk over but, worse comes to worse, make sure they don't take you alive.  Homosexual rape would be a given under such circumstances.

I really dont understand the religious conservative mindset either!! If you look at history, by definition conservatism (keeping things the way they are) always "dies out" or fades and we always move towards a more 'Progressive' future. No? The old people with 'old fashioned' ways die off and are replaced by more enlightened young people. No? Sure a few nutty parents indoctrineate their children so there are always a few 'young' conservatives but for the most part the young are for change and not the status quo. No? Anyhew I don't buy into this whole conserveative bullshit rhetoric about 'less Government' or less 'interference' in our lives. I lived long enough to see that both sides just want to get power hold onto it by any means nessesary then weild that power to force the other 49% of the population to obey their political ideology!! So the Dems use the ATF to grab guns, so what? The Repubs use the Attorney General and FCC to "attack" people who make porn (a legal product) or clean up the 'public airwaves' of so-called filthy talk. The Dems use the go'vt to enforce 'safety' laws like seatbelt laws or speed laws or other 'safety nazi' bullshit. the repubs if given the chance will outlaw abortion then use the FEDS to arrest doctors who provide abortions and detain women who are trying to sneak across the border to Canada to get a safe legal abortion. Don't think that's not possible! It happened in Ireland, A woman was arrested and detained so she could not go to England to get an Abortion! So it seems to me each side just wants to force the other to it's WILL. Period. I belive in another philosophy - live and let live and MIND YOUR OWN GODDAMN BUSINESS. If you know anything about Americas past then you'll know that prior to the 20th century that's the way it was. It was only with the rise of the modern 'super state' that people began interfering with other peoples lives. So to quote Ghandi - "......for God's sake, stop it!"

The degree to which the 'armed conflict' is likely depends on how disciplined the left is as it marches the nation leftward. They've been resisted the most during spurts of impatience like Hillarycare - which the better leftist strategists knew to be foolish and overreaching. Al Gore, dolt that he is, openly admitted this was a tactical mistake. As did Clinton with the AWB.

Obvious victories are not what got them to where they are today. Fabianism (incrementalism) did. Nor did something as extreme as the Green Party. If they remember this, they will never be resisted to any significant degree. If they don't, and lose patience, they will be resisted.

It's just the tired, old frog-boiling metaphor.

....few nutty parents..... I belive in another philosophy - live and let live and MIND YOUR OWN GODDAMN BUSINESS.

Nutty parents? Because they don't want their kids indoctrinated with "progressive" bullshit? And you really buy into the idea that "progressive" as it is in this country today is good? Gimme a break.  



Second part kinda sounds a little CONSERVATIVE, no? You seem to contradict your earlier glowing review of "progressive", which sure as hell ain't about minding your own business. It's about minding everyone ELSE'S business.

Quoted: du post: will fracture after this election no matter who wins. The Neo Fascists, anti-Christ Right Wing and the Paleo-Conservatives are barely keeping this party together. If the Bush Admin. doesn't acceed to the Fundie demands they have threatened to start a 3rd Party. I hope that they do. Isn't the "Constitution Party" Right Wing enough for them? If it comes down to an actual hot war with these fascists I am willing to be on the barricades. If it comes down to an actual hot war with these fascists I am willing to be on the barricades. _________________________________________________________________________________________ hmmm. I WANT HIM ON THE "BARRICADES"!!! I'll use his body for cover.

At least he understand that it is HE who will be on the defensive...

Quoted: The degree to which the 'armed conflict' is likely depends on how disciplined the left is as it marches the nation leftward. They've been resisted the most during spurts of impatience like Hillarycare - which the better leftist strategists knew to be foolish and overreaching. Al Gore, dolt that he is, openly admitted this was a tactical mistake. As did Clinton with the AWB. Obvious victories are not what got them to where they are today. Fabianism (incrementalism) did. Nor did something as extreme as the Green Party. If they remember this, they will never be resisted to any significant degree. If they don't, and lose patience, they will be resisted. It's just the tired, old frog-boiling metaphor.

Good call.

Quoted: Quoted: Fuck 'em. We're the ones with the guns. They're breeding faster than we are. Our children may very well be the last generation to know such things as a RKBA.

JUST BUY MORE AMMO!

Armed conflict my ass, the socialists will win in the courts, passing laws to lock up all the repubs.

Quoted: Armed conflict my ass, the socialists will win in the courts, passing laws to lock up all the repubs.

I am all in favor for the violent reimplementation of the Constitution.........along with the douching out of certain non-original intent amendments like the 17th, 16th...........

Dave S

Second part kinda sounds a little CONSERVATIVE, no? You seem to contradict your earlier glowing review of "progressive", which sure as hell ain't about minding your own business

  Nope. If you read the whole post  correctly you'd see that I do not belive that the Repubs practice what they preach!! They spout that gov't off our back rhetoric to win the "independant minded" Americans but they don't really mean it. Why? because they have another wing of the party they have to kow-tow to. The Christo-faschists. These people are just as bad as the gun grabbers! but instead of guns they use the gov't to grab or prohibit something else. I seem to contradict myself? Why? because I fall into neither your  left/right pigeon holes? Good! I'm a true independant! With opinions on both sides of the aisle. I think the best way to kill off gov't is to gridlock it with one party holding the house the other holding the executive. That way even if they manage to pass laws they will be half assed and so full of loopholes (AWB come to mind?) that it will be basically a useless gesture. Again, the only thing I can say is this, if your a lefty don't use JBT's to persecute people you don't like or approve of. And if your a righty.........don't use the JBT's to persecute people you don't like or approve of.    it's just so simple.

Quoted: Should be a walk over but, worse comes to worse, make sure they don't take you alive.  Homosexual rape would be a given under such circumstances.

. . . I'm stocking up on XM193 . . .

Quoted: Nope. If you read the whole post  correctly you'd see that I do not belive that the Repubs practice what they preach!! They spout that gov't off our back rhetoric to win the "independant minded" Americans but they don't really mean it.

I think that at least some of them do mean it, and they are certainly better than the Democrats in this respect.

The basic problem with the Republicans is that the free market/small government agenda only has so much play. People like the idea, but not when it means cutting their cherished government program . . . so you have to say "I'm for small government and freedom" while also telling everyone how you are going to pump up their favorit government handout.

Notice that even Dems try to avoid the liberal label ("let's get away from labels . . ."), and Repubs have to throw around money for perscriptions.

You've heard the saying you get the government you deserve? We got it.

Gotta get a IBTB here...

If you can't say "kill all the muslims," how can you say "kill all the liberals?"

Some of you have mentioned adoption in this thread so I'll throw this in.  My wife and I adopted a little girl from China when she was 9 months old.  She is now almost 2 years old and the light of our lives.  If anyone wants info on how to do it, I'll fill in details.  In short, the process is pretty easy and doesn't cost a whole lot.  There is also a $10,000 tax credit that will allow you to reclaim more than half your expenses.  Sorry for the off-topic but it was already in the thread.

In response to the main points of the thread, I think that there is a growing division between the "reds" and the "blues".  I can only see it growing worse.

James

hex. i think you are missing the point. conservative LEADERS are not advocating any of this. And God lnows I hope a war doesnt come. But I believe it will. Were not advocating rounding up our fellow citizens and murdering them nor do we advocate the gov doing it like the nazi's did. However if the libs or a liberal gov pushes too far we will have to make a stand. In any case they would fire the first shot so to speak.

If someone is hitting you and you have nowhere to run dont you fight? Were not advocating murder or genocide. If however the other side does get violent or oppressive we are advocating kicking their collective asses and regaining our freedoms.

nuff said.

When GW wins just remember the phrase domestic terrorist (sore looser)

They're breeding faster than we are.

Naw, they're too busy having abortions and homo's can't reproduce.  

Our children may very well be the last generation to know such things as a RKBA.

Now this is probably true.  You must read the book "FedEd" by Allen Quist.  It wil send chills up your spine.  I received a copy from a FALfile'r who was so concerned, he bought a case of books and is giving them away for the asking.

Check out these reviews:

www.edwatch.org/lewrockwell/yates.htm

www.townhall.com/bookclub/quist.html

Listen to this idiot from DU.  He thinks they are going to "give us"  some kind of access to the sea.  I wonder just how they plan to force us to live anywhere.  They'll be damn lucky if we allow them to live.

"I call for a bloodless separation. Give the right wing neo-cons and born agains their own part of the country - make sure they have some kind of access to the sea. Then, if they want to fight a war for some oil on the other side of the world or kill some infidels or rewrite the constitution for their christians and jews - they can do it with their own children. If peace seeking people are together - the true U.S.-America patriotic side with the original constitution, the enemies of the neo-con, born agains will know where the borders are. I want my constitution and a truly wise, non-partisan Supreme Court and idealistic leaders. I wish the neo-con, born again side all the best - it will be a relief not to have to suffer the deaths and casualties of neo-con, born wars. The side I'm on can sign a pact with all the other nations who are tired of the killing, usury, and take-overs."

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Fuck 'em. We're the ones with the guns. They're breeding faster than we are. Actually, they're not.  They believe in abortion and a woman's right to choose.

They're making up for it by importing as many 3rd world socialists as possible. See "the death of the west" by pat buchanan.

Quoted: Quoted: Fuck 'em. We're the ones with the guns. They're breeding faster than we are. Our children may very well be the last generation to know such things as a RKBA.

Its hard to imagine people who beleve in abortion as a valid means of population control out breeding those who don't...

They IMPORT more followers, from countries that are not used to having ANY freedom at all, but I don't think that they outbreed conservative Christians.

Funny, I"ve had the same discussion about them.  Giving them part of the country, with sea access, and parting company.

"I call for a bloodless separation. Give the right wing neo-cons and born agains their own part of the country - make sure they have some kind of access to the sea. Then, if they want to fight a war for some oil on the other side of the world or kill some infidels or rewrite the constitution for their christians and jews - they can do it with their own children. If peace seeking people are together - the true U.S.-America patriotic side with the original constitution, the enemies of the neo-con, born agains will know where the borders are. I want my constitution and a truly wise, non-partisan Supreme Court and idealistic leaders. I wish the neo-con, born again side all the best - it will be a relief not to have to suffer the deaths and casualties of neo-con, born wars. The side I'm on can sign a pact with all the other nations who are tired of the killing, usury, and take-overs."

You know, there's something to be said for seperate nations after a civil war.  When the left gets settled, we can watch them implode when all their social programs collapse their government.  With all the welfare deadbeats they'll have, there's no way they'll be able to pay for them.

We could also conduct forays into their territory to plunder and pillage just like the vikings did.  Most of them are afraid of guns and their police, if they have any, will most likely be unarmed.

I'm beginning to like this idea more and more.

Don't get too caught up in labels & Definations, Today the word liberal has been bastardized into a PC word used to describe Quazi Socialist/Communist (Kerry, Kennedy), People are too PC to call a spade a spade so Socialist/Communist=Liberal.
The word Conservitive has also been bastardized, In our culture it is used as a description for a modern Patriot who beleives in the law as stated in the US Constitution.

The Republicans ar not conservitive they are the true liberals, The dems ar just a bunch of Quazi Socialist/Communist who want to turn us into a Socialist Workers Paradise.  

I don't see the US surviving in its current state without some serious confrontation between the two groups, The gap has been getting wider & Nastier from the election of Clinton in 92 through today & I dont see it narrowing any time soon; The Socialist have already forgotten about Sept 11 & Are doing their best to help everyone else to forget ASAP.
Its going to be a long cold road ahead so stock up on all the ammo you can now, You are going to need it!  

Quoted: I really dont understand the religious conservative mindset either!! If you look at history, by definition conservatism (keeping things the way they are) always "dies out" or fades and we always move towards a more 'Progressive' future. No? The old people with 'old fashioned' ways die off and are replaced by more enlightened young people. No? Sure a few nutty parents indoctrineate their children so there are always a few 'young' conservatives but for the most part the young are for change and not the status quo. No? Anyhew I don't buy into this whole conserveative bullshit rhetoric about 'less Government' or less 'interference' in our lives. I lived long enough to see that both sides just want to get power hold onto it by any means nessesary then weild that power to force the other 49% of the population to obey their political ideology!! So the Dems use the ATF to grab guns, so what? The Repubs use the Attorney General and FCC to "attack" people who make porn (a legal product) or clean up the 'public airwaves' of so-called filthy talk. The Dems use the go'vt to enforce 'safety' laws like seatbelt laws or speed laws or other 'safety nazi' bullshit. the repubs if given the chance will outlaw abortion then use the FEDS to arrest doctors who provide abortions and detain women who are trying to sneak across the border to Canada to get a safe legal abortion. Don't think that's not possible! It happened in Ireland, A woman was arrested and detained so she could not go to England to get an Abortion! So it seems to me each side just wants to force the other to it's WILL. Period. I belive in another philosophy - live and let live and MIND YOUR OWN GODDAMN BUSINESS. If you know anything about Americas past then you'll know that prior to the 20th century that's the way it was. It was only with the rise of the modern 'super state' that people began interfering with other peoples lives. So to quote Ghandi - "......for God's sake, stop it!"

Quoted: I am shocked at how personal and nasty people are getting in this election. I have never seen the country so divided, not even during Viet Nam did people literally want to KILL each other over a variance in politics. I have seen people on both sides actually wish DEATH upon fellow Americans for holding the opposite view. This is utterly un-American. We are ALL Americans first and foremost, and we have the absolute right to whatever opinions we may choose to hold. I suppose you all are cheering that perhaps half of the folks killed on 9/11 were Democrats? Shame on both sides for being so hateful over something as controlled and bought-off as politics. Americans need to stand together, not be divided by something as stupid as partisan politics. Hell, both parties are bought and paid for by the corporations anyway.

The only problem with your comment is that liberals dont see us as all americans.  They will do anything including lying, cheating, destroying even killing in order to win.  They want to destroy america and remake it into their one world UN running Utopia and in order to do that they only have to do one thing.  Destroy conservatives and the Republican party.  If we dont stand up to these traitors and fight they will destroy us, there is no common ground. Its either victory or death!

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: How can the two opposing views POSSIBLY be reconciled?  Example: The left says that nothing in the Constitution wouild prevent complete disarmament of the general citizenry, because the 2nd Amendment only prohibits states from disarming their National Guard units. How can YOU honestly just 'agree to disagree' with that?  Do you think the left will agree to disagree, or do you think that they really do have complete civilian disarmament in mind? That's just one issue.  The problems are seen on both sides as so fundamental to our way of life that neither side can compromise or back off from their beliefs. DoubleFeed, the American people have the right to espouse whatever bizarre belief they wish. We have had commies, kkk, nazis, Shakers, Mormons, socialists, violent patriots, genocidal Indian killers, robber barons, capitalists, and a huge variety of other oddities amongst our own people before. It is the power of the vote that decides what path we follow. If enough of our fellow American citizens decide to take a path we do not agree with, and can influence the Supreme Court to say it is Constitutional, we HAVE NO CHOICE. They win. That is the people speaking, and we all know how easily the Supreme Court can be influenced in it's interpretation of the Constitution. We are WAY past the point of being absolutists with our Constitution, we have allowed too much as precedent already. Yet NOW, the ruling party followers suggest we KILL the opposition? One has the right to be as stupid and bigoted politically as one chooses in America. This is a fundamental right. When our government arrests or allows it's dissidents to be murdered, the country is no longer what our Founding Fathers intended. In fact, it becomes exactly what they tried to make sure it would NOT be. I am certainly NOT a liberal leftist, but to do what some here suggest, would make me a fascist, and I am not that either. We are a representative Republic, and if our masses are blind and stupid, they will elect the government that they deserve. Then what, pray tell, is the reason for a constitution? We are not a democracy. We are a representative republic with a Constitution that protects the people from the knee jerk reactions of a bunch of socialist retards. Fuck with that at your own peril. Yeah, you all can try to destroy the Constitution incrementally but I, and some others like me, WILL fight. I hope you all like the taste of lead.

drjarhead, you are da man!