Archives are no more.

And non-concur on 10 mile comms.

APRS routinely travels twice that distance or farther in my AO.

That may be some of the magic of digital modes in action.

It is, and where I live in the northern rockies, it's not uncommon for me to receive a non-digipeated APRS direct beacon from over 200 miles due to where the antennae are located, usually on mountaintops over 7K'.

FRS is a UHF radio using FM.  CB is a HF radio using AM.  They work differently.  When the FRS works, it will have a cleaner signal due to FM, But I have a damn hard time to believe that a good CB (using sideband) with a decent car antenna will ever have less range than a handheld with a 1" permanently installed antenna.


We never had an issue with 2 directional base antenna doing 30 miles with CB's using sideband.  That said, one base antenna and one mobile (no amp) - 10 miles was the edge unless you picked your hills.  We did do over 30 miles one time, with a good hill and an amp.

Baofeng radios make terrible scanners and won't receive shortwave frequencies.  You would be better off with a Uniden BearCat scanner for local emergency services/amateur radio traffic and a separate shortwave receiver (like the ones made by C. Crane)

10 miles is pushing it with CB, MURS, or VHF/UHF amateur.  The curvature of the earth limits line-of-sight to about 6 miles (these radios live and die by line-of-sight).  Add in buildings, hills, trees, etc and line-of-sight becomes even shorter.  GMRS and amateur radio can use repeaters, which extends range dramatically by putting the antenna up in the air.  My local EMCOMM repeater antenna is about 300 feet in the air.  The benefit to CB is that every hunter, Jeep owner, truck driver, and truck stop in my area has them, so there should be people you can talk to.  In true ARFCOM fashion, get both.

No, primarily due to line-of-sight limitations.

Like I said above, get both.  CB radios are cheap and plentiful, so you could put one in each vehicle and one in the house.  I don't know much about GMRS radios, but having a handheld one in your car can't hurt.  You can search for GMRS repeaters online as well.

If you cram practice exams to get your general ticket you'll discover all of that and more.

In the case of PD/FD radios,  the agency is issued a license authorizing it to use multiple radios on an assigned frequenc(ies) in a specific geographical area for specific governmental purposes. I think (but admit im not certain) that the FCC issued a single license to the State of Colorado to cover all 8700 people from 87 different agencies using the state's 800mHz digital system.

I think businesses who have their own frequencies go through a similar process, where the business is licensed to have X number of radios using some assigned frequency in the city of Tumbleweed OK.

Amateur licensing is different because the license is issued to an individual person, who isn't limited to one or two frequencies and is getting licensed for purposes other than business communication.

As for your last paragraph, don't take my next statement wrong: I don't think amateur radio is what you're looking for. It sounds like you're looking for some kind of plug and play solution,  which frankly doesn't exist in amateur radio.

Yes, but the amateur license isn't relevant. FCC regulations require what's called "type acceptance" for radios used on most bands. In short,  FCC needs to approve the specific radio or at least the design, to minimize spurious emissions or other interference. The amateur bands are exempt freon the type acceptance requirement because technical experimentation (including building your own radio from scratch) is part of the whole original purpose for amateur radio.

There's the added complication of CB's power output limit of four watts. Basically any amateur radio easily modifiable to CB frequencies will put out a lot more than that.

So,  yes,  illegal. If anybody cares. It's CB, pretty much the 4chan of radio.

That's not a terribly complicated answer.  But the analogy doesn't exactly correlate, either.  To own a gun, you don't need a license that requires a demonstration of knowledge (at least not in our free nation!).  But if you want to assume that there was such a requirement, and the requirement was to get a license before you use the the gun, not before you purchase it, like with radios, then let's move forward with this analogy.

Like many here, my first response would be that they should get their license and become proficient with the use of whatever gun they choose.  I'd explain the four simple safety rules that will make any gun safe to handle despite any other knowledge.  But when they then say that they don't want to shoot it except in an emergency, then I'd start pointing out the advantages and disadvantages of their options.  I'd encourage them to consider a shotgun loaded with buckshot or birdshot, depending on what they wanted to do with it.  I'd explain the fact that long guns are easier to point than handguns due to sight radius and the ability to brace them against your shoulder and use your offhand to support the muzzle and point the weapon naturally.  I'd explain how red dot sights make sight radius no longer matter, but that the inherently natural offhand pointing still makes long guns the natural choice for someone that never practices.  I'd explain the difference between the different actions, and the tradeoffs between the simplicity of single shots and the capability of semi-autos.  Blah, blah, blah....

My point is that I wouldn't just point and gasp and say, "But you have to have a license and you must practice!"  That's simply not true.  There are plenty of options for someone that wants a gun for emergency use without wanting guns to be a hobby or without getting some license.  If someone wants a $20 BaoFeng programmed to use only for an emergency, there's got to be a better answer than "get a license."  Surely there are some concise nuggets of knowledge that can be combined with someone else programming it to empower our friends and families to have comms equipment in an emergency.  Sure, it's good to know that birdshot isn't going to reliably kill a bad guy, just like it's good to know that a hand talkie (HT) isn't going to talk to another HT that is 7 miles away.  There should be (and has been) some great knowledge imparted here.  But I see a lot of "you aren't qualified to use a gun because you don't have a license" here, too.  A lot.  And it's a bit disappointing.

If you want to learn nothing, have other people do the programming, and have a reasonable chance of talking to your neighbors.....then buy an FRS blister pack.

You’re welcome.

Except the reason we require people to learn to properly operate vehicles and learn and obey rules of the road is they could otherwise kill innocent people.

Operating a radio incorrectly isnt quite the same

No analogy is perfect, but you can harm vital services with radios and especially with larger HF setups you can certainly harm people.

Sure, and it's only been repeated 87 dozen times. Program GMRS, FRS, and MURS frequencies into the radios.

You need a minimal amount of technical wizardry to get the free programming software set up, cable working, and all that jazz to be able to achieve the programming.

If you don't want to have to do that you can always just buy legal consumer GMRS or FRS or MURS radios which come pre-programmed.

If you want to get involved in the amateur radio service as part of developing a skillset in communications, then by all means get an amateur license.

There are plenty of people who don't need or want amateur licenses. Some who have no business with an amateur license. In no way is the amateur radio service the universal answer to personal communications.

People who know about communications are just trying to keep people between the guardrails as far as not causing themselves or others any problems. Yes you might well be able to just freeband anywhere you want and get by, but you might also cause a big problem, in which case you may end up with a big problem.  As an analogy, we're telling people to keep it to less than 10 over in the correct lane on the interstate. Trying to help people avoid 125 in a 70 zone, or 75 in a 70 but going the wrong way.

The obstinance of "we're going to do it wrong and illegally and you can't stop us nah nah" has become commonplace, and the folks with that attitude somehow feel they have to put down folks who've worked for years/decades within the rules to keep the radio spectrum working. There's plenty of disappointment to go around. It's not just "ham nazis" out there, there are a lot of people using the radio spectrum, amateur operators are but a small subset.

ETA1
I'm not picking on this individual, but as an example:
https://www.ar15.com/forums/outdoors/Not-technically-a-HAM-question/22-699140/
If he'd have used Chirp to program all the FRS channels in using their automated system it would have set the bandwidth correctly.

He tried to do it by hand, and not being that well versed in communications he didn't know to set FRS channels to narrow. May not have even known what "wide" or "narrow" even meant.

If this had been one of those "it's an EMERGENCY, we don't need no stinkin license" moments all the prepper folks like to crow on about, he'd be SOL. Regardless of whether you have a license, you need the knowledge and skills if you expect to do much when you get into the nitty gritty of communications.

ETA2

A baofeng can interfere with public safety/emergency services communications just as easily as amateur.

You could interfere with EMS operations, medical telemetry, fire or police dispatching, or any number of other things that could conceivably harm or kill people.

Hams also understand the tenuous grasp they have over the spectrum they get to use.  Those bands could be worth billions of dollars at auction.  For some reason we want to be responsible with it.

As far as the amateur spectrum, parts of it are shared with mil/gov users, and the only reason such a sharing arrangement is possible is because the amateur folks are as responsible as they are. People start acting like yahoos, and the mil just says no soup spectrum for you.

Amateurs just lost the 3ghz band, which was not used much but was planned for some satellite stuff.

Well finally got off my ass and got the radios that have been hiding away in a box programmed with my local repeaters and FRS and GMRS channels.

Now I need a license

Attached File

You can't use them on FRS/GMRS! They're not type certified!

For listening only of course.  

Added a couple of repeaters to mine today. I ain't got no license! I'm a law breaker!

Yes yes, listening only of course. Can’t have no boy scouts plotting on me without me hearing their comms

I don't disagree with anything you've said, and I appreciate the helpful answers that you and others have offered here.  

But to go back to the gun analogy, scroll back through this thread and look at how many assholes just said "you can't have a gun without a license and training".  Even some of the people who later offered helpful information often started off, or later responded with, asshole-ish "no gun for you" comments.

I don't think anybody said that.  Many have said that a Baofeng is not very useful to you without a license and some idea how to use it.  Rather than buying a Baofeng most people would be vastly better off buying pre-packaged FRS, MURS, or GMRS radios.

And this is the kind of attention we've been worried about...

https://www.ar15.com/forums/Outdoors/FCC-Advisory-17-Jan-2021/22-699154/

I want to get some extended batteries for my UV5R.....everything on amazon has mixed reviews about fakes and what not.

Is there a legit site I can get some quality ones or am I stuck rolling the dice?

Save your money and buy a better radio.  Yaesu Ft-65R is under $100...

@AKCORY762

Just get another regular battery. The stock batteries last a LONG time. I've had my UV-5R since 2013 and have never ran a battery down. I bought a second stock battery with the radio but have never needed it.

I do have another radio I’m not using but I figure if I went out for an extended period of time a second battery in the truck couldn’t hurt. I am going to look at getting a better radio once I get my license.

I'm having another issue now:

I fired up 'Chirp' and was able to connect to my radio, download my channel file, and open it up to edit it.

I added some stations, renamed a couple of things, rearranged a few things to where I could easily find a few basic channels I wanted to find....and couldn't upload.

I then figured out that I had saved this file as a generic /csv and needed to save it as a BAefong-specific file. OK, that should be simple enough, I'll re-download the file and copy/paste/save.

No dice. I have the latest driver from the ftdichip website. When I plug the USB cable in it makes the du-dum noise that signals the computer sees it. When I plug the end into the Baefong, the transmit LED (the red one) lights up (provided that I'm in frequency mode. It doesn't light up in channel mode. I've tried both ways). Everything acts connected but when I try to download the file, it times out after a few seconds.

Ugh.

Any suggestions?

you just described 90% of calguns forums.

Had the radio outside just now. The town near me (~10 miles away) just arrested a dude for DV. I happened to catch a transmission early on and stepped out to listen. They more or less talked through the whole thing. Like Days of our Lives, but based on the address they mentioned over the radio, not quite as upscale.

Just learned to do a little programing on my Anytone 878uv , no DMR yet but soon.

Taking the technicians exam Thursday afternoon, this was from a practice exam today.

It's a real learning curve.  Set your ID, then talkgroups, then channels, then zones.

Let me know if you need any help.  I have an 878 and a pair of 578s.

Yes , crazy getting this thing up and going for an OG , i truly might need help , thanks !

I just rechecked the prices of the radio gear I bought a few weeks ago.

The uv5rs that I bought for $19 each are now $40.
The pair of 42 inch Abree antennas went from $18 to $40.
The batteries and coax stayed the same thank god.

I have a total of 3 uv5rs and 1 uvb5 now, with two for walk-around use, one for a home station, and one for backup.

The 705 I just got is still on sale and the portable HF vertical was still about $100 and shipped the next day.  People sure love their “meh” radios something fierce.