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Posted: 12/20/2003 4:54:44 PM EDT
70-year-old Fort Mohave man stunned by weapons seizure, federal charges
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Robert Anglen
The Arizona Republic
Dec. 20, 2003 12:00 AM


Varnell Nichols gives it to you straight with no guff.

"Sure, I was selling guns without a license," he says. "I done that all my life."

But the 70-year-old Fort Mohave man never expected federal agents to swoop in and seize his entire cache of more than 205 shotguns, rifles and handguns, along with hundreds of rounds of ammunition and magazines.

"That just came out of the clear blue sky," he says. "Why didn't they just come to me and say, 'Look, Varnell, you need to get a license or we're going to arrest you'? I would have gotten a license."

Now, Nichols is facing federal weapons charges and forfeiture of more than $200,000 of merchandise.



Nichols, who was released on his own recognizance, says he has been a weapons dealer and gunsmith all of his life. He says he operated gun stores in Oklahoma and California, and he just didn't feel like getting a license here. "I was actually trying to get out of the gun business. I was looking at the jewelry business," he says. "When people wanted guns, I'd take down their names and information, same as I would in a store, and put them in a box. I didn't figure there was anything wrong with that."

From 2001 to July 2003, federal authorities say, Nichols and his friend Frank Burnette, who has also been charged, sold weapons to undercover agents.

Nichols doesn't deny any of it, but he bristles at the deception used by government agents.

"Those boys came up to me and said they wanted to buy some guns to sell at the swap meets, so I sold them some guns," Nichols says. "I wrote their names down and put them in the box."

Nichols says he has been selling guns since he was 14 years old and says the only weapons he wouldn't sell are fully automatic rifles.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:00:14 PM EDT
This topic title should be "BREAKING: FEDS SEIZE UNLICENSED DEALER'S MERCHANDISE"
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:01:28 PM EDT
But the 70-year-old Fort Mohave man never expected federal agents to swoop in and seize his entire cache of more than 205 shotguns, rifles and handguns, along with [red]hundreds[/red] of rounds of ammunition and magazines.
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hundreds? HUNDREDS?!?!?! WTF?
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:07:24 PM EDT
Gee, since there is no set number of guns you have to sell, to be called a dealer, I guess they could come after anyone of us. Well, at least we still have the individual right to keep and bear arms. Well we can still find ammo, at least for now....
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:08:31 PM EDT
What does it matter how old he is? (title) If he carried an FFL in OK and CA, then he knew the law. He's a dumbass for doing what he did.... Now, that dont mean he should go to prison.... but jeez what a dumbass. I bet there is a LOT more to this story.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:12:27 PM EDT
What an ass. I guess he also didn't care about selling guns to criminals or felons, since I'm sure all that "license" stuff is just a hassle. [rolleyes] I bet all the armed robbers (or wanna-be armed robber) in the area knew all about this "dealer"
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:15:57 PM EDT
Originally Posted By leelaw: This topic title should be "BREAKING: FEDS SEIZE UNLICENSED DEALER'S MERCHANDISE"
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or "BREAKING: FEDS SEIZE [b]70YR-OLD MORONIC [/b]UNLICENSED DEALER'S MERCHANDISE"
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:20:05 PM EDT
A true patriot fighting for his (and our) rights... unlike the armchair morons who called him that.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:22:00 PM EDT
Mr.Nicholes has apparently been a"gun dealer"since he was 14 years old.Souns like he was "run out of"several other states."I put the names in a box"well that is at least"some form of recordkeeping."....."them boys came up and said they wanted some guns to sell at swap meets"....scarry!
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:24:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/20/2003 5:25:55 PM EDT by Tonster]
If you have over $200,000 of gun inventory you are "in business" in anyones mind. Kinda like the guys who get caught with a Kilo of coke and claim its for personal use!!!! Stupid is as stupid does...
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:47:44 PM EDT
Originally Posted By FALARAK: What does it matter how old he is? (title) If he carried an FFL in OK and CA, then he knew the law. He's a dumbass for doing what he did.... Now, that dont mean he should go to prison.... but jeez what a dumbass. I bet there is a LOT more to this story.
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Ditto.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:54:19 PM EDT
ATF has been issuing cease and desist letters in AZ for a while to people they feel need an FFL. Several guys have fought them and won. Crossroads and Termark gunshows have also been turning over the names of all people who have a table more than twice a year to Arizona Dept. of Revenue. ADOR then notifies ATF. Kind of a catch 22. They won't give you an FFL without a storefront and a state tax license.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:07:23 PM EDT
When I was much younger, anyone could buy a gun. You didn’t need anything but cash. Thanks to Al Capone and his ilk, machine guns were outlawed. Thanks to a very few fanatical freaks, we all have to jump through hoops to buy something that is guaranteed to us by the 2nd Amendment. And, you boys seem to agree with the freedoms we’ve lost. Opinions are like assholes in that everyone has one. My opinion is if you’re caught using a gun or knife in the commission of a crime, an extra 20 years is tacked on to your sentence. No parole or plea bargains. All hard time. If you kill someone with a gun or knife during the commission of a felony, it’s an automatic death sentence. I’m sick and God Damned tired of criminals being treated like victims. I don’t care if the sonofabitch is 10 years old. He does the crime, he does the time. Wouldn’t bother me to strap anyone to a gurney and administer the needle. Somehow, we have to get over turning the other cheek when our freedoms are taken away wholesale. How many people have you killed? I thought so, none…
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:16:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By stator: A true patriot fighting for his (and our) rights... unlike the armchair morons who called him that.
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[hail2] AB
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:32:31 PM EDT
It's patriotic to break the law? Oh, brother. [rolleyes]
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:37:15 PM EDT
Originally Posted By stator: A true patriot fighting for his (and our) rights... unlike the armchair morons who called him that.
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Please explain how this idiot who has been breaking federal gun laws for the past 56 years is a "true patriot fighting for his (and our) rights". Well at least he wasn't selling fully automatic weapons - I guess that makes it all right then. Geeze, the stupidity of some people.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:39:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DK-Prof: What an ass. I guess he also didn't care about selling guns to criminals or felons, since I'm sure all that "license" stuff is just a hassle. [rolleyes] I bet all the armed robbers (or wanna-be armed robber) in the area knew all about this "dealer"
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yeah, yeah, thats it. I'm sure this was some scumbag gun dealer that sold to all those gangbangers at the fun shows. gimmee a break! The guy got charged with conspiracy (woo hoo!)(count 1), Dealing in firearms without a liscense (count 2) and possession of unregistered weapons made from shotguns (counts 4-6)
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:41:15 PM EDT
There is free trade of firearms between individuals in AZ. ATF seems to forget that.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:41:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/20/2003 6:42:54 PM EDT by danonly]
Originally Posted By FLGreg:
Originally Posted By stator: A true patriot fighting for his (and our) rights... unlike the armchair morons who called him that.
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Please explain how this idiot who has been breaking federal gun laws for the past 56 years is a "true patriot fighting for his (and our) rights". Well at least he wasn't selling fully automatic weapons - I guess that makes it all right then. [red]Geeze, the stupidity of some people.[/red]
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Yeah, like yourself. Where did you get the 56 years number from, dumbass?
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:47:05 PM EDT
Originally Posted By danonly: Yeah, like yourself. Where did you get the 56 years number from, dumbass?
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70 yrs old. - age he started selling (14) =56 years.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:48:54 PM EDT
Originally Posted By FLGreg:
Originally Posted By stator: A true patriot fighting for his (and our) rights... unlike the armchair morons who called him that.
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Please explain how this idiot who has been breaking federal gun laws for the past 56 years is a "true patriot fighting for his (and our) rights". Well at least he wasn't selling fully automatic weapons - I guess that makes it all right then. Geeze, the stupidity of some people.
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Before 1968, this would not have been breaking any law.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:50:02 PM EDT
how many 'laws' was he breaking prior to '68?
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:50:15 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Badseed:
Originally Posted By danonly: Yeah, like yourself. Where did you get the 56 years number from, dumbass?
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70 yrs old. - age he started selling (14) =56 years.
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See above post.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:50:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/20/2003 6:53:35 PM EDT by danonly]
70 yrs old. - age he started selling (14) =56 years.
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Yeah DUMBASS, it states in the article that he:
Nichols, who was released on his own recognizance, says he has been a weapons dealer and gunsmith all of his life. He says he operated gun stores in Oklahoma and California, and he just didn't feel like getting a license here
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Sure sounds like he had a liscense in CA and OK, huh? maybe you better go back to elementary school for some reading comprehension, mmmkay?
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:56:11 PM EDT
Holy Cow, that is breaking news??? F troope released their Public release on the matter back on july 9, this year. whoo hoo.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:04:34 PM EDT
THey always forget that part at the end: ".......SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED."
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:05:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By danonly:
Originally Posted By DK-Prof: What an ass. I guess he also didn't care about selling guns to criminals or felons, since I'm sure all that "license" stuff is just a hassle. [rolleyes] I bet all the armed robbers (or wanna-be armed robber) in the area knew all about this "dealer"
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yeah, yeah, thats it. I'm sure this was some scumbag gun dealer that sold to all those gangbangers at the fun shows. gimmee a break! The guy got charged with conspiracy (woo hoo!)(count 1), Dealing in firearms without a liscense (count 2) and possession of unregistered weapons made from shotguns (counts 4-6)
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Lemme spell it out for you guys that think this guy should go to jail for a decade or so, and forfeit his retirement money and motivation to live to F-troop He got charged with Conspiracy. woo hoo, everyone gets charged with conspiracy. I could deliver 90% of the people on this board with to a DA somewhere for their various conspiracies. He got charged with dealing without a liscense. Sure sounds like BS to me- does he run a store nowadays in AZ? i don't think so. Do you think some 70 year old is in a business dealing guns because he has "$200,000+" in "merchandise"? I don't think so. I got several people that have around that much tied up in guns that go to fun shows and sell guns. Are they doing it as a business, NO. and finally, he got charged with possession of unregistered weapons made from shotguns. wooo hooo eeee!!! I wonder if that is what they ended up charging weaver with, also. Notice how they didn't hit him with evading the tax on those shotguns? Why is that?
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:11:37 PM EDT
This guy stated that he is in the business of selling guns. He also admits that he has no license to do such. "Sure, I was selling guns without a license," he says. "I done that all my life." I find it hard to paint him as a patriot. An idiot maybe, but not a patriot. Seems he's just another guy working an angle.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:11:37 PM EDT
thanks, AR10er for pointing that out. So Flgreg and Badseed, care to change your numbers a bit??? This man could not have been breaking the law before 68, which means at the maximum he broke the law for around, say 35 years. Not to mention that he probably had a liscense before he moved to AZ, which can cut more time off that 35 year figure. quite a difference from 56 years, eh???
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:18:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/20/2003 7:19:17 PM EDT by danonly]
Originally Posted By Tonster: This guy stated that he is in the business of selling guns. He also admits that he has no license to do such. "Sure, I was selling guns without a license," he says. "I done that all my life." I find it hard to paint him as a patriot. An idiot maybe, but not a patriot. Seems he's just another guy working an angle.
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Uhhh, no he did not state he is in the business of selling guns. He stated that he was selling guns without a liscense, which i am sure most of us have done at some point in our lives. He didn't have to deal with the laws that we have now, which may or may not have applied to him, for most of his life. The guy is 70, remember? He was born around 1933. Don't give me the crap that this guy was breaking the laws for all his life. The laws that he is charged with breaking aren't even constitutional.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:20:20 PM EDT
Originally Posted By danonly: thanks, AR10er for pointing that out. So Flgreg and Badseed, care to change your numbers a bit??? This man could not have been breaking the law before 68, which means at the maximum he broke the law for around, say 35 years. Not to mention that he probably had a liscense before he moved to AZ, which can cut more time off that 35 year figure. quite a difference from 56 years, eh???
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he also said this:
"Sure, I was selling guns without a license," he says. "I done that all my life."
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In Az, private parties can buy and sell with no papers. I bet the old timer got ratted out by a jealous dealer. Having 200g of a certain item/s does automatically turn it into a business.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:30:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By danonly:
Originally Posted By Tonster: This guy stated that he is in the business of selling guns. He also admits that he has no license to do such. "Sure, I was selling guns without a license," he says. "I done that all my life." I find it hard to paint him as a patriot. An idiot maybe, but not a patriot. Seems he's just another guy working an angle.
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Uhhh, no he did not state he is in the business of selling guns. He stated that he was selling guns without a liscense, which i am sure most of us have done at some point in our lives. He didn't have to deal with the laws that we have now, which may or may not have applied to him, for most of his life. The guy is 70, remember? He was born around 1933. Don't give me the crap that this guy was breaking the laws for all his life. The laws that he is charged with breaking aren't even constitutional.
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Hummm.... Nichols, who was released on his own recognizance, says he has been a weapons dealer and gunsmith all of his life. He says he operated gun stores in Oklahoma and California, and he just didn't feel like getting a license here. He didn't "feel like getting a license". This seems to have him at the very least nominated him for a Darwin award. He thought he could beat the system and he lost. Hey if someone wants to start-up a gunshop they CAN do so legally. Simple.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:35:40 PM EDT
If you want to be in a certain business, you need to follow the law, that's all there is to it. You wanna be a doctor and practice medicine, you need a license. You wanna practice law, you have to pass the bar. You want to haul hazardous chemicals in a truck, you need a certain kind of license. If this guy wanted to deal in guns, he should have gotten a license - not doing so either makes him lazy, or stupid, but certainly not some kind of patriot or victim. I think it's very naive to think that locals with felony records didn't know about the unlicensed "dealer" in the area - just like teenagers will find out who the unlicensed doctor in town is if abortion is outlawed. ... of course if he only occasionally sold a gun (say less than 10 a year or something like that), then he really is being screwed, and the ATF is out of control. I guess the little story at the top really doesn't make that clear. But the fact that this guy used to operate gun stores means that he KNEW the law, and was extremely familiar with it and CHOSE to ignore it - he didn't "feel" like getting a licence? Give me a break [rolleyes]
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:43:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DK-Prof: Give me a break [rolleyes]
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Would you prefer an arm, or leg?[:D]
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:44:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew: In Az, private parties can buy and sell with no papers. I bet the old timer got ratted out by a jealous dealer. Having 200g of a certain item/s does automatically turn it into a business.
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So, do you know of anywhere in the BATFE's big book of rules and "opinion" that there is a number for how many guns you can sell before you are a "dealer"? Or how many you can own, before you magically become a dealer?
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:48:20 PM EDT
Originally Posted By danonly:
Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew: In Az, private parties can buy and sell with no papers. I bet the old timer got ratted out by a jealous dealer. Having 200g of a certain item/s does automatically turn it into a business.
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So, do you know of anywhere in the BATFE's big book of rules and "opinion" that there is a number for how many guns you can sell before you are a "dealer"? Or how many you can own, before you magically become a dealer?
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There is none. They make it up as they go. And that, boys and girls, is the truth.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 7:49:20 PM EDT
Originally Posted By danonly:
Originally Posted By Tactical_Jew: In Az, private parties can buy and sell with no papers. I bet the old timer got ratted out by a jealous dealer. Having 200g of a certain item/s does automatically turn it into a business.
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So, do you know of anywhere in the BATFE's big book of rules and "opinion" that there is a number for how many guns you can sell before you are a "dealer"? Or how many you can own, before you magically become a dealer?
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I meant DOESN'T.Sorry for the misunderstanding. I personally know of people with well over that in ceratin items(not just guns) and are in no way dealers.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 8:32:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/20/2003 8:40:04 PM EDT by danonly]
Originally Posted By DK-Prof: If you want to be in a certain business, you need to follow the law, that's all there is to it.
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even when you don't know what the laws are, and when you ask for clarification you get different answers?
You wanna be a doctor and practice medicine, you need a license. You wanna practice law, you have to pass the bar. You want to haul hazardous chemicals in a truck, you need a certain kind of license. If this guy wanted to deal in guns, he should have gotten a license - not doing so either makes him lazy, or stupid, but certainly not some kind of patriot or victim.
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From the news article, it is not clear to me that he intended to be an official "dealer" when he moved to AZ. the article says
"Sure, I was selling guns without a license," he says. "I done that all my life."
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do we know he was selling guns all his life, or selling guns without a liscense all his life? remember, he said he ran stores in CA and OK, so he probably had lisncenses in those locations.
I think it's very naive to think that locals with felony records didn't know about the unlicensed "dealer" in the area - just like teenagers will find out who the unlicensed doctor in town is if abortion is outlawed.
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i guess it all depends on what he was doing -was selling to anyone and everyone that came to his house or where ever, or was it at fun shows, or what? hard to tell from the article. and we all know those felons go to the fun shows to get their guns, right kiddees?
... of course if he only occasionally sold a gun (say less than 10 a year or something like that), [red]then[/red] he really is being screwed, and [red]the ATF is out of control.[/red] I guess the little story at the top really doesn't make that clear. But the fact that this guy used to operate gun stores means that he KNEW the law, and was extremely familiar with it and CHOSE to ignore it - he didn't "feel" like getting a licence? Give me a break [rolleyes]
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what's up with the number thing again? being a gun dealer does not depend upon the number of guns sold. No ifs ands or buts, the BATFE is out of control. and in case you have missed it, there is no amount or regularity that makes you a dealer. It is generally some esoteric notion of "are you in business to make money" Yup, i wouldn't feel like getting a licence if i had to deal with the BATFE at all. I would do whatever it takes, to keep my hobby legal, and not a business. It could very well be what this guy was doing also. Its kinda like taxes- the rich put their money in legal tax shelters, and have the fancy CPA's to do it legally. The poor don't have the money to protect, or the money to pay the CPA's. but at least the IRS mostly follows the rules. with guns it seems you are screwed if you do, and screwed if you don't. innocent bystander already mentioned there is a catch-22 situation in AZ, and i've heard of it in other places. The only problem is there aren't a whole lot of good gun lawyers, and they charge a whole lot more than CPA's. plus the boys at F troop do make up the rules as they go along. I don't know about you, but BATFE has no credibility in my eyes. i wish they would just go away.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 9:31:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Tonster: If you have over $200,000 of gun inventory you are "in business" in anyones mind. Kinda like the guys who get caught with a Kilo of coke and claim its for personal use!!!! Stupid is as stupid does...
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Damn straight
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 9:35:43 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Blue84S10:
Originally Posted By Tonster: If you have over $200,000 of gun inventory you are "in business" in anyones mind. Kinda like the guys who get caught with a Kilo of coke and claim its for personal use!!!! Stupid is as stupid does...
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Damn straight
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You must not know any hardcore collectors. I have a friend in Texas, that has well in excess of that.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 9:48:41 PM EDT
I vote dumbass. 1. He says he's run gun shops before. It's hard to imagine that he ran multiple firearms businesses without having an FFL. 2. He admits that he was in the business of selling guns. That requires a license, and he knew it. 3. He is no species of patriot. His stated motivation for operating without a license is that he "didn't feel like" getting a license in his new location. He didn't do it because the law is unjust and affront to the Constitution. He didn't do it because he wanted to frame a test case amounting to "NFA vs 2d Amdmt." He didn't do it because he thought of himself as a hobbyist. He did it because he "didn't feel like" getting a license in his new location. Motive is everything in a situation like this. His motive was laziness. That is neither heroic nor patriotic. That said, the vagueness of the BATFE definition of "dealing in firearms" is chilling. There is way too much discretion there, over and above the fact that the whole idea invites some absurd possibilities. Consider this: if I hated guns, didn't own any, and didn't want any, but found that "missing" .45 ACP Luger and jumped at the chance to buy it for, say, $3000 intending (and eventually effectuating) a resale for the $million+ I know it's worth. I don't collect, and bought the weapon solely for the purpose of trade. No way in hell BATFE will find me to be a dealer, even though financial gain is the sole reason for my brush with their jurisdiction. OTOH, if I am a passionate collector of Garands, and buy and sell a total of, say, 30 other guns a year [i]solely to acquire cash and trade goods to fill out my Garand collection[/i], they may very well decide I'm an unlicensed dealer and lock me up. I don't believe it is right that a license is required to deal in firearms. However, the guy who is the subject of this thread is, by all appearances, just a dipshit loser with no claim on the sympathy of any but the lazy.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 10:04:39 PM EDT
Originally Posted By FLAL1A: I vote dumbass. 1. He says he's run gun shops before. It's hard to imagine that he ran multiple firearms businesses without having an FFL. 2. He admits that he was in the business of selling guns. That requires a license, and he knew it. 3. He is no species of patriot. His stated motivation for operating without a license is that he "didn't feel like" getting a license in his new location. He didn't do it because the law is unjust and affront to the Constitution. He didn't do it because he wanted to frame a test case amounting to "NFA vs 2d Amdmt." He didn't do it because he thought of himself as a hobbyist. He did it because he "didn't feel like" getting a license in his new location. Motive is everything in a situation like this. His motive was laziness. That is neither heroic nor patriotic. That said, the vagueness of the BATFE definition of "dealing in firearms" is chilling. There is way too much discretion there, over and above the fact that the whole idea invites some absurd possibilities. Consider this: if I hated guns, didn't own any, and didn't want any, but found that "missing" .45 ACP Luger and jumped at the chance to buy it for, say, $3000 intending (and eventually effectuating) a resale for the $million+ I know it's worth. I don't collect, and bought the weapon solely for the purpose of trade. No way in hell BATFE will find me to be a dealer, even though financial gain is the sole reason for my brush with their jurisdiction. OTOH, if I am a passionate collector of Garands, and buy and sell a total of, say, 30 other guns a year [i]solely to acquire cash and trade goods to fill out my Garand collection[/i], they may very well decide I'm an unlicensed dealer and lock me up. [red]I don't believe it is right that a license is required to deal in firearms. However, the guy who is the subject of this thread is, by all appearances, just a dipshit loser with no claim on the sympathy of any but the lazy[/red].
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and another person makes ironclad claims from a poorly written and inarticulate article. you should get a job in a university, you are so good at english comprehension.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 10:10:05 PM EDT
Originally Posted By FLAL1A: I vote dumbass. 1. He says he's run gun shops before. It's hard to imagine that he ran multiple firearms businesses without having an FFL. 2. He admits that he was in the business of selling guns. That requires a license, and he knew it.
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wait wait wait wait. only i can throw around the vaunted title of dumbass in this thread. and i am going to call you a dumass unless you back up that claim that "he was in the business of selling guns" Well???
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 10:38:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By danonly:
Originally Posted By FLAL1A: I vote dumbass. 1. He says he's run gun shops before. It's hard to imagine that he ran multiple firearms businesses without having an FFL. 2. He admits that he was in the business of selling guns. That requires a license, and he knew it.
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wait wait wait wait. only i can throw around the vaunted title of dumbass in this thread. and i am going to call you a dumass unless you back up that claim that "he was in the business of selling guns" Well???
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From the article: [red]"Nichols, who was released on his own recognizance, says he has been a weapons dealer and gunsmith [b]all of his life.[/b]"[/red] He is still alive. Therefore he is still a weapons dealer. If someone says "I've lived in Oklahoma all my life," it means he presently lives in Oklahoma. [red]"He says he operated [b]gun stores[/b] in Oklahoma and California, and he just didn't feel like getting a license here." [/red] "Gun stores" are retail firearms outlets conducted from dedicated business premises. I've never heard anybody refer to a "kitchen table" operation or to churning a personal collection as a "gun store," and as previously stated, it is difficult to imagine that he ran anything he calls a "gun store" without a license. The guy was only 34 when GCA '68 came along. He says he's been a gun dealer all his life. That means he wasn't on sabbatical for the last 36 years, throughout which licensure was required. [red]"'I was actually trying to get out of the gun business. I was looking at the jewelry business,' he says."[/red] He can't try to get out of the gun business unless he is [b]in[/b] the gun business. By the way, what does this mean:
and another person makes ironclad claims from a poorly written and inarticulate article.
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particularly in view of the fact that the portion of my prior post you highlighted was not in any sense "ironclad," but expressly stated that the opinion was based on "appearances," to-wit: the portions of the original post which make it plain that the man was a self-described gun dealer who didn't feel like getting a license?
Link Posted: 12/21/2003 6:19:16 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ar10er:
Originally Posted By DK-Prof: Give me a break [rolleyes]
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Would you prefer an arm, or leg?[:D]
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Is there an ATF form I can fill out before they come to my house? [;)]
Link Posted: 12/21/2003 6:28:46 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/21/2003 6:40:16 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/21/2003 6:57:37 AM EDT by photoman]
To much missing info. Is there a law against private sales in AZ? Or a law that says priovate sales must go through an FFL? was he selling to out of state peole? To much shit is missing from this artical. What laws did the guy break exactly? Wait now that I've re-read this POS news story. This guy didn't do shit. Have any of you ever had a friend say hey i'm intersted in this gun, can you help me find one. I help people find guns all the time. Thats basicly what this guy is doing. I did that for a friend. He was looking for an SKS and I found him one cheap. he wasn't with me and there was another guy who was looking to buy it. I paid for the gun filled out the paper work and when my friend had the cash he gave me the cash. Now granted we went back and did a transfer on it at the shop even though we didn't have to because private sales in Wisconsin don't have to go through an FFL. The only thing I see that I did different was doing the transfer through an FFL. Unless more info comes out about this, like I said there really is not enough info in the story, we don't really know what the hell is going on.
Link Posted: 12/21/2003 6:47:24 AM EDT
I'm still guessing that he no longer wanted a storefront and thereby couldn't get an FFL under the new rules. Once again there are no restrictions on the private sales of firearms in AZ. Perhaps he was selling handguns to out of state residents but if this was the case you would have thought he would have been charged.
Link Posted: 12/21/2003 7:00:08 AM EDT
I would have thought you would need an FFL to be in the firearms business (buying guns for resale), even if you are 70 years old and live in AZ.
Link Posted: 12/21/2003 7:03:22 AM EDT
Originally Posted By TexRdnec:
But the 70-year-old Fort Mohave man never expected federal agents to swoop in and seize his entire cache of more than 205 shotguns, rifles and handguns, along with [red]hundreds[/red] of rounds of ammunition and magazines.
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hundreds? HUNDREDS?!?!?! WTF?
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Excellent observation, this is no deer hunter [:D]
Link Posted: 12/21/2003 7:09:02 AM EDT
could be that people would be looking for a certain gun, he would take their name, buy the gun , then sell the gun to the person. Could be Straw purchase violation. then again im no lawyer
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