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Posted: 11/21/2003 7:31:17 PM EDT
They consider it worse than nothing!

http://www.ipgv.org/The%20Assault%20Weapons%20Ban.pdf

CRC
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 8:10:44 PM EDT
Thus proving the point of SteyrAugs earlier post.

Only extremists don't understand the idea that part of something is always better than all of nothing.
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 8:22:26 PM EDT
The Assault Weapons Ban:
Straight Reauthorization v. Reauthorization and Strengthening

Problem

The assault weapons ban was enacted by Congress and signed into law by President Clinton in 1994. Unfortunately, soon after the assault weapons ban took effect, gun manufacturers began circumventing the ban by making minor modifications to their assault weapons, renaming them, and marketing them as legal post-ban products. An example is the Colt Match Target Rifle, which is functionally identical to the Colt AR-15 that was banned by name in the 1994 assault weapons ban. Other gun manufacturers began producing clones of banned assault weapons. The Bushmaster XM-15 and Olympic Arms PCR-6 are nothing but clones of the AR-15.

The result is that in spite of the 1994 assault weapons ban, military-style, semiautomatic assault weapons are just as available today than they were prior to the 1994 ban. Gun manufacturers openly boast of their ability to evade the current ban.

Straight Reauthorization

Diane Feinstein (D-CA) has introduced legislation in the U.S. Senate that would reauthorize the 1994 assault weapons ban, which is due to expire on Sept. 13, 2004 unless renewed by Congress and signed by President Bush. The Feinstein bill simply makes the 1994 assault weapons ban permanent without addressing the fact that the current ban has failed to meet the intent of Congress when it passed the ban in 1994. The Feinstein bill would maintain the status quo. That is, assault weapons that are now banned would remain banned, while assault weapons that are now being legally sold (e.g., the Colt Match Target Rifle, Bushmaster XM-15, and Olympic Arms PCR-6) would remain legal. The Feinstein bill is referred to as “straight reauthorization.”

Reauthorization and Strengthening

Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY) and John Conyers (D-MI) have introduced legislation in the U.S. House of Representatives that would not only reauthorize the assault weapons ban, but also addresses the problems with the current ban. The McCarthy-Conyers bill would keep the ban on assault weapons that are banned under current law, and would also ban the copies, duplicates, and clones of banned assault weapons that are currently being sold as legal post-ban products. The McCarthy-Conyers bill would strengthen the assault weapons ban so as to meet the original intent of Congress. The McCarthy-Conyers bill is referred to as “reauthorization and strengthening.”

IPGV Position

Iowans for the Prevention of Gun Violence (IPGV) considers that assault weapons constitute an unreasonable risk of death and injury to the general public, and in particular,
to law enforcement personnel who must deal with criminals armed with assault weapons. Therefore, IPGV strongly supports the McCarthy-Conyers bill to reauthorize and strengthen the assault weapons ban. Furthermore, we consider the McCarthy-Conyers bill as the only alternative that we can support.

Some gun violence prevention groups have stated that while they support reauthorization and strengthening, they would also support a straight reauthorization of the assault weapons ban. The reasoning being that a straight reauthorization of the assault weapons ban would have a better chance of passing in the Congress, and straight reauthorization would be “better than nothing.”

IPGV disagrees. We consider that straight reauthorization of the assault weapons ban is not “better than nothing,” it is “equivalent to nothing.” In fact, straight reauthorization may be “worse than nothing” because if Congress simply approves a straight reauthorization of the current ban, existing makes and models of post-ban assault weapons, which were designed specifically to evade the current ban, would become permanently legal (Table 1). Once they are “legalized” by Congress, it will be virtually impossible to ever ban them again. That greatly concerns us.

A congressional vote on straight reauthorization of the assault weapons ban would be a win-win situation for the gun industry. Gun manufacturers will be allowed to produce and sell to the general public military-style, semiautomatic assault weapons, irrespective of how the vote comes out. Either way, it will be a victory for the gun industry.

Bushmaster Firearms, the manufacturer of the Bushmaster XM-15 assault weapon used by the Washington, DC area snipers, has stated publicly that they are not opposed to reauthorization of the current assault weapons ban. Why? Because straight reauthorization of the assault weapons ban would not affect their business. They would be able to continue to produce their product line of post-ban AR-15-type assault weapons.

IPGV considers that gun violence prevention groups cannot afford to waste our limited resources working on legislation that will have no real impact on the availability of assault weapons to the general public. Therefore, IPGV sees no alternative but to fight for reauthorization and strengthening of the assault weapons ban, i.e., the McCarthy-Conyers bill. It will be a hard fight. But at least we will be fighting for something worth fighting for. IPGV is committed to this fight.

We consider that this is the message gun violence prevention groups should be sending to members of Congress. That we will not passively support a straight reauthorization of the current assault weapons ban that is not working as intended, and everybody knows it – Congress, gun manufacturers, gun rights supporters, gun control advocates, and the media. We ask other gun violence prevention groups to join us.

Table 1. Partial List of Post-Ban Assault Weapons Currently Available Rifles and Shotguns

(Source: Gun Buyers Guide 2003) AR-7 (.22LR) Armalite AR-10 Series (.243, .308
Armalite AR-15/M-15 Series (.223)
Armalite AR-180B (.223)
Armscor (.22LR)
ASA Competition/Bull/Tactical/Match (9mm, .223, .308)
Barrett M82A1 (.50BMG)
Beretta Cx4 Storm (9mm, .40S&W, .45ACP Bushmaster M17S Bullpup (.223)
Bushmaster XM-15 E2S Series/Varminter (.223) Colt Accurized Rifle (.223)
Colt Match Target Series (.223)
DPMS Race Gun (.223)
DPMS Panther (.223)
DSA SA58 (.243 .260, .308)
Entreprise Autoloaders (.308)
HK-SL8-1 (.223)
HK-USC (.45ACP)
KEL-TEC Sub-2000 (9mm, .40S&W)
Les Baer Ultimate AR-223 Rifles (.223)
Olympic Arms CAR-97 (9mm, .40S&W, 10mm, .45ACP) Olympic Arms PCR/FAR/PLINKER (.223)
Professional Ordinance Carbon-15 Type 97/97S/21 (.223)
Robinson Armament M96 (.223)
Robinson Armament VEPR (.223)
RRA A2/A4/VARMINT (.223)
Thompson Long Guns (.45ACP)
Wilson Tactical Carbines (.223)
Z-M Weapons LR-300 (.223)

Pistols
(Source: Internet Sites)
Intratec AB-10 (9mm)
Colbry MPA MAC-10 CB (.45ACP)
Colbry PM-11/9 (9mm)
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 8:29:02 PM EDT
Good, they will hopefully bite off more than they can chew!
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 8:29:35 PM EDT
Fine by me. It's pretty obvious that no one is really interested (other than the grabbers) in re-authorizing the existing AWB. To openly push for even more than that is just going to meet more resistance and indifference.

Let them throw their money, time and emotions at this. When it sunsets, there is nothing to take its place and the streets DON'T run red with blood they can crawl back into their holes and cry to themselves.

It will be interesting to see what POSITIVE economic impact will happen with the sunset. I know that I plan to go on a buying binge (I will be out of the PRK by Sep '04 come hell or high water).
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 8:38:36 PM EDT

Bushmaster Firearms, the manufacturer of the Bushmaster XM-15 assault weapon used by the Washington, DC area snipers, has stated publicly that they are not opposed to reauthorization of the current assault weapons ban

Is this true?
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 8:39:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2003 8:40:38 PM EDT by BigJ491]
Wow..what a bunch of morons. John R. Lott talks about a term called Substituion in his book, More Guns, Less Crime. Substitution is when criminals find other means to commit similar crimes. For example: If we sucessfully ban all guns, homicides won't decrease, but more people will be stabbed and beaten to death. In the case of Strengthening the AWB, you won't see a decrease in the amount of LEO's that are murdered by guns every year or even normal civilians that are murdered. What you will see is a slight increase in other types of weapons used INSTEAD of "Assualt Weapons."

The other laughable things is that they really have no clue what they mean when they say "assault weapon." They have this image in their head of some cracked out drug dealer holding a machine gun spraying a crowd of people w/ a fully automatic weapon. So they simply want to ban anything that LOOKS like they image they have in their head. A fine example of this is the HK UMC .45 that they list as an post-ban assualt weapon. Wow...10 rounds of .45ACP fired Semi-Auto...that sure is more dangerous than my 1911. I hate liberals.
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 8:40:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Sylvan:

Bushmaster Firearms, the manufacturer of the Bushmaster XM-15 assault weapon used by the Washington, DC area snipers, has stated publicly that they are not opposed to reauthorization of the current assault weapons ban

Is this true?



I think I remember something about this, from what I heard they took something some Bushmaster representative said out of context and the Bushmaster people were pissed about it.
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 8:50:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Mr-T:

Originally Posted By Sylvan:

Bushmaster Firearms, the manufacturer of the Bushmaster XM-15 assault weapon used by the Washington, DC area snipers, has stated publicly that they are not opposed to reauthorization of the current assault weapons ban

Is this true?



I think I remember something about this, from what I heard they took something some Bushmaster representative said out of context and the Bushmaster people were pissed about it.


Correct. BM was quoted out of context.
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 8:53:05 PM EDT
LMAO. Thanks to the Klintons there are many times more AW's and their clones "on the streets" than there ever were before hand. Someone ought to pull that little bit of info out and whack these losers over the head with it.
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 9:21:07 PM EDT
There's enough anti-rights people in Iowa to form their own group - of how many people!
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 9:30:53 PM EDT


(Source: Gun Buyers Guide 2003) AR-7 (.22LR) Armalite AR-10 Series (.243, .308
Armalite AR-15/M-15 Series (.223)
Armalite AR-180B (.223)
Armscor (.22LR)
ASA Competition/Bull/Tactical/Match (9mm, .223, .308)
Barrett M82A1 (.50BMG)
Beretta Cx4 Storm (9mm, .40S&W, .45ACP Bushmaster M17S Bullpup (.223)
Bushmaster XM-15 E2S Series/Varminter (.223) Colt Accurized Rifle (.223)
Colt Match Target Series (.223)
DPMS Race Gun (.223)
DPMS Panther (.223)
DSA SA58 (.243 .260, .308)
Entreprise Autoloaders (.308)
HK-SL8-1 (.223)
HK-USC (.45ACP)
KEL-TEC Sub-2000 (9mm, .40S&W)
Les Baer Ultimate AR-223 Rifles (.223)
Olympic Arms CAR-97 (9mm, .40S&W, 10mm, .45ACP) Olympic Arms PCR/FAR/PLINKER (.223)
Professional Ordinance Carbon-15 Type 97/97S/21 (.223)
Robinson Armament M96 (.223)
Robinson Armament VEPR (.223)
RRA A2/A4/VARMINT (.223)
Thompson Long Guns (.45ACP)
Wilson Tactical Carbines (.223)
Z-M Weapons LR-300 (.223)

Pistols
(Source: Internet Sites)
Intratec AB-10 (9mm)
Colbry MPA MAC-10 CB (.45ACP)
Colbry PM-11/9 (9mm)



How nice, they even gave us a shopping list!
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 10:12:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2003 10:13:32 PM EDT by jrzy]

The result is that in spite of the 1994 assault weapons ban, military-style, semiautomatic assault weapons are just as available today than they were prior to the 1994 ban. Gun manufacturers openly boast of their ability to evade the current ban.



And yet murders with these "deadly assault weapons" has not increased one bit, they proved themselves wrong with their own information.
FUCKING MORONS!
Link Posted: 11/22/2003 11:22:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Paul:
There's enough anti-rights people in Iowa to form their own group - of how many people!



From what I can tell, the only member of this "group" is John Johnson of Iowa City. He keeps himself busy by writing pro-gun control letters (several of which I have rebutted in our local paper) to the editor of every newspaper published in Iowa. Perhaps he has a friend or life partner who is also a member, but Johnny boy is the only one who writes letters.
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