User Panel
User Panel
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:30:58 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In addition to the obvious backed problem, you are using circuits designed for 1 (one) 220V dryer to power what? Just the fridge and AC, and a few lights...... This is a spectacular way to burn your house down.... dumber than shit. You can install a transfer switch (whole house is really easy, but manual is not bad) that will allow you to properly use a generator and not cause problems. Do this... it is worth it.... check out youtube..... A dryer connection is rated for 30A. A stove connection is rated for 40A 30A @ 230V=6,900W 40A @ 230V=9,200W Most generators have a lower rating than that. Locking the main breaker off, pulling the main fuses upstream from the switch, or pulling the meter from the socket will all prevent killing the linesmen. We went through the 98 ice storm where nobody at the time was prepared for such an event. 99% of the people with a generator we're back feeding them. It is not ideal but in dire emergencies when you need power and we're not prepared it is done quite often. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:35:43 AM EDT
[#2]
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Isn't the Neutral & Ground still tied in if you shut off your Main Breaker? Have you ever been electrocuted using the sink or shower? |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:39:05 AM EDT
[#3]
I'm not going to read all these posts to see who got it right. It can be done in a pinch, If you know what your doing, and it can be done safety.
If you use 1 plug only half your panel will work. Basically if you plug into a outlet that is on the A leg of you panel, only A leg breakers will be energized. So if you have a generator with 2 outlets that are on separate legs 1-A & 1-B, then run two suicide extensions and make sure one is plugged into an A and one is plugged into a B leg outlet. Now you will energize both the A & B leg breakers. Key here is to make sure the generator is not hot while you plug in or handle these suicide cords. You will have to shut off the main breaker for it to work. Not because I think you will kill a lineman, but because the generator will instantly overload and trip. Why? Because you will be back feeding into the grid and your neighbors houses will start drawing from you generator. On a side note. Lineman always take full precautions because they know the lines can become live at any moment. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:46:44 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
 Don't be so damn hysterical!
You have to be smarter than the average rabbit. You have to have the presence of mind to flip the main breakers off before plugging into a socket. My garage is wired so one side corresponds to one leg, and the other garage side to the other leg. Chain the Genny to the Jeep parked in the garage, and plug into the side of the garage that what you need powered in the house. Easy. Now, the only downside is that you have to watch the neighborhood to see when the power comes back on, to know when to unhook the Genny and repower the breaker box. People get killed after every natural disaster from running generators indoors. The fucking generator must be outdoors where there is no chance of exhaust gasses re-entering the building. So far 3 people have died in Florida due to this stupidity. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:56:23 AM EDT
[#5]
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For curiosity's sake. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:01:19 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You really can't be that stupid , can you? People get killed after every natural disaster from running generators indoors. The fucking generator must be outdoors where there is no chance of exhaust gasses re-entering the building. So far 3 people have died in Florida due to this stupidity. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Don't be so damn hysterical!
You have to be smarter than the average rabbit. You have to have the presence of mind to flip the main breakers off before plugging into a socket. My garage is wired so one side corresponds to one leg, and the other garage side to the other leg. Chain the Genny to the Jeep parked in the garage, and plug into the side of the garage that what you need powered in the house. Easy. Now, the only downside is that you have to watch the neighborhood to see when the power comes back on, to know when to unhook the Genny and repower the breaker box. People get killed after every natural disaster from running generators indoors. The fucking generator must be outdoors where there is no chance of exhaust gasses re-entering the building. So far 3 people have died in Florida due to this stupidity. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:01:22 AM EDT
[#7]
Not all electrical panels have a single main shutoff. Some homes built from like the 50s to the 70s have a split bus panel where each high amp appliance has its own breaker and then a single 60 amp shutoff for the remainder of the panel's 15 and 20 amp breakers (lights and outlets).
The problem here is some retard may shutoff the 60 amp "main" that he sees in his panel, but then plugs the generator into the drier outlet, which would still be connected to the utility. That's the trouble with giving advice for stuff like this. Most people don't know what they are looking at and will make stupid assumptions. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:03:31 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lineman dies and you get arrested. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:12:37 AM EDT
[#9]
Cut MAIN BREAKER
go to everyone's house that is doing this shit and cut theirs off too! That is If your going to do this shit |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:23:10 AM EDT
[#10]
Don't kill some poor linesman .. hire a pro to do It right
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:24:59 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think I'm going with this Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
You are literally full of shit. If you shut your main off. Everything else is a mute point. You will only be powering your house. "Good way to kill a lineman is total bullshit". If you ACTUALLY back fed your neighborhood your generator would stall or fault from the excess load. This is because everything that's still left switched on in every house on your block is a power draw. Just like if you are isolated and left your HVAC system on while trying to power your house with too small of a gen set it would stall or default. Not to mention safety protocol dictates they check the line and isolate the repair. If you think Harry home owners gen set can back feed a neighborhood you are either retarded, full of shit or parroting bullshit that your read on the internet. It might do it for a short period of time but IT WILL. Maybe long enough to kill a lineman. Use a transfer switch. Back feeding into your panel is stupid and dangerous. ETA I had an electrician install a transfer switch. I checked with several electricians and a city inspector before I had it done. Believe me, very few electricians, even if licensed, will install a transfer switch for an emergency generator in a LEGAL AND SAFE MANNER. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:40:06 AM EDT
[#12]
My cousin is a lineman. He does this for his own house and he wired up my generator also.
Yes there is a process to hook it up and you do need to kill the main breaker first like already mentioned. I have a ordered list of what to do inside the door of my main box. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:46:05 AM EDT
[#13]
i am a lineman more specifically a troubleman and I have personally seen people backfeed the system with their generators twice and when I kindly told one gentleman he was back feeding the system he smugly told me I was wrong, I pulled his meter out isolating him from the system, his neighbors lights went out the call came in for part power and low voltage. You would be surprised the amount of grown men that don't even know what a main breaker is or what is does. People suck and that is how lineman get killed on storm duty yes you take precautions but not every lineman gets the same level of training or has the same level of experience. I work trouble calls everyday and approach situations differently then some young crew that builds new lines everyday where the system is in a normal configuration.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:50:12 AM EDT
[#14]
The other thing I haven't seen mentioned yet is how do you verify that your main breaker that you turned off (cuz your safe), is actually off.
I take it no one has ever seen a breaker fail closed. Aka the switch arm moves but the internals are broken and its still live. I haven't seen that on a main yet, but I've seen a few single pole and double poles like that. Or the better yet, double pole breaker that only drops one leg when off or tripped. (saw that once). Point is that in here there are very few people in this forum that will go the extra step and pull the cover and ohm the breaker to verify that it is indeed off. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:53:46 AM EDT
[#15]
step one turn off main breaker
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:54:04 AM EDT
[#16]
Ohm a breaker, the general public and most of the people putting these backfeed generators in don't have a clue what that even means
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:02:27 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Your neutral and ground is also connected to your water pipe. Have you ever been electrocuted using the sink or shower? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Isn't the Neutral & Ground still tied in if you shut off your Main Breaker? Have you ever been electrocuted using the sink or shower? |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:09:02 AM EDT
[#18]
I have a pullout disconnect above my panel that gives me 3" of air between my shit and the grid. Rather than back feeding through a plug, I ran 6 gauge wire through the attic from my generator location out back to the panel and put the same breaker my dryer uses on the panel end. When I need it I just pull the disconnect, open the panel, pull the dryer breaker and pop the other one in it's place. I have a tri-fuel carb on a B&S Storm Responder and it will run clean cool and quiet all day and night on natural gas. It also doubles the length of oil life as NG is much cleaner burning than gas. I run the whole house (less 220V fixtures) and two 6000 BTU window units non stop with no problems.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:10:30 AM EDT
[#19]
 Attached FileJust last night at dinner, every cell phone in the restaraunt did the emergency warning (amber alert style) tone with this message. If the average idiot isn't smart enough to run a genny outside, the last thing the idiot should be doing is adapting his home electrical wiring to the genny. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:13:48 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The other thing I haven't seen mentioned yet is how do you verify that your main breaker that you turned off (cuz your safe), is actually off. I take it no one has ever seen a breaker fail closed. Aka the switch arm moves but the internals are broken and its still live. I haven't seen that on a main yet, but I've seen a few single pole and double poles like that. Or the better yet, double pole breaker that only drops one leg when off or tripped. (saw that once). Point is that in here there are very few people in this forum that will go the extra step and pull the cover and ohm the breaker to verify that it is indeed off. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:16:25 AM EDT
[#21]
I would only do it in a pinch. Backfeeding through another circuit is less than ideal. Either setup a transfer switch to your main breaker panel or just run some extension cords to power what you need.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:20:13 AM EDT
[#22]
Shut off main, plug into a 240v socket, kill your self or someone else when they unplug the hot end not knowing?
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:24:10 AM EDT
[#23]
A ton of people do it in my ao. It isn't ideal but when you need water it will allow you to run your well pump in a pinch.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:26:54 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Another option is to just run extension cords through the house so you can pick and choose, then manage what needs to run. Not the greatest long term option, but it's an option. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:37:32 AM EDT
[#25]
As others have posted; back-feeding a house electrical system is OK if done correctly. No problem if the main breaker is turned off first. I have a 50A 220V sub-feed box in the garage. When necessary I have connected my 6500W 220V generator feeds directly to the main lugs in the box, always making sure to disconnect the generator before turning the main back on.
Something that has been only touched on in this discussion is the need for a 220V generator and back-feed system if one wants to run a well pump, central A/C, etc. 6500W will run my well pump, chest freezer, refrigerator and a few lights. I use an antique Kohler generator that has a liquid-cooled Kohler 4 cylinder engine. I run it off of propane tanks from my gas grill. Kind of a clunky set-up for only 6500W but it runs quiet and has been very dependable. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:39:03 AM EDT
[#26]
Backfeeding is fine as long as you turn the main off or pull the meter.
Not all meters are user-serviceable, and the average dingus probably shouldn't be outside pulling his meter though. If you don't shut off your main breaker, chances are your generator will stall out the second you plug it in because it will be attempting to power all of your neighbor's shit too. If you have an extra-big-ass generator and no close neighbors (or they all have their main breakers or all breakers turned off and thus are not drawing a significant load), then your generator will not stall and you will be powering a downed section of grid which is an obvious risk to anyone working on said grid that believes it is not live. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:40:42 AM EDT
[#27]
How big a transfer switch is needed for a 7500 w 220v generator?
How does one wire up said transfer switch? Asking for a friend. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:46:11 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How big a transfer switch is needed for a 7500 w 220v generator? How does one wire up said transfer switch? Asking for a friend. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:52:22 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You really can't be that stupid, can you? The garage has a 17ft door. The door is OPEN. THAT is why the Genny has to be CHAINED to the frame of a locked vehicle. Because theft. Just because Floridians can't think for themselves, don't think other people are as foolish! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Don't be so damn hysterical!
You have to be smarter than the average rabbit. You have to have the presence of mind to flip the main breakers off before plugging into a socket. My garage is wired so one side corresponds to one leg, and the other garage side to the other leg. Chain the Genny to the Jeep parked in the garage, and plug into the side of the garage that what you need powered in the house. Easy. Now, the only downside is that you have to watch the neighborhood to see when the power comes back on, to know when to unhook the Genny and repower the breaker box. People get killed after every natural disaster from running generators indoors. The fucking generator must be outdoors where there is no chance of exhaust gasses re-entering the building. So far 3 people have died in Florida due to this stupidity. I have a 50 amp outlet on the side of my house for the generator to suicide plug into. This is not a good idea for about 75% of the population, maybe more. It is also used to run an air compressor. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:53:44 AM EDT
[#30]
Cut the main breaker.
Good friend is a lineman and he told me he grounds both ends before doing any work during an emergency. He said that any lineman killed by a home generator did not do his job correctly. EVERYONE around here does it. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:54:33 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/122768/IMG_7201-307187.JPG Just last night at dinner, every cell phone in the restaraunt did the emergency warning (amber alert style) tone with this message. If the average idiot isn't smart enough to run a genny outside, the last thing the idiot should be doing is adapting his home electrical wiring to the genny. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:56:28 AM EDT
[#32]
Another option that I haven't seen mentioned is a meter connection. Our power company offers it, and will install for you. Pretty cool.
GENERLINK  Attached File |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:05:54 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How would a lineman die with the main breaker off. Please explain. Really if it needs explaining don't do it. But... Shut off main breaker first. Set up a 2 male end cord thats heavy gauge that goes into the generator and a plug for any 220/240 outlet like a welder receptacle in your garage close to outside. Plug it in before starting generator. Turn off unneccesary things like your router, computer, and lights. You only have your generator wattage. This way above is workable if you arent a dumbass. I use this way but I have only lost power once in 5 years at my house so it isn't worth buying a better system. Live in an area with frequent outages buy the right stuff. Edit for order. Shut the main off First incase the power comes on. You should also have the breaker that the generator is run from off. Double up, be smart. Everything you need to know here on podcast |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:06:43 AM EDT
[#34]
If you are going to do something that stupid pull the fucking meter so it can't backfeed.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:13:07 AM EDT
[#35]
Yes we check the line denergized and then ground it dead. People get complacent and fatigued on these storms 16 hours a day or more for weeks on end and preventable accidents happen.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:13:52 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You really can't be that stupid , can you? People get killed after every natural disaster from running generators indoors. The fucking generator must be outdoors where there is no chance of exhaust gasses re-entering the building. So far 3 people have died in Florida due to this stupidity. Anyways, been running my generator until late last night from Sunday afternoon with a suicide cord (male on both ends). I installed a 30amp circuit with a plug right under the panel in the garage. I use it for the gen and my welder. First time I got to use the plug with a generator. It was wonderful having electricity in the whole house, minus the all the 220v heavy stuff except for water heater here and there. It was more wonderful when I got to finally shut everything down and throw that main back on. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:15:59 AM EDT
[#37]
Done it several times before we got a transfer switch installed.
I used a 5500 Watt Generator ran through a dryer outlet...... Pulled the meter head= NO FUCKING WAY OF BACK FEEDING THE LINE......... No issues despite claims of imminent doom and gloom. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:24:48 AM EDT
[#38]
Every time the power has been out long enough for me to go to generator power I have had a lineman ask to see my connection before they restore service in my area. It passes muster and I have been complimented on it a few times.
My house has 2 - 200 amp panels, each with a manual transfer switch to a few select circuits. I have a connection in a weather proof box on the outside of the house that the cord from the generator plugs into. The circuits for the refrigerator, freezer, ceiling fans, TV, and some overhead lights are able to go live via the transfer switch. I also have my well pump on a circuit but can only use that one if everything else is off due to the amp draw. The procedure is to kill the main on both boxes, turn the circuit breakers that are wired to the transfer switch to the off position, make sure all transfer switches are off, plug in the cord from the generator, start the generator then switch on the selected transfer switches individually - generator will not start under a load. Since the transfer switch connects to the breakers on the feed side, with the breaker in the off position there is no back feeding to the entire panel. The transfer switch has a breaker for each circuit, 6 breakers per switch, to eliminate the possibility of an overload as well. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:28:00 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There it is. The right way. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I have a disconector just after the meter. I flip it off and I have my pole barn panel wired to let me plug in my generator and power my whole house. Did this for a week when we lost power back in 2012. It is nice coming home to AC when it is 98 degrees outside.
There it is. The right way. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:33:13 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There it is. The right way. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I have a disconector just after the meter. I flip it off and I have my pole barn panel wired to let me plug in my generator and power my whole house. Did this for a week when we lost power back in 2012. It is nice coming home to AC when it is 98 degrees outside.
There it is. The right way. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:34:39 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Call a friend or competent person. 
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:36:22 AM EDT
[#42]
it is just too easy when you have a transfer switch. I start my genny, then throw the switch to "generator". What could be easier? No mains to touch, no extension cords to run, just 1 flip of a switch.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:45:56 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Good way to kill a lineman. Get your stuff set up correctly before an emergency with a transfer switch or interlock and be safe about it. it just shows you know nothing about electricity or how lineman work |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 10:05:43 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Power's been back on since yesterday morning so it's not an issue I was just wondering if it was as easy as dude made it seem. * To be fair, he did mention shutting off the main switch on the panel in his initial explanation. I got a 10 circuit panel. All it takes to install is to run the wires into your main box. You undo the hot wire from the breaker, wire nut it to the wire from the panel and hook the other wire from the panel into the breaker. You plug your generator into the receptical and flip the switches for the individual circuits. You could install one in a few hours for $300. It sucks only being able to do 10 circuits, but you just have to choose the important stuff ahead of time. IE refrigerator, place to plug in a air conditioner, ect. This system is good for a smaller generator. If your up for buying a big one, you could put in a transfer swtich and wiring to switch the whole house over. It would be nice to run my big HVAC units off a generator, but the 5500W one is good enough for the rare instances I lose power. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 10:13:10 AM EDT
[#45]
Get a panel outside with cutoff and a plug, do it right or go without.
Transfer switches suck unless it's for a stand by, pay someone to replace the panel with a built in interlock and a 30-50 amp 220 plug. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 10:26:11 AM EDT
[#46]
Quoted:
Isn't the Neutral & Ground still tied in if you shut off your Main Breaker? The meter box switches two 120v leads, and the ground is always connected. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 10:47:49 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Don't kill some poor linesman .. hire a pro to do It right Do tell, how do the pros murder linemen correctly? Is there special training? |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 10:53:09 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Im not sure you really understand how CO2 poisoning really works. Even low levels of it can kill you over time. It builds up in your body over time . I have a 50 amp outlet on the side of my house for the generator to suicide plug into. This is not a good idea for about 75% of the population, maybe more. It is also used to run an air compressor. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 10:54:35 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No, but I have been tickled by it and never knew why until recently. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Isn't the Neutral & Ground still tied in if you shut off your Main Breaker? Have you ever been electrocuted using the sink or shower? |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 10:56:15 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You are missing the important step to not harm the linemen. Kill your main breaker. The idea is still stupid, but at least this way you can be less stupid. What this does is separates your pole power from your breaker panel while it has voltage. And of course, you have GOT to throw the Main Breaker in your box to disconnect from street power. CMOS |
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