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Posted: 5/22/2003 3:11:11 PM EDT
HK, USP, Compact, .45 Who's got one? Who likes it? hates it? What's the going rate new? used? Accuracy? Reliability? Concealability?
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 3:13:28 PM EDT
I've got a Compact .40 and it's never given me any trouble. It's easy to conceal under a long shirt or light jacket if your frame allows. I'm looking to step up to the full sized .45 in the next few months.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 3:21:13 PM EDT
"Universally Shitty Pistol" ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Well, there's your first ill informed, ignorant assumption right off the bat. I have the USP.45 in compact and fullsize. IMO, there is no finer pistol made. [b]Accuracy[/b].....out of the box, dead nuts on and as good as some high dollar 1911's I've shot. Extremely accurate for a service pistol. [b]Reliability[/b].....Niether one of mine have had so much as a hiccup in the thousands of rounds through them. [b]Concealability[/b].....This is a relative question because many people consider these larger than average pistols and harder to conceal. I have used both in that capacity with no problems. They are my favorites out of the many, many I have owned and shot.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 3:34:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: "Universally Shitty Pistol" ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Well, there's your first ill informed, ignorant assumption right off the bat. I have the USP.45 in compact and fullsize. IMO, there is no finer pistol made. [b]Accuracy[/b].....out of the box, dead nuts on and as good as some high dollar 1911's I've shot. Extremely accurate for a service pistol. [b]Reliability[/b].....Niether one of mine have had so much as a hiccup in the thousands of rounds through them. [b]Concealability[/b].....This is a relative question because many people consider these larger than average pistols and harder to conceal. I have used both in that capacity with no problems. They are my favorites out of the many, many I have owned and shot.
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What He Said!!
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 3:38:44 PM EDT
Gee Normy, what make you think it is a "Universally Shitty Pistol".
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 3:39:05 PM EDT
I had one and switched to a Glock. I don't think it's bad but I have some beefs: 1) The control levers on the V1 can be challenging if you have proper technique, i.e., ride the safety. If you do so you can engage the decock by pushing to hard, in which case the gun won't operate. Very bad and scary if you need it. 2) It's a little big. 3) Otherwise well made and reliable, the latter of which is very important. The 1911 style should avoid problem one, but in that case why not get a Kimber.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 3:50:26 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: "Universally Shitty Pistol" ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Well, there's your first ill informed, ignorant assumption right off the bat.
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Don't go flying off the handle now, I meant it as a joke. One of my old friends, who carried AT LEAST one of them almost daily called it that and I thought it was a funny joke. It looks to be about the same size as my Glock 19, but holds 8 rounds of .45. Weight for me is a big concern in a carry piece, and it looks to be lighter than the aluminum frame 1911's. Thanks for the input so far guys.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 3:58:25 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:03:38 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:04:10 PM EDT
After many misadventures with my colt defender, I sold it and bought a USP in .45. All I can say is: It kicks ass It never jams It's way more accurate (I know the barrels longer...) Colt won't have to listen to be bitch anymore. [:D]
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:04:52 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:15:01 PM EDT
I guess you could say I'm a fan..I have three. The USP .45 Tactical, 45C, and 9C. It's a hellacious weapon. Dead-nuts reliable, accurate and TOUGH! Only issue is the full size are a little largish. I carried one for years, and I'm currently carrying my 9C fairly regularly..though I admit being seduced over to the dark side by the slim hips of my SA Lightweight Loaded.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:20:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:22:29 PM EDT
I would like to buy one myself. I have shot a fullsize 45 and it feels great. But I have seen it jam once, the mag candle sticked. But that may have been the mag or not.Haven't seen it do it again. Just wished they were cheaper.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:26:07 PM EDT
Blasphemer!!!!!!!! can't talk for the "c" but I have a full size .45.. works great, right out of the box.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:26:11 PM EDT
Duke, you need the suppressor...it's really a whole another world when shooting the Tac silenced.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:32:07 PM EDT
Thanks for all the opinions guys. For what it's worth, I'd never bother with it in any other caliber than .45. In 9mm and .40 I'd take the Glock any day. Lighter and more rounds. So no one has mentioned price, what should I expect on a .45 compact?
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:37:34 PM EDT
I once shot the Usp .45 compact anlongside Glock 19 and a Sig 228 ... The only one that I wanted to take home with me was the H+k... t
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:37:55 PM EDT
If you buy a 9mm "upper" for a USPc, will that fit ona USPc 40 "lower?" What about the mags?
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:41:00 PM EDT
Everybody knows the USP is just a Glock with a bunch of lead weight added so it will sink in water. [;D]
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:45:08 PM EDT
I know you really meant [b]U[/b]nabashedly [b]S[/b]uperb [b]P[/b]istol. I've had mine for a year, this past April. Never jammed, never casued any problems and just as accurate as my 1911 with some of its mods. Now I just got a Bar-Sto barrel in my 1911 so i'll have to compare the two again but otherwise i have no complaints and plan to buy another HK (and another 1911 as well) [:D]
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:48:17 PM EDT
I had a full-sized USP Tactical .45 ACP and it was a nice gun, but it never really did it for me. The trigger was not great (even though it was a "match" trigger). It didn't point well for me. I ended up selling it. I may buy another some day, but I didn't fall in love with it...
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 4:58:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/22/2003 4:59:18 PM EDT by SuperChicken]
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 5:03:06 PM EDT
Originally Posted By norman74: Thanks for all the opinions guys. For what it's worth, I'd never bother with it in any other caliber than .45. In 9mm and .40 I'd take the Glock any day. Lighter and more rounds. So no one has mentioned price, what should I expect on a .45 compact?
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IMHO, ya can't go wrong with John Brownings designs. I carry a Kimber PRO-CDP, (NOT the II [:D]) [url]http://www.kimberamerica.com/cdp.php[/url]
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 5:43:14 PM EDT
The USPc is a keeper for sure. The USP goes with me to training classes so that speaks volumes to me. My only gripe is the cheesegrater grip which I have covered in race tape and I added finger grooves. Easy to use controls and NEVER a failure of ANY type.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 5:54:21 PM EDT
Where did you get your goofy information?? I have a Tactical and a Compact(which is nice but not very compact). No jams,no malfunctions no problems of any kind thru thousands of rounds od ball, HWP and semi-wadcutter. I guess you could get a Glock, they dont have levers or exposed moving parts or a decent trigger. They are perfect for someone with limited ability, who could be confused by a regular gun. [:)]
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 5:59:45 PM EDT
My .45 USP Compact double-taps like a dream, has NEVER failed to fire, its dishwasher-safe, blow-the-balls-off-a-gnat accurate oh hell...a glock would have to stand on it's mother's shoulders to kiss an Hk's a$$. (OK! OK! I was kidding about the dishwasher[;)])
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 6:01:48 PM EDT
I have the full size USP in 45ACP and a 40 compact. The 45 sleeps next to me at nights and the 40 goes to work with me at the gun/pawn shop. I've had Colts,Sigs, Smiths, Glocks, Para Ordnances. I shoot and abuse the H&Ks and they just keep working. The triggers aren't the finest and they are pricey, but they work, and work well.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 6:22:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By norman74: Thanks for all the opinions guys. For what it's worth, I'd never bother with it in any other caliber than .45. In 9mm and .40 I'd take the Glock any day. Lighter and more rounds. So no one has mentioned price, what should I expect on a .45 compact?
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$1000s of dollars, unless of course you are helping me with a home improvement project. [;)] Come shooting with us Tuesday the 27th and I'll let you put some rounds down my USP9. I'll also get you a quote on a NIB one in .45. Also show you a few tricks that can only be done with a USP.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 6:31:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/22/2003 6:49:42 PM EDT by SHIVAN458]
Norman: Indeed you must be the bizarro-Shivan as I have the USP40c as a daily carry gun. My first handgun was a USP40f, I now have a USP45f and as soon as I adjust the night sights a touch it should be hell on wheels. They are stout, reliable, accurate and the feel of a German firearm under your coat or shirt is reassuring. Trigger is as good as it gets for a "service type" pistol. IMHO of course.... I got to shoot Hydguy's Wilson Combat last night and while I [s]liked[/s]LOVED it, I would get two USP45c's first..... Ed
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 6:36:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
Originally Posted By norman74: Thanks for all the opinions guys. For what it's worth, I'd never bother with it in any other caliber than .45. In 9mm and .40 I'd take the Glock any day. Lighter and more rounds. So no one has mentioned price, what should I expect on a .45 compact?
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$1000s of dollars, unless of course you are helping me with a home improvement project. [;)] Come shooting with us Tuesday the 27th and I'll let you put some rounds down my USP9. I'll also get you a quote on a NIB one in .45. Also show you a few tricks that can only be done with a USP.
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You guys and your goddamn weekday shoots...
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 7:27:54 PM EDT
Steyr: What "tricks" are you referring to? (I'm serious BTW. IM if you want, but I'm a 1911 guy who's always curious about other .45 designs, with the USP being my favorite behind the 1911.) Thanks, Corey
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 7:54:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Corey: Steyr: What "tricks" are you referring to? (I'm serious BTW. IM if you want, but I'm a 1911 guy who's always curious about other .45 designs, with the USP being my favorite behind the 1911.) Thanks, Corey
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Just some speed techniques. The primary one being able to dump a mag with the trigger finger while maintaining your sight picture. There are a couple others involving the decocker/safety lever as well.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 7:57:52 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 8:07:23 PM EDT
The only thing shitty about the USP is HK USA. THEY SUCK. Good thing these pistols are reliable.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 8:15:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By -Duke-Nukem-: Corey, if you look at the operating system I think you'll find that a USP .45 variant 1 is basically an overgrown, over-engineered, overly large 1911. Wouldn't you agree with me Steyr?
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It is more like if a 1911 and a Walther design fucked and had a really big kid with a modern capacity magazine.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 8:26:28 PM EDT
I was looking at USP 45s on Gunbroker.com and they seemed to be running around 1000-1500. I saw a few of the SOCOM models up there for like 2500. I think if I ever got my pistol permit I would get a USP 45 as my first handgun. Unfortunately, I'm not even allowed to touch a handgun in NY without a permit, so I can't check out the HK's I see at the local gunshop.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 8:32:27 PM EDT
I remembered what I didn't like about them. When they first came out the store I worked at was a stocking dealer. The decock levers were shearing off at the pins. HK would NOT admit that they had a problem. It was a major pain in the ass. They also screwed us when the local PD went to the HK.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 8:39:41 PM EDT
I have a full-size 40 (from 1994 - before the polygonal rifling), and my brother has a compact 45. I've shot both (mine extensively), and they are both accurate, comfortable, and completely reliable. I don't find the full-size 45 comfortable due to it's big grip girth, but I love the others. I think the the compact models have especially comfortable grip. DrMark
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 9:58:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By norman74: I remembered what I didn't like about them. When they first came out the store I worked at was a stocking dealer. The decock levers were shearing off at the pins. HK would NOT admit that they had a problem. It was a major pain in the ass. They also screwed us when the local PD went to the HK.
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I bought mine in 1994 and had a similar problem (but it didn't sheer off, just felt like it bent and wouldn't function). I sent it back to HK and it was corrected under warranty for free. Haven't had a problem in 8+ years since.
Link Posted: 5/22/2003 10:04:53 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SteyrAUG: It is more like if a 1911 and a Walther design fucked and had a really big kid with a modern capacity magazine.
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That is classic!
Link Posted: 5/23/2003 6:10:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/23/2003 6:14:48 AM EDT by Corey]
Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
Originally Posted By SteyrAUG: It is more like if a 1911 and a Walther design fucked and had a really big kid with a modern capacity magazine.
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That is classic!
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Classic and true! [:)] My shooting buddy has a fullsize USP .45 (he's also a Team Member here). He and I have discussed this v. the 1911 in great detail. I've never stripped the HK down, but the SA 1911 (or CZ? early Beretta?) inspired safety is great. I've heard that the HK has incredible reliability. I'm sure that is in large part due to the generous size and "tolerances" (that one's for Campy! [:D]) built into it. Which, unfortunately means that it can feel like you're handling a small brick to some people (me included). Even next to the 1911, the dimensions are similar, but the USP seems much more "chunky." Very tough gun. It would be a great SHTF pistol if it could be carried openly. I think it would be easier to conceal a 1911, however that's just speculation. I wish they could slim it down and make it a single-stack. I'd be really interested in something like that. EDITED to add the words "inspired safety" above, which I forgot.
Link Posted: 5/23/2003 6:27:49 AM EDT
interesting weight comment... my fullsize USP45 weighs less than my Colt officers model.
Link Posted: 5/23/2003 6:28:17 AM EDT
Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
Originally Posted By Corey: Steyr: What "tricks" are you referring to? (I'm serious BTW. IM if you want, but I'm a 1911 guy who's always curious about other .45 designs, with the USP being my favorite behind the 1911.) Thanks, Corey
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Just some speed techniques. The primary one being able to dump a mag with the trigger finger while maintaining your sight picture. There are a couple others involving the decocker/safety lever as well.
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?????????? I used to be able to do that with 1911A1, and my S+W 4506. I can "kinda" do it with my Glock 21 and 30, I "slingshot" to put it in battery. (I'm left handed")
Link Posted: 5/23/2003 6:51:38 AM EDT
Originally Posted By RipMeyer:
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: "Universally Shitty Pistol" ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Well, there's your first ill informed, ignorant assumption right off the bat. I have the USP.45 in compact and fullsize. IMO, there is no finer pistol made. [b]Accuracy[/b].....out of the box, dead nuts on and as good as some high dollar 1911's I've shot. Extremely accurate for a service pistol. [b]Reliability[/b].....Niether one of mine have had so much as a hiccup in the thousands of rounds through them. [b]Concealability[/b].....This is a relative question because many people consider these larger than average pistols and harder to conceal. I have used both in that capacity with no problems. They are my favorites out of the many, many I have owned and shot.
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What He Said!!
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Ditto. Only difference is that I have only one [:(] and it's a USP40C. LOVE that pistol!
Link Posted: 5/23/2003 7:41:33 AM EDT
It was one of those guns I really wanted, so I finally picked one up. After I got it I never understood what all the fuss was about. In theory I appreciated the way it was supposed to be 1911-like but for some reason it never did feel right in my hand. The DA trigger was pretty stiff, though in SA mode it was all right. The decocker would occasionally be way too hard to activate. The molded checkering was too sharp; I noticed they seem to have blunted the points on later guns. It is an awfully bulky gun, even in "compact" trim. Dovetailed sights mean the factory 3-dots are easily replaced with night sights, and I liked the position of the mag release. Mine was a full-sized .40 and I soon got rid of it. I told myself I'd like to pick up a compact .45 because it's a more reasonable size, but with prices spiraling towards $900 I don't see it happening now.
Link Posted: 5/23/2003 8:04:15 AM EDT
Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:
Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
Originally Posted By Corey: Steyr: What "tricks" are you referring to? (I'm serious BTW. IM if you want, but I'm a 1911 guy who's always curious about other .45 designs, with the USP being my favorite behind the 1911.) Thanks, Corey
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Just some speed techniques. The primary one being able to dump a mag with the trigger finger while maintaining your sight picture. There are a couple others involving the decocker/safety lever as well.
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?????????? I used to be able to do that with 1911A1, and my S+W 4506. I can "kinda" do it with my Glock 21 and 30, I "slingshot" to put it in battery. (I'm left handed")
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Not everyone is left handed and shooting a right hand pistol. More to the point anyone can do this with a USP, and much more comfortably and reliably, since it is a ambi mag release.
Link Posted: 5/23/2003 8:23:41 AM EDT
Tucson P.D. was/is the single largest users of USP pistols in the US. Tucson said enough is enough about two years ago and started to phase out the USPs for Glocks as their budget allows. Tucson complained about parts breakage related to the safety/decock lever, magazine retention problems and poor support from HK Usa.
Link Posted: 5/23/2003 8:29:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/23/2003 8:52:23 AM EDT by Dredd308]
Heres mine [img]www.funtigo.com/go?i=i455720_17950.jpg[/img] ZERO problems. I carry it all the time. I shoot IDPA with it. I love it. Very comfortable. More accurate than I am. Ok, its not really very compact. But it is smaller than my Tac. Oh yeah, I paid $925 with night sights, new. I also own a USP40F and a H&K P7 Can you tell I'm a huge HK fan (ie.nut) ?
Link Posted: 5/23/2003 8:38:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/23/2003 8:42:58 AM EDT by SPECTRE]
Originally Posted By innocent_bystander: Tucson P.D. was/is the single largest users of USP pistols in the US. Tucson said enough is enough about two years ago and started to phase out the USPs for Glocks as their budget allows. Tucson complained about parts breakage related to the safety/decock lever, magazine retention problems and poor support from HK Usa.
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I have a few friends who are TPD officers, they had no problems with their USP's and even bought USP's for themselves (in .45 though, not .40). I also know that the TPD armorer was pissed at HK for various reasons and the dept was given the standard "El Cheeeepo" deal from glock and as usual, lowest bidder wins. Things are not always as they seem. There's a local gun/police supply shop I stop by from time to time. Many TPD leo types there off and on. The owner is a prick and hates HK, when asked why, he started with all the problems TPD had. When asked what they were, he couldn't be specific. I think it's more that he's a glock pimp and it costs more to be a HK dealer. **edited to add.....I wonder what they will think when the new glaachs start to KB on them.
Link Posted: 5/23/2003 8:51:26 AM EDT
Originally Posted By innocent_bystander: Tucson P.D. was/is the single largest users of USP pistols in the US. Tucson said enough is enough about two years ago and started to phase out the USPs for Glocks as their budget allows. Tucson complained about parts breakage related to the safety/decock lever, magazine retention problems and poor support from HK Usa.
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This is true, but they were using .40 full size. I know one of the training officers who helped with the decision, and he can go off on HK for hours. He is and will admit to being a full blown Glock freak. However, their only experience is with the .40, and IMHO the .45 is an entirely different beast. And as we all know, some of the new Glocks have manf. issues as well, and Glock has not been that forthcoming either. Norman, I'm selling my compact for one reason only. It prints more than I would like. Otherwise I like the gun, and used it in the required AZ CCW class. No FTFs. Since it's hot as hell here now I'm carrying a SW PD340 that I can stick in an IWB without belt in a pair of shorts. If I wear jeans, I carry a P7. Neither is a range gun, but adequate for close encounters as most gunfights are. In Winter I carry a Wilson Protector Compact I've had for several years.
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