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Posted: 6/27/2003 2:03:57 PM EDT
Government Indicts Alleged "Paint Ball" Terrorists 06-27-2003 03:53:PM (Alexandria, VA) -- The U.S. government has indicted a group of Muslim men for allegedly plotting a jihad, or holy war, overseas. The group allegedly conducted "paint ball" training missions in the woods of northern Virginia. U.S. Attorney Paul McNulty said the group "met, plotted and recruited for a violent jihad." He said the group "purchased and distributed weapons and ammunition for this violent jihad." McNulty says the suspects are linked to a violent Islamic extremist group "Laskar-e-Taiba (tie bee uh)." According to McNulty, the group claims to be active in Afghanistan, Chechnya, Kosovo, Bosnia, Kashmir and the Philippines. The extremist group has taken credit for terrorist attacks against India. Most of the suspects live in the U.S. Nine are American citizens. Three are in Saudi Arabia. Copyright 2003 Metro Networks Communications Inc., A Westwood One Company
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 2:18:18 PM EDT
Seems maybe, in times gone by, these would be called "Freedom Fighters, or Kashmiriran "Patriots".. I wonder, if ALL freedom fighters are now "terrorists".. This bust, also sends a message to the Pakistani ISI...
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 2:40:32 PM EDT
Whatever they are called now they are also called "neighbor" because they are all over my home town. More mosques here then Catholic Churches. I sure hope they wont shit where they eat.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:12:47 PM EDT
I wonder how many here are paintballers.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:16:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/27/2003 3:17:18 PM EDT by ARgue]
I also wonder when people here will be rounded up for the crime of being "linked" to some patriot/militia group, or some other Enemy Du Jour, some day. [i]First they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out - because I was not a Jew. Then they came for the communists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a communist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I did not speak out - because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me - but there was no one left to speak out for me. -- Martin Niemoller[/i]
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:18:29 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARgue: I also wonder when people here will be rounded up for the crime of being "linked" to some patriot/militia group, or some other Enemy Du Jour, some day. [i]First they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out - because I was not a Jew. Then they came for the communists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a communist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I did not speak out - because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me - but there was no one left to speak out for me. -- Martin Niemoller[/i]
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Fuck you
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:25:27 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARgue: I also wonder when people here will be rounded up for the crime of being "linked" to some patriot/militia group, or some other Enemy Du Jour, some day. [i]First they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out - because I was not a Jew. Then they came for the communists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a communist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I did not speak out - because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me - but there was no one left to speak out for me. -- Martin Niemoller[/i]
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Since my thread is about to be hijacked I offer this: According to Harry W. Mazal, the exact text of what Martin Niemöller said, and which appears in the Congressional Record, 14, October 1968, page 31636, is: When Hitler attacked the Jews I was not a Jew, therefore I was not concerned. And when Hitler attacked the Catholics, I was not a Catholic, and therefore, I was not concerned. And when Hitler attacked the unions and the industrialists, I was not a member of the unions and I was not concerned. Then Hitler attacked me and the Protestant church — and there was nobody left to be concerned.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:42:54 PM EDT
Raven, lighten up. W_W, thanks for the correction, I appreciate it.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:48:53 PM EDT
someone shot my truck with a paintball gun yesterday. the "paint" wiped off. stupid kids. I wish a had a starter pistol, I would have shot randomly into the bushes (better check the legality first)
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:10:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raven:
Originally Posted By ARgue: I also wonder when people here will be rounded up for the crime of being "linked" to some patriot/militia group, or some other Enemy Du Jour, some day. [i]First they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out - because I was not a Jew. Then they came for the communists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a communist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I did not speak out - because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me - but there was no one left to speak out for me. -- Martin Niemoller[/i]
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Fuck you
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You tell 'em raven!!!! [^] The Supreme court, the FBI, and ATF would NEVER allow that Un-American stuff!!! [}:D]
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:59:50 PM EDT
Its just scared people on a witch hunt. GG Damn Raven, What happened? GG
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 5:13:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/27/2003 5:17:03 PM EDT by raven]
I dont know. Maybe I am crazy, thinking that maybe we should keep an eye on Muslims since you know, when nutcases crashed jets into our cities in Allah's name, Muslims' first concern is how the attacks bear on their public perception....even though they call for rejection of western values and the destruction of America and Israel, egg this kind of anger and action in their mosques, raise money for these terror organizations. Then when we call them on it, they cry about how they're being unfairly singled out. So if I get this CRAZY idea that maybe, just perhaps, Muslims are generally opposed to the United States and call for its destruction, we should keep an eye on them...I am somehow a bigot? I mean, during the Cold War, we kept an eye on the communists. We made sure they were not in sensitive positions. Because their fundamental philosophy was antithetical to what the United States stands for. When I read ARgue's post suggesting that the US is just picking on Muslims as if they are some convenient manufactured "other" to get the public polarized to back the government.....ignoring the multitude of terror crimes committed against the US by Islamic nutcases...it just pisses me off. Especially since it is drawing comparisons of the war on terrorism to Nazism. It just disgusts me. All I can say to someone who thinks like that is "FUCK YOU".
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 5:53:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/27/2003 6:02:14 PM EDT by Imbroglio]
One of those guys who got busted got national coverage on NBC news a while ago about how the feds were harassing him to no end because of his religion. Not only is he a gulf war vet, but his dad who was standing up for him today is a korean war vet. How about the "rocket launcher" b.s. that the feds were going ape shit about that turned out to be flare gun? HAHA! The klintons had the "militia and right wing extremists" and now the bushys have the "muslim extremists". I guess every administration needs a gimick to keep the sheeple in constant fear. It reminds me of an "right wing white supremacist domestic terrorist cell" that the lapd took down about 5 years ago. A group of guys, including a reserve officer, were doing their own ipsc type shooting courses out in the desert and aparently some weenie got all scared. The lapd anti-terrorist unit had them under surveillance and after busting them on b.s. charges had the usual press conference showing all of the guns and ammo confiscated. Well their "white supremacists" turned out to be a group of 5 guys, 3 being chinese.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 6:04:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Imbroglio: One of those guys who got busted got national coverage on NBC news a while ago about how the feds were harassing him to no end because of his religion. Not only is he a gulf war vet, but his dad who was standing up for him today is a korean war vet. ...
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Yeah- his dad started in on that tired ass " he's being picked on because he be black- we done been oppressed by whitey fo o' four hunert years- ya hear me now!!" Fvck 'em both. Wasn't it a black muslim 'war veteran' that fragged the officers in the 101st recently???
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 6:47:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/27/2003 10:50:29 PM EDT by ARgue]
Originally Posted By Only_Hits_Count: Yeah- his dad started in on that tired ass " he's being picked on because he be black- we done been oppressed by whitey fo o' four hunert years- ya hear me now!!" Fvck 'em both. Wasn't it a black muslim 'war veteran' that fragged the officers in the 101st recently???
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[s]Oh, I guess you didn't hear. (Imagine that.)[/s] [s]That "black muslim 'war veteran' that fragged the officers in the 101st recently" with a grenade turned out to part of some love triangle-murdering scheme.[/s] [b][u]Their plan was to make it look like terrorism and blame it on arabs/muslims to hide their true motives.[/u][/b] [s]When that story came out it was ALL over foxnews/cnn, etc.. and it even made me suspicious of Muslims serving in our Armed services. But when all the details finally came out, and there wasn't any "muslim terrorist" involved, it got a lot less press coverage. (I wonder why.) If you do a search, you'll prolly find several threads on the topic. You'll probably also find plenty of outrage and hatred towards Muslims and Blacks in threads when the story first broke. But, IIRC, the when it was found that no real "muslim" or "terrorism" was involved, people here didn't have much to say. Typical. [rolleyes][/s] And to get back on topic, the guys in question were playing freakin' PAINTBALL! Until I see something more concrete than "links" to groups and allegations of "training" for "jihad" [rolleyes] in the woods or at paintball parks, I'll withhold judgement. [Edited to strikeout my incorrect information, and recant my odoriferous bullshit, per Jarhead_22's clarification.]
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 7:16:14 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARgue:
Originally Posted By Only_Hits_Count: Yeah- his dad started in on that tired ass " he's being picked on because he be black- we done been oppressed by whitey fo o' four hunert years- ya hear me now!!" Fvck 'em both. Wasn't it a black muslim 'war veteran' that fragged the officers in the 101st recently???
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Oh, I guess you didn't hear. (Imagine that.) That "black muslim 'war veteran' that fragged the officers in the 101st recently" with a grenade turned out to part of some love triangle-murdering scheme. [u]Their plan was to make it look like terrorism and blame it on arabs/muslims to hide their true motives.[/u] When that story came out it was ALL over foxnews/cnn, etc.. and it even made me suspicious of Muslims serving in our Armed services. But when all the details finally came out, and there wasn't any "muslim terrorist" involved, it got a lot less press coverage. (I wonder why.) If you do a search, you'll prolly find several threads on the topic. You'll probably also find plenty of outrage and hatred towards Muslims and Blacks in threads when the story first broke. But, IIRC, the when it was found that no real "muslim" or "terrorism" was involved, people here didn't have much to say. Typical. [rolleyes] And to get back on topic, the guys in question were playing freakin' PAINTBALL! Until I see something more concrete than "links" to groups and allegations of "training" for "jihad" [rolleyes] in the woods or at paintball parks, I'll withhold judgement.
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No I didn't hear. Who exactly is the 'they' tha wanted to obscure the motives?? Against my better judgement, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. So I still stand by my comment: "Yeah- his dad started in on that tired ass 'he's being picked on because he be black- we done been oppressed by whitey fo o' four hunert years- ya hear me now!!' I tune out when it starts like this. If you have a legitimate complaint, please be able to articulate it. If you're muslim- you're suspect- deal with it. Killed athletes at '72 olymics- muslim terrorists Beruit barracks- 242 U.S Marines killed- muslim terrorists and pretty much [b]every[/b] major terrorist act since then --muslim terrorist. I can list a long litany of horrors- but you get the idea.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 7:24:13 PM EDT
I'm not a Muslim...what do I care? The government could never arrest me unreasonably....our government is too perfect for that.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 7:38:49 PM EDT
One, I am a paintball player and have been since the 80s. Two, this article and the one I read a couple of weeks ago mentioned that they had firearms and ammunition. If I remember correctly some of the weapons were deemed illegal for them. They only played paintball because they thought that may give them idea of combat? If so, they need to be removed from the gene pool.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 7:48:00 PM EDT
[url]http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A43265-2003Jun27?language=printer[/url] Federal prosecutors yesterday announced indictments against 11 members of what they called a "Virginia jihad network" who are charged with training to work with terrorists to fight for Muslim causes in foreign nations. The 42-count indictment, returned by a grand jury Wednesday and unsealed yesterday in U.S. District Court in Alexandria, charges that the men trained with and fought for Lashkar-i-Taiba, a group that is trying to drive India from Kashmir and has been named a terrorist organization by the U.S. government. Federal agents arrested six of the men yesterday in raids in the Washington suburbs and in Pennsylvania. Two were in custody as part of the investigation that began in 2000, and three are living in Saudi Arabia. The men -- including nine U.S. citizens -- face weapons counts and charges of violating the Neutrality Act, which bars Americans or U.S. residents from using force to overthrow a foreign government. "Right now in this community, 10 miles from Capitol Hill, American citizens allegedly met, plotted and recruited for violent jihad," said Paul J. McNulty, the U.S. attorney in Alexandria. "These indictments are a stark reminder that terrorists of various allegiances are active in the United States." There is no evidence that the men were planning attacks in the United States, law enforcement officials said. But the indictment says that the conspirators had "an intent to serve in armed hostility against the United States" and that one of them, Masoud Ahmad Khan, had a photograph downloaded from the Internet of the FBI headquarters building in Washington. The indictment also says that an unindicted co-conspirator told other group members that fighting U.S. troops in Afghanistan "was a valid jihad for Muslims" and that those killed fighting Americans there would be martyrs. Law enforcement officials said that there was no evidence of specific plots to target the FBI building or U.S. troops but that, given the climate since Sept. 11, 2001, they decided to move on the evidence they did have. "It is just no longer sound judgment to have people that you believe have engaged in illegal activity and let them conduct an attack before you do something about it," said Michael E. Rolince, acting assistant director of the FBI in charge of the Washington field office, which led the investigation. "A lot of this is about preemption." One of those charged, Ismail Royer, arrested yesterday at his home in Falls Church, characterized the allegations as baseless during an interview Thursday. He dismissed the discovery of pistols and rifles inside the homes of some group members as insignificant. "Ooooh gosh, they have weapons," said Royer, a former spokesman for such organizations as the Council on American-Islamic Relations and the Muslim American Society. "I really resent the idea that a Muslim with a gun -- he's a threat. A Jew with a gun -- he's not a threat." Just an excerpt, click the link for the full story.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 7:53:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Sniper_Wolfe: I'm not a Muslim...what do I care? The government could never arrest me unreasonably....our government is too perfect for that.
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Ahhh yes, the innocence of youth. How I miss those care free days.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 8:02:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Only_Hits_Count: ...and pretty much [b]every[/b] major terrorist act since then --muslim terrorist. I can list a long litany of horrors- but you get the idea.
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Here are some hard numbers: [img]http://www.state.gov/cms_images/378699.gif[/img] Don't forget to check 2001, and 2002.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 8:16:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARgue:
Originally Posted By Only_Hits_Count: ...and pretty much [b]every[/b] major terrorist act since then --muslim terrorist. I can list a long litany of horrors- but you get the idea.
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Here are some hard numbers: [url]http://www.state.gov/cms_images/378699.gif[/url] Don't forget to check 2001, and 2002.
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Yeah, so what? Unless you show a pie graph with the religions of those making the terrorist attacks, I don't see how your post is relevant to the thread.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 8:45:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/27/2003 8:48:32 PM EDT by ARgue]
The vast majority of anti-US terrorist attacks (i.e., bombings, kidnappings, armed attacks, etc.) occur in Latin America. Maybe that's where Osama and Sadaam are hiding out. Don't you see that there's a huge discrepancy between the rhetoric and the reality of terrorism?
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 9:00:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Only_Hits_Count: ... and pretty much [b]every[/b] major terrorist act since then --muslim terrorist. ...
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Not quite *every* one. Remember this guy? [img]http://www.cyrusproductions.com/Tim%20Mcveigh.jpg[/img] And this? [img]http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/1455000/images/_1457616_okbombap150.jpg[/img] Let's not get too narrowly focused here...
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 9:08:25 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 9:20:55 PM EDT
I'm with Raven. The muslims in this country and around the world aren't doing nearly enough to fight terrorism. Their goal IS to destroy western civilization. Watch them like a hawk.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 9:21:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/27/2003 9:22:57 PM EDT by cc48510]
Originally Posted By ARgue: The vast majority of anti-US terrorist attacks (i.e., bombings, kidnappings, armed attacks, etc.) occur in Latin America. Maybe that's where Osama and Sadaam are hiding out. Don't you see that there's a huge discrepancy between the rhetoric and the reality of terrorism?
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I don't consider the attacks/kidnappings in Colombia to necessarily be Anti-American. FARC, a left-wing communist group, kidnaps and kills for profit. They only taget American Businesses and Businessmen, because we can afford to pay protection/ransom. The only true terror attacks by FARC are directed against the Colombian government/citizens. We are just their cash cow. If FARC needs money for supplies, they attack/kidnap Americans and demand ransom/protection (or traffic cocaine). The Islamists want us dead...FARC just wants our money. That is the difference.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 10:03:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARgue:
Originally Posted By Only_Hits_Count: ...and pretty much [b]every[/b] major terrorist act since then --muslim terrorist. I can list a long litany of horrors- but you get the idea.
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Here are some hard numbers: [url]http://www.state.gov/cms_images/378699.gif[/url] Don't forget to check 2001, and 2002.
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I said [i]major[/i] attacks againt the U.S. You're trying to compare apples and oranges.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 10:06:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/27/2003 10:10:31 PM EDT by Only_Hits_Count]
Originally Posted By DScott:
Originally Posted By Only_Hits_Count: ... and pretty much [b]every[/b] major terrorist act since then --muslim terrorist. ...
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Not quite *every* one. Remember this guy? [url]http://www.cyrusproductions.com/Tim%20Mcveigh.jpg[/url] And this? [url]http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/1455000/images/_1457616_okbombap150.jpg[/url] Let's not get too narrowly focused here...
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I said "pretty much" every... You could also post pics of Janet Reno Slick Willie and Louis Freeh if you want to take that tact. >>Might as well throw Vincente Fox in there as well- Is he helping or hurting the southern invasion??
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 9:08:16 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Aggie1:
Originally Posted By Sniper_Wolfe: I'm not a Muslim...what do I care? The government could never arrest me unreasonably....our government is too perfect for that.
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Ahhh yes, the innocence of youth. How I miss those care free days.
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You do realize I was being sarcastic, right?
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