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Posted: 6/1/2003 2:41:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/1/2003 4:41:34 AM EDT by go0n]
I don't think it's fair to label all the palestinian people as terrorists. Here are the five main keys to the palestinian people 1.) Arafat - FUCKING IDIOT! 2.) the palestinian people - scared and defenseless 3.) Hamas and Fatah - extreme psychopaths who were molested as babies 4.) palestinian militia/militants - they're on the sidelines. They're armed but they're constantly getting the shit kicked out of them. They're always there to fight the israelis every time they invade. They're efforts are good but usually in vain. They're about as annoying as a fly buzzing in someone's ear. 5.) Israel - a country that refuses to quit tyranizing the palestinian PEOPLE in response to what Arafat, Hamas and Fatah are doing. It uses collective punishment and murder/genocide as its means of enforcement. Think of this situation as something similar to what would happen with the US. Arafat - whoever is president of the US. Palestinian People - us. the american commoner hamas/fatah - KKK/Nazi Parties and all that bullshit. they've resorted to terrorism. etc..... then there's the UN that's constantly bitching at the US and would soon in the future, use it's own troops on American soil.(hey the way things are going, it might happen). Now imagine yourself in that situation and there's a whole bunch of other countries out there who arent under UN influence and they're watching and criticizing from what they hear on TV. No one cares or if they do they refuse to help and you're left there defenseless. The only groups that are doing anything are hateful groups like the KKK and Nazi Party. They're going around recruiting suicide bombers or whatever. So it's either help fight by their side and get some money to your family to help them get out or just sit there and be one of the many to perish in poverty and fascism. So you join, and what you know about the outside world is next to nothing because of government information control. You join thinking this is your chance to help free people and it's the only group that'll do anything. Remember you were born in this kind of environment. You weren't born free. So you don't know anything about the past lives of previous palestinians/americans. Just a thought as to how brainwashed some would be. and how helpless and scared. But that's just me. People resorting to join hamas/fatah because it's the only place to get a gun and to actually resist what fascists are out to get you. Or you could join the local militia, groups that are constantly getting slaughtered etc. Chances are you'd die the first day even though it's a righteous group. While the Nazi/hamas/fatah/KKK parties are evil and sadistic, they are more financed and better trained and they prey on the lack of information flow in palestine to trick people into joining them. "Here go blow yourself up and we'll give your family 30,000 so they can get out of palestine". That's basically the drill. Helpless and desperate but no other country wants to help because no other country cares. It doesn't look at the situation piece by piece. It doesn't bother looking that most palestinians are not evil militants. But those countries don't give a shit. It's just entertainment for them on the sunday night news. So you're left in the dark helpless and desperate willing to do ANYTHING to get your family to safety. Think about it. P.S. and YES the palestinians WERE driven from their land and harshly abused by both israelis and the british. I await your hateful replies.....
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 2:59:50 AM EDT
I think you forgot to cut-n-paste number 5. CHRIS
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 3:09:12 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/1/2003 3:13:57 AM EDT by go0n]
hmmmmm just realized I never typed it and now I Can't remember what it was... =x now I remember. number 5 was the palestinian militants/militia (no not the hamas and fatah) these are the guys you see shooting aks at the israelis when they invade the west bank.. and no most do not have connections to hamas and fatah and do NOT carry out suicide attacks. most, but of course there are always a few rotten apples. you can compare them to our local militias. with our local militias' bad apples being the OK city bombers or the KKK type nazi assholes. etc
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 3:36:51 AM EDT
Last time I looked the Jews were there 1ST.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 3:49:32 AM EDT
Let me see now, Palestenians, weren't they the group of people celebrating 9/11? Aren't they the people that have their teenagers set bombs off in shopping centers and restaurants? Aren't they the group of people that their fellow Arabs don't even want? You can support them all you want. It's pretty fashionable for people to be anti-Jewish/anti-American these days. Fashionable, but stupid.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 3:56:19 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 4:12:28 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Fuzzybunny: Let me see now, Palestenians, weren't they the group of people celebrating 9/11? Aren't they the people that have their teenagers set bombs off in shopping centers and restaurants? Aren't they the group of people that their fellow Arabs don't even want? You can support them all you want. It's pretty fashionable for people to be anti-Jewish/anti-American these days. Fashionable, but stupid.
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you think I support them out of fashion? I don't care what other people think of me. Hence what fashion usually is. If I did care what people thought of me I don't think I'd be going around advertising I support palestinians. And when I say they were forced off their land I mean that they were forced off their land by force from the israelis. Yes violence was used by extremist Palestinians, but the israelis then used military equipment and extreme force to push(LITERALLY) civilians into the ocean. Collective punishment. ILLEGAL and no better than what the palestinian extremists did. That started the war. Blaming the whole bunch for the actions of a small group of bad eggs...... So in essence the israelis are in the wrong and they essentially started the whole thing. Had they not used collective punishment the palestinians probably wouldn't be in israel anymore. Most would prolly have headed to Jordan and the remaining obssessed would most likely have not lasted long against the israelis.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 4:19:10 AM EDT
REGARDLESS THEY ARE ALL WORTHLESS WOMEN AND CHILDREN INCLUDED. REMEMBER THE 9/11 DANCES THE ENTIRE GROUP SHOULD BE WIPED OUT EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 4:23:27 AM EDT
Israel - a country that refuses to quit tyranizing the palestinian PEOPLE in response to what Arafat, Hamas and Fatah are doing.
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Yeah, I agonize over it every time the Israelis seen in a kid with a bomb strapped to chest to kill innocent Palestinian PEOPLE. Eddie
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 4:26:15 AM EDT
The palestinians target INNOCENT civilians who have nothing to do with the war. That is unforgivable. What possible targets are discos and pizza restaraunts? Geezus, some people.....
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 4:32:23 AM EDT
GaryM obviously you read none of my first post so I won't even bother commenting on that.... stupid democrat blind with rage: "ooooooh those gun owners. they're all the same! THEY SHOOT UP SCHOOL YARDS CONTINUALLY!!"
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 4:38:09 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 4:43:44 AM EDT
http://www.mfa.gov.il/mfa/go.asp?MFAH00pp0 nothing to abridge the civil liberties of the palestinians. well gee whiz, I guess things went off the cliff there eh?
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 4:46:26 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 4:52:18 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 4:59:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/1/2003 5:03:01 AM EDT by go0n]
I think who I'm talking to is relatively obvious. [soapbox] You, however, OBVIOUSLY don't have the intelligence to figure it out and how you've managed to hold up in arguement so far is beyond me. You sure you don't have someone sitting behind you? [pissed] [argue] [50]
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 5:17:26 AM EDT
First of all, there is no such thing as a Palestinian. They are Arabs. If you think otherwise, you truly know nothing of history and therefore you are wasting your time and ours. Secondly, the Jews have lived on that land since before there was any such thing as Islam, by at least a thousand years. Maybe you should do a little "human shield" volunteerism. I hear they need a few good bulldozer blockers these days. Go away.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 5:29:30 AM EDT
until the jordanians took over..... and then the "palestinians emerged from there when they wanted the land" jordan still held LEGAL ownership to it but in other sense they basically abandoned it. The land was nothing more than simply recognized as part of jordan by other countries. as far as jordan was concerned in itself they could have cared less. It was populated by the "palestinians" and then the jews came into place which got really irritating for them.... and things progressed from there... so if there's no such thing as a palestinian then there's really no such thing as an american because during the revolution america was still recognized as part of britain officially. "NEW" england. =x so take your bulldozer and shove it.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 5:34:53 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 5:45:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/1/2003 5:48:30 AM EDT by gus]
You might also want to consider that there are MANY Arab citizens of Israel that are not calling themselves Palestinians, are not killing innocent civilians, and are not in any way being oppressed by the Israelites. How is it that they can live, work, and succeed in Israel but the terrorists cannot? The fact that you refer to Arafat as an idiot proves you know nothing of the situation. Arafat is a terrorist, plain and simple. That makes him evil, not an idiot.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 5:52:18 AM EDT
You, however, OBVIOUSLY don't have the intelligence to figure it out and how you've managed to hold up in arguement so far is beyond me. You sure you don't have someone sitting behind you?
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Opps! Losing the debate; revert to name calling. That's tactic number one in the liberal's handbook. Eddie
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 5:54:44 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 7:32:00 AM EDT
[img]http://photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/IG_LoadImage.asp?iImageUnq=9229[/img]
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 7:44:22 AM EDT
goOn, you might want to loosen the rag on your head, it's probably wrapped too tight. [rolleyes] What a crybaby, Land and peoples have been conquered since the dawn of time. They don't deserve to have a "palestinian state" nor recognition as a legitimate nation because they don't have the ability to fight for it and hold on to it. I know it hurts the feelings of you poor crybabies, but to the victors go the spoils. I bet you would like every nation that exists today that occupies conquered land to just give it back, after all thats the kumbaya thing to do. Freakin whiny crybabies. [>(]
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 7:52:39 AM EDT
go0n, Do you realize most Palentinians would like nothing more than to kill you?
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 7:52:53 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 7:56:26 AM EDT
they had a chance to live in peace, but they and other arab countries decided to try and kill the Israelis, and they all got their asses kicked, the palestinian people are full of hate, they won't be happy until all Israelis are dead/driven from the THEIR land. add to that their hate for America/support for al quaida/hussein and you've got a prime candidate for "liberation"
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 7:59:43 AM EDT
Originally Posted By go0n:
Originally Posted By Fuzzybunny: Let me see now, Palestenians, weren't they the group of people celebrating 9/11? Aren't they the people that have their teenagers set bombs off in shopping centers and restaurants? Aren't they the group of people that their fellow Arabs don't even want? You can support them all you want. It's pretty fashionable for people to be anti-Jewish/anti-American these days. Fashionable, but stupid.
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you think I support them out of fashion? I don't care what other people think of me. Hence what fashion usually is. If I did care what people thought of me I don't think I'd be going around advertising I support palestinians. And when I say they were forced off their land I mean that they were forced off their land by force from the israelis. Yes violence was used by extremist Palestinians, but the israelis then used military equipment and extreme force to push(LITERALLY) civilians into the ocean. Collective punishment. ILLEGAL and no better than what the palestinian extremists did. That started the war. Blaming the whole bunch for the actions of a small group of bad eggs...... So in essence the israelis are in the wrong and they essentially started the whole thing. Had they not used collective punishment the palestinians probably wouldn't be in israel anymore. Most would prolly have headed to Jordan and the remaining obssessed would most likely have not lasted long against the israelis.
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Bla, bla, bla, Palestinians bla, bla, the Jews. It is the same old tired argument. Take the next leap of faith and with the help of revisionist history, you can blame the Pilgrims for all the evils of this country.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 8:40:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/1/2003 8:41:57 AM EDT by gus]
Originally Posted By go0n: so if there's no such thing as a palestinian then there's really no such thing as an american because during the revolution america was still recognized as part of britain officially. "NEW" england. =x so take your bulldozer and shove it.
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Two points here: The Patriots here won, the Arabs there didn't. Also, the Patriots of the American Revolution didn't go around attacking English civilians, avoiding contact with the English military. Your understanding of historical facts is almost as dismal as your grammar and writing ability.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 9:10:20 AM EDT
I support the Palestinians' right to a state but not the campaign of terror against civilians inside Israel. Hamas, Fatah, Islamic Jihad and all the other terrorist orginizations should be hunted down and exterminated. Everything in the Occupied Territories is far game however; if the Isrealis don't want to be attacked in the West Bank or Gaza they shouldn't build homes on land that isn't theirs.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 9:13:50 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Kroagnon: I support the Palestinians' right to a state but not the campaign of terror against civilians inside Israel. Hamas, Fatah, Islamic Jihad and all the other terrorist orginizations should be hunted down and exterminated. Everything in the Occupied Territories is far game however; if the Isrealis don't want to be attacked in the West Bank or Gaza they shouldn't build homes on land that isn't theirs.
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The occupied territories are occupied because the Israelies took that land from countries that attacked them. As far as I'm concerned, all that land now belongs to Israel.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 9:20:05 AM EDT
You can be anti-jew all you want. You look foolish supporting the non-existant palastinians as an outlet for your infantile bigotry. Please remember, there is no country palastine, and even though they were offered a country, they turned it down. And how can you say that Israel is the ones causing the problems, there are 1 billion arabs, and 6-7 million Jews there? Who's the problem? TXLEWIS
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 9:20:32 AM EDT
Originally Posted By gus:
Originally Posted By Kroagnon: I support the Palestinians' right to a state but not the campaign of terror against civilians inside Israel. Hamas, Fatah, Islamic Jihad and all the other terrorist orginizations should be hunted down and exterminated. Everything in the Occupied Territories is far game however; if the Isrealis don't want to be attacked in the West Bank or Gaza they shouldn't build homes on land that isn't theirs.
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The occupied territories are occupied because the Israelies took that land from countries that attacked them. As far as I'm concerned, all that land now belongs to Israel.
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Yes, there was a war, which the Arabs lost (all of them). There was also a peace agreement which stated that Israel would stop building settlements on occupied Palestinian land (the Oslo Occords). Israel continued to violate that agreement and the Palestinians had enough, so they started throwing rocks. The IDF thugs responded in their usual heavy-handed way by killing the protesters. So begins the Second Intifada.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 9:20:34 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Kroagnon: I support the Palestinians' right to a state but not the campaign of terror against civilians inside Israel. Hamas, Fatah, Islamic Jihad and all the other terrorist orginizations should be hunted down and exterminated. Everything in the Occupied Territories is far game however; if the Isrealis don't want to be attacked in the West Bank or Gaza they shouldn't build homes on land that isn't theirs.
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Then following your "logic" every nation that now sits on what was once someone elses land should get out and give it back because it really "isn't theirs". Yea, ok , whatever......... Freakin crybabies. [>(]
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 9:21:18 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 9:24:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: Then following your "logic" every nation that now sits on what was once someone elses land should get out and give it back because it really "isn't theirs". Yea, ok , whatever......... Freakin crybabies. [>(]
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Israel signed an agreement with the Palestinians to stop building settlements on occupied Palestinian land, and the existing settlements to be either dismantled or other Israeli land given to Palestinians as compensation. They have done neither. If they had no intention of abiding with the Oslo Accords, they shouldn't have signed it.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 9:35:32 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 9:38:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Kroagnon:
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: Then following your "logic" every nation that now sits on what was once someone elses land should get out and give it back because it really "isn't theirs". Yea, ok , whatever......... Freakin crybabies. [>(]
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Israel signed an agreement with the Palestinians to stop building settlements on occupied Palestinian land, and the existing settlements to be either dismantled or other Israeli land given to Palestinians as compensation. They have done neither. If they had no intention of abiding with the Oslo Accords, they shouldn't have signed it.
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Ok, who's the pali in charge this week ?? How do you deal with something that doesn't exist ?? How do you deal with a group who's only goal is to see ALL OF YOUR PEOPLE DEAD !!! Why should Israel deal with terrorists at all ?? IMO, they are being VERY patient and VERY nice in dealing with these terrorists, maybe too patient and nice.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 9:42:38 AM EDT
Originally Posted By gus:
Originally Posted By Kroagnon: I support the Palestinians' right to a state but not the campaign of terror against civilians inside Israel. Hamas, Fatah, Islamic Jihad and all the other terrorist orginizations should be hunted down and exterminated. Everything in the Occupied Territories is far game however; if the Isrealis don't want to be attacked in the West Bank or Gaza they shouldn't build homes on land that isn't theirs.
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The occupied territories are occupied because the Israelies took that land from countries that attacked them. As far as I'm concerned, all that land now belongs to Israel.
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Am I anti-jew if I think this is BS? Which country owned the occupied area? Tell me if Im wrong but when Israel was attacked they were attacked from those areas which werent Jordan or Egypt. The folks that did live there ran when the fighting started and they are the refugees that are now attacking Isreal.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 10:07:51 AM EDT
Originally Posted By go0n: Think of this situation as something similar to what would happen with the US. Arafat - whoever is president of the US. Palestinian People - us. the american commoner hamas/fatah - KKK/Nazi Parties and all that bullshit. they've resorted to terrorism. etc..... blah blah...
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Yes, because there is no moral difference between us and them. [rolleyes] I forget the numbers, but it is well over half the Palestinians support suicide bombings on Israeli civilians. In America, we would never have half the population supporting KKK/nazis, as you seem to think. The Palestinians cheered on 9/11. Since you cheer them, I assume you must have cheered as well.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 10:08:40 AM EDT
I am one very anti-semetic, and come on, no one will change their minds, keep in mind who you are talking to, the baby boomers are afraid of everything, and are fed information by their jewish controlled televisions. I have a solution, we put all of the jews in kalifornistan, and let the Palestinians have Palastine. Kalifornistan already has many of the same attributes, antigun legislation for everyone but the people making the laws, large amounts of homosexuals, and you can't forget the highly oppresivefeeling towards the Palestinians. P.S.-Moderator, please don't ban me, inplace, give that Frankie guy his wish and ban him.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 10:12:58 AM EDT
Originally Posted By hkump45: I am one very anti-semetic, and come on, no one will change their minds, keep in mind who you are talking to, the baby boomers are afraid of everything, and are fed information by their jewish controlled televisions. I have a solution, we put all of the jews in kalifornistan, and let the Palestinians have Palastine. Kalifornistan already has many of the same attributes, antigun legislation for everyone but the people making the laws, large amounts of homosexuals, and you can't forget the highly oppresivefeeling towards the Palestinians. P.S.-Moderator, please don't ban me, inplace, give that Frankie guy his wish and ban him.
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They don't call it DOPE for nothing. [%|]
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 10:22:52 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 6172crew:
Originally Posted By gus: The occupied territories are occupied because the Israelies took that land from countries that attacked them. As far as I'm concerned, all that land now belongs to Israel.
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Am I anti-jew if I think this is BS? Which country owned the occupied area? Tell me if Im wrong but when Israel was attacked they were attacked from those areas which werent Jordan or Egypt. The folks that did live there ran when the fighting started and they are the refugees that are now attacking Isreal.
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Are you saying that the West Bank and Gaza were a country called "Palestine", and that the attacks from Jordan and Egypt came through this country? I need to see it on a map...
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 10:34:20 AM EDT
Originally Posted By gus:
Originally Posted By 6172crew:
Originally Posted By gus: The occupied territories are occupied because the Israelies took that land from countries that attacked them. As far as I'm concerned, all that land now belongs to Israel.
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Am I anti-jew if I think this is BS? Which country owned the occupied area? Tell me if Im wrong but when Israel was attacked they were attacked from those areas which werent Jordan or Egypt. The folks that did live there ran when the fighting started and they are the refugees that are now attacking Isreal.
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Are you saying that the West Bank and Gaza were a country called "Palestine", and that the attacks from Jordan and Egypt came through this country? I need to see it on a map...
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Me too. Are you saying that the gaza and the west bank were Jordan or Egypt?
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 10:36:37 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 10:42:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/1/2003 10:43:41 AM EDT by IDFM_203]
I was very hesitant to respond here, for what we have here is not an intellectual debate on the issues but more like a total fabrication of the historical facts that some of you are continuing to spew on to this great site. I am only responding for I do love this site and I hate to see it sometimes be hijacked by morons that have a very limited understanding of history. There are two types of liars in this thread. First there are the ones who totally out of the blue come up with historical fallacies in which I choose not to even indulge them in a meaningful response. An example of this would be a post where it was written by go0n that the Jews pushed some of the Arabs literally into the sea. Its such a laughable quote that it just makes anything else come out of his mouth seem myopic and ridicules. I feel that you should not even waste your time here on this forum for you bring no intellectual ideas or thought to this debate. Then there are people who I don’t feel are doing it intentially but are more likely to be misguided in the facts by the same liberal media that exist here, yes the same media that said all the “horrible things” that the u.s. were doing in Iraq. There was this one post where it said that the Israeli army responded to mere rock throwing (which by the way also kills) by using brute force. This is factually untrue and unlike the liberal media that you relied on for your false view I was actually there. YES I AM AN FORMER ISRAELI SOLDIER WHO WAS IN UNIFORM AT THE START OF THE INTIFADA. (I JUST FINNISHED SERVING ABOUT A YEAR AND A HALF AGO). I remember the first day, we were behind a wall and being shot at by Palestinian gunman(yes the same ones that you falsely say were using only rocks) who were using kids as human shields. The heavy handed response we used was to wait for hours and to not respond until our lives became in immediate danger and only then did we do what any other (well any other country would not do what we do but likely would do what the u.s. did in Afghanistan and just bomb the shit out of them) soldiers or army would do, and respond to defend our lives. I could go on and on with stories of how much restrained the Israeli army really is. I just end off with one story to illustrate the danger that we faced and the resulting liberal media spinning it, in their anti Israel favour . In July 2001 my unit was posted by ramallah . I remember it was a Friday and my patrol was stationed at “tzomet ayosh” (ayosh junction). What happens is usually on Fridays after the population goes to the masques and they hear their usual sermons of “idbach el yehud” (Arabic for death to the Jews) they then pour out of the masques and make their way towards that junction which is right by beit el. And they throw stones and the like. So we are standing there, just three jeeps facing hundreds if not thousands of angry people. We were there for about a half of an hour, just standing there while they were throwing stones and empty bottles. We did not respond. Then there started to be shooting, this went on for about ten minutes, only then did we respond with first rubber bullets then with live bullets, all directed from where the fire was coming from. After a short while the crowd dispersed and that was it. I get back to the base and I see on bbc the reporter is saying that today he was at this junction where he witnessed Israeli forces firing at Palestinians. That is how he put it. He did not mention that we were there for about an hour and then there was shooting from their side and only then did we respond. No wonder the world hates us. With reporting like that I have become to feel that they are as culpable as the terrorists. I end off with just one question to the remaining doubters of the truth on this site. Forget my biblical reasons or the other great responses that have rightly corrected some of your false historical assumptions....... If its a fact that a majority of the Palestinians want to destroy Israel so they can have a "right of return" what good is it to leave the territories when after that, they will just continue to fight from these new borders. (With missiles that can now hit tel aviv and using more suicide bombers)????????????
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 10:50:16 AM EDT
Why don't they sell dem golden palaces and helps dem poor Palestinian peoples. [url]http://www.alshindagah.com/janfeb2002/the_chairman_s_message.html[/url]
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 11:48:06 AM EDT
[url]http://www.infoclick.org/conflict.html[/url]
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 11:53:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/1/2003 2:17:12 PM EDT by Lumpy196]
What helpless,scared Palestinians are capable of: [img]http://masada2000.org/Busbomb2.JPG[/img] Fuck 'em, and everyone that looks like 'em.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 11:56:36 AM EDT
Originally Posted By rogerdodger: [url]http://www.infoclick.org/conflict.html[/url]
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Pretty well sums it up, I'd say.
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 12:03:15 PM EDT
So, will goon come out and play again?
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