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Posted: 6/3/2003 2:50:39 PM EDT
just wondering? thanks
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 2:51:42 PM EDT
yup...within specs.
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 2:52:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 3:27:11 PM EDT
anyone settle this?
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 3:52:11 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 3:54:31 PM EDT
I happen to have a box of Winchester Ranger 115 gr 9mm +P+ sitting right here. Let me list what's printed on the box and I'll let you decide. (FRONT) FOR LAW ENFORCEMENT USE ONLY NOT FOR RETAIL SALE PRESSURE LEVELS EXCEED INDUSTRY STANDARDS USE ONLY IN PISTOLS (BACK) Do not use in Uzi firearms. These cartridges are loaded to specifications that require higher velocity and pressure than conventional 9mm Luger cartridges. Average pressure is 20-25% higher (approx 40,000cup) than industry standard pressure for 9mm Luger.
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 3:59:16 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Troy: SAAMI specs include ONLY 2 instances of "+P", and NO instances of "+P+". The two +P loads that have SAAMI-approved limits are .38Spl +P and 9mm +P. Anything beyond those pressures, or beyond standard SAAMI pressures in any other caliber, are over and above SAAMI limits. Pretty straightforward. -Troy
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Ahem, .45 +P, ?
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 4:56:38 PM EDT
sammi is just a bunsh of freaking lawyers. no disrespect to the fine counselors on this board. TXL
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 5:04:00 PM EDT
SAAMI serves its purpose. Think of it as minimum requirement of chamber pressure for firearm makers to keep in mind when they design their wares. Some designs are stronger than others, thus, they can withstand higher chamber pressures. The tricky part is determining which designs are to be considered adequate.
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 5:06:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 5:26:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/3/2003 5:27:57 PM EDT by skullworks]
Originally Posted By Johninaustin: (BACK) Do not use in Uzi firearms.
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Hmmm, not arguing, but I find it interesting that the 9mm ammo we use in our Glocks and submachineguns (the kpist m/45B - otherwise known as the "Swedish K,") the m/39B, is classified as +P+, and deemed armorpiercing by the U.S. Army. [:\]
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 5:52:19 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 5:58:55 PM EDT
[url]www.handloads.com/misc/saami.htm[/url] ??? .45 ACP +P, 23,000 PSI Is this wrong? 9mm +p+ is a "non-standard" designation.
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 7:27:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Johninaustin: Do not use in Uzi firearms.
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What is the reason for not firing them out of Uzis?
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 7:40:56 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 7:48:14 PM EDT
Originally Posted By shotar:
Originally Posted By warlord:
Originally Posted By Johninaustin: Do not use in Uzi firearms.
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What is the reason for not firing them out of Uzis?
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Fear of KABOOM
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I thought those sub-guns and its semi-auto cousins are supposed to be super strong and blow-up proof. Boy that is news to me.
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 8:46:14 PM EDT
SAAMI does not create, SAAMI only defines. Much like a (misunderstood) dictionary, it descibes a past use, it does not limit a future (or current) use. Wildcatters develope a round, then SAAMI codifes it. SAAMI did not develope +p in 9mm, SAAMI described and codified it after the fact. The commonly understood definition of "+" is +10%. So +p is SAAMI+10%, +p+ is SAAMI+10%+10% or 1 x 1.1 x 1.1=1.21. For 9mm; 35,000 x 1.1 x 1.1 = 42,350psi. SAAMI is important, but like the French controlling SI units, ISO900x, CE mark definitions, it sometimes stinks.
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 6:15:16 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Troy:
Originally Posted By skullworks: is classified as +P+
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Classified by whom?
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SAAMI
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 6:56:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/5/2003 3:15:16 PM EDT
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