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Posted: 12/7/2003 7:23:43 PM EDT
We're supposed to act as if we are a radio commentator in 1932, and talk about the differences in Hoover and Roosevelt, and state who I would vote for. It's only about 1.5 pages, just a biweekly assignment.

Hoover Vs. Roosevelt – The Election of 1932
Sage Wolfe
This year, the main presidential candidates are Franklin D. Roosevelt and Herbert Hoover. Roosevelt is a Democrat that I predict will have socialist tendencies, and Hoover is a Republican and a conservative, albeit not a strict Constitutionalist. The two are pretty far away from each other on the political spectrum, and it appears that Roosevelt is a formidable contender.
Roosevelt blames the depression we are enduring to be a result of the inaction of the Republican Party. Hoover blames poor business practices. Roosevelt’s solution is more government regulation, based on the belief that government has the duty to step in under these circumstances. Hoover believes in some government programs to ease the suffering of those in need, but nowhere near the amount Roosevelt does.
All of this arises from the fundamental difference in beliefs of the two candidates. Roosevelt has stated “American people have always refused to provide the necessities of life for those who, through no fault of their own, are unable to feed, clothe, or house themselves”. All of this is good and well, but when he says “American people” what he really means is the American government, using taxpayer money. He does not mean charity, or even a dollar-for-dollar tax credit for charity donations. What he wants to do is play Robin Hood with hard-working Americans.
Hoover is a believer in laissez-faire, and economic freedom. He said “[W]e should find the solution for many of our complex problems….not by the extension of government into our economic and social life.” He is not a radical Constitutionalist, though, because he believes in work programs, attempts at price control, credit to private enterprises, etc.
Hoover is the better candidate of the two. Roosevelt will open the door to socialism, even if he himself may not be a socialist. Do not be lured by the call of Roosevelt’s sirens – you will crash on the rocks of heavy-handed government. Some will call this necessary, that we are doomed to failure with out it – I ask that you listen to a good piece of advice from William Pitt, “Necessity is the plea of every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.” Remember that freedom is not painless – I believe those who have fought and died for this country over the years would agree entirely.
Link Posted: 12/7/2003 7:35:29 PM EDT
Not bad at all, Sniper. What year are you in school again? BTW check your IM.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 2:13:54 PM EDT
Originally Posted By -Duke-Nukem-: Not bad at all, Sniper. What year are you in school again? BTW check your IM.
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I'm a sophomore - thanks for the IM. BTW I'll post here again when I get my grade back, my teacher supports Clark. So I don't think he'll like it exactly.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 2:18:28 PM EDT
Good job. Great analysis on Hoover's philosophy.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 2:42:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2003 2:49:06 PM EDT by markl32]
Originally Posted By Sniper_Wolfe: BTW I'll post here again when I get my grade back, my teacher supports Clark. So I don't think he'll like it exactly.
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Sniper_Wolfe, When I started college I falsely believed faculty was interested in my opinions and point of view. I was asked in each class to write my opinions. English papers, lit classes, world history… I scraped by with C’s. Then I conducted an experiment for a couple weeks; I gave the instructors what they wanted to hear. I started getting all A’s and B’s. Be prepared to check you ideology at the door when you get to college. I hope your experience goes better than mine did. Fine work on the posted paper! [i] Edit for spelling. Clearly I am still only a C student...[/i]
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 4:37:49 PM EDT
I have some strong reservations about "checking my ideology at the door". I still haven't decided precisely what I'll do when I get there.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 4:40:44 PM EDT
Nice job. Well written.
...freedom is not painless...
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Somehow....I like that.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 4:51:49 PM EDT
Here at Minnesota State University-Mankato, I have found that I can write what I please and it's always at least B work. Haven't had a problem, but that could just be that my style or writing scares them. For the record, I didn't burn any cars, just flipped them over...
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 4:53:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By markl32:
Originally Posted By Sniper_Wolfe: BTW I'll post here again when I get my grade back, my teacher supports Clark. So I don't think he'll like it exactly.
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Sniper_Wolfe, When I started college I falsely believed faculty was interested in my opinions and point of view. I was asked in each class to write my opinions. English papers, lit classes, world history… I scraped by with C’s. Then I conducted an experiment for a couple weeks; I gave the instructors what they wanted to hear. I started getting all A’s and B’s. Be prepared to check you ideology at the door when you get to college. I hope your experience goes better than mine did. Fine work on the posted paper! [i] Edit for spelling. Clearly I am still only a C student...[/i]
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I have refused to check my ideology anywhere, and i am not better or worse for it as far as my grades are concerned. Dont be afraid to tell it how you see it. if worse comes to worse, you could always go over teh profs head and get another opinion. live free or die.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 5:22:35 PM EDT
Originally Posted By markl32: Sniper_Wolfe, When I started college I falsely believed faculty was interested in my opinions and point of view. I was asked in each class to write my opinions. English papers, lit classes, world history… I scraped by with C’s. Then I conducted an experiment for a couple weeks; I gave the instructors what they wanted to hear. I started getting all A’s and B’s. Be prepared to check you ideology at the door when you get to college. I hope your experience goes better than mine did. Fine work on the posted paper! [i] Edit for spelling. Clearly I am still only a C student...[/i]
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Sniper Wolfe, I went to college and always said what I meant and didn't fashion it to match up with the prof's personal beliefs, and I always thought I was treated fairly. When I wrote well-reasoned arguments and defended them well, I was rewarded with a good grade. I know you are young, but don't buy into this, "If you disagree with the teacher, you will get a bad grade." It's probably a defense used by people who are semi-literate and want to blame their poor marks on someone else. I'm sure there are some teachers and profs out there like that, all I'm saying is to hope for th ebest and don't go start your life or career with the attitude that "they're all out to get the conservatives" and thinking everyone wants to nail you. That type of thinking isn't a good way to be successful. That said, I think you wrote an excellent piece for a sophomore in high school and I predict you will get a good grade even though your teacher supports Clark. I am predicting B+ or better. Let us know... -Nick Viejo.
Link Posted: 12/17/2003 4:51:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By N_Viejo: That said, I think you wrote an excellent piece for a sophomore in high school and I predict you will get a good grade even though your teacher supports Clark. I am predicting B+ or better. Let us know...
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Guess not! Got a D on it.
Link Posted: 12/17/2003 4:56:04 PM EDT
I'm a sophomore
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Oh man, that sucks. I feel for you man, I was their once. Whatever classes you need to take to graduate early, take em. If that means passing on shop or art three, so be it. You will be glad you did. Why? B/C college rocks!
Link Posted: 12/19/2003 8:55:30 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Sniper_Wolfe:
Originally Posted By N_Viejo: That said, I think you wrote an excellent piece for a sophomore in high school and I predict you will get a good grade even though your teacher supports Clark. I am predicting B+ or better. Let us know...
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Guess not! Got a D on it.
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Did your teacher specify any reasons for the low grade?
Link Posted: 12/19/2003 9:20:00 AM EDT
Yea, I wanna hear why you got a D[:(!] I thought it was a great report! Maybe there were some simple guidlines you left out or something?
Link Posted: 12/19/2003 9:29:01 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/19/2003 9:29:57 AM EDT by Brohawk]
Originally Posted By Sniper_Wolfe: BTW I'll post here again when I get my grade back, my teacher supports Clark. So I don't think he'll like it exactly.
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I don't know if you caught my previous posts on this, but several days ago I sent Clark's campaign an e-mail asking if it was true that he supplied the armor for the assault on the Branch Davidians (I have a nasty way sometimes of asking a question when I already know the answer). Silence from their side. Hey, wasn't the dictator in Babylon 5 President Clark?????!!!! Kinda prophetic, eh? Edited to add: Oh yeah- good writing. I can tell you're a student at ARFCOM University!
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 8:57:37 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Shane333:
Originally Posted By Sniper_Wolfe:
Originally Posted By N_Viejo: That said, I think you wrote an excellent piece for a sophomore in high school and I predict you will get a good grade even though your teacher supports Clark. I am predicting B+ or better. Let us know...
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Guess not! Got a D on it.
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Did your teacher specify any reasons for the low grade?
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Well the paper is at school, so I can't tell you exactly what he wrote, but I can tell you more or less what he said. He mainly just wrote a bunch of counter-arguments to what I said, and gave it a D. There was no set rubric for grading, and a lot of people got low grades. The people that wrote exactly (I'm talking to the word) what he said in class did well. I know this, because he read one of the A papers. The only thing I can see I actually did wrong was when I said that Hoover blamed the Depression on poor business practices, and he actually blamed it on Europe. He also said that it wasn't right in the sense that it was supposed to be played on the radio, and I didn't incorporate that. Oh well. I guess I will have to take the semester exam in that class. [:(]
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 9:26:43 AM EDT
Man, getting a D on that because the teacher has a different [b]OPINION[/b] blows goat balls. If'n it was me, I'd be looking at any sort of grading guidelines I can get my hands on -- school guidelines, district guidelines, ANYTHING, then complaining loudly, starting with the teacher, though I wouldn't expect to make any progress there -- then I'd start talking to the principle, and up the chain from there. But then, back in HS I was a real asshole about things like that. Fortunetly, its not as big of a problem in college -- as said above, there are a lot of profs who ARE able to put their opinions aside and grade a paper fairly. (there are still some that won't, but, in college, there are usually fairly well defined sequences of talk to this person, then that person, then that person.....)
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 10:26:40 AM EDT
Sadly, my experience in English clases have been the same. I never managed to pull better than a B for an entire semester. Then, for one paper, I decided to just regurgitate the leftist BS the professor always spouted. I had more grammar errors, spelling errors, and (of course) logic errors than any previous paper (these were what she always used to justify dinging my grade). I got an "A" - the errors were overlooked - I found them myself when re-reading the paper. Good luck. I can tell just from the subject matter you are assigned that your teacher has a political axe to grind.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 10:36:06 AM EDT
SW, no worries. I'd rather have my own ideas and a 1.2 GPA than be a 4.0 Student with the viewpoint of your average american sheepie.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 10:45:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/20/2003 10:50:43 AM EDT by photoman]
Your teacher obviously has never listened to a radio commentator from the 1930's. Perhaps he needs to learn a bit more about things. But he does have one point in that it's writen more as what you'd see in the paper and not so much writen as it would be for radio news copy. I'll see if I can dig up an example for ya. Is this a regular assignment, I mean writing it like it's a commentary for the radio? if it is check this site it will give you a good idea of writing copy for the radio. [url]ww.newscript.com/copy.html[/url]
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 11:08:46 AM EDT
Originally Posted By brasspile: SW, no worries. I'd rather have my own ideas and a 1.2 GPA than be a 4.0 Student with the viewpoint of your average american sheepie.
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I agree. Your grade may not reflect it, but you've demonstrated yourself to be a thoughtful, articulate and educated young man. Your life and who you are is a reflection of the challenges you conquer in life. This is but one of many.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 11:28:44 AM EDT
Originally Posted By brasspile: SW, no worries. I'd rather have my own ideas and a 1.2 GPA than be a 4.0 Student with the viewpoint of your average american sheepie.
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You are a man of integrity, no doubt. However, I would rather tell them what they want to hear and work my way up their ranks from the inside. I would have never made it past an initial interview for a social work position if the interviewer knew how conservative I was. Once inside, I let the true me out. It was too late then...the bleeding heart liberal bastards had to deal a conservative that believed in tough love and the judicial system...not pandering a 17 yr old rapist's emotional well being... end rant... sorry. I guess what I was getting at is your end goal. You should strive for a 4.0. I regret not doing so in High school. Do what it ever it takes. Delight in the fact that the liberal pussy that your are mirroring is dumb enough to believe you are a convert. At the end of the line, people will think, SW is smart, he has a 4.0. Not, SW is a man of conviction....that expains his 2.0 average.... in essense: Fuck them at thier own game. They don't play fair, you don't either. -HS
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 12:35:48 PM EDT
arrrgh!! makes me angry! in the 30's right, Were'nt people 'old fashioned' ya know, the good old days when men were real men women were real women and small furry creatures from alpha centuari were REAL small furry creatures from alpha centuari????? They did'nt at that time have social security for old people and people pulled themselves up by their own bootstraps, right? Yet they still voted for Roosevelt not once BUT 4 TIMES!!!! WHY? because they lived through the depression, you did'nt!! the Lassie faire attitude of the repubs led to economic disaster that had people literally starving in the streets! people talk about the high crime rate of today but ya knowwhat ? it actually peaked in 1932! people were killing each other just to eat. who's gonna fix this problem? the idle rich? HA! most of the industrial world at that time literally had to resort to 'command economy' to restore order. russia had stalin, germany had hitler, france and england had "labor" partys in control, italy had mussolini. do an actual study of what really happened during that time like 'Grapes of wraith' or 'mice and men' as well as other history books to find out how people were effected. In fact, except for the 8 years of Eisenhower from 1932 to 1968 was all democrats because they had seen the effect of "Voodoo" economics!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 12:51:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By t-stox: arrrgh!! makes me angry! in the 30's right, Were'nt people 'old fashioned' ya know, the good old days when men were real men women were real women and small furry creatures from alpha centuari were REAL small furry creatures from alpha centuari????? They did'nt at that time have social security for old people and people pulled themselves up by their own bootstraps, right? Yet they still voted for Roosevelt not once BUT 4 TIMES!!!! WHY? because they lived through the depression, you did'nt!! the Lassie faire attitude of the repubs led to economic disaster that had people literally starving in the streets! people talk about the high crime rate of today but ya knowwhat ? it actually peaked in 1932! people were killing each other just to eat. who's gonna fix this problem? the idle rich? HA! most of the industrial world at that time literally had to resort to 'command economy' to restore order. russia had stalin, germany had hitler, france and england had "labor" partys in control, italy had mussolini. do an actual study of what really happened during that time like 'Grapes of wraith' or 'mice and men' as well as other history books to find out how people were effected. In fact, except for the 8 years of Eisenhower from 1932 to 1968 was all democrats because they had seen the effect of "Voodoo" economics!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Do me a favor and post that again when the caffiene/cocaine/ wears off, ok?
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 12:58:10 PM EDT
Originally Posted By brasspile:
In fact, except for the 8 years of Eisenhower from 1932 to 1968 was all democrats because they had seen the effect of "Voodoo" economics!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Brass...I think "cousin it" isn't a fan of supply side economics Like Kennedy and Reagan...He wants Uncle Sam to tell him when to eat, shit and sleep. He probably wants a state job too....and 2 months a year off. However, what this has to do with SW making the grade, I don't have a fucking clue.... -HS
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 1:21:00 PM EDT
Originally Posted By t-stox: the Lassie faire attitude of the repubs led to economic disaster that had people literally starving in the streets! people talk about the high crime rate of today but ya knowwhat ? it actually peaked in 1932! people were killing each other just to eat.
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I call [BS] on this. Perhaps you should start a new Thread with some solid proof to back up your incoherent blather....instead of fucking up this thread with your diatribe. Oh, and prohibition might have lead to some of the crime...peaking in '32. When did prohibition end.....was it '33? -HS
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 2:06:24 PM EDT
I was lucky, most of my profs in college (even one who was an admitted Marxist-God did we torture him) didn't let their communist views effect grading. I once did a final where I told the prof his whole premise for the semester was false-got an A. My HS English teacher was an Arty officer in Vietnam (w/Purple Heart), so no worries there! SW, stay true to your beliefs.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 3:53:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By t-stox: arrrgh!! makes me angry! in the 30's right, Were'nt people 'old fashioned' ya know, the good old days when men were real men women were real women and small furry creatures from alpha centuari were REAL small furry creatures from alpha centuari????? They did'nt at that time have social security for old people and people pulled themselves up by their own bootstraps, right? Yet they still voted for Roosevelt not once BUT 4 TIMES!!!! WHY? because they lived through the depression, you did'nt!! the Lassie faire attitude of the repubs led to economic disaster that had people literally starving in the streets! people talk about the high crime rate of today but ya knowwhat ? it actually peaked in 1932! people were killing each other just to eat. who's gonna fix this problem? the idle rich? HA! most of the industrial world at that time literally had to resort to 'command economy' to restore order. russia had stalin, germany had hitler, france and england had "labor" partys in control, italy had mussolini. do an actual study of what really happened during that time like 'Grapes of wraith' or 'mice and men' as well as other history books to find out how people were effected. In fact, except for the 8 years of Eisenhower from 1932 to 1968 was all democrats because they had seen the effect of "Voodoo" economics!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Wow. Write a coherent post, and then I'll respond to it.
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 5:22:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/20/2003 5:30:21 PM EDT by 8531sgt]
Respectfully challenge the grade. Ask your pinko for his justification and the grading breakdown to back-up your score. Keep it civil, and if he insists on grading based on differing opinions take it up the chain. You should be graded on your work as stated in the assignment and as such cannot be "correct/incorrect" as long as your facts as presented are correct. That being said and considering your age group and content of the assignment as presented it looks like strong B work. Has the class covered broadcast journalism of the '30's? If not, I don't see where you can be graded down for inaccurate period copy style. Gud luk.... jj PS, Having his written counter points on your paper strengthens your position for inappropriate grading practices. Don't get rid of your paper, make copies and keep the original.
Link Posted: 12/21/2003 8:29:53 AM EDT
SW, If you wrote the paper for a political science or debate class then the instructor can pick apart your arguments but your position is off limits. You should be free to argue based on your beliefs. [i]How[/i] you argue is the only thing open to criticism. If he knocks off points because he doesn't agree with you then you have a case. Take your paper to the department head or principal. If they won't help, get your parents involved and bring it up with the school board. If you wrote the paper for a composition class then the instructor is completely out of bounds. I ran into a situation like that in 11th grade. The year was 1978 and the instructor was a standard issue liberal feminist imbued with all the political biases and psychopathologies prevalent among liberals of the time. Two buddies and I decided to make a point. We selected topics sure to set her off. I wrote a paper defending Hitler's eugenics policies. The other two took affirmative action (con) and welfare to work (pro). The assignment included an oral presentation before the class. We showed up in three piece suits, briefcases, the whole nine yards. We put on quite a show. The instructor wanted to shred our papers but we challenged her decision. She lost because the papers were for a class called "Lit[erary] Forms and Oral Communication". The only thing she was allowed to critique was the writing (which was very good), and the presentation (which was spectacular). Our theses were not open for critique. We all wound up with B's but she was on our case for the rest of the semester.
Link Posted: 12/21/2003 9:25:21 AM EDT
I have never compromised my beliefs for a class. Of course, I'm an Engineer, so that doesn't really apply. There was one time in English 1102 (the only English class I took in college) where I had to write something about Marxist criticism. To this day, I have no idea what the hell that is, or how I managed to write a short paper about it.
Link Posted: 12/21/2003 9:53:17 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Adam_White: Sadly, my experience in English clases have been the same. I never managed to pull better than a B for an entire semester. Then, for one paper, I decided to just regurgitate the leftist BS the professor always spouted. I had more grammar errors, spelling errors, and (of course) logic errors than any previous paper (these were what she always used to justify dinging my grade). I got an "A" - the errors were overlooked - I found them myself when re-reading the paper.
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I too had one of those professors when I took English. He had us write a paper on one of our life experiences, so I wrote about my first deployment to Bosnia in 1996 with the US Army. To make a long story short he gave me an F and because of that paper being a major grade I failed English. He said "I can see the military come through in your writing because it was so long". I took English again the next semester and my new professor told me to resubmit the exact same paper, when I got it back he had given me 2 A's and told me that it had made him very interested about the Bosnia mission. My first prof was a liberal shmuck that looked like a troll and graduated from UC Berkley, my second prof had written 6 books and taught Survival training in the Air Force. Go figure!
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