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Posted: 7/3/2003 11:33:30 AM EDT
Where is the line drawn in your minds eye that tells you it's time to punch someones lights out. Would you hit someone for a verbal insult against you or your wife/girlfriend? It a given with me that if someone lays a hand it's time to dance no matter where I am. Under other conditions verbal can and has provoked a violent response from me,I'm not proud of that but it's true. So answer up and leave out the "i'd like to punch jrzy out for his posts"
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:36:14 AM EDT
naw, verbal is jus that, a bunch of trash talking. i wouldnt get into a fight over verbal, cause 99% of the ppl that talk shit , ARENT, but i will verbally defend against verbal attacks, now a physical attack, all bets are off. all i gotta say is dont bring a knife to a gun fight. lol.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:36:23 AM EDT
My policy has always been "Retaliation, not Escalation". Words mean nothing. If I am physically threatened I retaliate. Period. I do not engage in a cycle of escalation by back-talking and threatening.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:36:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/3/2003 11:38:16 AM EDT by Hawkeye]
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:40:31 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/3/2003 11:43:55 AM EDT by ANGST]
I'd have to say never. I will try to avoid and/or deescalate the situation until myself of loved one is in danger of their life or grievious bodily harm , then the CCW comes out. I'd never want to fight within arms reach while carrying a gun. And if unarmed I tend to use Aikido which is not violence , its simply helping the attacker get to where he's moving to.... generally the ground.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:40:44 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:41:38 AM EDT
if someone is talking trash, who cares, if they are saying that they are going to lay a hand on me, I ain't waiting to find out if they are still talking trash. It is not time to talk any longer.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:41:56 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Hawkeye: It varies from situation to situation. My wife and children are very VERY touchy things with me. It wakes a lot less to cause physical voilence with me when it comes to them, than it does other things. I take things on a case by case basis. It normally takes quiiiite a bit for me to get physical.
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Hawkeye ,believe it or not for the most part that is me also. If someone says to ones of the guys wives that posted above you , "hey your wife has nice tits" ,are they saying they wouldn't react with any violence?
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:42:18 AM EDT
I haven't been in a fight since high school. Unless someone hits me first I'll do my best to avoid a fight because the legal problems that could arise are not worth it. Hell ya it would be satisfying to punch someone's lights out if they're asking for it. But I like to think of the consequences of engaging in such activity.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:42:49 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Hawkeye: It varies from situation to situation. My wife and children are very VERY touchy things with me. It wakes a lot less to cause physical voilence with me when it comes to them, than it does other things. I take things on a case by case basis. It normally takes quiiiite a bit for me to get physical.
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Ditto that.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:47:17 AM EDT
A quick temper is a sign of poor intelligence. People with tempers can be manipulated by those who have better control of their facilities. "losing it" out of anger, is as dangerous as "losing it" from fear or panic. This being said, a response to a threat is quite different than someone saying that 'they had your mama'. It's my hope that anyone with a concealed handgun permit, does not fall into the hot tempered category.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:47:48 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:48:01 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:52:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/3/2003 11:54:45 AM EDT by BenDover]
A verbal threat of physical violence combined with aggressive movement or body positioning is where I will react in a physical manner. If I fear for the personal safety of myself or a loved one, it's considered assault and I will take appropriate, defensive measures within the confines of the force continuum. EDITED TO ADD: If someone says my wife has nice tits, I will respond with agreement -- because they are nice and they are all mine. I don't get offended by that, I am proud to be with an attractive woman.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:57:39 AM EDT
Originally Posted By DriftPunch: A quick temper is a sign of poor intelligence. People with tempers can be manipulated by those who have better control of their facilities. "losing it" out of anger, is as dangerous as "losing it" from fear or panic.
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I would very much like to see your data proving there is any relationship between people with quick tempers and intelligence, I could show you some of the smartest people I know who have a very short fuse. I would agree with one point you made, if you do not control the anger and let it blind you then you can make some really bad decisions. I use anger as a motivating force and have used peoples own anger against them.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:58:20 AM EDT
Ok, but what if they refered to the President as [red]Shrub????[/red] Egad!
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:59:13 AM EDT
I won't throw a punch or a draw a piece unless my life is in danger. If I can AVOID trouble I will. I like my freedom and rights too much to "sock" some smart-ass in the jaw for telling my wife she has "nice chi-chi's. Before I was married and had kids, sure; i'd pop someone in the mouth for being a jackass or threatening me. Not anymore in this litigious society.Plus, it's just too damn dnagerous.You don't know if he's gonna flip out and cut your head off like a sweet ninja. Plus, in my experience the one's with the biggest bark were also the one's that once you bitch slapped would cry or call the fuzz on you. It's the quiet one's you need to worry about cause his mental wheels are always a churning[%|]
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 11:59:49 AM EDT
Originally Posted By jrzy: ...and leave out the "i'd like to punch jrzy out for his posts"
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You take all the fun out of this, don't you. How about when the JBT looks at my dog wrong? [;)] (just messing with ya - please don't hit me) Seriously - verbal insult receives verbal response (if any). If someone is trying to provoke me, why give them the satisfaction of knowing they got to me? But if someone says anything about glazed eyes and donuts, they get smacked with the ASP!!! (kidding again) CR
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:02:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/3/2003 12:04:40 PM EDT by jrzy]
Originally Posted By BenDover: EDITED TO ADD: If someone says my wife has nice tits, I will respond with agreement -- because they are nice and they are all mine. I don't get offended by that, I am proud to be with an attractive woman.
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Yes my wife also but lets change the argument just a little, Lets say the guy says, "Hey what are you doing with that ugly slut?" Trying to provoke you ,are you gointg to let him insult your wife like that? For me the answer is palin as day.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:03:31 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:05:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By jrzy:
Originally Posted By BenDover: EDITED TO ADD: If someone says my wife has nice tits, I will respond with agreement -- because they are nice and they are all mine. I don't get offended by that, I am proud to be with an attractive woman.
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Yes my wife also but lets change the argument just a little, Lets say the guy says, "Hey what are you doing with that ugly slut?" Trying to provoke you ,are you gointg to hem insult your wife like that? For me the answer is palin as day.
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Since my wife is a classy lady and neither of those it wouldn't bother me. Now, if they said "hey, what are you doing with that classy lady you filthy jew pig?" [:D]
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:05:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/3/2003 12:05:50 PM EDT by The_Macallan]
My father taught me to never hit anyone out of anger unless I was SURE..... ...I could get away with it. [:D]
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:07:12 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SGB: In as much as I am [b]ALWAYS ARMED[/b] I go out of my way to avoid physical altercations.
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I don't think you answered the question posed. Can someone provoke a physical response from you based on a verbal attack on you or your wife?
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:10:31 PM EDT
I believe John Wayne said it best. "I wont be wronged, I wont be insulted." [:)]
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:11:02 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:12:46 PM EDT
Nowadays, I must precisely assess an impending physical threat. Insults are meaningless. Any asshole with a dicksucker can talk shit in an attempt to get me to reach a physical altercation. Being 6"3' and 260 lbs, I rarely attract attention which leads to physical violence. I always keep a cool head and once I am touched, I use the least amount of force to eliminate a threat. Being a long time Jiu-Jitsu student, I can incur legal liabilities if I use excessive force. A cool head prevails against a hot head!
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:21:01 PM EDT
"Hey what are you doing with that ugly slut?"
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your moms genital warts were flaring up again......
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:27:24 PM EDT
I limit myself to only getting violent if someone lays a hand on me. But being only human, that does mean if someone pushes me enough. I would grab thier wrist, and slap myself with it. or something like that. If your going to claim I'm quote "inferior" as some punk with a peach fuzz mustache, made him look like a field mouse btw, then don't bump into me when your walking by...
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:27:33 PM EDT
Well, being that I've seen a lot of violence, I can tell you a sure fact....there is somebody out there that can stomp a mudhole in your butt. If you get in enough fights, you will eventually run into him. What then? I once saw a fist fight, where I'm sure the loser just thought the worse case was he was going to be beaten, turn into an almost-murder. The bigger guy got the little tough guy down on the ground and then proceeded to stomp the crap out of him, ending up by stomping onto his face. He almost killed him. Now, if you had a gun, where do you decide, the fist fight has become a danger to my life. A couple of seconds too late, and it is all over but the crying. I carry to protect my life and my families lives. I will not get in a situation where I may lose my weapon or my ability to use my weapon by getting into a fist fight. Besides, getting mad over an insult and getting in a fight can easily lose you your legal right to carry a concealed weapon. Nope, I'm too old and fat to get into tough guy fights. I will walk away from verbal abuse. I'm not taking a chance of escalation over words. But if you threaten my life or my families lives, .....get ready to meet Jesus.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:30:58 PM EDT
Come on! You are all evading! Forget your wives and kids and consider the ultimate; A guy refers to President Bush as [red]"The Shrub."[/red] Wouldn't you kick his ass then? Maybe even just shoot the bastard?
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:33:05 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:37:31 PM EDT
It's been my experience that those who 'talk' about it, are the one's I least have to worry about......[rolleyes]
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:38:29 PM EDT
Depends if they came for my guns.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:42:00 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:42:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Scottman: Ok, but what if they refered to the President as [red]Shrub????[/red] Egad!
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Originally Posted By Scottman: Come on! You are all evading! Forget your wives and kids and consider the ultimate; A guy refers to President Bush as [red]"The Shrub."[/red] Wouldn't you kick his ass then? Maybe even just shoot the bastard?
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Whats the matter ,you're not having any luck trolling me so you posted this twice?, transparent , but funny.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:45:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By jrzy: Whats the matter ,you're not having any luck trolling me so you posted this twice?, transparent , but funny.
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No, I'm enjoying your non-vindication. Also hoping someone else would point out the absurdity of the notion that someone should get a whack for saying [red]shrub[/red]. [NI]
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 12:51:52 PM EDT
This is really interesting in that the majority of us would prefer not to escalate the situation, or act rashly and kick someone's ass, but to basically avoid violence altogether. I am the same. I'll admit that I'm not much of a fighter and will avoid one if possible. Does that make me a chicken? Some would think so. I don't think avoiding violence makes one a chicken, though. But sometimes we're put into a situation where you are expected to perform or behave a certain way, even if it means violent retaliation. If someone verbally abuses me, big deal. If it is my wife or kids, you can bet I'll say something back. But touch me or anyone in my family, I will react and someone will get hurt (maybe even me, but at least I tried). If threatened with imminent bodily harm, the weapon comes out, hopefully to diffuse the situation and make it worse.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:04:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Scottman:
Originally Posted By jrzy: Whats the matter ,you're not having any luck trolling me so you posted this twice?, transparent , but funny.
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No, I'm enjoying your non-vindication. Also hoping someone else would point out the absurdity of the notion that someone should get a whack for saying [red]shrub[/red]. [NI]
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scottman I don't need vindication for what I believe is the right course of action for me. That's the nice part of being a man, It doesn't matter to me what you or someone does. I was just curious to see what others might do, I tend to think there will be more people of the side of a violent reaction but if not thats OK too. I live my life according to what I feel is right. Thats the other part of being a man, deciding what is the right course of action for you. This thread might hold some surprises for you yet scott. By the way it's nice to try and provoke someone through the computer isn't it. I bet you aren't as brave in real life though.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:12:26 PM EDT
jrzy said: I live my life according to what I feel is right. Thats the other part of being a man, deciding what is the right course of action for you.
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I would only add a slight addition to this: "And be ready to be held responsible for your actions." I would expect that you would agree with this. My only question, as I have asked in other threads like this one is: Are you willing to go to jail for your actions? Are you ready to pay a lawyer a big pile of money? Are you ready to have your family lose their home to pay lawyer bills and bail? If not, don't be so silly brave and rash. Think before you act. Try to consider, "Is it really worth all the grief I'm going to put myself and my family through?" Use your big head. Think. Maybe walking off is a better choice.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:21:30 PM EDT
Well being that (I'm guessing here) you don't have a CCW, I guess YOUR tolerance is lower than MINE, as I let go MANY a thing more now that I have more to lose.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:28:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By BenDover: EDITED TO ADD: If someone says my wife has nice tits, I will respond with agreement -- because they are nice and they are all mine. I don't get offended by that, I am proud to be with an attractive woman.
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What if they say you have great tits?
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:30:15 PM EDT
Originally Posted By jrzy: Where is the line drawn in your minds eye that tells you it's time to punch someones lights out.
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The sixth grade. As an adult it has never been an issue.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:32:31 PM EDT
The punks that start in verbally, are typically idiots trying to get a rise out of you. If I see anything like that going on, I will look at them to assess the threat level, but I will not engage. Words from the kind of human trash that tires to start things are of no concern to me. The only time I will engage is if the justifiable need for deadly force is required, and then I will do what needs to be done. Like HighStrung1 said, when you're big (~6'4" 240lbs), this doesn't really come up much...
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:40:14 PM EDT
There's nothing verbal that would provoke me to physical action other than, "I'm going to kill you!" spoken by a person holding a weapon. Otherwise, once you lay a hand on me, all bets are off. Same applies to MarianLibrarian..though she'd likely shoot his ass herself.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 1:52:53 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Old_Painless:
jrzy said: I live my life according to what I feel is right. Thats the other part of being a man, deciding what is the right course of action for you.
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I would only add a slight addition to this: "And be ready to be held responsible for your actions." I would expect that you would agree with this. My only question, as I have asked in other threads like this one is: Are you willing to go to jail for your actions? Are you ready to pay a lawyer a big pile of money? Are you ready to have your family lose their home to pay lawyer bills and bail? If not, don't be so silly brave and rash. Think before you act. Try to consider, "Is it really worth all the grief I'm going to put myself and my family through?" Use your big head. Think. Maybe walking off is a better choice.
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Yes I have calmed down a great bit in the last ten years and yes I have paid over 10 grand in fines and legal fees for fights I have been in , I was lucky never to have been sued but part of that reason is I was never the one who instigated the incident in the first place. You asked me if I would be responsible for my actions ,yes I always stayed and faced the music, I never ran when the police were on the way ,I stayed right there and explained my side,sometimes I got cuffed and sometimes I didn't. I was lucky enough to have beat most of the charges and the ones that i didn't beat were minor simple assualt with a fine. I just had my disorderly persons record expunged and that was another 25 hundred. Now I have a clean record and do not wish to ever be arrested again (not that I ever wanted to be in the first palce) The arrests were all when I was in my late teens and very early 20's. I was extremely lucky that I never got arrested for any firearm owning disqualifying felony and I understand a great deal more then you think I do about restraint, If I didn't I would surely not be walking around.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 2:08:33 PM EDT
I have a short temper, it don't take much. Insult my wife or kids with them present and you won't be eating solid food for a long time. But I'm not stupid, I won't initiate a physical attack just because of words. What I do is heavily verbally attack and get the other fool to get mad enough to attack me, in which case it's self-defense and then my physical assault begins. Works great and I never get hit anyway, I just wait til they throw a punch or try to push, then do a counter and take it from there. Akido is really fun to know.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 2:17:59 PM EDT
it completely depends on the situation....if its me myself thats taking the verbal abuse...i can usually let it go...but if it were directed at my girlfriend, my mother, or my sister....most likely i'll respond to you w/ a chin check free of charge. i also dont like thiefs or liars....thank you, good night.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 2:25:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/3/2003 2:43:03 PM EDT by KeithC]
Words are just words, in most cases, and I'd just ignore it. If it was something particularly "hot button"ish with me, I'd do my best to discretely provoke *him* into violence first. Sometimes the difference between self-defense and assault is who threw the first punch. Then again, there are such things as "fighting words" - hence the discrete muttering on my part. 45-y-o Soccer Mom Witness: "Well, the first guy said, 'Nice tits' or something but the second guy just stared at him and smiled. I *think* his lips moved but I couldn't tell. So the first guy took a sloppy swing and that's when the trachea landed on my shoe...." [;)] Seriously, something to consider is that sometimes trash talk is actually "interviewing". The smack-talking guy (and/or his unseen partner) might really know what the hell he's doing, is watching for your reactions and gauging your ability and willingness to resist. Don't underestimate your opponent and don't let ego and temper make you an easy target.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 2:58:24 PM EDT
Heh, interesting topic. Here is a conversation I had at work the other day (names change to protect the guilty): John: Those Dell laptops are cool, I'm thinking of getting one. Steve: I can save you some money with my Microsoft discount. John: Oh ya how much of a discount? Steve: (thinking....) Me: Hmm 20 bucks? Enough for a cheap hooker! Jackass: Hey, nobody wants your wife (talking to me). Now, we talk a LOT of trash in the office all in fun, but I thought this really went over the line. I really didn't say anything. After that everybody dispersed, and I followed "Jackass" to his office, and said "If you say anything like that about my wife again, I am going to punch you in the f***ing face" and walked out. I was so pissed. I think my heart rate had doubled.
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 3:11:57 PM EDT
My only threshhold is my own life and my families life in danger. If that happens the perp will have my 45 in his or her face with a triger half depressed. If it comes to that... then the slimeball is without a head. If anything else happens....Ill walk away
Link Posted: 7/3/2003 3:15:02 PM EDT
Originally Posted By jrzy: Where is the line drawn in your minds eye that tells you it's time to punch someones lights out.
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Those faggy 10 speeders or mountain bikers in the road.[:D]
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