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Posted: 5/16/2001 1:25:58 PM EDT
It just seems that alot of the pre-ban guns are upwards of 1k+ all the way to 10k,20k etc.. But if you have 10k to spend wouldn't you rather stock up on the $750 bushmaster M4 post-ban. Who knows maybe if they decided to ban ar15 guns all together then your 10k worth of post-ban guns be worth double what you spent. Of course this is coming from a business stand point. In the long run if you got the cash to spend you can be a millionaire 10 or 20 years from now.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 1:33:57 PM EDT
You can get into MOST pre-ban AR's for about $1,200 - 1,400. To me, its worth that to have the collapsible stock. the "Is it worth it" question has NO answer. Its only worth it if its worth it to you.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 1:58:42 PM EDT
Vega, I'm going to say "yes", it is worth paying for a preban. IMHO, it's "worth" the extra bucks not just for the collapible stock and flash suppressor, but also for the ability to figuratively thumb your nose at those who say "nobody should have one of those". I thinh every AR owner should have at least one preban in the inventory. CMOS
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 2:18:10 PM EDT
I agree with CMOS on this. The features themselves may not be "worth it", but having something that scares the daylights out of certain politicians makes it worth while.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 3:06:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By VegaXK8: It just seems that alot of the pre-ban guns are upwards of 1k+ all the way to 10k,20k etc.. But if you have 10k to spend wouldn't you rather stock up on the $750 bushmaster M4 post-ban. Who knows maybe if they decided to ban ar15 guns all together then your 10k worth of post-ban guns be worth double what you spent. Of course this is coming from a business stand point. In the long run if you got the cash to spend you can be a millionaire 10 or 20 years from now.
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IF...you have to be in the "pre-ban elite" for whatever reason....go for it......from a practicality standpoint...your money is better spent on new rifles with today`s technology.....ask yourself....do i want to spend 1200 on a "pre-ban" USED rifle, or the same amount (maybe less) on something "new" like a bushy or armalite MATCH GUN.....pretty much a case of common sense to me!!!!!!!!...fact is, we still have the RIGHT in the good ole` usa (yes dan, even n.y.) to make whichever choice makes us happy......NOTHING MORE VALUABLE THAN A HAPPY AR OWNER.........[smoke]
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 3:09:30 PM EDT
LEGP gun....$660........DPMS....bull 20" stainless bbl.....RETAIL......$900........you do the math.............[grenade]
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 3:14:07 PM EDT
If you think about it, a pre-ban will always keep making you money because the price just keeps going up. As long as you keep it in good condition that is.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 3:53:03 PM EDT
Well, yes and no. If you are a bitch, and are too afraid of big brother to put a telestock on your post, then, yeah. Get a pre. I've said once, i'll say it again. A buddy of mine has been pulled over [red]TWICE[/red], not just once, while in possesion of a post ban gun with 2 evil features. He told the officer "I have an AR in my trunk", the cop checked it out, and both times told him how cool his gun was. McUZI
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 4:10:07 PM EDT
I've gone back and forth with myself on this subject myself. The only question I have is if a preban would be considered a better shtf kind of gun. Is a flash suppressor and collapsible stock make that big of a differance in that kind of scenario? I mean, a flash suppressor doesn't come standard on an AK. Anyone ever shot their AR at night with or without a flash suppressor? And as far as throwing a Collapsable stock and a preban upper on your post ban lower, by the time you do that it would cost you almost as much as it would to just buy a bona fide pre ban.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 4:18:27 PM EDT
Of course it is worth it, anyone who says its not, cant afford one with out getting a divorce or not eating. Some boys play with exensive toys because they can, others wish they could.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 4:19:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By seamusmcoi: I've gone back and forth with myself on this subject myself. The only question I have is if a preban would be considered a better shtf kind of gun. Is a flash suppressor and collapsible stock make that big of a differance in that kind of scenario? I mean, a flash suppressor doesn't come standard on an AK. Anyone ever shot their AR at night with or without a flash suppressor? And as far as throwing a Collapsable stock and a preban upper on your post ban lower, by the time you do that it would cost you almost as much as it would to just buy a bona fide pre ban.
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Oh. I see. So if the "Shit hits the fan", you are going to be checking 922r to make your battle rifle is legal?!?!?!?! Whatever. If the "Shit hits the fan", I am more concerned about saving my ass, then making Bill Clinton happy. Besides. WTSHTF, they are going to want to take your gun, be it a pre or post.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 4:32:42 PM EDT
There was a good article on the old site"The Ideal AR 15" which basically said that the best weapon for a shtf scenario is an AR15 with collapsible stock, 16" lightweight 1/7 or 1/9 barrel, flash suppressor, bayo lug give or take. However, some feel that the a2 buttstock is more comfortable and a crowned barrel is more accurate than flash suppressor and or brake. So it is strictly an individual decision. My personal opinion is that it is a good idea to have one preban type weapon around. Good shooting to all!!
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 4:32:47 PM EDT
I like post bans but the pre-bans are like the nice cars I used to own. wish I never sold them but who would of thought back in the mid 1970's that 68 shelby that I sold for $2,500 would be worth more than $30 grand or that sp1 that cost under $400 would be worth over a grand but I can still wish I had them back and why not always look for that deal. just found that sp1 about a month ago now for $500 (very nice condition) and if I can now only find that shelby while out at garage sales in someones garage I would be set. I can only wish but!!!!
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 4:49:09 PM EDT
I feel everyone should have at least one pre and one post ban! That way you have the best of both worlds!!!! I keep my Colt pre-ban with a 16 1/2" ultra light barrel and 4 position collapsable stock and of course a bayonet to complete the look put away for special occasions! My post ban is the one for all my blasting, I kept it 16 1/2" so they are alot alike, of course with none of the evil add ons it just don't have the appeal of the Colt but it shoots just as well!!!
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 5:08:01 PM EDT
I don't like a collapsable stock except for carrying--don't much like to shoot them. Don't see a need for me personally to have a bayonet lug. Don't have any interest in an auto sear, so the block/no block thing doesn't move me too much, except to have an easier time installing a match trigger or working on the gun in general. But I have come to appreciate a flash suppressor, especially in a 16" barrel, and would be content with post ban's if the f/s were legal on them. So for that reason alone I will stick with prebans. Too bad, too, because the AR's made today are probably as good or better than any of the old ones. I think the most versatile, most accurate AR is the old style Colt SP1, with the 1-12 20" skinny barrel. Have seen some of these box stock guns consistently shoot 1/2" 100 yard groups with issue 55gr ammo. They shouldn't be able to, but I've seen it more than once.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 5:09:59 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 2FatGirlsAndA12Pack: Well, yes and no. If you are a bitch, and are too afraid of big brother to put a telestock on your post, then, yeah. Get a pre. I've said once, i'll say it again. A buddy of mine has been pulled over [red]TWICE[/red], not just once, while in possesion of a post ban gun with 2 evil features. He told the officer "I have an AR in my trunk", the cop checked it out, and both times told him how cool his gun was. McUZI
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I'll have to agree w/Fat Girl on this one.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 5:19:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By seamusmcoi: I've gone back and forth with myself on this subject myself. The only question I have is if a preban would be considered a better shtf kind of gun. Is a flash suppressor and collapsible stock make that big of a differance in that kind of scenario? I mean, a flash suppressor doesn't come standard on an AK. Anyone ever shot their AR at night with or without a flash suppressor? And as far as throwing a Collapsable stock and a preban upper on your post ban lower, by the time you do that it would cost you almost as much as it would to just buy a bona fide pre ban.
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I have shot with and without a flash suppressor at night. Yes it does allow you to re-aquire your target faster. It still is not worth it. The only feature on a pre-ban that is practical is the collapsible stock. A complete fake pre-ban, i.e. totally illegal gun can be bought brand new and unfired for $480 plus shipping. That is if one knows where to look. That's a far cry from the $1200-$1400 they are asking for legitimate pre-bans.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 5:25:29 PM EDT
Those who can afford it thinks that it is worth it and those that can't will think otherwise. To me, the physical differences of the two rifles does not mean much. The only significant thing about a pre-ban is the boost that it gives to my ego knowing that I have one. Honestly, I do not think that it is worth it since I could not afford a postban more so a pre-ban. All I can afford is this. [img]http://www.bugei.com/swords/images/forgedfolded_katana.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 5:35:07 PM EDT
I agree with CMOS Every time I bring my preban sporter to the range I love the looks I get. If you can afford it buy one just to piss off an ANTI
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 5:39:47 PM EDT
The features themselves may not be "worth it", but having something that scares the daylights out of certain politicians makes it worth while. [/quote] Couldn't have said it better myself
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 5:54:24 PM EDT
I think it is probably worth, but I am not going to do it. I have about $1500 to spend now on an AR and I am going to get a nice new post ban Armalite 20" flat-top and as many 20 and 30 round mags as I can. To me lots of mags are worth more than a bayo lug, flash hider or adjustable stock.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 5:56:53 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 2FatGirlsAndA12Pack: Well, yes and no. If you are a bitch, and are too afraid of big brother to put a telestock on your post, then, yeah. Get a pre. McUZI
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McUzi you dumb SOB. Your testosterone overload is going to get your sorry butt where it doesn't need to be. You may get by for awile flaunting a post ban with pre ban features and possibly even get by forever, but all it takes is one time and you could find yourself being someones bitch on a regular basis (I know...you will be giving it, not taking it). At the very least the law could get into your pockets big time and put some serious road blocks on your life. Any way prebans are a damn good investment.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 6:13:10 PM EDT
I own four Pre-bans and soon one Post ban. So, I guess you can figure what I think. It's all good!!! [beer]
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 6:20:52 PM EDT
well my 1977 sp1 does not have the bayo lug on it but reminds me of the old m16 guns and I do want to build a match rifle and after talking with a few folks most likely a post-ban is in order so I think there's room for both. but my mouth waters at the thought of a legal pre-ban para fal that has the sear cut in it. (do not ever plan on converting but what a conversation piece) with all the kit pieces out there the parts would be cheap! but as the old saying goes don't do the crime if you can't do the time!!! and if and thats a big if I ever buy the nasty parts they would be a few states away from the gun at all times. and what fun would that be so I guess I will save that money and stay out of trouble.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 6:33:46 PM EDT
Get whatever you can, but get it quick. You can never be certain when the window's gonna close. If we can keep this up, and everone buys as many as their wallets will allow, just think of the monumental task that awaits the idiots that seek to disarm us! Several more years like the last ten and I think all the firearms manufacturers can pretty much retire and we'd still be overwhelmingly armed. Eric The(Hoarder)Hun
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 6:48:50 PM EDT
Damn Mcoozie, does your pussy hurt? ONCE AGAIN, if the shtf it would be pretty easy to convert a post ban rifle into a pre ban rifle if you have the parts laying around. I could do it in about thirty seconds, maybe a few minutes if I wanted to install the stock as well. That's the nice thing about AR's, you can do so much with them. And like I said, you can piece together a legal pre ban rifle for about two hundred fifty dollars more than a post ban if you know how to shop. Shit, Two fiddy wouldn't even begin to pay for lawyers fees if ever.....
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 6:55:20 PM EDT
I just got my 1st "PRE-BAN" today... I bought the gun from a friend of a hunting buddy and I don't think he knew what he had... The gun looks brand new and un-fired. < droooool > I think it's been in a closet for many, many, years... < droooool > He wanted $650 for it, so I gladly paid his asking price (+$10 transfer fee,etc...) < droooool > Not sure of it's history, but I'm pretty sure it's a "PRE-BAN" and is worth $650... It has the Tele-stock on it and a shorty barrel w/flash hider & bayo-lug.... Info on receiver is: E.A. Co. KR. SPR. LA CAL.223-5.56 MOD.J-15 EA.##### What company is "E.A." ??? What is the gun actually worth ??? I'm still relatively new to AR's so please excuse my ignorance & lack of AR knowledge... Can't wait to shoot it...
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 7:03:20 PM EDT
Originally Posted By dragracerart: I just got my 1st "PRE-BAN" today... I bought the gun from a friend of a hunting buddy and I don't think he knew what he had... The gun looks brand new and un-fired. < droooool > I think it's been in a closet for many, many, years... < droooool > He wanted $650 for it, so I gladly paid his asking price (+$10 transfer fee,etc...) < droooool > Not sure of it's history, but I'm pretty sure it's a "PRE-BAN" and is worth $650... It has the Tele-stock on it and a shorty barrel w/flash hider & bayo-lug.... Info on receiver is: E.A. Co. KR. SPR. LA CAL.223-5.56 MOD.J-15 EA.##### What company is "E.A." ??? What is the gun actually worth ??? I'm still relatively new to AR's so please excuse my ignorance & lack of AR knowledge... Can't wait to shoot it...
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What you have there is an Essential Arms, I believe they went out of business in '93 so you do have a pre-ban gun. It's bought out by DPMS.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 7:05:07 PM EDT
Also i'm not sure what the value might be, but if you bought it for $650 you got a fine deal there man. Wish i can buy a pre-ban for that price these days.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 8:26:04 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 8:40:13 PM EDT
Answer no. 1: Yes, if you have the money to spare Answer no. 2: No, if you don't Get it?
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 9:10:06 PM EDT
As the saying goes, if you have to ask you can't afford it. I will let you in on a secret: Fuck the year and status of rifle and buy more ammo!!!!!!!
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 9:37:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By leadfly: I will let you in on a secret: Fuck the year and status of rifle and buy more ammo!!!!!!!
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I must wholeheartedly agree. The ammo will be a more viable target for the antis. If they have not yet gotten on to that give em' time cause they will. Buy it and buy it now.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 10:15:41 PM EDT
I sometimes refer to post bans as insult rifles. I'm of the thumb your nose at the antis mind set. That being said you can thumb your nose at the antis with a post ban also. When they see them they think "I thought assault weapons were banned". Well they were'nt they just look a little different. All that hate and discontent for a hollow victory and the liberals in congress suffered a political blood bath for it. Don't let them scare you they learned their lesson. You can fight the NRA but you will never really beat it if we stick together. Buy what you can afford, buy what you like. Never give in to them, never surrender.
Link Posted: 5/16/2001 10:28:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 2FatGirlsAndA12Pack: He told the officer "I have an AR in my trunk", the cop checked it out, and both times told him how cool his gun was. McUZI
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I don't think those guys are going to do anything if they stopped you for speeding, etc. But if you were refusing to pull over, bank robbery, etc..., then you could be in big trouble. Then those folks are going to check it over with a fine tooth comb.
Link Posted: 5/17/2001 3:34:47 AM EDT
Defenitely yes. For collecting and for investment. May be it is me, but I can't stand the look of a post ban. They don't look right. Look like a cat who got his tail cut off.
Link Posted: 5/17/2001 5:52:13 AM EDT
What AR Rifle said. And every time I look at a post-ban with no flash suppressor it makes me think of Klinton, Feinstein, Schumer, etc. And that makes me not want to look at the rifle! A real business purpose rifle needs a flash suppressor.
Link Posted: 5/17/2001 8:01:12 AM EDT
not worth it to me.id rather have a brand new post ban.
Link Posted: 5/17/2001 8:12:40 AM EDT
PREBANS CAN BE BOUGHT FOR UNDER $1000 IF YOU LOOK AROUND ENOUGH. I JUST BOUGHT A PREBAN SPORTER WITH BAYO AND FLASH SUPPRESOR FOR $750. IT IS POSSIBLE.
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