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Posted: 6/27/2003 10:01:48 PM EDT
Got a tentative "think you'd be interested in doing a surgical residency in the St. Louis area?" from my attending today. He has a contact there that is looking for someone (starting in a year when I'm done with my Medical year). The location (per Map Quest) is slightly North-Northwest of St. Louis. Not sure exactly where the other hospitals/surgi-centers are located, but the bulk of the work is probably there. I'll visit to do the "meet and greet" sometime soon, but would also like to have some pointers on where to start looking at housing (apartments/townhouses mostly) while I am there. Basic Questions: 1. Guns (Full Auto with C & R License, right?) 2. Traffic (what areas to avoid). 3. Cost of Living. Thanks!!! AFARR
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 10:29:21 PM EDT
I can't stand St. Louis. Perhaps it's because I spent some time at Wash U, or perhaps its because I have an ex gf who lives there & is a dirty, dirty tramp. But either of the 2 above reasons are good enough to keep me away for a long while. Just FYI, if you want to dump a body, head across the river to E. St. Louis. OTOH, taking the beer tour twice a week is fun :)
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 10:36:00 PM EDT
I did basic training in the state of Missouri(pronounced Misery). Colder that a well diggers arse in the winter. Couldn't wait to get the hell out of Dodge.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 5:55:52 AM EDT
I like St.Louis. Mild winters, nice summers. Cost of living is fine. Lots of good places to eat. I shoot at the Arnold gunclub, south of St.Louis, I see full-auto almost every weekend I go out there. Rush hour traffic can be a bitch, but it's no worse than other cities. I think it's a nice area to raise a family.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 6:59:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/28/2003 7:00:58 AM EDT by die-tryin]
[size=4]TORNADOS[/size=4]
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 8:50:38 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 1:50:20 PM EDT
I can't stand St. Louis. I also went to Wash U, and that may have something to do with it. (My class was filled with thousands of Blair Hornstines...) My biggest beef was traffic. 64/40 becomes a virtual parking lot from during rush hour. St. Louis drivers are also quite bad, generally speaking. They're slow, and don't do so well in snow, and rain. The only positive thing that I can say about St. Louis is that there are plenty of good places to eat.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 6:49:10 PM EDT
Tell me which hospital you are considering so I can give you info on the neighborhood; NNW of St. Louis City sounds like DePaul, Christian Hospital Northeast or Northwest, perhaps St. Joseph's in St. Charles. The two largest hospitals in the area are probably Barnes-Jewish and St. Louis University Hospital, but they are west of downtown St. Louis. If you pick where you live wisely, the traffic is tolerable. The weather is, let's say, variable.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 7:05:44 PM EDT
I like to shoot at the Bullseye on Manchester, the Hill has some of the best resturaunts at some of the most reasonable prices you can imagine. If you get to Stagger Lees (the home of rock n roll) on Broadway tell them Ben sent you.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 7:37:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/28/2003 7:38:37 PM EDT by AFARR]
DePaul (but would probably have to go to various other locations during the couple of years). I'm in Chicago right now, so I know of Liberal BS and VERY restrictive gun laws and bad traffic. What about the important stuff: Gun Laws (and Full Auto)? Cost of Living (what's a 3 BR apartment/townhouse run in various areas)?
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 8:09:09 PM EDT
Missouri has much better gun laws than Illinois, but the city of St. Louis has a stupid policy on buying handguns, ask someone who has bought one there lately for details, I've been out of the area for a while now. full auto is ok in Missouri. Cost of living is good, my brother is paying about 650 for a 3 bedroom in the city, and that is on the high end for St. Louis area.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 8:13:20 PM EDT
I am an Illinois resident (Chicago area) and I shot a highpower match weekend last week at the Benchrest Rifle Club of Missouri. This is the finest range I have ever seen. I would consider moving to the St. Louis area just to shoot at this range.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 8:24:16 PM EDT
Benchrest is where my uncle shoots his .50
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 5:41:19 AM EDT
St Louis blows in comparison to KC, but either are better than Chicago as far as traffic & guns. Missouri weather can be screwed up...hotter than hell in summer, bitter cold in winter, etc. Tornadoes, & possible earthquakes (the New Madrid fault is overdue).
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 6:20:24 AM EDT
Originally Posted By AFARR: DePaul (but would probably have to go to various other locations during the couple of years). I'm in Chicago right now, so I know of Liberal BS and VERY restrictive gun laws and bad traffic. What about the important stuff: Gun Laws (and Full Auto)? Cost of Living (what's a 3 BR apartment/townhouse run in various areas)?
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Well, if you're coming from Chicago, you'll think you died and went to heaven.
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 8:02:54 AM EDT
DePaul is located in St. Louis County, not the city (St. Louis city is a special political subdivision in this state and is not part of any county). The location of DePaul gives you a lot of options if you want to live nearby - I-70 and I-370 serve this area, so you can live in St. Charles county for lower cost without killing yourself in a commute. If you were to choose to live in St. Louis county, you should examine the region just northwest of the hospital in Florissant, up on Howdershell or Shackleford Road; this should be reasonably convenient, with a 20 minute commute, but a nice location. There are also some areas just south of the hospital near McKelvey Road that you might like, and I don't know about apartment availabilty there, but you could access the hospital easily without ever dealing with traffic on the interstates. Locations in the nearby north side of the hospital are going to suck when the new runway at Lambert Field is complete - the west end will be almost to I-270, and it will be noisy as hell. I haven't lived in an apartment in a while, but I don't think 3 bedroom apartments are common, so that might dictate where you live; I have an employee that just moved into one, but I know he had to look for a couple of weeks to find it. If you're going to be here a while, with historic low interest rates you ought to buy a modest house with a small mortgage (probably less than rent) and a small yard that is easy to maintain. If you choose a location between Depaul and the Barnes/SLUH/Children's Hospital center (southeast from Depaul), rent prices will increase, dramatically, and to breathtaking levels in some areas. [Barnes and SLUH are located just at the east edge of the St. Louis donwtown region - near Forest Park, US 40, and Grand Blvd.] Guns - we still use pickup gun racks in the civilized regions of Missouri. Missouri has the premier conservation department in the nation - it is supported by a 1/8 cent sales tax that has provided very nice public land and river access all over the state. The Conservation Department is run by a commission that insulates it from the whims of the governor and the state legislature. Cost of Living - low, even in St. Louis county, but lower still elsewhere. Taxes in Missouri are amongst the lowest in the nation - personal property is taxed, real estate is taxed, and income is taxed, but it is fairly well balanced and no single tax is astronomic as in some states. St. Louis city levies an income tax - don't live there. Sales tax averages about 7.25 to 8 percent in the region. Traffic - avoid east bound US 40/I64 eastbound from St. Charles county in the morning rush hour, all the way to St. Louis city. Avoid westbound US 40 to St. Charles county in the afternoon rush. Avoid Manchester Road west of I-270 at all times; there is not a damn thing along there that you can't find elsewhere. Downtown St. Louis traffic sucks; take the Metro Link rail if you want to go to a ball game, concert, or the convention center. Avoid the Poplar St. bridge between St. Louis and Illinois at rush hour. The Weather - the weather can be extreme some years. About the only feature that is a constant is the humidity, and so far this year, that has been low (but look out, we're going to have regular summer weather starting this week). Folks that went to basic training at Fort Wood got would have miserable in almost any winter or summer here. At least we don't get snow piled so deep that it is still melting in June! Recent years have had very mild weather, nothing like it was when I was a kid in SW Missouri. The rivers in the St. Louis region moderate winter weather - most of the snow by passes us to the north and south (and the terrrain just to the south is ~1000 feet higher). Would I live here if my job wasn't here? No, because I don't like densely populated cities. But there is far worse, such as almost any old industrial city east of the Mississippi.[peep]
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 8:32:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/29/2003 8:34:01 AM EDT by The_Flashlight]
I could tell you about central Missouri, since I live in Columbia, but I don't know much about the St. Louis area. We've enjoyed going there to visit on occasion to see Rams and Cardinals games, but that's about it. I've gotten caught in horrible traffic there in the past - but I don't think you're going to find a large metropolitan area that doesn't suffer from bad traffic at certain times of the day. In terms of culture and entertainment, you have 3 professional sports franchises whose stadiums are within walking distance of each other, and most traveling plays and comedians and the like make stops in St. Louis. I don't think it would be a bad place to live.
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 9:38:48 AM EDT
Regarding C3, as David said, no suppressors, but everything else is okay as long as you have a C&R FFL. The MGs don't need to be C&R, you just have to have some type of FFL to own C3, and a C&R qualifies. [url]http://www.csmetall-werkes.com/[/url] Email Jon Shoop or Ken Choate at C&S. They're great guys with a good selection. Their C3 inventory seems to be at an all time low lately, but the first time I walked in there, they had a wall full. Anyway, when you figure out a couple areas you want to live, they can tell you if the Sheriffs/Chiefs will sign off in those areas. I've only been here a couple years, but St. Charles Co. seems to be a lot more friendly, less snobby, and generally the cost of living seems to be a lot less then St. Louis County. Plus the houses and aparts. seem to be a lot newer out there. We got a bit of a shooting community started here from AR15.com members. We usually meet in Columbia every couple months to shoot. As soon as I get the Carbine shoots up and running, I plan to have those every month or so as long as the weather is good. Basically the idea is IDPA with black rifles and very few rules. BTW the weather here is NOT pleasant IMHO.
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 10:05:10 AM EDT
Weather: Humid almost all year 'round. Summers usually in the mid 90's during the day, winters around the mid 30's usually. January and February can have snow and ice, but not as bad as it once was. So, if global warming is a fact, it's a good one for us. The weather is VERY variable. There's a joke here that "If you don't like the weather, wait 20 minutes". This is no joke. We once had a tech in from Modesto California, where they honest to God forecast the weather by the week. When he came in that early December morning it was 55 degree's and sunny. By 3:30 it was 28 degrees, and raining, sleeting, and snowing. Lots of sun in the summer, overcast and gray in the winter. Tornado's, violent thunderstorms, and the New Madrid Fault. The State birds are mosquitoes and ticks. Crime. Downtown, bad (as usual anywhere). Outside downtown, not bad. Missouri is heavy on large lakes and rivers for recreation. VERY heavy on state forests and parks for hunting and hiking. We have a well-funded State Conservation agency, and they build shooting ranges. Guns: Other than some city or county laws, there are few gun laws. To buy a rifle or shotgun, there are no state restrictions at all. For pistols, you go to the county sheriff and apply for a "permit to buy". These are issued during normal business hours, and in many counties, it's a "while you wait" process. Once you have your permit, you pick up the gun at the dealer, no waiting periods. LEGALLY you need a permit to buy even for private pistol purchases. In fact, people do it all the time. At this time, there is NO (0) concealed weapons CCW, unless you're a "duly sworn Law Enforcement officer", (read, an "actual" cop). We're working on this. Open carry depends on where you are, and who you are. I was once told by a Deputy that "concealed" depended on how dark it was. Some rural areas, you won't have any problems if you don't look like trouble, others you'll get trouble. Most areas it's SUPPOSED to be Ok to have a pistol openly carried in a car on the seat or dash. Usually you'll get grief. Cost of living/housing is lower than most big cities. Like them, chose the neighborhood. Downtown is expensive everywhere. Gas is usually cheaper, so is good food. Plenty of good restaurants. "The Hill" is world famous for it's Italian places. A local favorite is Ragazzi's. The best fast food roast beef sandwich in the world is one of the Lion's Choice places. Traffic is bad, just like every large town. Speeds are a little lower than most state's since the Missouri State Police actually ENFORCE the speed laws. Bottom Line: Better than average guns laws, but no CCW. Cheaper living costs, with plenty of affordable and available housing. Lots of things to do, and see. Other than downtown, quiet and conservative. Friendly people who tend to leave you alone.
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 11:48:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/29/2003 11:52:10 AM EDT by GaryM]
What AeroE and Faris said. I would add do not even think of living anywhere near St Louis city proper. St. Louis county is ok in some areas, St. Charles is your best bet. Maybe Jefferson county too. Traffic sux everywhere in the StL area, always some sort of highway construction going on and it ain't gonna stop anytime soon. Cost of living is cheap all the way around. Gas is 1.33 for regular unleaded today. Groceries are reasonable too. Housing keeps going up but isn't that the way it is all over the country? Benchrest rifle club is beautiful, you have to see it to believe it. I am a member BTW and if you want to check it out sometime I can help you there. (That goes for anyone else here too, as long as I can fit the time into my schedule) Umm.. how do I put this.... The StL area is full of... lets say "gravitationally challenged" people. Means nothing if you are from here but visitors have often noticed this at first sight. The worst part of StL is the racism. It is rampant here and not one sided in the least. Once a person realizes the fuel that StL feeds on is racism all the rest makes sense. Crime in north StL is quite well known and according to Morgan Quitno StL has the dubious reputation as the most dangerous city in the USA. (http://www.morganquitno.com/) but that is the city proper, not the county or outlying areas. If you do end up here make sure you have a local guide when going downtown the first few times so you will have an idea where to go and where to avoid. Hmm.. I think I am rambling on here so in a nutshell here is my opinion. Avoid the city proper like the plague. Outlying areas are nice with some being very good places to live/visit. Avoid the city proper like the plague. Outdoorsman type activities/opportunities are some of the best anywhere. Avoid the city proper like the plague. Gun laws with the exception of CCW are acceptable. Avoid the city proper like the plague. Weather is extremely variable, hotter than Georgia in the summer, cold as Maine in the winter. Avoid the city proper like the plague. Good luck! BTW, WashU on your resume carries a lot of weight in the medical field. editted to add; StL is the hometown of teh rapper Nelly if thats helps...
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 3:49:39 PM EDT
*NO GOOD PIZZA*
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 5:00:38 PM EDT
Much GOOD Pizza, in fact, boatloads!
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 2:58:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/30/2003 2:59:37 PM EDT by GoGo]
Originally Posted By AeroE: Much GOOD Pizza, in fact, boatloads!
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LOL- I really hope you can point me to some. I will be there in a few weeks. When I've been there before my transplanted friends have ordered Pizzas just to prove how terrible they are. A bunch of drinking guys neglected to finish it! I have never seen that before anywhere at any price! The best we've come across (delivery-wise) is Domino's (ewwwww). Maybe it's just because we've sampled it all across the USA, while some have remained in one area. New York, Chicago, Detroit- all have some great 'za whether deep dish or great tasting cardboard fare. If there is any new pie chains over there worth a darn, or maybe even a small mom and pop shop with a decent product I'd love to hear some feedback. Edited to say: Is the "boatloads" a hint? Have not been down to the Casinos yet.
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 3:34:52 PM EDT
[img]http://www.imospizza.com/images/home_logo.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 4:45:02 PM EDT
Originally Posted By GoGo:
Originally Posted By AeroE: Much GOOD Pizza, in fact, boatloads!
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LOL- I really hope you can point me to some.
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Talayna's is pretty good - I used to live up near the DeBaliviere location and we'd go fairly regularly. Racanelli's in the Delmar Loop is another good choice. However, the best pizza in the known universe is at Shakespeare's in Columbia. Man, I miss that stuff! JScott ex-Columbia (1983-1990) ex-St. Louis (1997-2000) Sweating it out in Boston, where the chowder is a lot better than the pizza.
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 5:02:49 PM EDT
Dick Gephardt territory [}:D]
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 5:10:33 PM EDT
Saw on the TV today that they had @ 5.5" Rain in an hour. 70 & 170 closed! Lovely! Come across the river sometime. Fast Eddie's is the largest volume distributor of Buttwiper product. Excellent food at cheap prices. Bands on the weekends. See beautiful Alton, Il. Drive up the river road & view the Piasa Bird. I think its good for a laugh!
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 5:47:19 PM EDT
You are going to want to live in Saint Charles, or further west along I70. Avoid East Saint Louis if you value your life. There are several good Free shooting ranges that I really miss. They are free of those range nazi's that have such a problem with rapid fire, doubletaps, exploding targets etc. you can compare the penetration of the .223 vs. the 762x39 on old air conditioners and the like. But don't forget to throw your trash away afterwards. Logan was good, and there was another in Warrington, about 40 min west. The fish/wildlife people can give you directions. Avoid weekends, because it can get busy. On week days, I usually had the place to myself. Friendly people, weather is OK, if you don't mind a little humidity, and some thunderstorms. Cheap real estate. You can afford a mansion for what you pay for a cardboard box in CO, or CA.
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 6:57:04 PM EDT
Originally Posted By BillofRights: you can compare the penetration of the .223 vs. the 762x39 on old air conditioners and the like. But don't forget to throw your trash away afterwards. Logan was good, and there was another in Warrington, about 40 min west. The fish/wildlife people can give you directions. Avoid weekends, because it can get busy. On week days, I usually had the place to myself.
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I hope you aren't refering to Reifschneider. Long story but I did see some idiots get arrested there for shooting at things other than the target stands. Of course they were idiots and in all the times I have been there it only happened once but it did indeed happen. I do however totally concur about places to live. BTW, Mark Twain National Forest, the closest part maybe two hours away, has virtually no rules or regulations on shooting. This means yes to full auto and other sorts of fun. Just use common sense and do not trash the place or endanger anyone else. For more info on what is allowed there contact the Potosi ranger station.
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