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Posted: 7/3/2003 12:23:43 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:28:00 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:28:20 PM EDT
Paragraph two, sentance one, seems to contradict the headline...
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:38:03 PM EDT
It doesn't help the brain, that's for sure.[rolleyes]
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:40:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/3/2003 12:41:00 PM EDT by raven]
I know for a fact this isn't true. Long term marijuana use leads to, uh, ummm......I forget. I'm hungry. Anyone up for some nachos?
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:44:04 PM EDT
most people, prior to doing drugs or drinking, are too stoopid for drugs/booze to have a measurable change in their intelligence. drugs don't do much to make folks stoopid. 95% of them were born in that condition.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:45:18 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:52:51 PM EDT
[b]Or maybe it's just that the heavy pot smokers I knew in and after high school were always destined to become burnouts with trouble remembering their home addresses.[/b] most likely the case. i could (but will not) point out many members of the boards that smoked a whole lot of herb back in the '60's and '70's. why...i have it on good authority clinton did inhale and bush snorted and drank his way thru his youth. america! where even drug abusers can go on to become president!!! what a country...eh?!?!
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:54:54 PM EDT
Then why are most of the stoners I know brain dead?
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:03:57 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:05:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MadProfessor: Then why are most of the stoners I know brain dead?
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What he said.....
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:11:19 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:29:43 PM EDT
Duh! In my graduating class at MIT, the top honor winners were myself and my smoking buddies. We got high pretty much everyday, but responsibly, after homework was done for day, and after work. I know plenty of stupid people that have never smoked pot. Pot in itself has nothing to do with intelligence or capabilities to learn. Most of my smoking buddies from college still smoke pot occasionally and have very respected jobs that range from rocket science to medical research to computer design, funny we could manage all that being "burn-outs". I don't know any "burn-outs" as I don't associate with losers in general, but I know plenty of very successful people that smoked pot on a regular basis for over 20 years.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 2:42:03 PM EDT
For all of you that claim all your friends that smoked/smoke are all burnouts, I call BS. You guys either hung out with a crowd that was full of un-motivated losers from the get go (which so happens you are the only one that turned out OK, pfft), or your making shit up about ALL the people you guys know. I know shit loads of people (25 yo) and still hangout with different groups of people just like you would see in high school or college and I'm not just not seeing the same results as you guys. People’s current situations are nothing more then the choices THEY have made. Not a silly plant. My proof of this is in the people I know and converse with. I have burnout friends that do use drugs; I have burnout friends that DON'T use drugs. I know successful and clear thinking people just like myself that use it regularly. I have relatives that are lawyers and other top notch jobs that smoke it as well. When it comes to pot, I think most of you are seeing what YOU WANT to see.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 3:18:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/3/2003 3:28:16 PM EDT by Max_Mike]
For all of you that claim all your friends that smoked/smoke are all burnouts, I call BS.
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No you are full of BS I personal know too many people who have had their lives have ruined by that sh*t. The pot head crowd loves to ignore reality.
[size=3]Regular cannabis users 'at greater risk of mental illness'[/size=3] Regular cannabis users are at greater risk of developing mental illness later in life, according to research. [red]One study found that the risk was seven times higher for heavy users[/red], said Professor Robin Murray of the Institute of Psychiatry in London. Speaking at the Royal College of Psychiatrists' annual conference in Edinburgh, he said: "In the last 18 months a number of studies have confirmed that cannabis consumption acts to increase later risk of schizophrenia. [red]This research must not be ignored[/red]." The findings come as the Government prepares to downgrade cannabis from a Class B to Class C drug next year. Most people caught in possession of a small amount will have the drugs confiscated and receive a reprimand or warning, the Home Office has said. According to a Government fact sheet, cannabis "can cause psychotic reactions amongst individuals with mental health problems", but it does not suggest use of the drug can prompt those problems. For his study, Professor Murray reviewed research in Sweden, Holland and New Zealand. A recent Dutch study of 4,000 people in the general population showed that those taking large amounts of cannabis were almost seven times more likely to have psychotic symptoms three years later. [red]Another study, in 1987, of 50,000 Swedish Army conscripts, found that those who admitted at age 18 to having taken cannabis on more than 50 occasions, were six times more likely to develop schizophrenia in the following 15 years.[/red] Professor Murray said these findings had been largely ignored.
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[url] http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_796035.html[/url]
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 4:30:54 PM EDT
[b]Another study, in 1987, of 50,000 Swedish Army conscripts, found that those who admitted at age 18 to having taken cannabis on more than 50 occasions, were six times more likely to develop schizophrenia in the following 15 years.[/b] yup! that data has GOT to be valid! no refuting THAT with real world expirience...no sir! why hell, most of my friends were 6 times more likely to be schizophrenics. the rest either became manic-deppresives, narcoleptics or went on to successful careers as axe murderers!
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 4:38:15 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Max_Mike:
For all of you that claim all your friends that smoked/smoke are all burnouts, I call BS.
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No you are full of BS I personal know too many people who have had their lives have ruined by that sh*t. The pot head crowd loves to ignore reality.
[size=3]Regular cannabis users 'at greater risk of mental illness'[/size=3] Regular cannabis users are at greater risk of developing mental illness later in life, according to research. [red]One study found that the risk was seven times higher for heavy users[/red], said Professor Robin Murray of the Institute of Psychiatry in London. Speaking at the Royal College of Psychiatrists' annual conference in Edinburgh, he said: "In the last 18 months a number of studies have confirmed that cannabis consumption acts to increase later risk of schizophrenia. [red]This research must not be ignored[/red]." The findings come as the Government prepares to downgrade cannabis from a Class B to Class C drug next year. Most people caught in possession of a small amount will have the drugs confiscated and receive a reprimand or warning, the Home Office has said. According to a Government fact sheet, cannabis "can cause psychotic reactions amongst individuals with mental health problems", but it does not suggest use of the drug can prompt those problems. For his study, Professor Murray reviewed research in Sweden, Holland and New Zealand. A recent Dutch study of 4,000 people in the general population showed that those taking large amounts of cannabis were almost seven times more likely to have psychotic symptoms three years later. [red]Another study, in 1987, of 50,000 Swedish Army conscripts, found that those who admitted at age 18 to having taken cannabis on more than 50 occasions, were six times more likely to develop schizophrenia in the following 15 years.[/red] Professor Murray said these findings had been largely ignored.
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[url] http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_796035.html[/url]
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What, you think I didn't see this article on every news site and read the thread on Ar15.com? We could throw links to articles back and forth all day and it still wouldn't prove a point. I'm telling you of my observations because I know alot of people that smoke pot. Honestly, how many people do you know that smoke?
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 5:00:53 PM EDT
"The researchers found only a "very small" impairment in memory and learning among long-term marijuana users."
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"very small" compared to what??? Why use such vague terms? Is it statistically significant or not? Sounds fishy to me.
"The marijuana users in those 15 studies -- which lasted between three months to more than 13 years -- [red]had smoked marijuana several times a week or month or daily.[/red]"
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Ummm... that's quite a broad spread of useage. I need to see the original research report to see if the methods, analyses and conclusions are valid.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 5:15:34 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 5:30:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/3/2003 5:31:59 PM EDT by TomJefferson]
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 5:56:48 PM EDT
Well, I hate to bust your bubble America but I just graduated Basic in May, 90% of my platoon were at least occasional weed smokers, 50% used harder, and about 30% sold as a living prior to enlistment. I'd say that was about right for my entire company.... If you're going to say that they will either reform or be booted before they make it anywhere in the military, of the ten Drill Sgts, our Jr.Drill had a cocane habit that was obvious to anyone who ever had taken it (the afore mentioned 50%) or been around people who toke it. Our Sr.Drill was what I'd call a regular pot smoker (his office always smelled faintly of weed). The 2nd platoon's primary drill drank like a fish (or rathar was ALWAYS drunk) and openly discussed that he was a pothead in his youth (which lasted into his late 20s...). One of third platoon's drills routinely talked about going home and smoking his paycheck in his hash pipe, although his counter-part wasnt an obvious user. Fourth's senior drill sgt came to graduation reeking of pot and vodka and was very VERY obviously "effected", their other drill was one of the older in the unit having been busted back ranks occasionaly for "hot" piss-tests. Fifth's drills didnt realy bring their problems to work with them, however one admitted freely that he smoked weed now and then, and the other was, on a SFC's paycheck, just divorced, coming from a poor background, driving a Lincolin navigator as well as a brand new $11,000 BMW motorcycle, and dressed like a rap-star on his off-days with gold chains and rings. He also had furnished his own office and had a futon and a 30" plasma screen TV up there. Now what kind of buisness does a guy, working with the people I just listed, do on the side to make enough dough to afford three kids, an ex wife, and all that stuff? Maybe you guys know something I dont about Drill Sgts. Of my immidiet circle, including the Guard unit I'm in, may be 20% of the people I know wont toke every once in a while, and, to add fuel to the fire, they're the guys I go to Masjid with (thats Mosque for you non-hackers). I smoke weed maybe three or four times a year, and never buy my own- as I dont drink alcohol I figure its my one allowed "nasty habit". In the end alcohol and any kind of smoking, weed, tobacco, or otherwise (I smoked a pack of cloves a week once untill my lungs started bleeding) is going to effect you negatively if you do enough of it. I think however that alcohol is a far bigger problem in this country than weed is. I have yet to hear of a weed related rape, or a weed related murder, or a weed related fatal auto accident, I'm sure they happen, just no where near the occurance of alcohol related crimes. Well, I'd better shutup now, before the shotguns come out and people start accusing me of being a no-good dirty sandnigger trying to take their beer away :) (j/k) RG
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 6:22:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 3:36:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/4/2003 3:38:13 AM EDT by TomJefferson]
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 4:13:47 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Searcherfortruth: It doesn't help the brain, that's for sure.[rolleyes]
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Actually, the primary active ingredient preserves nerve cells in the absence of oxygen and, therefore, they are currently testing a number of medical uses for it, including treatment for strokes and exposure to nerve gas.
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 4:14:31 AM EDT
Originally Posted By raven: I know for a fact this isn't true. Long term marijuana use leads to, uh, ummm......I forget. I'm hungry. Anyone up for some nachos?
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Oh god, this is hilarious. I have split a gut all of the ten thousand times I have heard it.
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 4:16:43 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Jarhead_22: Personally observed anecdotal evidence doesn't tally with the results of the study. Or maybe it's just that the heavy pot smokers I knew in and after high school were [b][i]always[/i][/b] destined to become burnouts with trouble remembering their home addresses.
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I knew some burnouts, too. But they were burnouts with or without any chemical help. They were stupid with just about everything, drugs just being one more thing on the list.
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 4:19:02 AM EDT
Originally Posted By MadProfessor: Then why are most of the stoners I know brain dead?
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Because you don't hang around with people like the founders of Apple and Microsoft, Harrison Ford, Kerry Mullis the Nobel Laureate for dna research, etc., etc. Maybe you just have more in common with brain dead people.
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 4:31:37 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Max_Mike:
[size=3]Regular cannabis users 'at greater risk of mental illness'[/size=3] Regular cannabis users are at greater risk of developing mental illness later in life, according to research.
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Note that it says "at greater risk". That is, there is no causality presented. Assuming there is an association, is the association because: 1) Cannabis causes mental illness or; 2) Mentally ill people begin to degenerate a long time before they are officially diagnosed and take drugs because they are trying to alleviate their problems, or; 3) Because lots of people tend to be poly drug users and we are really seeing the effects of use of multiple drugs. But there is also a problem with the association and it is a simple one. According to which estimates you want to believe, perhaps 150 million people in the US alone have used marijuana and millions use it on a regular basis. The numbers are even larger for the rest of the world where the cannabis plant is a common food. We have had almost forty years of experience with large numbers of regular users in the US and we have good research on places like Jamaica, where it is estimated that the average marijuana smoker consumes as much as 28 times what a heavy US smoker does. If the association was anything of real significance, we wouldn't be guessing about it at this point. There would be lots of clear evidence. But, even if it was true, that wouldn't mean that it would be a good justification for making marijuana illegal any more than cihrossis of the liver makes prohibition of alcohol a good idea. For all those who are really interested in reading something on the subject, you can find the full text of the major studies of the subject -- including evaluations of the health effects -- at http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/Library/studies/studies.htm The collection includes the largest studies ever done by the governments of the US, the UK, Canada, and Australia, to mention a few. If you read them all, you will find that they all came to the conclusion that -- even if this allegation was true -- cannabis is not a major threat to public health and criminal laws against it are simply not justified.
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 4:35:08 AM EDT
Originally Posted By TomJefferson: Damn Rebel, this is depressing information. I went through basic in the early 70's when pot was $10 oz and $40-$80lb and could be found on any street corner and never even saw the stuff in basic and we didn't have drug testing. All of my Smokey the Bears, were straight back from Nam and straight as arrows, nuts as hell but straight. I have always thought that it is not right to make anything God makes illegal, however if man modifys it, it's a different story. I play music so to tell you I'm not exposed to weed would be a blatant lie. It's not my choice of recreation but in my house or in basic training, it's not appropriate.
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When I was in the Army 65-69, alcohol abuse was the order of the day -- far worse than anything else both in numbers of guys and severity of abuse. A pretty fair number smoked pot, lots of people experimented a little here and there, and there were quite a few guys with real emotional problems who consumed everything they could.
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 4:44:14 AM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Macallan:
"The researchers found only a "very small" impairment in memory and learning among long-term marijuana users."
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"very small" compared to what??? Why use such vague terms? Is it statistically significant or not? Sounds fishy to me.
"The marijuana users in those 15 studies -- which lasted between three months to more than 13 years -- [red]had smoked marijuana several times a week or month or daily.[/red]"
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Ummm... that's quite a broad spread of useage. I need to see the original research report to see if the methods, analyses and conclusions are valid.
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You can find a ton of that stuff, ranging back 100 years at [url]http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer[/url] See Major Studies of Drugs and Drug Policy at [url]http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/Library/studies/studies.htm[/url]. Nearly all of them discuss this issue. Also see the Cannabis Research Library, listed on the main page of the first link above, which has the full text of a ton of medical journal articles on the subject. Bottom line, they have found a slight association between marijuana use and schizophrenia. They aren't sure why it is there -- whether people susceptible to schizophrenia are made worse by marijuana use, or whether people who are developing mental illness feel themselves slipping and are trying to self-medicate. The research doesn't seem to indicate an increase in the absolute numbers of people with mental illness -- and they probably should if marijuana caused mental illness because we have had tens of millions of users in the US for the past forty years or so. But the numbers of people involved are very low, anyway. There is no indication that this is a problem for the vast majority of users. The biggest study on health of pot users done to date was by Kaiser Health Group. They found no significant difference in the health records of pot smokers versus non-smokers.
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 5:04:39 AM EDT
For every nest of birds, a couple fall out and the cats get them. So what! It's darwanism.
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