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Link Posted: 1/15/2021 8:08:36 PM EDT
[#1]
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I am sure chosen and shown to send a message.  Well done guardsman (woman).
Link Posted: 1/15/2021 8:24:21 PM EDT
[#2]
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I have to say, I'm a bit concerned about our National Guards in this country.

This past summer I saw the California National Guard on videos and a lot of them were wearing non-issued airsoft level coyote brown plate carriers.  

Every National Guard unit I've seen is this mix of OCP and ACU still.  

The ones in D.C. though are by far the most overweight I've seen yet.  True, they are layered due to the cold, but I saw one woman with what my wife said looked like size 22 pants on and a guy behind her who had to be a men's size 40 or 42.  How can someone get that big and still be in the National Guard? I'm not saying that to be mean or disrespectful, it's an honest question.

Also, what is up with logistics?  Why are they still using M9 pistols? Didn't the US Army start taking shipments of M17s years ago?  How long does it take to field the new pistols? ACU rucks and assault packs still?  How long ago was the conversion over to OCPs done?

I don't mean to be negative to men and women who I feel serve this nation with distinction and are a credit to this country, but where are all our tax dollars going? Largest defense budget in the history of mankind and they're rolling in old gear with old weapons many overweight some obese.  We can't afford nutrition counseling and gym membership for these NG folks?
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yes m9s are still current issue even in the AD, did you think some magical fairy overnight distributes M17s? You're looking at OCIE gear it has to be filled up over the next 6 or 7 years. And yes thats accurate, it took about that long to distribute the UCP pattern gear.  If the Army didn't piss around with uniform flair for the last 10 years there would be the correct gear in OCP.

I really do appreciate and love are you guys spouting off about logistics, weight control and counseling gems and all this other bullshit you have no idea about what it takes to get soldiers in the Armory and  trained in the field.  Guess what their are fat fucks on AD too. The big differences active-duty chapters them out.  and there's a constant influx of recruiting 18-25 yos  who BTW a good % are still out of shape and overweight. They can beat the hell out of them on active duty to go to the gym 24x7 and do all that other stuff or in 4 years they'll be out of a job,  a good half of them gets fed up leave.

NG is alot older like in there 28 to 30s about 1/2 is prior service and more  about retaining numbers, mainly because it's so hard to keep train people in their ranks. They're expected to do the exact same job with half the time. I have SNCOs that do do exercise programs and weight control on their own dime.  but taking a bunch of random part time people constantly telling them do exercise, be marathon runners and crossfitters to GDd non serving jags liking,  is near impossible and also accomplish the same certification proficiency tasks in a technical branch like artillery. Lets add in  SHARP, safety,  orders briefings, maintenance, supply issues, medical SRPs  and general admin bs  all in a 2 to 3 day weekend.  Plus mix in State missions like these, Hey you, crap for 2-3 weeks in DC.  Do you start to see the issue now?

Lets take you out of your regular job for 48-60 days a year with a 12mo deployment  for good measure and see how it works out for you.  This ain't your grandpappy's guard anymore and God forbid you're in a critical low-density MOS you are going to get rotated as backfills every 3 years.
I
Link Posted: 1/15/2021 10:24:49 PM EDT
[#3]
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Quoted:
I have to say, I'm a bit concerned about our National Guards in this country.

This past summer I saw the California National Guard on videos and a lot of them were wearing non-issued airsoft level coyote brown plate carriers.  

Every National Guard unit I've seen is this mix of OCP and ACU still.  

The ones in D.C. though are by far the most overweight I've seen yet.  True, they are layered due to the cold, but I saw one woman with what my wife said looked like size 22 pants on and a guy behind her who had to be a men's size 40 or 42.  How can someone get that big and still be in the National Guard? I'm not saying that to be mean or disrespectful, it's an honest question.

Also, what is up with logistics?  Why are they still using M9 pistols? Didn't the US Army start taking shipments of M17s years ago?  How long does it take to field the new pistols? ACU rucks and assault packs still?  How long ago was the conversion over to OCPs done?

I don't mean to be negative to men and women who I feel serve this nation with distinction and are a credit to this country, but where are all our tax dollars going? Largest defense budget in the history of mankind and they're rolling in old gear with old weapons many overweight some obese.  We can't afford nutrition counseling and gym membership for these NG folks?
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i like how you're worried about your tax dollars and also want the military to throw away current generation equipment that is the wrong color.  do you have any idea how much money it would cost to replace every piece of UCP patterned clothing and equipment at the same time instead of just replacing as it wears out?

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Link Posted: 1/15/2021 10:26:41 PM EDT
[#4]
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She is a real porker. I bet she works admin or supply.
Link Posted: 1/15/2021 10:33:42 PM EDT
[#5]
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That's probably the most impressive post count I've ever seen, as related to account age.


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That's probably the most impressive post count I've ever seen, as related to account age.



Link Posted: 1/16/2021 12:14:08 AM EDT
[#6]
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I served on active duty as was out for 10yrs, when 9/11 happened I was in my early 30's so I decided to go back in, I joined the PA Army National Guard that January or February, and I am still serving.
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Guess I wasn’t the only one. But add additional breaks in service post 9/11 while my peers all retired or retiring. Friend of mine a 13B E-8 with 21 yr letter laid into me about not finishing 20
Link Posted: 1/16/2021 12:19:41 AM EDT
[#7]
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Quoted:
I have to say, I'm a bit concerned about our National Guards in this country.

This past summer I saw the California National Guard on videos and a lot of them were wearing non-issued airsoft level coyote brown plate carriers.  

Every National Guard unit I've seen is this mix of OCP and ACU still.  

The ones in D.C. though are by far the most overweight I've seen yet.  True, they are layered due to the cold, but I saw one woman with what my wife said looked like size 22 pants on and a guy behind her who had to be a men's size 40 or 42.  How can someone get that big and still be in the National Guard? I'm not saying that to be mean or disrespectful, it's an honest question.

Also, what is up with logistics?  Why are they still using M9 pistols? Didn't the US Army start taking shipments of M17s years ago?  How long does it take to field the new pistols? ACU rucks and assault packs still?  How long ago was the conversion over to OCPs done?

I don't mean to be negative to men and women who I feel serve this nation with distinction and are a credit to this country, but where are all our tax dollars going? Largest defense budget in the history of mankind and they're rolling in old gear with old weapons many overweight some obese.  We can't afford nutrition counseling and gym membership for these NG folks?
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Fat soldiers aside, clearly you have no clue as to the fiscal and logistical nightmare that is the Army and the "simple" pattern change to a uniform presents.

Link Posted: 1/16/2021 1:01:06 AM EDT
[#8]
Link Posted: 1/16/2021 1:07:02 AM EDT
[#9]
Link Posted: 1/16/2021 11:24:34 AM EDT
[#10]
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Quoted:


i like how you're worried about your tax dollars and also want the military to throw away current generation equipment that is the wrong color.  do you have any idea how much money it would cost to replace every piece of UCP patterned clothing and equipment at the same time instead of just replacing as it wears out?

Read more, post less 20er.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
I have to say, I'm a bit concerned about our National Guards in this country.

This past summer I saw the California National Guard on videos and a lot of them were wearing non-issued airsoft level coyote brown plate carriers.  

Every National Guard unit I've seen is this mix of OCP and ACU still.  

The ones in D.C. though are by far the most overweight I've seen yet.  True, they are layered due to the cold, but I saw one woman with what my wife said looked like size 22 pants on and a guy behind her who had to be a men's size 40 or 42.  How can someone get that big and still be in the National Guard? I'm not saying that to be mean or disrespectful, it's an honest question.

Also, what is up with logistics?  Why are they still using M9 pistols? Didn't the US Army start taking shipments of M17s years ago?  How long does it take to field the new pistols? ACU rucks and assault packs still?  How long ago was the conversion over to OCPs done?

I don't mean to be negative to men and women who I feel serve this nation with distinction and are a credit to this country, but where are all our tax dollars going? Largest defense budget in the history of mankind and they're rolling in old gear with old weapons many overweight some obese.  We can't afford nutrition counseling and gym membership for these NG folks?


i like how you're worried about your tax dollars and also want the military to throw away current generation equipment that is the wrong color.  do you have any idea how much money it would cost to replace every piece of UCP patterned clothing and equipment at the same time instead of just replacing as it wears out?

Read more, post less 20er.


If that's what you're taking out of this thread by your response you are part of the problem.

You mention how much it costs to change the color of equipment.  Like the initial "investment" in Universal Camouflage Pattern(UCP), otherwise known as the Army Combat Uniform (ACU) pattern was ever a good choice?!  Whoever made the decision to issue it in the first place should have been shot.  I won't doubt that the 2nd Amendment community forced the Army to upgrade their camo pattern to multicam and then OCP... because we already had Multicam and any idiot can see that UCP doesn't work for sh!t.

The 2012 GAO report estimated that it “may cost up to $4 billion over five years to replace” the Universal Camouflage Pattern uniform and related protective gear like body armor.  (less than 1% of the Army's annual budget... some of which would be spent on new gear anyway)

You failed to address the fact that it's obvious to the WHOLE WORLD that a whole lot of those soldiers CAN NOT PASS an APFT or ACFT fitness test.

Its painfully obvious to all that the M9A1's being issued in Washington DC, which based of on 1970's pistol and was originally issued in 1985 (36 years ago), is very much out of date.  I'm not sure that the Army's decision to issue an M17 pistol that discharges when dropped is that much better.  The US civilian market focuses around Glock and M&P which are better pistols and will last a lot longer than the M9A1 (which wears out after only 75,000 rounds).

You need to get your head out of the sand if you think keeping UCP to "save a little money" and endanger troops is a good idea.  Spending $1 billion/year to save lives is inexpensive in the grand scheme of Trillion dollar wars
Link Posted: 1/16/2021 11:56:32 AM EDT
[#11]
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When TA-50 ACU runs out, they'll stop issuing it. I just had a private get issued all brand new ACU TA-50 this last month. We were shocked as everyone for the last couple of years was getting OCP. Oh well. We finally got M4s and M17s last year. I don't care as there is nothing wrong with the M16A2. I do prefer thr M17 over the M9.
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Quoted:

When TA-50 ACU runs out, they'll stop issuing it. I just had a private get issued all brand new ACU TA-50 this last month. We were shocked as everyone for the last couple of years was getting OCP. Oh well. We finally got M4s and M17s last year. I don't care as there is nothing wrong with the M16A2. I do prefer thr M17 over the M9.


Exactly.

99% of the people in this thread have no idea of how anything works past the few visual images that periodically grace their sphere of influence.

Soldiers get issued what is on hand in the inventory system for CONUS training. They get issued the latest generation or pattern equipment with deployment orders at RFI.  It isn't the most ideal system, but there is actually a system.

This is what an active duty combined arms formation looked like in 2006 right before a deployment.  It is what it is.






Quoted:

You need to get your head out of the sand if you think keeping UCP to "save a little money" and endanger troops is a good idea.  Spending $1 billion/year to save lives is inexpensive in the grand scheme of Trillion dollar wars



You seem to have several misconceptions about how the rollout of new equipment is prioritized with regard to need.
Link Posted: 1/16/2021 12:43:54 PM EDT
[#12]
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