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Posted: 11/28/2003 1:48:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2003 1:51:59 PM EDT by Zaphod]
Can you believe these people?

www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-3441048,00.html (The Guardian... What can I tell you?)


Bush Visit to Iraq Becomes Talk of Baghdad

Friday November 28, 2003 6:46 PM


By NIKO PRICE

Associated Press Writer

BAGHDAD, Iraq (AP) - President Bush's surprise visit to Iraq was the talk of Baghdad's teahouses, kebab shops and mosques Friday, with many Iraqis asking why he didn't take advantage of his trip to see firsthand how his rule has treated them.



Sorry for the interuption...

Maybe because so many of you ungrateful slobs want to KILL HIM?


Many complained that Bush met with few Iraqis during his secret, two-hour stay Thursday evening and never left the grounds of a heavily fortified U.S. base. Several called the trip an electoral stunt, and took offense that he would use their country as his stage.

``He visited Iraq for the sake of the Americans, not the Iraqis. He didn't come to see how we are doing,'' Muzher Abd Hanush, 54, said in his barbershop. ``To come, say hello and leave - what good does that do?''

U.S. forces in Iraq generally took the trip as a morale boost, and praised their commander in chief for what they called a courageous move.

``It's an extremely admirable gesture. It's really a good example as a leader,'' Capt. Craig Childs, of Galveston, Texas, said at his base in the northern city of Tikrit. ``It's a bold statement that he's confident of the job we're doing here to come within the enemy's reach.''

But among Iraqis generally disappointed in the U.S.-led occupation, the trip swayed few opinions.

Some people applauded what they called a bold move and expressed vague hopes that it would help bring security, political stability and jobs to their war-shattered country. But they stressed it was results - not a photo opportunity - that would boost Bush's popularity here.

``If he takes care of Iraq, he will be welcomed here. If not - whether he's here or in the White House - he is of no use to us,'' said Fadel Hadi, 59, playing dominoes at a teahouse. ``If his visit brings us some good, he will be welcome every day.''



Sorry, HAD to interupt again...

Hey, ASSWIPE!

You're in a reasonably free country now! How many relatives of yours got fed through the shredders before we showed up?


Ahmed Kheiri, 24, saw the visit as a campaign tactic.

``He came for the sake of the elections,'' Kheiri said. ``He never thought of the Iraqi people. He doesn't care about us. It was a personal visit for his own sake.''



Looks like DUh has a cell in place already...


Iraqi politicians had mixed reactions to the visit. Mouwafik al-Rubei'e, a member of the U.S.-appointed Governing Council who met Bush on Thursday night, said the president ``reaffirmed his country's commitment to building a new, democratic and prosperous Iraq.''

Another member of the Governing Council, Mahmoud Othman, said the trip meant little.

``We cannot consider Bush's arrival at Baghdad International Airport yesterday a visit to Iraq,'' he said. ``He did not meet with ordinary Iraqis. Bush was only trying to boost the morale of his troops.''



NO SHIT, SHIRLOCK!

I guess your absolute brilliance is why you're an Iraqi politician? Are you a democrat, too?


Indeed, many Iraqis questioned how the trip could possibly help improve their dire situation. Eight months after the U.S. invasion, Iraqis complain they still have few jobs, little security and no political representation.

During Friday prayers on the Muslim holy day, imams at Shiite and Sunni mosques alike criticized the visit, saying Bush should expend his energy helping Iraq recover from war instead of flying across the world to pose for the cameras.



Now THERE's a shock...


``Instead of coming here to celebrate Thanksgiving with his troops, Bush should release the innocent people in his prisons and arrest the real terrorists conducting attacks,'' Skeikh Abdul Hadi al-Daraji said at the Muhsen Mosque in the poor, Shiite Muslim neighborhood of Sadr City.





``First Bush said he would liberate Iraq. Now he is occupying it. How long will he stay?'' asked the imam at Baghdad's largest Sunni mosque, Abu Hanifa.

Bush's visit was spent entirely on the grounds of Baghdad International Airport, a 15-square-mile complex heavily guarded by U.S. troops. He flew in under complete secrecy, keeping his plans even from his own parents, whom he had invited to his Texas ranch for Thanksgiving dinner.

News of his visit didn't emerge until he had left Iraq, and given the power outages in some Baghdad neighborhoods Thursday night, that meant many Iraqis didn't hear about it until Friday.

While U.S. troops called the trip courageous, some Iraqis saw it as cowardly.

``The way he made the trip shows he's afraid of Iraqis,'' said Mohammed Kamel, 40, a former soldier who now drives a taxi. ``He should be; we're a fierce people.''





Oh, yeah! REALLY fierce! That's why you're OCCUPIED, right?

Enter the Queen Bitch of the Universe:


U.S. senators Hillary Rodham Clinton and Jack Reed spent about 10 hours in Baghdad on Friday and planned another day in Iraq on Saturday after overnighting out of the country. On Friday, Clinton traveled between the airport, coalition headquarters and another U.S. military base in a convoy of civilian SUVs with an escort of Humvees and Apache helicopters.

She met with coalition officials, U.S. troops, a group of Iraqi female politicians and talked briefly with Iraqi workers on the bases. Media coverage was restricted, however, and few Iraqis heard about her trip Friday.

Alla Abdul Wahab, a 38-year-old windowpane seller, hadn't heard about Clinton's trip, but asked what Bush's visit would ultimately do for Iraqis.

``What good will this visit bring?'' he asked. ``He came to see the Americans - that's all.''



DUH! Somebody gets it!

Maybe we'll all get lucky and one of those "fierce" Iraqis will take a swipe at Klinton.

Nah......even the terrorists are not stupid enough to kill their own allies.

Edited for code...
Link Posted: 11/28/2003 3:46:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2003 3:47:53 PM EDT by rn45]
Too bad Clinton got away clean. I care less than nothing what the Iraqi's think. Their opinion on any topic matters not at all. I thought President Bush's trip was a very thoughtful visit by a good leader to bolster the morale of the troops. That's all. Why Hitlery went over there is anyone's guess. Maybe she has a gay lover she missed. Who knows.
Link Posted: 11/28/2003 3:56:05 PM EDT
Yep, the President could have walked the streets and raised his right arm. Maybe put a fake mustache on. Trust me, most Iraqis praise Allah we're there. As soon as those people figure out Saddam ain't commin' back, things will change quickly. Iran and Syria are freaked about the possibility of a free Muslim state in their midst.
Link Posted: 11/28/2003 5:05:14 PM EDT
This will give rise to a new expression: "Only in Iraq."
Link Posted: 11/28/2003 6:59:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2003 7:01:01 PM EDT by CrazyMonkey]
I know some Iraqis living here.... Under Saddam, according to them, they were fine, so long as they didnt openly oppose him. And remember, they live in the US and are not under pressure to say this. But they say that since the war (they still have family over there), though the Iraqi's are now technically "free", so are thousands of other thugs who are making life very, very hard for ordinary people- a problem that didn't exist there under Saddam. I know I'll get lynched for this... but it seems like the whole freedom thing is just bullshit... the country just got messed up even more.
Link Posted: 11/28/2003 7:14:58 PM EDT
Here's what an Iraqi said about the surprise visit. [b]You know this was really weird. Just yesterday morning I was reflecting whether Bush would visit Iraq some time in the future and I turned it over in my mind expecting it to be a surprise visit in the same manner of Rumsfeld's. I knew it was going to happen, but I didn't imagine it to be so close, especially after the attacks on the DHL cargo plane leaving Baghdad Airport. Anyway, I was at the cafe chatting with my cousin in London, and I was checking my blog's comments section at the same time when a reader asked me what I thought about Bush's visit to Iraq. I stared in disbelief at the screen for some time, then I went to Yahoo news and there it was: Bush landed in Baghdad Airport, spent a couple of hours with American troops, met Talabani and Chalabi, and left. He didn't leave the Airport area as far as I know. I did hear American fighters flying over Baghdad though during the day, and I was wondering what was going on. After leaving the cafe I asked some people in the neighbourhood what they thought of it. Everyone I talked to stared blankly at me as if I was crazy or something. It seems that nobody thought it was possible for Bush to visit Iraq at this time. I went to buy dinner from a nearby restaurant and IMN was displaying Bush's speech to his troops. Everyone stopped eating and stared at the tv. It was quite a scene, I just wished I had a camera at that time. It was so comical. I watched it all on Al-Jazeera later, and as usual, they described it as a cheap attempt by Bush & Co. to boost American public opinion in his favour for the upcoming election campaign. You could easily detect the anguish in their anaylsis to the fact that Bush didn't go down to the streets or meet everyday Iraqis, or that Air Force 1 wasn't hit by an anti-aircraft missile fired by Iraqi militants. They were really frustrated. Their news have become so predictable. My father was peculiarly furious with one of these 'analysts', he almost kicked the tv. The guy was saying that this visit would practically achieve nothing, or to be more accurate "would trick nobody". He also said that it would have no effect whatsoever on morals of American troops...etc. I have mixed feelings myself. The fact that he is the first American president to set foot on Iraqi soil is a huge event in itself, and a three hour visit to Baghdad Airport definitely wouldn't be the same as a tour in the country and most importantly meeting Iraqi citizens, Iraqis who would be grateful for this visit. But I understand the security considerations and this gesture alone would be sufficient to send a message to whoever it may concern that Iraq is safe enough for an American president to visit. To tell the truth I'm still shocked to this moment that he took the risk to come here. I used to like him before, but now I admire the guy.[/b] [url]http://healingiraq.blogspot.com/archives/2003_11_01_healingiraq_archive.html#107004417848562893[/url]
Link Posted: 11/28/2003 7:25:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By CrazyMonkey: I know some Iraqis living here.... Under Saddam, according to them, they were fine, so long as they didnt openly oppose him. And remember, they live in the US and are not under pressure to say this. But they say that since the war (they still have family over there), though the Iraqi's are now technically "free", so are thousands of other thugs who are making life very, very hard for ordinary people- a problem that didn't exist there under Saddam. I know I'll get lynched for this... but it seems like the whole freedom thing is just bullshit... the country just got messed up even more.
View Quote
And the thugs are free why? Because good ol Saddam let them out in an attempt to raise his 'approval' rating and look like a nice guy, back when the UN was on his case in 02...
Link Posted: 11/28/2003 7:44:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By CrazyMonkey: I know some Iraqis living here.... Under Saddam, according to them, they were fine, so long as they didnt openly oppose him. And remember, they live in the US and are not under pressure to say this. But they say that since the war (they still have family over there), though the Iraqi's are now technically "free", so are thousands of other thugs who are making life very, very hard for ordinary people- a problem that didn't exist there under Saddam. I know I'll get lynched for this... [red]but it seems like the whole freedom thing is just bullshit... the country just got messed up even more.
View Quote
[/red] So, if the U.S. government revoked all of your constitutional rights, you wouldn't have a problem with it as long as you could keep your mouth shut and not be punished for saying nothing? Chew on that for awhile. The Iraqis now have the [red]freedom[/red] to criticize the people governing their country. That's a lot more in the way of freedom than they've had in the past four decades.
Link Posted: 11/28/2003 8:50:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2003 8:52:50 PM EDT by CrazyMonkey]
Originally Posted By Dave_A: And the thugs are free why? Because good ol Saddam let them out in an attempt to raise his 'approval' rating and look like a nice guy, back when the UN was on his case in 02...
View Quote
It's not just the people Saddam let out- most of those were simply political prosoners, not murderes. When the US went in, there was practically anarchy- the looting was defenately not just ex-cons and political prisoners- it was done by many people who were taking advantage of the lack of a law. I recall an american official saying something along the lines of "after so many years of opression, let them have some fun" ... basically turning his back on the problem. And no, its not because the Iraqi's are "wild people", the same kind of looting took place here during some riots in the early 90's- but there was a law to try to stop it. In Iraq, hospitals and things just got ransacked. Plus, when the US went in, the country became a terorist magnet- they started comming in from everywhere to try and kill us- and that was defenately not there before.
Originally posted by Corporal_Chaos: So, if the U.S. government revoked all of your constitutional rights, you wouldn't have a problem with it as long as you could keep your mouth shut and not be punished for saying nothing? Chew on that for awhile. The Iraqis now have the freedom to criticize the people governing their country. That's a lot more in the way of freedom than they've had in the past four decades
View Quote
I'm not saying I dont want freedom- but political freedom is not necesarily anarchy. Political freedom should theoretically go along with security- like in this country. The US just tried to do a quick job of imposing political freedom- by getting rid of the existing governmental structure- and in doing so completely neglected security. Our troops can't be both police men and soldiers, so by getting rid of the authority that existed so quickly without first establishing another authority, Iraq was at the mercy of terrorists and looters- the mess that it continues to be in. And besides- house to house searches like those going on in Iraq hardly qualify as fair treatment- I know we are fighting a war, but that only makes more enemies- if we want the Iraqi's to really be greatful, those policies will not work. We want out kind of government there, but look at the example we are giving the people. Its one thing for them to look at the US and its succeses- its another thing for them to see the US first hand over there, where it affects them more, and unfortunately, has been affecting them somehwat negatively.
Link Posted: 11/28/2003 9:19:31 PM EDT
Well, my personal philosophy, and this applies to all nations, is that if they had taken care of themselves and deposed Saddam like they should have, we wouldn't need to be there. For me, as an American, the security of this country will always come before the security of another. We went into Iraq because it posed a threat. If the Iraqi people had taken care of Saddam then we wouldn't be there and they wouldn't be bitching about us screwing up their lives. However, they did not do this so they must reap the consequences. We're there, and as far as I'm concerned, our first priority is to neutralize threats to Americans. Iraqi liberation comes second. They can bitch all they want. I personally don't give a shit. If the Iraqi people can endure 40 years of Saddam's reign, then I think they can endure a few years of U.S. occupation during the rebuilding of their country. If they can't, f**k 'em, they need to learn to take care of their own problems next time. Also, the Iraqis never had security with Saddam. I'm sure we've all heard the stories of that sick family's indulgences. F**king Uday killed his father's food taster for firing an AK into the air at a party. If he could do that, how many Iraqis do you think he could have picked up off the street to torture, just for fun? Speaking out against Saddam's regime wasn't the only way to kick your ass clipped in pre-war Iraq. On another note: Iraqis expecting Bush's visit to be an Iraqi PR trip is just ludicrous. He took a big enough risk just flying in. Anyone who would expect him to walk the streets of Baghdad and meet with Iraqis truly is an idiot.
Link Posted: 11/28/2003 9:40:37 PM EDT
Just a vain attempt to minimize the significance of Bush's trip, nothing more. This morning, most of the American media was visibly relieved to be able to throw cold water on the trip by also mentioning the death of another American serviceman – which they invariably did in the same breath. It's almost like they believed his trip was going to magically stop all the bloodshed in Iraq... This hasn't been a good week for the liberal media – not only did Hillery's trip flop, but it flopped because GW trumped her.
Link Posted: 11/28/2003 9:56:03 PM EDT
?? Come on [b]Zaphod[/b], you’re actually believing a British news article about GWB? I wouldn’t be surprised if the whole thing is fabricated.
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